[grndslm]

Got a problem with capitalism, Delta Airlines has a flight ready to take you away from your problem! And they are ready whenever you are! And an immagrant is waiting to take your spot!

So don't feel like you need to endure the evils of capitalism another day!

I have a problem with selfish people. Bill Gates is selfish...as are most advocates of capitalism. I'm not an economist, but I'd say that pure communism is definitely better than capitalism. I don't think pure communism is possible though until we have Treo devices maybe 5 or 10 years down the road....WiMax...and enough people to fight all the ones with the money. BUT THIS IS ALL OFF TOPIC AND BELONGS IN ANOTHER THREAD!

If you've never seen negative aspects of capitalism, you've prolly been too busy counting your money to notice.

Did you ever stop to think that WiFi is faster than even the fastest EV-DO connection?

Samsung e-mail phone challenges the Treo 650

NOO!! NEVER!!! Of course, dude, I suck up technological information and innovation faster than you can brag about some crappy Samsung phone.

OK...now it's time to tear the i730 to shreds!!

(1) How many markets is EV-DO available in??? Last I checked, it wasn't even close to as much as the 1xRTT network you use on your Treo (or perhaps you use EDGE?). So, that EV-DO doesn't do much for most people...YET!!

(2) Also...how much are you going to have to pay for EV-DO versus Sprint's unlimited $10 plan!??!

(3) Is that slider reliable?? Haven't used it nor do I care. I use the keyboard A LOT...I use it to launch programs (I.e. hold X for calculator, hold C for Camera, hold W for Web, hold V for Versamail, hold P for PTunes, hold T for TCPMP...get the pic??) and obviously for typing, which I do a lot.

(4) The screen might be bigger...but it's got a poorer resolution. I love the pixel density of the Treo's screen...No other handheld has a 320x320 pixels in a 2" X 2" screen.

(5) The Treo still has a slightly smaller footprint, prolly a lot more if you don't include the Treo's antenna. Don't have an i730 in hand to really tell myself though.

(6) The Treo's battery life is prolly 2 to 3 times larger than the i730...and much longer if you decide you want to use the WiFi on the i730 often (but that's your choice)

(7) The i730 has a 1.3 megapixal camera, but that doesn't mean jack if it doesn't have a good quality lens...I'll have to wait until I see comparison photos.

(8) PPC has a few downfalls (honestly, prolly less than PalmSource, but i can deal with it since I've got free apps that work on Palm's excellent hardware) such as the 5-way not working very well....and then there's the lack of free software again....also the fact that you're contributing to that evil sith lord's empire!!

(9) It's more expensive than the Treo

So after all that....the only thing it's got on the Treo is EV-DO (which nobody's doubting that the next Treo will have) and WiFi!!! And EV-DO can't really be that great yet if it's not available everywhere and is prolly overpriced (especially from Verizon).

What is their cost for EV-DO access BTW?? And does anybody have a link to Verizon's EV-DO coverage map??

[darnell]

I have a problem with selfish people. Bill Gates is selfish...as are most advocates of capitalism.

http://www.gatesfoundation.org/default.htm

Like most opponents of capitalists you ignore all that we give.

Bottom line is WiFi can offer the fastest connection. So it should be and will be in the next Treo.

[Geckotek]

I'm NOT assuming you want to carry around your laptop all the time...I certainly don't. I said in the airport, which would mean you're traveling. I travel all the time, and NEVER without my laptop (what true geek could travel without a laptop?). No matter where I go, I get broadband like speeds due to the tabs in firefox. I close one tab, and the next page is already open. I can't download a gig of movies, but I don't want to do that when I'm traveling...if I needed to, I could, but I haven't yet...nor wanted to.

