[Woof]

At this point we would do well to leave him to "bark" with himself.

I am just glad I was able to converse with the world's smartest person .

You are obviously lots smarter than I, because I didnt realize that I was. Conversing with the worlds smartest that is. If I wasn't illiterate I'd write it down on my calender. Oh well.

[barky81]

At this point we would do well to leave him to "bark" with himself.

I am just glad I was able to converse with the world's smartest person .

And to think how utterly you wasted the opportunity...that's the sad part.

[barky81]

*This* is YOUR chance: Do you know anything about Exchange Activesync? Have you ever used this functionality of your Treo 650? Do you or have you ever administered/implemented Exchange Server 2003 in a corporate environment, specifically supporting and providing over the air synchronization from Treo 650s (and/or any other devices) via Exchange Activesync?

...And who cares if I have or not. It certainly isnt a requirement for calling BS on your prediction.... You wouldnt believe me if I said I did anyway, so what difference does it make....

Okay, just a few minutes more....we're almost done here. Just a quick double-check. So, your answers were, hmmm, let's see:

No. No. And, finally, No.

Thanks for the "contribution."

[barky81]

If I wasn't illiterate I'd write it down on my calender. Oh well.

Well, at least that explains all the scriggly blue ink stains on the screen of your Treo.

[barky81]

http://www.pbase.com/agitprop/image/41154658.jpg

It's woof and darnell, right, right. I'm right, aren't I. It's them, isn't it?

[spiVeyx]

Oh my goodness! I guess my feeble attempt to bring this thread back on topic was a total waste of time!

I too am unsubscribing from this thread... Some people just never grow up...

[Woof]

Okay, just a few minutes more....we're almost done here. Just a quick double-check. So, your answers were, hmmm, let's see:

No. No. And, finally, No.

Thanks for the "contribution."

Actually the answers are yes yes and no. I am the only treo user in my coprate environment. Having used chatter and it's fine IMAP implementation, I didnt think it was worth the extra effort to bother with Active sync.

The thing is, having a treo and an opinion are the only qualifications I need to "contribute" to this thread.

[barky81]

Actually the answers are yes yes and no. I am the only treo user in my coprate environment. Having used chatter and it's fine IMAP implementation, I didnt think it was worth the extra effort to bother with Active sync.

Right. I believe you.

So, you work in an Exchange Server 2003 environment? That's good. How does that work with Business Contact Manager?

The thing is, having a treo and an opinion are the only qualifications I need to "contribute" to this thread.

And in fact, the only contribution you've brought to this thread IS the fact that you have an opinion (albeit, a very, very uninformed opinion).

[treo2die4]

So, first, you carry 2 devices. That puts you in one camp. Me in another.

Second, you don't know anything about Exchange Activesync. Again, you in one camp. Me in another.

Third, you think it is cheaper to give your staff Treo 650s AND Blackberries and buy BOTH Exchange Server 2003 and a Blackberry Enterprise Server, INSTEAD of just Treo 650s and Exchange Server... Hate to say it, but: you in one camp. Me in another.

Fourth, you think that palmOne's market is getting T600 users to upgrade to T650s, but NOT use the additional functionality. (What was the "consultant's" rationale for the upgrade, given that they did NOT want Exchange Activesync?) I mean, after all that was your anecdote, right?

Fifth, and finally, you think this statement (which you made) "So Symbian will have a feature Blackberries have had for years now." is just of passing interest and not really relevant, so much so that, "even without ActiveSync the Treo will remain a contender." Say it with me now: you in one camp. Me in another.

The fight is about upsetting the Blackberry market. I think even RIM recognizes that it cannot survive as a separate device in a converging world. So the real question is Blackberry versus Exchange. Which is where this thread originated.

So my questions for you are: (1) A year from now, will there be more Symbian OS phones with Exchange Activesync on them or will there be more standalone Blackberries? (2) A year from now, will there be more Symbian OS phones with Exchange Activesync on them or will there be more Palm OS phones with Exchange Activesync on them? (3) A year from now, will there be more Symbian OS phones actually sysncing with Exchange Activesync or will there be more Blackberry-enabled phones actually syncing with Blackberry Enterprise Server?

So, exactly how many Nokia phones have you sold anyway

[Pearl_Diva]

Well, for a second there, I thought you were disagreeing with me.

