[Captweez]

Uh, every sale of any phone anywhere at any time in the recent past, present or future is a potential lost sale of the Pre, is it not? Kinda hard for Palm to do anything about that.

Now they've already spilled the beans about their features, and are giving time for others to catch up.

The thing they can do about it is release the device in a timely fashion, before others have time to copy it or supersede it. People need to be able to buy the Pre when it's the hottest thing out there, not second best.

[anon(45821)]

Which then begs the question as to why Palm should care so much about Apple's plans, no? Yes, their success is assured. All of this is true whether the Pre launches now or in 4 months. All Palm can control is whether it launches properly or not, not when it will launch. If Palm doesn't care about whether the Pre launches properly or not, then it will be in stores as soon as the boxes leave their Asian manufacturing facilities. If Palm does care - and everything Pre-related thus far indicates they do - then the Pre will launch when the OS and apps are in good shape, bugs are minimized, inventory is good, and marketing is in place.

I agree with this 100%. Imagine yourself as CEO of a troubled company with an as yet to be released device that could possibly pull you from the grave. Are you going to worry more about it's release date than it's readiness to be released? I think you would focus more on getting it release ready and less on when that date actually is. Not saying the release date doesn't play an important role, but it shouldn't come to "okay, we've reached a certain date, we'll just release the phone as is".

Yeah, but simple business sense would probably lead Palm to want to release its product before its main competitor releases a product that will likely achieve more attention and press.

I think Palm should focus on releasing a stable, mostly bug free device and less on who is realeasing what and when. Palm Pre is going to be what it is regardless of what others release.
Maybe my thought process on purchasing a cell phone is too simplified. I either like it and buy it, or I don't like it and don't buy it.

[cardfan]

When they were talking pricing, i mentioned i don't think you should let others set the price such as apple.

In this vein, i don't think palm should let anyone but themselves dictate when to launch.

I think some on here are a little too worried about apple. Sprint and Palm are going to put a lot of muscle behind advertising. Maybe its Apple that should worry about any buzz stealing?

It's been mentioned over and over...success for palm doesn't equal what would be success for apple at this time.

[mobileman]

I agree with this 100%. Imagine yourself as CEO of a troubled company with an as yet to be released device that could possibly pull you from the grave. Are you going to worry more about it's release date than it's readiness to be released? I think you would focus more on getting it release ready and less on when that date actually is. Not saying the release date doesn't play an important role, but it shouldn't come to "okay, we've reached a certain date, we'll just release the phone as is".

If I was this CEO and I was releasing a device thats success was needed to save my company I would definitely have to consider the release schedule of my competitor. I would need to take into account that the technical advantages I would have against the competitors current model may no longer be there at the time of my release. In addition my competitor new model may actual now be better than my current unreleased device.

[Reeves]

Now they've already spilled the beans about their features, and are giving time for others to catch up.

Really? Given that the only beans spilled thus far are about OS and architecture-levels of usability, who exactly is going to "catch up" by building a brand new OS and form factor to take advantage of it in four months?

To put it in perspective, Windows Mobile 6.5 continues to run off the same Win CE shell from Windows Mobile 2003. What year is it again? May wanna ask RIM that as well.

Android has been nigh stagnant since release. How many software iPhone complaints have been answered since 2007? (e.g. cut and paste, Safari crashes, landscape keyboard, bulk email delete, MMS, etc.) In fact, how much has the core iPhone OS really changed in functionality since 2007?

Unless these "Others" are the ones on the island on ABC's "Lost", I don't think Palm should be worried too much. Even the handsets announced MWC mostly only had new HARDWARE. Same ole' Android. Same ole' Windows Mobile 6.1. And when WM 6.5 arrives, it's merely a skin on a few areas with the same Win CE core, and won't be officially offered on any existing handsets.

The thing they can do about it is release the device in a timely fashion, before others have time to copy it or supersede it. People need to be able to buy the Pre when it's the hottest thing out there, not second best.

Buddy, if you or anyone else thinks the Pre is second to ANY handset running Windows Mobile 6.1 or Android in their current or even proposed future states, it never stood a chance anyway. The Pre will be the hottest thing for Sprint customers when it launches just like the Instinct was when it launched and Touch Diamond was when it launched and so on and so on. From there, word has to get out, but it won't get out in a good way if the release is rushed, buggy, and crappy (see Instinct launch).

[Reeves]

If I was this CEO and I was releasing a device thats success was needed to save my company I would definitely have to consider the release schedule of my competitor. I would need to take into account that the technical advantages I would have against the competitors current model may no longer be there at the time of my release. In addition my competitor new model may actual now be better than my current unreleased device.