You're right about not wanting to pull it out for "casual surfing and checking email"...that's what I own a Treo 650 for. No matter where I am, I can do that. But, I'd gladly pull out my laptop for casual surfing if I were going to be sitting down in an airport for an hour. But if I don't have my laptop...got the next best thing -- my Treo. WiFi will not make it into the Treo. I seriously doubt they'd put it on there without Palm Linux. Why do I think they won't?? Let's go over all the reasons: (1) Because it's going to cost them extra money to add WiFi. (2) One less feature to get you to upgrade to the next next Treo (the 750). (3) Millions of people have bought Treos already and they have proven they didn't care about WiFi. (4) Palm OS 5 can't seamlessly roam between cellular towers and WiFi. (5) Speaking of cellular towers, the conservative carriers (Cingular & Verizon) prolly don't want you to have the option of not using their data plan even though most would use it anyway. (5) WiFi is too much of a battery hog!! (6) In Palm's research, they've prolly found that WiFi will not be a dealbreaker for most people; hence, WiFi in this particular smartphone being a sub-niche (OK, maybe not sub-niche, but at least niche) market. But we can only wait and see, I guess.



It's $10/mo for a data plan with Sprint...not too much of a drag on my wallet considering it's got a much greater coverage area than your silly WiFi spots.

I don't have those free WiFi spots like you, though...you're in that niche market I've been repeatedly talking about. What amount of time do you spend inside those WiFi hotspots versus outside of them (and remember we're talking about hotspots, not when you're at home or office in front of your desktop)??

For what reason would you want to browse your local network from the Treo?? If you want to browse your local network, then use your cellular data connection. If you're trying to up/download files on your local network, bluetooth would work just fine (not the best for data transfer, I agree, but certainly good enough for MOST and at least it wouldn't drain your battery as easily).

The ONLY areas again, that I see WiFi being useful are VoIP (which isn't happening on Palm 'til Palm Linux) and these hotspots where people spend such a minority of their time. And even in that hotspot, you've got your own hotspot, albeit a slower one....maybe a coldspot, but enough to get some browsing done for sure.

Mark my words...WiFi ain't comin' in the next Treo. It prolly won't hit the Treo lineup until Palm Linux is released!!!

WOW!!!! Way to much crap to respond to!!!! But here are a couple off the top of my head:

1) Sprint's $10 plan does not cover EV-DO...WiFi is WAY faster than the 1xRTT and given a choice I would connect to WiFi anyday instead of paying the $40-$90 EV-DO rates. And all the other carriers are more expensive on their data plans.

2) Sprint announced EV-DO in 34 markets yesterday. While not as much as 1xRTT, it's WAY more than enough to make it serious.

3) By your argument of not including upgrades till the next feature, the 650 would be much less of a machine than it is.....ACTUALLY, the 600 would have had WAY fewer features. More than likely there was a technical and/or cost reason the 650 didn't have WiFi, but I'll bet that reason has been overcome. But one other consideration is the carrier and it appears that Verizon had the SX-66 WiFi removed, so that could be the case for the next Treo on some carriers.....but not all (just like the SX-66.) Oh, and the SX-66 is selling very well despite what you say (my company alone has purchased several of them in the past month.)

I'll have to gather my thoughts on other responses, but I'm not gonna get into the whole capitalism argument crap. Pointless and off topic.

Edit: Oh, although I know what you are getting at, this makes absolutely no sense at all! "No matter where I go, I get broadband like speeds due to the tabs in firefox."


Another thought....who needs seamless roaming between towers and WiFi?!! When I'm in an WiFi zone, I can disconnect from the network and connecto to WiFi....simple.

Why browse my local network? Let's start by controlling my HTPC. That's just one of several examples I could come up with. And why use cellular when I am sitting in a house covered by WiFi?? And yes, when I'm at home I would often prefer to use my phone than drag out my laptop. And BT is not fine, it doesn't cover all 3 floors of my house like my WiFi and it's to slow.

Just because ppl buy a 650 w/o WiFi doesn't mean the don't care about WiFi and doesn't mean they won't care more about WiFi when other units on the market are offering it. And I guess all those ppl that bought the SX-66 proved there are ppl who DO care about WiFi. What about all the ppl buying the WiFi SD card? Do they care about WiFi?

It cost extra money to add features everytime they upgrade a unit, yet they do it....invalid argument.

Conservative carriers don't want you off their data plan? Cingular has WiFi on the SX-66....invalid argument

You have seen Palm's research?!?! Wow, share it with us!

