[barky81]

Symbian licenses Microsoft Exchange Server ActiveSync Protocol for Symbian OS

Quoting: "Under the terms of the agreement, Symbian will develop an Exchange Server ActiveSync protocol – plug-in – for the Symbian OS messaging architecture to enable Symbian OS licensees – the world's leading mobile phone manufacturers – to include in their Symbian OS-based phones direct over-the-air (OTA) synchronization capabilities for email, calendar, contacts and other personal information management (PIM) data supported by Microsoft Exchange Server 2003 ."

Wait till you read the rest.

This was the sole point of distinction for the Treo 650 (NO other non-PPC phone offered this). Worse, PalmOne's implementation appears flawed.

If that firmware doesn't come out soon, and address these issues specifically, I now think the Treo 650 is well on its way to the Early Adopter Museum.

At this point, I cannot wait for an alternative to come out, so my wife can inherit mine.

[wolwol]

hmm, earliest they will have activesync with their symbian phones? 2006?

[westronic]

"First nail?" Time will tell...

Meantime, the Palm OS simply can't be beat for flexibility - so many people develop Palm software that you find find pretty much anything you want, which is still not true for any other PIM and/or phone OS. Maybe this will change over time, maybe not.

[thelonius#AC]

Keep watching the sky chicken little.

[techyogi]

didnt' palm license this as well months ago??/

[meyerweb]

People have been predicting the demise of Palm at least since it was part of 3Com. Somehow, it's managed to hang on. But if someday Palm dies, I'll either keep using my existing device, if it still meets my needs, or find something else. I'm certainly not going to worry about it now.

[robangel]

How does a coffin nail become official? Is there licensing for that sort of thing? I personally am against that kind of regulation. Also the coffin is going to have to be really little....and will my Sprint store carry it?

Seriously though..Have you all used a Symbian phone? I have and was not very impressed at all. Palm is pretty worry free and elegant. I am one who has consistently flipped flopped between Windows PPC and Palm for PDA's. I must admit although the PPC beats Palm in areas like multimedia integration, I've had a lot less headaches with Palm overall. My Symbian phone never progressed beyond its basic phone functions for me.

[defii]

How does a coffin nail become official? Is there licensing for that sort of thing? I personally am against that kind of regulation. Also the coffin is going to have to be really little....and will my Sprint store carry it?

Seriously though..Have you all used a Symbian phone? I have and was not very impressed at all. Palm is pretty worry free and elegant. I am one who has consistently flipped flopped between Windows PPC and Palm for PDA's. I must admit although the PPC beats Palm in areas like multimedia integration, I've had a lot less headaches with Palm overall. My Symbian phone never progressed beyond its basic phone functions for me.

I agree fully with your post. Right now I have an i-mate JAM and a Treo 650. There are pluses to each, with the Pocket PC prevailing in multimedia. However, the Treo stands tall in terms of full integration.

I tried a Symbian device (Nokia), but there was not the option to sync with my Mac, nor were applications I use extensively readily available for the Symbian OS.

[atnight]

in other news, sony is going to buy apple right before apple buys sony

[barky81]

Great replies, all of you. But.

First, I did not predict the end of palmOne, did I? I predicted a fairly abrupt end to the Treo 650's lifecycle.

Why? Because all of you "toy junkies" are NOT the intended market for the Treo 650: Corporate customers are/were. That's why it was the first non-PPC device to include Microsoft's licensed Exchange ActiveSync functionality--something I am pretty sure NONE of you have used or know anything about.

Thus, why should I be surprised at your quick, uninformed posts?

The implementation is a 2-step process:

Quoting: "Symbian will make the Exchange Server ActiveSync protocol plug-in available to all Symbian OS licensees which, when coupled with a separate standard distribution agreement with Microsoft, enables the licensees, at their discretion, to implement direct synchronization capabilities with Microsoft Exchange Server 2003 in their selected Symbian OS products with reduced time to market, improved interoperability and lower development costs."

So Symbian builds it into the core OS, and then individual phones can include it or not, based on their side licensing with Microsoft.

I am pretty sure you will see the Exchange ActiveSync functionality next in the upcoming Nokia business phones. After all, they've already signed their side agreement with Microsoft:

http://www.nokia.com/BaseProject/Sit...activesync.pdf

I am sorry I offended any of you. Enjoy your phones. You're all doing really good work here.

