[jetkins]

sorry jetkins but is the checkpoint only with the reg version??

Don't know - I've never used the demo. I'm using version 3.07.

[mavie]

Have you guys tried CardBackup? Its an awesome backup application - its core features are free too (shareware).

You can find it at: http://www.jkware.com/CardBackup.php

[Silverstring]

Yes, restoring is the true test, and I've had most of them fail at a restore... another important feature to me is encryption so God forbid if my card falls into the wrong hands my data's safe....

So which program do you use, then?

I'm looking hard at Backup Buddy VFS, since I have a MAc, and the desktop application won't work for me.

[fkjr2]

I just purchased BackupMan and I've got two cases where it was better than just hotsyncing.

The first case happened when I had installed a program that my Treo didn't like and it reset and lost all my settings and application registrations. Unfortunatly, I didn't notice the problem before I had hotsynced again. Unfortunatly, because hotsyncing only saves one backup it was too late for me to restore my settings. I had to reconfigure my Treo and my apps manually and that's what convinced me to get BackupMan in the first place.

The second case happened just tonight. I had just left the house and was on my way to dinner with my wife. This time my Treo reset itself out of the blue and again I lost all of my settings and registrations. In this case, though, I had been using BackupMan and I had it set to automatically back up to SD card every night. In this case I was able to restore last nights backup and I was up and running again in less than 5 minutes. Admittedly I could have waited until I got home after dinner and restored with a hotsync, but it would have been a pain to use the treo until thin... and if I was heading away from home to go to work or for a vacation instead of just dinner it would have been even more of a pain.

BackupMan is definitely worth the $10 in my opinion.

does the phone part need to be off for Bup man to backup/restore properly?

[Chillin_]

I have a question regarding Backup Programs: What exactly do they backup?

What I mean is there are a few files that don't seem to get backed up during HotSync, so when I have a need to do a Hard Reset they are lost.

It is none of my important data, it is things like my game high scores, annoying to lose, but not vital.

So, will a backup program backup Everything that is on my Treo?

[hofo_mofo]

let me put it to you this way chillin....i did not see the need for a backup program....HOWEVER! randomly my treo will erase all my preferences and such...so whenever that happens i would have a clean state that i could restore to (with backupman)

the state that i would choose, would most likely be the first one I made after i configured all my settings...ie put in the serials, paired with the bt products etc

[Chillin_]

let me put it to you this way chillin....i did not see the need for a backup program....HOWEVER! randomly my treo will erase all my preferences and such...so whenever that happens i would have a clean state that i could restore to (with backupman)

the state that i would choose, would most likely be the first one I made after i configured all my settings...ie put in the serials, paired with the bt products etc

Never used a Backup program, but wouldn't that put the entire contents of your Treo to the state when you made the Backup?

What I mean is I thought a Backup was like a Snapshot of your Treo. So, when you want to restore from a backup it makes Everything on your Treo look exactly like the Snapshot (meaning any and all data from when you took the snapshot to when you re-applied it is lost.) No?

[jetkins]

What I mean is I thought a Backup was like a Snapshot of your Treo. So, when you want to restore from a backup it makes Everything on your Treo look exactly like the Snapshot (meaning any and all data from when you took the snapshot to when you re-applied it is lost.) No?

Yes. And no. A full backup and restore should result in a machine that's almost exactly as it was before. The differences will depend on exactly where your applications save their preferences.

The Palm OS handles preferences in two "flavours": Saved Preferences and Unsaved Preferences. As the names suggest, only one of these is backed up and restored by the normal Palm backup process. In fact, I understand that Palm's development guidelines state that Unsaved Preferences should not be backed up and restored, yet most VFS backup utilities do.

Not being a developer, I'm unsure what factors influence the decision of which to use, but this does help explain why a backup and restore does not always leave things exactly as they were, and also go some way to explaining why different backup apps have varying degrees of success in different scenarios.

[Chillin_]

Yes. And no. A full backup and restore should result in a machine that's almost exactly as it was before. The differences will depend on exactly where your applications save their preferences.

The Palm OS handles preferences in two "flavours": Saved Preferences and Unsaved Preferences. As the names suggest, only one of these is backed up and restored by the normal Palm backup process. In fact, I understand that Palm's development guidelines state that Unsaved Preferences should not be backed up and restored, yet most VFS backup utilities do.

Not being a developer, I'm unsure what factors influence the decision of which to use, but this does help explain why a backup and restore does not always leave things exactly as they were, and also go some way to explaining why different backup apps have varying degrees of success in different scenarios.

OK, this makes sense, but leaves me with 2 questions:

1. if a restore will effectively put your Treo back in time to (almost) exactly where it was when you did the backup then why would HoFo_MoFo be using his earliest restore point when he needs to backup? (as he said here "the state that i would choose, would most likely be the first one I made after i configured all my settings") would he then not be losing all his data from that point forward?

2. the saved/unsaved preferences explain why many of my game high scores etc. are lost after a H.R. So, just to be clear, if I was using a Backup program (that does backup Unsaved prefs.) I will not lose that data after a H.R.? Meaning (depending on settings, etc.) I will lose Absolutely Nothing after a Hard Reset, is I am using a Backup program?

[jetkins]

why would HoFo_MoFo be using his earliest restore point when he needs to backup? (as he said here "the state that i would choose, would most likely be the first one I made after i configured all my settings") would he then not be losing all his data from that point forward?

Yes, he would lose any configuration changes made after that point. But as he says, he would use the earliest backup after he had completed making all his changes. This would avoid any possible "creeping malaise" that might have caused imperceptable corruption to the Preferences databases. Think of it as restoring to a "last known good" configuration.

So, just to be clear, if I was using a Backup program (that does backup Unsaved prefs.) I will not lose that data after a H.R.? Meaning (depending on settings, etc.) I will lose Absolutely Nothing after a Hard Reset, is I am using a Backup program?

Everything is stored in memory, hence if you use a backup utility that successfully backs up and restores the entire contents of every file in memory, then by definition, you will lose nothing.

To expand further on the preferences thing, applications are not restricted to storing their preferences only in the system Preference databases, though that's apparently the preferred method. But should he so desire, a developer might instead decide to create his own database (or .pdb file) and stick everything in there. DateBk5, for example, does a little of both, with the current prefs stored in the system database, while Saved Views are stored in its own Datebk5DB.pdb file. You could liken the two options to using either the Registry or a .ini file on a Windows system.

[IamVincent]

So which program do you use, then?

I'm looking hard at Backup Buddy VFS, since I have a MAc, and the desktop application won't work for me.

Right now I backup using several programs since I never know which will really provide a usable restore. I use BB VFS, RightBackUp and BackUp Man