[AdidasNYR]

Daring Fireball: Why Palm's WebOS 'Media Sync' iTunes Integration Can't Be Legit

[snoopb]

Nice find Adidas. It was an objective write-up. Clicking to the link for DVD Jon's assessment was pretty insightful, too. Some of the comments brought up a good point about leading to a war that boils down to Apple vs. Everyone.

nanocr.eu » Blog Archive » Syncing music and video to the Palm Pre

Quoting lqz: Apple arguing iTunes can only work with iPods. Would be like MS arguing that Windows needs IE. No one in their right mind would buy it.

Why wouldn't other PMPs jump in this to sync with iTunes also?

[jhoff80]

The original article has already been discussed here:
http://forums.precentral.net/palm-pr...unes-sync.html

[Pearl_Diva]

Let's wait and see what Apple officially says(or does concerning iTunes updates) on the matter.

But why yell at the OP for just pointing out the blog post?

[hamkins]

Daring Fireball: Why Palm's WebOS 'Media Sync' iTunes Integration Can't Be Legit

I've read several articles, including this one, that imply that Apple might file suit against Palm because the Pre can sync with iTunes. Apple would not have a leg to stand on in a suit against Palm. Palm simply made their device interoperate with another program. That is just about the definition of following the law. You can't file suit against someone for making hardware that interoperates with your software.

[Badandy]

Let's wait and see what Apple officially says(or does concerning iTunes updates) on the matter.

But why yell at the OP for just pointing out the blog post?

I'll tell you why. Because pointing out a potential drawback of the Pre and even mildly praising the iPhone or Apple leads to a storm of anti-Apple rhetoric and the Pre fanboys to loudly proclaim their greatness, superiority, and dismiss any legitimate argument. Honestly, I'm a member of Macrumors with about 1,000 posts, I've owned Palms my whole life, and I seriously see no difference between the lunacy of Apple fanboys on Macrumors and the Pre fanboys on this site. Their tactics are the same, their logic is identically blinded by group think, and they show the same "hands cupped over their ears" attitude for anything even resembling a criticism of their beloved consumer products.


EDIT @ Hamkins: It *seems* as though Palm is able to interoperate with their software because it is registering itself as an Apple product instead of on an approved non-Apple device list. The verdict is still out on this one.

[Pearl_Diva]

If it's true that "iPod" shows up when connected, that makes me wonder if it might not be a hack.

[miles4000]

Let's wait and see what Apple officially says(or does concerning iTunes updates) on the matter.

But why yell at the OP for just pointing out the blog post?

I think its because this site is getting alot more new people on it as we get closer to Pre launch. I hope this doesnt turn out to be like PIC forum.

"I know Palm is now the underdog, and I’m rooting for the Pre to be a success. Competition is good for the industry. But this move strikes me as more desperate than scrappy."

Why is it desperate to want to give your users the option of using itunes? Its the leading music sync'n program (which I sometimes use but dont like it).

[TeckieGirl40]

Has anyone read BGR article on why any phone can sync with itunes? And if so, the suit would be baseless. All of this is rubbish. The new update has to do with tthe new sofware coming down for the iphone 3 and not the Pre. The iphone is beautiful, but I can't type on it: and it didn't have push email or cut and paste when it first came out. Now it does. The reason I am leaving my stable blackberry for the Pre is because it multitasks, it pushes email really quickly and it is not an iphone. I want something no one has, that happens to be beautiful. I got to see it, why apple would turn down literally millions of new users is beyond me.

But, every phone can sync with iTunes… : Boy Genius Report

[nerdtalker]

If it's true that "iPod" shows up when connected, that makes me wonder if it might not be a hack.

It does say "Syncing iPod" up at the top, but what caught my eye (and apparently nobody else's) is what it says on the left.

Devices
- Paul's Device
- (little white square with a question mark)

That's what I find interesting. It doesn't say iPod. If it was masquerading as an iPod by some sort of trick, wouldn't it show up as a real, legit, 100% supported iPod? Or at least be called one?

Look:

[dbmgreen]

I've read several articles, including this one, that imply that Apple might file suit against Palm because the Pre can sync with iTunes. Apple would not have a leg to stand on in a suit against Palm. Palm simply made their device interoperate with another program. That is just about the definition of following the law. You can't file suit against someone for making hardware that interoperates with your software.

Palm actually have several patents in the area of desktop syncing, does anyone know if Apple already pay palm $ for the right to sync ipods?

[enjoyingsilence]

Palm actually have several patents in the area of desktop syncing, does anyone know if Apple already pay palm $ for the right to sync ipods?

Palm may have patents on their technology, formerly referred to as hotsync, and how it integrated with their desktop manager software. Beyond the scope of that , I doubt they would have a leg to stand on either.

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Other replies, I'm too lazy to do the whole quote code. Sorry it's 5:40 am on the east coast, and I'm going to bed in a while. it might be a tldr moment. lol

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<q>I'll tell you why. Because pointing out a potential drawback of the Pre and even mildly praising the iPhone or Apple leads to a storm of anti-Apple rhetoric and the Pre fanboys to loudly proclaim their greatness, superiority, and dismiss any legitimate argument. Honestly, I'm a member of Macrumors with about 1,000 posts, I've owned Palms my whole life, and I seriously see no difference between the lunacy of Apple fanboys on Macrumors and the Pre fanboys on this site. Their tactics are the same, their logic is identically blinded by group think, and they show the same "hands cupped over their ears" attitude for anything even resembling a criticism of their beloved consumer products.</q>

Agreed. There are the few of us who remember the anti competitive scandals Mr Gates, Mr Ballmer, and Microsoft were involved with. A number of them involved Microsoft throwing a **** fit over integration with Microsoft products, e.g. a sony walkman, being able to sync with Windows Media Player.