BTW, I'm not in Austin and I don't have crazy WiFi coverage. But I want the feature to be available to use when I have the opportunity to use it (I piggyback on my roommies T-Mobile hotspot account for one...my Church and favorite non-Starbucks coffee shop have free WiFi as well.)

Oh, did I forget to mention the native support for WiFi in Windows Mobile 5.0? I guess M$ thinks WiFi is important in a Smartphone.

[grndslm]

EXACTLY...why use cellular when sitting in a house covered by WiFi?? Don't you have REAL computers?? Bluetooth goes more than 600 feet if you have the proper adapter...that's when you could use it at an office or your home. And the speeds are prolly just as fast as your broadband connection can throw at you...unless you have a T3 or somethin'.

Just because ppl buy a 650 w/o WiFi doesn't mean the don't care about WiFi and doesn't mean they won't care more about WiFi when other units on the market are offering it. And I guess all those ppl that bought the SX-66 proved there are ppl who DO care about WiFi. What about all the ppl buying the WiFi SD card? Do they care about WiFi?

Most don't really care about WiFi, though, compared to cellular networks/radios and bluetooth...I'm about to start a poll to get this topic over with until Palm actually releases the real phone.

It cost extra money to add features everytime they upgrade a unit, yet they do it....invalid argument.

Valid argument, remember. Capitalist country...the goal of large businesses is not to innovate, it's to make money! Capital=money=power! In this game, Palm is winning and will continue to win by delaying WiFi for one more upgrade. After that, then they start to lose a little ground.

Conservative carriers don't want you off their data plan? Cingular has WiFi on the SX-66....invalid argument

Nobody buys the SX-66, at least compared to the 650. But yea, for the most part, you got me there. I honestly don't care what phone is released in the next 11 months 'cause I know it's not going to compare to whatever Palm's top model is at the time. But I prolly still won't be upgrading for another year after that point that I start looking at phones again.

You have seen Palm's research?!?! Wow, share it with us!

Haven't you been listening...It says, NO WIFI, BEECHES! It's even worded just like that at the top of one of those pages...yup.

BTW, I'm not in Austin and I don't have crazy WiFi coverage. But I want the feature to be available to use when I have the opportunity to use it (I piggyback on my roommies T-Mobile hotspot account for one...my Church and favorite non-Starbucks coffee shop have free WiFi as well.)

That piggybacking stuff isn't very moral now is it, Mr. Church-goer. Also, aren't there more important things to do at Church besides check if TreoCentral's homepage has been updated yet?? I seriously doubt you people would really use WiFi that much unless if you required it for work, lived on a college campus, or needed to use VoIP. I don't see Church or the occasional coffee shop as a good enough reason to DEMAND that this smartphone which is good enough as is be upgraded with WiFi. You could try the bluetooth reverse DUN, though...maybe try getting a Class 1 USB....What do you do at work that would require it?

Oh, did I forget to mention the native support for WiFi in Windows Mobile 5.0? I guess M$ thinks WiFi is important in a Smartphone.

We've already gone over this....they're the ones doing the catch up. Of course they're going to do whatever they can...competition is a great thing (not to be confused with capitalism; I still think competition could be possible without it..again, another convo, another thread). But a lotta customer base already belongs to Palm and I think that's what keeps Apple rolling along as well.

The thing I'm trying to point out is not how many devices have WiFi, or that there might actually be a coupla good uses for WiFi on the Treo. But what I am saying is that it's not going to be a deal breaker for most Treo users; hence, it ain't happenin', guys!

[darnell]

Interesting to see someone who does not live close to any WiFi areas comment on how people are using it .

[grndslm]

SORRY ABOUT THE ABOVE POST, Somethin's wrong with my internet connection or TreoCentral, but it didn't post it all...so this is the entire repost, including the bottom half from 2 posts up:

"

WOW!!!! Way to much crap to respond to!!!!

Agreed...completely.

1) Sprint's $10 plan does not cover EV-DO...WiFi is WAY faster than the 1xRTT and given a choice I would connect to WiFi anyday instead of paying the $40-$90 EV-DO rates. And all the other carriers are more expensive on their data plans.