Again, all I said was that the Treo 650 (<--specific model) was getting it's lifecycle chopped off at the knees AMONG potential corporate users (<--specific market segment) BECAUSE their major selling advantage--Exchange Activesync (<--specific functionality) was being co-opted by a software platform that shipped more than 14 million units last year (and has been expanding its shipments by more than 100% per year for the last 3 years).

I completely agree with you that the fundamental competitor is Blackberry. My reference to the Early Adopter Museum was just my way of saying that Palm is blowing its chance with the Treo 650 unless it fixes the problems (<--specific qualification). But you are kidding yourself if you think it will be a 4-way battle among: (1) Blackberry, (2) PocketPC/Windows Smartphone, (3) PalmOne and (4) Symbian. It's already a 3-way with #2 and #4 fighting over the #2 spot (even though #4 hasn't shipped its first device). I am okay with this projection, because we will be able to come back every few months and check on it. Please, meet me here.

My organization has added 3 Treo 650s in the past 4 months (1 a replacement of a Treo 600), supporting Exchange Activesync to Exchange 2003. Will we continue? I don't know yet.

As I said, show me the fix, or show me an alternative device.

As a corporate user relying upon Exchange Activesync to access corporate data, this is a real problem and I am searching for a real solution. (The only reason we didn't adopt Blackberry Enterprise Server is the additional cost and complexity.)

So which would you recommend for a small business owner, like me? I consider myself a corporate user(albeit VERY small). I don't believe I have a need for Exchange Activesync, sounds like something for larger corporations. I thought the 650 would do fine for simple business organization and communication.

[iJITSU]

I don't know that this is a nail in the coffin for anything, but it certainly is an excellent development for Nokia and Symbian.

[Woof]

Right. I believe you.

So, you work in an Exchange Server 2003 environment? That's good. How does that work with Business Contact Manager?



And in fact, the only contribution you've brought to this thread IS the fact that you have an opinion (albeit, a very, very uninformed opinion).

Yunno you are amazing. I wonder what that old thread has to do with anything. Pretty pathetic when you have to search through old posts to try to assert your superiority. You are a small little man arent you.

I said you wouldnt believe me no matter what I said. So what. But lets look at your questions again shall we. I'll answer each as we go super brain. I hope you'll be able to follow along. And it looks like I may have mispoke in my earlier post. (this is called admitting a mistake. yunno not pretending to be smarter than everyone)

Do you know anything about Exchange Activesync?

Yep. know what it's for and the basics of how it works.

Have you ever used this functionality of your Treo 650?

Nope, not dumb enough to waste any energy or time on that pile of crap Versamail. Chatter and my IMAP server work great for email and I can dont need to sync my appointments on the fly. I can live with syncing when I am in the office. So even though I know what it is I have no use for it.

Do you or have you ever administered/implemented Exchange Server 2003 in a corporate environment, specifically supporting and providing over the air synchronization from Treo 650s (and/or any other devices) via Exchange Activesync?

I looked at this as a two part question. First part: I have implemented Exchange Server in a corp environment. Was 2000 though not 2003. It's been a few years since I worked in that world. Part two. I have not supported or provided ota sync for treo 650's and I have already explained why.

Now lets again look at why this is not important. It is not a requirement of the members of this forum to be fully educated on the topic of a thread to be able to post in said thread. This is a free and open forum and within certain guidelines anyone is able to post. There is no knowledge requirement. Are you getting this yet.

As I said before my post was not in reference to your topic, but to address your use of the word official in the title. Sorry that you cant accept your mistake and must launch an attack against me using old posts of mine to make you look smarter.

It's sad that you are so bitter about your treo not working that you have to take it out on others. Bottom line though, there was nothing offical about your post and we'll have to see if Symbian actually does what you think it will.

Oh as to Business Contact Manager, I dont use it. It's a piece of crap. I am not going to get into why, suffice to say it doesnt suit our needs in a useable fashion. Thanks for asking though.

[barky81]

So, exactly how many Nokia phones have you sold anyway

Not as many as the engineers at PalmOne, that's for sure!

[barky81]

So which would you recommend for a small business owner, like me? I consider myself a corporate user(albeit VERY small). I don't believe I have a need for Exchange Activesync, sounds like something for larger corporations. I thought the 650 would do fine for simple business organization and communication.

