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  1.    #1  
    This is a thread to discuss documentation of Legacy webOS.

    I guess the categories are:
    • User information (how to operate the system and hardware)
    • Tweaking (how users can enhance or fix webOS)
    • App development
    • System development / Hacking

    • Official sources (generally Palm & HP sites)
    • 3rd party websites
    • Forums
    • Archives (including off-line)

    As various sources date, break or get removed, the aim is to ensure the documentation is preserved. Options:
    • Preserve or encourage the maintenance of the original site.
    • Recover 'lost' material
    • Rehost material
    • Update existing material
    • Generate new material

    This thread will identify and list documentation by category or specific source and discuss the best preservation approach to take.
    • Preserve things as they are.
    • Link to archives
    • Consolidate data on a few sites

    On the last point, we are currently using as a master back up for documentation. Please post sources that we can copy here. You can also mirror this if you would like to host your own copy.
    Last edited by Preemptive; 09/10/2019 at 10:48 AM.
  2.    #2  
    So a suggestion might be:
    • News - pivotCE
    • User information - The pivotCE Guide
    • Tweaking (how users can enhance or fix webOS) - ???
    • App development - Site dedicated to Enyo / Mojo and other app coding methods
    • System development / Hacking - webOS Internals
    • Main forum - webOS Nation

    Possibly tweaking should also be on the webOS Internals wiki. There is of course a danger in splitting things up too much as there is overlap in all areas. Articles on pivotCE can highlight interesting developments in all areas.
  3. #3  
    I like the idea of this a lot. especially considering im just coming back so as to help avoid the week long pain of rooting around for others. My only advice would be something thats more inclusive. Going around searching 20 different sources makes things more difficult. For resources such as files Im already looking into hosting as I own my own domain.

    The real problem is maintenance. Things like wiki's get dated fast and need updating regularly. We all have lives and get busy so im not sure how that can be accomplished unless someone can live solely by donation's to just maintain things.

    Overall having one giant source encompassing as much as possible would make things easier.
  4.    #4  
    Just to reply to this:

    Quote Originally Posted by ami mizuno View Post
    The real problem is maintenance. Things like wiki's get dated fast and need updating regularly. We all have lives and get busy so im not sure how that can be accomplished unless someone can live solely by donation's to just maintain things.

    Overall having one giant source encompassing as much as possible would make things easier.
    At this point, legacy webOS is in 'maintenance mode', which is the polite way of saying that there are occasional fixes that keep the zombie OS staggering on. Changes since 2011 have been few (but sometimes significant), so most of the information that was correct then, remains so. If old information is checked to still be correct and the fixes since 2011 are documented, then the effort is not huge.

    In terms of resources, 'the community' does not run this forum. We have access to webOS Internal's wiki. Likewise, pivotCE welcomes community contributions. These sites ARE for practical purposes, community resources and as far as the future can be predicted, will be around for a while. Additionally, many community members maintain their own archives or websites. If we had the resources and control, one big site might be the answer. But that's when we might need money, time and effort to build and administer it - a big ask. I agree that the number of sites should be limited to prevent confusion, but a small number of sites - each dedicated to a particular aspect of webOS, would be easier to maintain and manage (as most already exist). We already have this forum for comment, Internals for system hacking and pivotCE for news. Still required is a user guide and app development tutorials. An advantage to having 4 or 5 separate sites is that if anything happens to one, material could be re-hosted at one of the others (if it's archived!).
    Last edited by Preemptive; 01/02/2018 at 08:47 PM.
  5.    #5  
    I saw this posted somewhere:
    Are there any comments on this? Would it have value for a new documentation site (probably on app development)? Is there any advantage over a wiki?
  6.    #6  
    I'm just going to post some sources I found. I don't know if they are 'lost' as they just came from a web search, but I'll post for reference. (Dev plugin) (webOS projects on NPM) (Frank Zametti's book)
  7. #7  
    The npmjs repository is for the tv version of webos, I think
  8.    #8  
    Looks like it, but some is old enough to maybe be of use for legacy also.
  9.    #9  
    At the last meeting of the webOS User Group, it was suggested that a centralised github repository of all documentation be maintained. This would not affect whatever various support sites we might operate, but function as a 'master' back up (version control included of course).

    The only issue I see is the obvious pre-existing one of copyright. We can of course ask for permission on various sources and where that's not possible for some reason, disclaimers and clear references to the copyright holders could be included. Technical data can be rephrased if necessary. We could also use and link back.

    A further suggestion was that where possible, all sites maintain backups of the other sites.
    Last edited by Preemptive; 10/23/2018 at 08:44 AM.
  10.    #10  
    Is there an actual guide for a first time developer to set up the system with tools to begin development? The information must exist.