I realize that Sprint's price doesn't cover EV-DO and that other carriers are higher. That's why I have Sprint and am not upgrading my Treo 650 until there's a phone with Palm Linux, EV-DO, AND Wi-FI. It'll happen in two years, not one. And at the absolute most, three years.

2) Sprint announced EV-DO in 34 markets yesterday. While not as much as 1xRTT, it's WAY more than enough to make it serious.

It's most definitely serious, but not that much. How many total markets does Sprint have?? Take 34 outta that number and it's geographically going to be a tiny area. For travelers, which includes a large number of 650 users...most will prolly wait for the price to come down a little or perhaps replace our broadband connection at home with EV-DO...I'd certainly have to if paying those prices.

3) By your argument of not including upgrades till the next feature, the 650 would be much less of a machine than it is.....ACTUALLY, the 600 would have had WAY fewer features. More than likely there was a technical and/or cost reason the 650 didn't have WiFi, but I'll bet that reason has been overcome. But one other consideration is the carrier and it appears that Verizon had the SX-66 WiFi removed, so that could be the case for the next Treo on some carriers.....but not all (just like the SX-66.) Oh, and the SX-66 is selling very well despite what you say (my company alone has purchased several of them in the past month.)

I've already told you like a bajillion reasons that WiFi wasn't in the 650 and won't be in the 700. I'm not going to be typing in this thread or in response to slinky anymore. Between these two, I can't find time to eat and ****.

But anyway, the 600 did have WAY fewer features than it should...and so did the 650...One reason I hate capitalism (Could have doubled the RAM on the Treo if they had spent like $5 more per Treo (if even that much); I woulda gladly paid an extra $5 or $10 even for RAM, but this could prolly be the first thing to irritate me in the future when looking at newer phones slip past me without my touch).

Edit: Oh, although I know what you are getting at, this makes absolutely no sense at all! "No matter where I go, I get broadband like speeds due to the tabs in firefox."

Well....everyday I get on my computer, I start by clicking bookmarks, going to my "EVERYDAY" folder at the top that has (you guessed it) the websites I visit daily, and right-clicking it to Open all of them in multiple tabs at once. I've done this on a couple trips already with the Bluetooth DUN. After the first webpage is down downloading (It's Slashdot by the way; LINK: http://www.slashdot.org), I read it...When I close it...all of the other 18 or so websites have already downloaded in the background. I never have to wait for anything with tabs...no matter how fast my connection is. Sometimes I wonder why I pay for broadband anymore, 'cause I don't download massive (mostly illegal) multimedia files anymore. I think most people could live without broadband if they knew about Firefox.

Another thought....who needs seamless roaming between towers and WiFi?!! When I'm in an WiFi zone, I can disconnect from the network and connecto to WiFi....simple.

I'd rather not get WiFi 'til Palm Linux was out so that I could seamlessly roam between whatever wireless connection provides good enough signal for VoIP!! Other than that, I've already said I don't want WiFi on my phone 'til more WiFi spots show up around here (Not likely) or I move to a college campus (Gettin' tired of this community college sheet)...now that I think about it, going to school where I'm surrounded by WiFi makes me want to cross-over. Just for a second, though...I can wait 'til Palm Linux comes and I can cancel Sprint's service altogether...I'm only kidding Sprint. I'd never do it!

Why browse my local network? Let's start by controlling my HTPC. That's just one of several examples I could come up with.

Good one. Now come up with one more. What HTPC do you have by the way?? I was considering building a MythTV PVR outta some fanless components so that I could truly leave it on. But I'm gonna have to wait for one more year maybe to get the components that I really want.

And why use cellular when I am sitting in a house covered by WiFi?? And yes, when I'm at home I would often prefer to use my phone than drag out my laptop. And BT is not fine, it doesn't cover all 3 floors of my house like my WiFi and it's to slow.

EXACTLY...why use cellular when sitting in a house covered by WiFi?? Don't you have REAL computers?? Bluetooth goes more than 600 feet if you have the proper adapter...that's when you could use it at an office or your home. And the speeds are prolly just as fast as your broadband connection can throw at you...unless you have a T3 or somethin'.