So as a CEO, you would base your company's entire strategy on rumors about what your competition could do?

Wow, would you be easy to put out of business. All I have to do is bend the ear of three tastemaker/journalist-types in your industry, say my company is unleashing a super-product with triple all your current specs and some new made up ones that aren't even possible, and then sit back and let you go broke trying to create this vapourware and rush it to market to beat my super-device, of which there is no proof of its existence or even my intent to make it.

I guess Sun Tzu was right after all.

[Captweez]

Sprints handset choices have a history of being mediocre and lagging behind the cutting edge.

The fact that the Pre will reign supreme as compared to the other phones on a sinking carrier is uninteresting to me.

I don't know enough about Android to feel qualified enough to dismiss it or not.

A lot of the Features of the Pre were based on Apple's Iphone to begin with. Multitouch, App Store, The Browsing Jesters, Accelerometer. In terms of the hardware all the pre has to boast is a physical keyboard.

The new features Pre brings to the table are compelling, but mostly software based, and thus easily copyable. If any one thinks it would be impossible to extend mobileme to be like Synergy, or add some form of Multitasking to the iPhone... well we have a difference of opinion. Oh and they can slap on some kind of better notification system.

[mobileman]

So as a CEO, you would base your company's entire strategy on rumors about what your competition could do?

Wow, would you be easy to put out of business. All I have to do is bend the ear of three tastemaker/journalist-types in your industry, say my company is unleashing a super-product with triple all your current specs and some new made up ones that aren't even possible, and then sit back and let you go broke trying to create this vapourware and rush it to market to beat my super-device, of which there is no proof of its existence or even my intent to make it.

I guess Sun Tzu was right after all.

I never said I would base my "entire strategy" on my competition. You need to read my last post more carefully. I said I would have to consider my competition. Any CEO would do this. If you wouldn't, then "you would be easy to put out of business"

[anon(45821)]

If I was this CEO and I was releasing a device thats success was needed to save my company I would definitely have to consider the release schedule of my competitor. I would need to take into account that the technical advantages I would have against the competitors current model may no longer be there at the time of my release. In addition my competitor new model may actual now be better than my current unreleased device.

I guess my point is, would you release it buggy just to get it out before a possible competitor releases their device (and pay the price of negative reviews) or release it mostly bug free when that time comes, but within the timeframe you promissed it's release?

[Reeves]

I never said I would base my "entire strategy" on my competition. You need to read my last post more carefully. I said I would have to consider my competition. Any CEO would do this. If you wouldn't, then "you would be easy to put out of business"

But you're not competing against them. You're competing against rumors. Not only that, but you're letting them dictate the launch for your flaghsip/do-or-die product. That's why you'd be so easy to bankrupt.

[mobileman]

But you're not competing against them. You're competing against rumors. Not only that, but you're letting them dictate the launch for your flaghsip/do-or-die product. That's why you'd be so easy to bankrupt.

But you know that your closest competition will be releasing an updated model in the June time frame. It you can't see why Palm should take that into consideration, "you would be so easy to bankrupt".

[mobileman]

I guess my point is, would you release it buggy just to get it out before a possible competitor releases their device (and pay the price of negative reviews) or release it mostly bug free when that time comes, but within the timeframe you promissed it's release?

I would release a non-buggy version before my competitor. Whats wrong with old fashioned, around the clock, hard work?

[cckgz4]

Wow

[Captweez]

First of all, the only reason I would be bankrupt is because I'd want to keep all the latest cool sh** for myself. :-)

[Reeves]

But you know that your closest competition will be releasing an updated model in the June time frame. It you can't see why Palm should take that into consideration, "you would be so easy to bankrupt".

First off, this is absolutely not meant as an insult, but repeating my words back to me over and over is inadequate both as an insult and as a legitimate response. We can do better. So let's delete the "you would be so easy to bankrupt/put out of business" macro, ok?

Ok, then. Palm already took this into consideration. Palm took the entire market into consideration. And then instead of just trying to equal their products, they surpassed a lot of them in terms of usability and system management with WebOS. Apple is not going to release a new OS in four months because of the Pre, when they've let the existing OS remain essentially unchanged for two years. They haven't been able to add cut and paste and a landscape keyboard in all of that time, despite the myriad of complaints from their millions of customers. But you think because some Web journalists and readers get excited over WebOS, they're going to change everything in less than half a year? Really? There's also the matter of the kazillion or so apps in the App Store.

Anything Apple is adding to the supposed June release of a new iPhone is something they had in development well before Palm's announcement was made, and thus something Palm can do nothing about and should not worry about.