[Woof]

And how many corprate customers use Symbian?

Can your crystal ball do lottery numbers too?

[Woof]

Are these "official" nails carrying the Symbian or Microsoft Exchange logo? I mean if they are official that have to have some sort of logo right?

Can you post a pic? That would be really cool.

[treotim]

Hey Barky - as you know, I'm also pretty irritated with the flaws in P1's implementation of Activesync. However, I wouldn't go so far as to say this is the first nail in the coffin for the Treo 650. As a matter of fact, I think the story you quote is actually pretty irrelevant.

Why? Because P1's biggest competitor in the space you're describing is not a future Symbian phone with Activesync. It's the Blackberry - and Blackberry is the overwhelming leader in the corporate mobile email space.

So in reality, everyone is targeting the Blackberry with their new Activesync implementations - including P1. P1's failure to properly implement Activesync with its Versamail application is in reality just slowing down P1's potential growth in the corporate market.

It's good to see other competitors pushing forward with Activesync implementations. This should force P1 (if there is any intelligence there at all) to move more quickly in pushing out a fix for their implementation.

[darnell]

Why? Because all of you "toy junkies" are NOT the intended market for the Treo 650: Corporate customers are/were. That's why it was the first non-PPC device to include Microsoft's licensed Exchange ActiveSync functionality--something I am pretty sure NONE of you have used or know anything about.

You know what happens when people "assume".

Usually many tech toy junkies are techies themselves that make recommendations for corporate buys. Like I do. I also have a Blackberry that syncs in real time with MS Exchange. Still has not resulted in Blackberries crushing the Treo.

Plenty of corporate customers have no need to sync with MS Exchange and use the Treo every day. I was meeting with a consultant yesterday who has a T600 and is considering upgrading to a T650. Funny how syncing with MS Exchange never came up as a need for him .

So Symbian will have a feature Blackberries have had for years now. Does not mean P1 will not keep improving what they have and even without ActiveSync the Treo will remain a contender.

Even if the Treo 650 had ActiveSync that worked great most corporate buyers I know that demand ActiveSync would still use a Blackberry instead because they are cheaper. And they already do.

[westronic]

To tell you the truth, I am anxiously waiting for the Blackberry Connect software for Palm. My company does not (and maybe never will) support ActiveSynch but does already have Blackberry infrastructure, so that would be the best of both worlds for me!

[barky81]

And how many corprate customers use Symbian?

Can your crystal ball do lottery numbers too?

You know, asking stupid questions is kinda like saying, "hey, I'm stupid."

But since you clearly are NOT stupid, how about you give us the breakdown of corporate handset usage.

In the meantime, I'll go out on a limb and say:

More corporate customers are using Symbian os phones than Treos. Do you agree or disagree?

[barky81]

Are these "official" nails carrying the Symbian or Microsoft Exchange logo? I mean if they are official that have to have some sort of logo right?

Can you post a pic? That would be really cool.

Since you have so little knowledge of/experience with Exchange Activesync, although you have been clearly offended by this thread, it doesn't really apply to you.

But, yes, you are guilty of essentially trying to "water down" another potentially useful exchange of information with meaningless drivel.

Way to work the post count, though!

[barky81]

Hey Barky - as you know, I'm also pretty irritated with the flaws in P1's implementation of Activesync. However, I wouldn't go so far as to say this is the first nail in the coffin for the Treo 650. As a matter of fact, I think the story you quote is actually pretty irrelevant.

Why? Because P1's biggest competitor in the space you're describing is not a future Symbian phone with Activesync. It's the Blackberry - and Blackberry is the overwhelming leader in the corporate mobile email space.

So in reality, everyone is targeting the Blackberry with their new Activesync implementations - including P1. P1's failure to properly implement Activesync with its Versamail application is in reality just slowing down P1's potential growth in the corporate market.

It's good to see other competitors pushing forward with Activesync implementations. This should force P1 (if there is any intelligence there at all) to move more quickly in pushing out a fix for their implementation.

Well, for a second there, I thought you were disagreeing with me.