Just because ppl buy a 650 w/o WiFi doesn't mean the don't care about WiFi and doesn't mean they won't care more about WiFi when other units on the market are offering it. And I guess all those ppl that bought the SX-66 proved there are ppl who DO care about WiFi. What about all the ppl buying the WiFi SD card? Do they care about WiFi?

Most don't really care about WiFi, though, compared to cellular networks/radios and bluetooth...I'm about to start a poll to get this topic over with until Palm actually releases the real phone.

It cost extra money to add features everytime they upgrade a unit, yet they do it....invalid argument.

Valid argument, remember. Capitalist country...the goal of large businesses is not to innovate, it's to make money! Capital=money=power! In this game, Palm is winning and will continue to win by delaying WiFi for one more upgrade. After that, then they start to lose a little ground.

Conservative carriers don't want you off their data plan? Cingular has WiFi on the SX-66....invalid argument

Nobody buys the SX-66, at least compared to the 650. But yea, for the most part, you got me there. I honestly don't care what phone is released in the next 11 months 'cause I know it's not going to compare to whatever Palm's top model is at the time. But I prolly still won't be upgrading for another year after that point that I start looking at phones again.

You have seen Palm's research?!?! Wow, share it with us!

Haven't you been listening...It says, NO WIFI, BEECHES! It's even worded just like that at the top of one of those pages...yup.

BTW, I'm not in Austin and I don't have crazy WiFi coverage. But I want the feature to be available to use when I have the opportunity to use it (I piggyback on my roommies T-Mobile hotspot account for one...my Church and favorite non-Starbucks coffee shop have free WiFi as well.)

That piggybacking stuff isn't very moral now is it, Mr. Church-goer. Also, aren't there more important things to do at Church besides check if TreoCentral's homepage has been updated yet?? I seriously doubt you people would really use WiFi that much unless if you required it for work, lived on a college campus, or needed to use VoIP. I don't see Church or the occasional coffee shop as a good enough reason to DEMAND that this smartphone which is good enough as is be upgraded with WiFi. You could try the bluetooth reverse DUN, though...maybe try getting a Class 1 USB....What do you do at work that would require it?

Oh, did I forget to mention the native support for WiFi in Windows Mobile 5.0? I guess M$ thinks WiFi is important in a Smartphone.

We've already gone over this....they're the ones doing the catch up. Of course they're going to do whatever they can...competition is a great thing (not to be confused with capitalism; I still think competition could be possible without it..again, another convo, another thread). But a lotta customer base already belongs to Palm and I think that's what keeps Apple rolling along as well.

The thing I'm trying to point out is not how many devices have WiFi, or that there might actually be a coupla good uses for WiFi on the Treo. But what I am saying is that it's not going to be a deal breaker for most Treo users; hence, it ain't happenin', guys!"

[shadowmite]

I think enough is enough, a mod should close this thread about now. Leave it at this please:

Bluetooth was designed for portable devices and as such gets incredible battery life.

Wifi was designed for stationary devices and as such EATS power ALWAYS... Any cell phone with wifi built in will be a mistake as the customer will soon be complaining about how the vendor could design such a horrible battery life.

That's not to say it won't happen, but I'd consider wifi doubtful in the treo in the future except via add-on devices.

The End.

[darnell]

I find a few hours of streaming can take the battery down a good bit too. Which is why I keep a spare power adapter handy. Anyone using WiFi would probably do something similar or carry a spare battery.

Why some folks desire that the Treo be limited in it's features I'll never know .

Hope you all are not disappointed when WiFi is in the next release.

[grndslm]

Sorry oh holy Shadowmite...but I already typed this up before I read your post, so here goes:

"

http://www.gatesfoundation.org/default.htm

Christopher Reeves never gave a damn about people with paralysis 'til he got it; then he started giving money to cure paralysis for the rest of his life. Doesn't mean that the money was given outta sincerity.

Just because Gates has $60 billion doesn't mean that any percentage of that money will be given outta sincerity. It would be tough for someone to be that rich and not feel just a little bad for how much money he holds and some people can't even get a bite to eat...or go for a year without having their homes and lives ruined by hurricanes, etc.