I would release a non-buggy version before my competitor. Whats wrong with old fashioned, around the clock, hard work?

Do you seriously believe that a lack of hard work from Palm employees is what is keeping the Pre from launching in 30 days as opposed to 120 days? You think there are developers there doing 4-day, 6-hour-a-day work weeks and catching up on their season sets of Battlestar Galactica or something? You think they're spending the mornings in the office having Halo 3 tournaments or doing Wii Sports? Palm finishing the handset is just ONE piece of the puzzle that must be completed before you can walk into Best Buy or a Sprint store and buy it.

FCC approval?
Sprint testing?
Sprint custom ROMs?
Marketing setup?

Think about it.

[anon(45821)]

Do you seriously believe that a lack of hard work from Palm employees is what is keeping the Pre from launching in 30 days as opposed to 120 days? You think there are developers there doing 4-day, 6-hour-a-day work weeks and catching up on their season sets of Battlestar Galactica or something? You think they're spending the mornings in the office having Halo 3 tournaments or doing Wii Sports? Palm finishing the handset is just ONE piece of the puzzle that must be completed before you can walk into Best Buy or a Sprint store and buy it.

FCC approval?
Sprint testing?
Sprint custom ROMs?
Marketing setup?

Think about it.

What you said!! I think Palm is doing all they can to get it released within the time frame promised and mostly bug free, despite what other manufacturers are doing or when they're doing it.

[mobileman]

First off, this is absolutely not meant as an insult, but repeating my words back to me over and over is inadequate both as an insult and as a legitimate response. We can do better. So let's delete the "you would be so easy to bankrupt/put out of business" macro, ok?

Ok, then. Palm already took this into consideration. Palm took the entire market into consideration. And then instead of just trying to equal their products, they surpassed a lot of them in terms of usability and system management with WebOS. Apple is not going to release a new OS in four months because of the Pre, when they've let the existing OS remain essentially unchanged for two years. They haven't been able to add cut and paste and a landscape keyboard in all of that time, despite the myriad of complaints from their millions of customers. But you think because some Web journalists and readers get excited over WebOS, they're going to change everything in less than half a year? Really? There's also the matter of the kazillion or so apps in the App Store.

Anything Apple is adding to the supposed June release of a new iPhone is something they had in development well before Palm's announcement was made, and thus something Palm can do nothing about and should not worry about.



Do you seriously believe that a lack of hard work from Palm employees is what is keeping the Pre from launching in 30 days as opposed to 120 days? You think there are developers there doing 4-day, 6-hour-a-day work weeks and catching up on their season sets of Battlestar Galactica or something? You think they're spending the mornings in the office having Halo 3 tournaments or doing Wii Sports? Palm finishing the handset is just ONE piece of the puzzle that must be completed before you can walk into Best Buy or a Sprint store and buy it.

FCC approval?
Sprint testing?
Sprint custom ROMs?
Marketing setup?

Think about it.

First of all, you continuously make statements as if you were an official Palm employee. You are not, and therefore shouldn't speak as you are. You have no idea what Palm has taken into consideration and what they did not. You have also not had any hands on time with the Pre so its hard for you to justify comments about what the Pre has achieved and what it has not.
Again, I offered my opinion as to why Palm should consider the competition in setting its release schedule. You clearly do not share my opinion. Lets just agree to disagree and move on

[cardfan]

I think he's speaking as an observer who is excited about the Pre and makes well thought out posts. I don't get the palm employee cracks.

But these are the Pre forums after all. What i don't get is why someone with such an affinity for his iphone is doing here questioning every positive thing about the Pre with hardly anything good to say about it.

We know. The iphone rulez for you, you using it for work, its apps are the bestest ever, palm better watch out, blah blah blah. To me, hearing that over and over is much much more annoying.

[anon(45821)]

I'm glad to see that Palm employee's are not participating in this forum, cuz it would seem none of us are getting any work done

[mobileman]

I think he's speaking as an observer who is excited about the Pre and makes well thought out posts. I don't get the palm employee cracks.

But these are the Pre forums after all. What i don't get is why someone with such an affinity for his iphone is doing here questioning every positive thing about the Pre with hardly anything good to say about it.

We know. The iphone rulez for you, you using it for work, its apps are the bestest ever, palm better watch out, blah blah blah. To me, hearing that over and over is much much more annoying.

Wow, the same attack from the same person in multiple threads. Awesome, I have a stalker. I plan on buying a Pre. I also own a iPhone, and a Blackberry. If the iPhone was "the best ever" at everything I wouldn't also carry a blackberry. Are we not allowed to discuss any issues, questions, or anything else that we may not love about the Pre?