Again, all I said was that the Treo 650 (<--specific model) was getting it's lifecycle chopped off at the knees AMONG potential corporate users (<--specific market segment) BECAUSE their major selling advantage--Exchange Activesync (<--specific functionality) was being co-opted by a software platform that shipped more than 14 million units last year (and has been expanding its shipments by more than 100% per year for the last 3 years).

I completely agree with you that the fundamental competitor is Blackberry. My reference to the Early Adopter Museum was just my way of saying that Palm is blowing its chance with the Treo 650 unless it fixes the problems (<--specific qualification). But you are kidding yourself if you think it will be a 4-way battle among: (1) Blackberry, (2) PocketPC/Windows Smartphone, (3) PalmOne and (4) Symbian. It's already a 3-way with #2 and #4 fighting over the #2 spot (even though #4 hasn't shipped its first device). I am okay with this projection, because we will be able to come back every few months and check on it. Please, meet me here.

My organization has added 3 Treo 650s in the past 4 months (1 a replacement of a Treo 600), supporting Exchange Activesync to Exchange 2003. Will we continue? I don't know yet.

As I said, show me the fix, or show me an alternative device.

As a corporate user relying upon Exchange Activesync to access corporate data, this is a real problem and I am searching for a real solution. (The only reason we didn't adopt Blackberry Enterprise Server is the additional cost and complexity.)

[barky81]

You know what happens when people "assume".

Usually many tech toy junkies are techies themselves that make recommendations for corporate buys. Like I do. I also have a Blackberry that syncs in real time with MS Exchange. Still has not resulted in Blackberries crushing the Treo.

Plenty of corporate customers have no need to sync with MS Exchange and use the Treo every day. I was meeting with a consultant yesterday who has a T600 and is considering upgrading to a T650. Funny how syncing with MS Exchange never came up as a need for him .

So Symbian will have a feature Blackberries have had for years now. Does not mean P1 will not keep improving what they have and even without ActiveSync the Treo will remain a contender.

Even if the Treo 650 had ActiveSync that worked great most corporate buyers I know that demand ActiveSync would still use a Blackberry instead because they are cheaper. And they already do.

So, first, you carry 2 devices. That puts you in one camp. Me in another.

Second, you don't know anything about Exchange Activesync. Again, you in one camp. Me in another.

Third, you think it is cheaper to give your staff Treo 650s AND Blackberries and buy BOTH Exchange Server 2003 and a Blackberry Enterprise Server, INSTEAD of just Treo 650s and Exchange Server... Hate to say it, but: you in one camp. Me in another.

Fourth, you think that palmOne's market is getting T600 users to upgrade to T650s, but NOT use the additional functionality. (What was the "consultant's" rationale for the upgrade, given that they did NOT want Exchange Activesync?) I mean, after all that was your anecdote, right?

Fifth, and finally, you think this statement (which you made) "So Symbian will have a feature Blackberries have had for years now." is just of passing interest and not really relevant, so much so that, "even without ActiveSync the Treo will remain a contender." Say it with me now: you in one camp. Me in another.

The fight is about upsetting the Blackberry market. I think even RIM recognizes that it cannot survive as a separate device in a converging world. So the real question is Blackberry versus Exchange. Which is where this thread originated.

So my questions for you are: (1) A year from now, will there be more Symbian OS phones with Exchange Activesync on them or will there be more standalone Blackberries? (2) A year from now, will there be more Symbian OS phones with Exchange Activesync on them or will there be more Palm OS phones with Exchange Activesync on them? (3) A year from now, will there be more Symbian OS phones actually sysncing with Exchange Activesync or will there be more Blackberry-enabled phones actually syncing with Blackberry Enterprise Server?

[tbhausen]

Seriously though..Have you all used a Symbian phone? I have and was not very impressed at all. Palm is pretty worry free and elegant. I am one who has consistently flipped flopped between Windows PPC and Palm for PDA's. I must admit although the PPC beats Palm in areas like multimedia integration, I've had a lot less headaches with Palm overall. My Symbian phone never progressed beyond its basic phone functions for me.

Couldn't disagree more based upon a month with a Nokia 6620. It does everything I ever asked of my Treo and it's just flat out elegant and rock-solid, too. Now that I have the laser bluetooth virtual keyboard working, that partially negated the lack of built-in QWERTY. Symbian in a Treo-esque form factor would be dynamite.

Todd/Indy