OK, so Gates could release the source code of his operating system AND still have enough money to pay like a ton of people to start programming open source applications (that might actually be worth a dern). He could, but he won't because he's selfish. Just because he gives away like 10% of his money doesn't mean he's not selfish. It's not like he even NEEDS a couple million dollars, let alone 50-100 BILLION!! The type of people that I'd prefer with 50 to 100 billion dollars are selfless people. But it's tough to find people who are selfless in an environment that advocates the distribution of power to as few people as possible as opposed to the distribution of power among all people. But again...if you really wanna talk about this, start another thread, I'm constantly having to force myself back on topic after you praise capitalism like I praise the choices that Palm makes.

Like most opponents of capitalists you ignore all that we give.

So, you were one of the jackarses that voted for Bush, eh? I thought you lived in the United States of Canada, city boy?? Wutch ya doin' promotin' for those red staters?

No, man...it's the exact opposite of that. You see it as ignoring what you give, but what I'm really focusing on is how much you hoard.

Bottom line is WiFi can offer the fastest connection.

Not a single person on this planet is arguing with you about that.

So it should be and will be in the next Treo.

How exactly do you jump to that conclusion with so little factors?? I spit out like a ton of reasons it won't be there, but you still arrogantly deny it because of my hometown (which you still couldn't tell me, yet continue to think it's the anti-WiFi capital of the world or something...so that explains grndslm's weird behavior...wish I woulda known before this debate started) and the fact that WiFi's the fastest connection. But you're ignoring the drawbacks of WiFi on a cell phone, like battery life for one.

Interesting to see someone who does not live close to any WiFi areas comment on how people are using it .

I love how you know everything about me based on where my parents decided to raise me, my age, and also my current profession.

But let's come up with a list, shall we? How many reasons are there to have WiFi over a cellular radio and bluetooth?? Three reasons to use it.

You would perhaps be using it for business usage or for classes because carrying books and laptops to class become irrelevant...say, perhaps you had some type of database that logged inventory, or tracked other employee data, or whatever. I'd really enjoy reading what some of you corporate conservative sons a beeches use your PDAs for that requires so much data throughput. Once and for all, I'm not saying you're not out there, but I am saying you're in a niche area for what the Treo is targeting.

You could use it in Starbucks, maybe a couple T-Mobile hotspots, or whatever...but wouldn't you want to finally take a break from using your Treo everywhere else in the country. Not to say that you couldn't use your 1xRTT connection to look something up using Wassdat (LINK:http://www.pocketscience.com) in Starbucks. However, maybe you could consider making friends while you drink coffee instead of sucking up everything that you think you need but really have no use for at all. Just know that all this speed you crave is making you sound like a fiend. If I were you, I'd consider seeing a psychiatrist because you're going to need a lotta medication to calm you down after Palm disappoints with no WiFi on the next Treo) We should be seeing the specs of this next model pretty soon. Anybody remember when the specs for the 650 were purposely released, **AHEM** purposely released, last year??

You could use them at paid hotspots, but you prolly don't want to spend that money since you're already paying for Sprint's $10 service.

You wouldn't be using it at your house...you've got a full-fledged screen, keyboard, and operating system for this use...if absolutely necessary, you could use bluetooth reverse DUN with a class 1 usb adapter.

You wouldn't be using it at your office...for the same dern reason...and again, if absolutely necessary, you could use bluetooth reverse DUN with a class 1 usb adapter.

You wouldn't use it at church, because God already hates you enough as it is.

You wouldn't use it for VoIP since you have a much more reliable and reasonable cellular phone...unless it was the business or college campus examples where you're constantly underneath this WiFi blanket. VoIP ain't happenin' on OS 5 anyway...need to wait for Palm Linux which is going to take a good year at least, making it hop frequencies seamless between WiFi (WiMax, maybe even) networks and the cell towers.

You wouldn't use it in an airport, because you've got your laptop to do the DUN thing while the tabbed viewing puts your entire data connection to work all at once where you don't even notice the obiously inferior speed to wifi. As long as you're not downloading some ginormous media file, I promise that you'd never be able to tell a difference between broadband and 1xRTT. (Don't travel with your laptop? Sell the laptop! Enjoy having limited input and output areas experienced on the Treo. Don't have a laptop? Buy one and get a bluetooth usb adapter or make sure it has bluetooth already; the latter if you've got the money).