    If there is, it could be updated if required. If not, we could gather any scattered sources and create one.

    In my opinion, it should also include advice on the various frameworks (and which to select for what purpose).

    A generic, sample app should also be included which would not do much, but would include code that would enable scaling to available screen sizes, registration (if needed) of a file-type handler to enable selection as a default app and anything else that would enable the app to function across legacy webOS, LuneOS and OSE (where practical).

    Does anyone have suggestions for:
    • A 'first step' developer guide?
    • Or sources for such a guide?
    • Code for the basic app?
  11.    #11  
    I haven't yet read this closely enough to be sure of the relevance, but it is about restoring server software. Note the bit about 'legal possession' though.
    At first I thought it might be relevant to doctors & abandoned documentation, but there is a possibility here for 'Palm Profile' services - assuming 'legal possession' of that is possible.
  12. #12  
    Sorry that I missed this thread, here's my latest on this effort:

    I made the "Get the tools" page the default page of my restored archive (the tools include sample code for basic apps), and intend to make a Getting Started guide out of my Stopwatch app, once done. Much like in the original book (

    I'll keep this thread updated from now on.
    Last edited by jonwise80; 10/31/2018 at 08:30 AM.
    Preemptive and MudShark22 like this.
  13. #13  
    Related to the storage requirements query on the splinter thread on this subject, currently the two restored pages from the Developer Download site, and the SDK-PDK documentation are clocking in at 40.5MB.
    However, that excludes the sample code projects from the SDK and the actual binaries from the Download site, which I'm storing in a public OneDrive folder. I'll update this post with those file sizes later.
    Preemptive likes this.
  14.    #14  
    From the last meeting, the decision for now is to place all documentation in a central github repository as a back up. Github static pages can be used. Specific types of documentation will continue to be housed at domains dedicated to the content.
  15. #15  
    Here's the repo for contributions:
    Anyone can submit a pull request. If you'd like to be an active contributor (push requests), PM me your Github username and I'll add you to the project.

    The working theory is that a GitHub Pages version that is automatically published whenever the repo changes can be our hosting provider:
    ...that is, as soon as I figure out how to use this feature, and strip out the PHP dependency.

    If we have a better domain we can use, perhaps someone can help set-up a redirect.
  16. #16  
    I've updated the repo with the Enyo reference that @Misj' pointed me to.

    I've also updated my VisualStudio Code extensions so they work with Enyo template generation.
  17. #17  
    I've updated the docs, removing the PHP dependency, which means we can use GitHub pages for hosting. Its already up-and-running, with recent updates to the Linux installation instructions, and an external link to the LunaSys docs.

    The only domain I own is a personal one, so for now, the custom domain for the content is: webOS Dev Center - SDK-PDK Download
    This points to the GitHub pages site at:

    If someone can help with a better domain, we can use that instead!
    Misj' likes this.
  18.    #18  
    In the light of the scandals around Facebook, I saw this article: We Should Replace Facebook With Personal Websites - Motherboard (there's not much to it beyond the title).

    Anyway, I suddenly remembered web rings! I wondered if we could start a Palm / webOS web ring: Find one, discover them all!

    This could include all documentation sites and the main back up. In fact every relevant site could go in.

    Some of the options listed at the bottom of the wiki page seem to have vanished, but here are a few: (this slow loading site appears to be more of a zombie than webOS!)
    Orca PHP Scripts - Camouflaged PHP/MySQL Web Applications

    This appears to be a manual version - basically a linked list on a page with everyone including reciprocal links on their own pages: I guess that's the simplest way. Then there's running a simple program or script, then using a service (if there are any left!)

    Any opinions? There's a simple list in the webOS status report (link below), but the terms of this site prohibit posting links to similar sites to avoid losing traffic (though the reverse might apply here now), so you have to search for the listed sites.

    I guess the ideal would be to invite every site to include a web ring script, though I suppose there's nothing to prevent us hosting a curated list as part of the documentation.
    Last edited by Preemptive; 12/21/2018 at 08:17 AM.
  19. #19  
    Web ring was a pain, as is maintaining a website. That's why stuff gets outdated.
  20.    #20  
    I think this popped up on Twitter:

    I'm not 100% sure exactly what it is... An addon to save pages to But it seems to seek every* page from the Internet Archive and save a version if it is not found. I have a slight concern that widespread use might knock over the servers..?

    What's the appeal / possible interest to us? We already use the archive to search for old documentation. What if we used this and auto-created backups of documentation as we look at it?

    *there's an exclude list and the archive doesn't do some sites - like Github (presumably because it has it's own version control).
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