Apple is no different. Also, there are those of us who remember when Apple had their "moment". They were sue happy/defensive, then they were lax, now they're back to sue happy.

I wish I could point a time line, the point where they were pretty lax about lawsuits, was because they needed good press. Apple was hurtin'. Now, they have the iPhone, they're selling them dime a dozen + hardware/software sales, and their Pro App sales are up more than ever. Of course they'll get defensive about what's going on in regards to the Palm Pre and it's ability to synch with iTunes.

As we know, there are 3rd party apps we can install that let "other devices" sync with iTunes. Makes you wonder why Apple hasn't gone after them eh? Cause they don't pose a threat. My guess is - Apple's feeling a little heat from the Pre. Mac users can be lunatics, and will bleed (proverbailly) fro apple. Windows Mobile users do the same, Palm fans do it, bmw drivers, toyota, religious followers, republicans, democrats, etc etc. We defend what we love. Seems to be an American tradition.

Then again, so does defaming the competition :P

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It does say "Syncing iPod" up at the top, but what caught my eye (and apparently nobody else's) is what it says on the left.
\\\ Umm.. the square with a question mark is (I think) the default icon for a removable drive of unknown origin, OR, one that did not provide it's own icon.

I'm willing to wager a cookie, that Palm is using Mark/Space plugins to do this. After all, we have NO idea (first hand) what is installed on our computers, or what *needs* to be installed on our computers when we get the phone. Or, perhaps there's some sort of 2 way communication, that lends itself to Mark/Space Missing Sync (who was announced as a launch partner, right?), immediately plugged into iTunes. As far as windows users, that one - is beyond me. Tho I doubt, it's difficult to port the code for Mark/Space iTunes integration from Unix/BSD based, or w/e it's written in, to something compatible with x86/x64 windows

[northy014]

Apple will need to draw a fine line between not being seen as anti-competitive (e.g. by the EU who already aren't big fans), but on the other hand they won't want to allow Palm the chance to eat into more of their market share when they must already be worried about Android.

[west3man]

<< edited by berd >>

In general, I prefer to draw the line at name-calling, but it sure is hard not to leave "Thanks" for this and every other post that breaks up the wave of unprovoked rudeness that's washed up on our digital shores, lately.

I used to hang at a forum that was pretty biased against outsiders (whether they recognized that or not) and now I understand why that might've been the case.

It's tough to be a part of a community for years then see a dramatic influx of juvenile personalities. It's hard not to think poorly of all newcomers.


Ultimately, I thought it was a worthwhile article and a worthwhile link. I don't know enough to vehemently disagree with the author's conlusions but I do disagree with them. If the API is SO old, I'd expect it to be a loophole that Palm's exploited, at best.

[Kupe]

Apple has succeeded so far in keeping OS X installations on their own hardware and off of other hardware. No reason to think they won't take a similar stand with iTunes and non-iPod devices.

[cardfan]

I was disappointed when i first saw it during the D7 blog. I still am.

Palm misses another opportunity to do something better. Some of you are asking why reinvent the wheel? Because its not Palm's wheel.

"We're acknowledging the power of itunes" Roger says. With that mentality then why bother with webOS or the Pre-tender? You're not acknowledging, you're conceding. Making excuses.

Why stop here? Let's fool BIS into thinking the Pre is a blackberry.

But what the heck. If this is really Palm's answer then there's nothing to stop them from introducing a webOS media player/PDA. Apple has sold a ton of iPod Touch's. MS is coming out with Zune HD. Get going Palm...

[mobileman]

I was disappointed when i first saw it during the D7 blog. I still am.

Palm misses another opportunity to do something better. Some of you are asking why reinvent the wheel? Because its not Palm's wheel.

"We're acknowledging the power of itunes" Roger says. With that mentality then why bother with webOS or the Pre-tender? You're not acknowledging, you're conceding. Making excuses.

Why stop here? Let's fool BIS into thinking the Pre is a blackberry.

But what the heck. If this is really Palm's answer then there's nothing to stop them from introducing a webOS media player/PDA. Apple has sold a ton of iPod Touch's. MS is coming out with Zune HD. Get going Palm...

Because Palm realizes they dont have the time or resources to create a better solution. Instead they will allow their customers to use the industry leading and most used music software. Major win for Palm users if you ask me.

[meyerweb]

The entire article is based on guesswork and assumptions. No one outside of Palm know how the iTunes sync works, nor whether it's legit. The guy's entitled to his guesswork and conclusions, but to give it any more credence than the rumor and guesswork on this site is absurd. We'll know for sure soon.

[palandri]

The entire article is based on guesswork and assumptions. No one outside of Palm know how the iTunes sync works, nor whether it's legit. The guy's entitled to his guesswork and conclusions, but to give it any more credence than the rumor and guesswork on this site is absurd. We'll know for sure soon.

[sir_mycroft]

Why stop here? Let's fool BIS into thinking the Pre is a blackberry. ...

Hey, that is not a bad idea.