ANY MORE PRACTICAL USES OF WIFI WOULD GLADLY BE ACCEPTED ON THIS LIST. Let's hear 'em, guys.

[grndslm]

I think enough is enough, a mod should close this thread about now. Leave it at this please:

Bluetooth was designed for portable devices and as such gets incredible battery life.

Wifi was designed for stationary devices and as such EATS power ALWAYS... Any cell phone with wifi built in will be a mistake as the customer will soon be complaining about how the vendor could design such a horrible battery life.

That's not to say it won't happen, but I'd consider wifi doubtful in the treo in the future except via add-on devices.

The End.

Thank you, kind sir...except for the closing the thread bit. I so enjoy arguing over nothing all day!!

[grndslm]

I find a few hours of streaming can take the battery down a good bit too. Which is why I keep a spare power adapter handy. Anyone using WiFi would probably do something similar or carry a spare battery.

This is true, I didn't think about that. But where ya gonna use that battery if you're outside the niche of a business, college campus, starbucks??? Palm forces this niche to get a Windows Mobile device, but they don't care because they're the ones with the larger smartphone customer base.

Why some folks desire that the Treo be limited in it's features I'll never know .

You and slinky are really upsetting me by not being able to comprehend the English language. Nobody said they wouldn't take it if it were there...we were arguing over whether Palm considered it reasonable to place in the next upgrade or not, NO??

[darnell]

This is true, I didn't think about that.

Yea you miss a bit.

Anyone outside can carry a spare battery if they were going to need it.

If you enjoy being held back in features that is fine. I hope Palm makes a Treo just for you. But Palm will meet the market and have WiFi in the next Treo.

As for your other ignorant ramblings. Maybe after you get beyond college life you'll learn how the real world works and stop endorsing failed economic models.

[grndslm]

Yea you miss a bit.

I admit I hadn't thought of your point of view of swapping batteries...and you say that sheet?? It's not even like I was wrong, we weren't arguing about that. We were arguing over whether WiFi would be put in the next Treo or not, dang man...keep it together!!

I love the details of your comment, at least I have the decency to point stuff out to you...you make these vague statements like "You miss a bit"...what else was I wrong about?? I'd accept the "carriers not wanting WiFi" argument as one possible answer, but you can't prove that I'm wrong. Most who need a WiFi device as much as you say the market needs it, wouldn't have the need for the cellular data. I'd guess that the carriers are also influencing Palm to keep WiFi out as they have the MONEY and POWER to do so as they are the main buyers of cell phones.

Anyone outside can carry a spare battery if they were going to need it.

Thanks for the reminder. But you still act as if that's really acceptable. As if that's any different from using flaky WiFi on an OS that wasn't designed for networking. You can use WiFi now if you really want and do that little battery switch, but it's not going to get any better with this next upgrade. I'm about to show you in a poll, essay!

If you enjoy being held back in features that is fine. I hope Palm makes a Treo just for you. But Palm will meet the market and have WiFi in the next Treo.

FOR THE MILLIONTH TIME, HOMESLICE...I don't enjoy being held back, but IT'S NOT A DEALBREAKER FOR THE MAJORITY OF TREO USERS! FINAL ANSWER! You are very correct in Palm meeting market expectations alright...but are definitely wrong about it having WiFi. I'm ignoring every comment you make stating that the next Treo will have WiFi...it's gotten really old.

As for your other ignorant ramblings. Maybe after you get beyond college life you'll learn how the real world works and stop endorsing failed economic models.

Dude, you're the biggest nutsac I've ever met on this forum. You've finally gotten above the ranks of Slinky. Actually you've been there for awhile, considering Slinky didn't know any better. He's only had this phone for like 2 weeks, if even that.

That's it!! NOW this thread has ended and the new polls and threads begin.

[darnell]

Dude, you're the biggest nutsac I've ever met on this forum.

Knew it would not take long for you to resort to childish names.

So predictable!

[Geckotek]

Ok, again way too much crap, it's late, and I have an early morning meeting for Habitat. So, I'll keep this short.

1) I have a real PC, but NOT in every corner of my house. And NO, BT does not penetrate very well and cannot cover all 3 floors of my house like my WiFi can (besides, I already own a WiFi, AP...why spend more for a stronger BT AP)

2) Piggybacking on my roommate's account is perfectly legal and moral since we reside in the same houshold...not to mention he pretty much stopped using it and gave it over to me (and I've only used it twice.)

3) I don't browse during Church service dood, but I am there enough to use the WiFi at other times

4) You talk like you work for Palm and what you are saying is all fact. That annoys the crap out of me and I'm guessing others. I'll admit (and hopefully I've expressed things in a way) that I don't KNOW. I am purely making conjecture based on what I know about marketing and technology. Unless you work for Palm, at least admit that what you are saying is your opinion and conjecture. Stop stating things as fact.

5) Although Shadow may be correct in saying it will be an add-on solution, (but I still think it will be built-in due to market pressures) either way I'm convinced the next Treo will include WiFi in some form or fashion.

6) This is the last post I'll make here. It's very obvious that we will not convince each other of anything.

[yeah yeah]

the treo 700, 750, or whatever it's going to be called. i can pretty much guarantee that it wont be much of an upgrade from the 600/650. MAYBE have ev-do. might have 48mb of ram. stretch for 64. i mean...y'all need to be real with this. how much of an upgrade was the 300 to 600...besides form factor...? and from the 600 to 650. the 650 is one of sprint's top selling phones. why change drastic when you're already the top seller out there...? people are GENERALLY happy with the phone. besides internet geeks and all that...most people are fine with the phone. so i doubt you see much change. a lil more memory...some change in the OS and form factor. then you got your treo 700.

[grndslm]

1) I have a real PC, but NOT in every corner of my house. And NO, BT does not penetrate very well and cannot cover all 3 floors of my house like my WiFi can (besides, I already own a WiFi, AP...why spend more for a stronger BT AP)

Well, you might consider buying a stronger BT AP because you can use your Treo as you're wishing for...in every corner of your house. This is the kinda stuff that drags out for far too long. Nobody except for Bill gates has a real PC in every corner of his house. Somebody mentioned that BT and WiFi were different...I said, Nope...they're virtually the same: "data transmission" and not if you're only planning on using this at one single location, where a BT AP would provide you with the same data throughput up to 600 feet without the battery leakage and trouble of flaky wifi drivers....if your 3 story house is taller than 600 feet, invite me over some time. Wifi's semi-ubiquitousness in cities is the only thing it's got goin' for itself when it comes to cell phones.

2) Piggybacking on my roommate's account is perfectly legal and moral since we reside in the same houshold...not to mention he pretty much stopped using it and gave it over to me (and I've only used it twice.)

OK...sounds perfectly alright to me. I'm convinced.

3) I don't browse during Church service dood, but I am there enough to use the WiFi at other times

Makes sense if you volunteer for something, or are a paid youth director or something. But maybe you could ask for a computer if you spend that much time there. Or get one donated if it's that important. Call me crazy, but I'm gonna go out on a limb here and say that it isn't.

4) You talk like you work for Palm and what you are saying is all fact. That annoys the crap out of me and I'm guessing others. I'll admit (and hopefully I've expressed things in a way) that I don't KNOW. I am purely making conjecture based on what I know about marketing and technology. Unless you work for Palm, at least admit that what you are saying is your opinion and conjecture. Stop stating things as fact.

I certainly don't work for Palm...and I'm spittin' out the same same conjecture (well, I guess it's slightly different, but it's still conjecture) you are about marketing & technology. I think most people could pick up the sarcasm in me saying NO WIFI BEECHES. I hope no corporation, would say something that ridiculous. It's been thrown around this forum several times that I'm a college student. Palm, if you wanna hire me as an intern, give me a holla!

5) Although Shadow may be correct in saying it will be an add-on solution, (but I still think it will be built-in due to market pressures) either way I'm convinced the next Treo will include WiFi in some form or fashion.

Maybe this, maybe that...but the answer to your false conjecture is nope.

6) This is the last post I'll make here. It's very obvious that we will not convince each other of anything.

Agreed. New thread.

[ronbo2000]

Closed