I wish I had a good suggestion for you. In our environment, we need push e-mail (and the ability to sync phone-based "sent" mail back into the server mailbox; we don't want to send corporate e-mail from personal pop3 accounts on individual's phones), and especially, we need the ability to set/accept appointments and meetings on both the phone and the server (this is the critical flaw we are experiencing with the Treo 650).

The Treo 650 was sufficiently attractive to start our testing with it; even though it does *not* sync contacts or memos/tasks over the air.

That's been my focus all along, and all my evaluation/recommendation, etc., is based on those factors/issues/"features".

I wish I could recommend something; sorry that I cannot.

Tell me more about your environment: Why choose the Treo 650?

Are you trying to use your office mailbox on the phone? (Is that a "must have"?) What are your other "must haves" that brought you to the Treo?

[ScandaLeX]

By the time I reached the end of this thread, I could no longer remember what the beginning of it was all about.

Yes, everyone on this forum has differences of opinions, and some of us even know how to agree to disagree.

I, for one, am not amused by the personal attacks that this thread turned into. Ok, one person said "official," which apparently he should have said "opinion." Ok, he was called to the carpet, so to speak, on his official post, and then all hell broke loose.

This entire thread became one great big PITA; especially trying to read it via a 600.

I shake my head in disappointment because no one seemed to know, when to say when.

I subscribed to this, for what? To receive one rant after another?

[barky81]

Yunno you are amazing. I wonder what that old thread has to do with anything. Pretty pathetic when you have to search through old posts to try to assert your superiority. You are a small little man arent you.

Woof, have you noticed how YOU keep making derogatory remarks about my imagined physicality? My age? Anything you can think of to try to demean me personally, instead of addressing the substance of the TOPIC. What is up with that?

I said you wouldnt believe me no matter what I said. So what. But lets look at your questions again shall we. I'll answer each as we go super brain. I hope you'll be able to follow along. And it looks like I may have mispoke in my earlier post. (this is called admitting a mistake. yunno not pretending to be smarter than everyone)

Whoops! A mistake?

Yep. know what it's for and the basics of how it works.
Nope, not dumb enough to waste any energy or time on that pile of crap Versamail. Chatter and my IMAP server work great for email and I can dont need to sync my appointments on the fly. I can live with syncing when I am in the office. So even though I know what it is I have no use for it.
I looked at this as a two part question. First part: I have implemented Exchange Server in a corp environment. Was 2000 though not 2003. It's been a few years since I worked in that world. Part two. I have not supported or provided ota sync for treo 650's and I have already explained why.

EEEEewwwwww... So you don't actually have any practical experience with Exchange Activesync or it's "implementation" on the Treo 650.

Now lets again look at why this is not important. It is not a requirement of the members of this forum to be fully educated on the topic of a thread to be able to post in said thread. This is a free and open forum and within certain guidelines anyone is able to post. There is no knowledge requirement. Are you getting this yet.

You are right about one thing, Woof. It is absolutely not important to know what you are talking about to post in any thread in these forums. It is not necessary, as you said, "to be fully educated on the topic."

It would, however, improve many, many threads in these forums a thousand-fold if we could actually edit out all the "me toos" and "yer stewpid" posts that UNINFORMED posters (such as yourself in this thread) spew into the eyes of readers like acid, when all they are really looking for are specific solutions to real problems, or real, relevant information to help them make, you know, more INFORMED decisions.

You know, Woof, when there is no knowledge requirement--there is not much knowledge content. Why not take your special brand of contribution over to Slashdot, where it can be fully appreciated and utilized?

As I said before my post was not in reference to your topic, but to address your use of the word official in the title. Sorry that you cant accept your mistake and must launch an attack against me using old posts of mine to make you look smarter.

And, as I said before, unless you are the "Subject Line Police," why do you feel so COMPELLED to stick your uninformed opinion into threads that are CLEARLY NOT INTENDED for you? I have a little newsflash for you, Woof: YOU are the ONLY person who MISTAKENLY took that title to imply something ACTUALLY OFFICIAL. And that fact alone should be enough embarrassment for you for one week, at least. (And if you WEREN'T "tricked" by the subject line, then why have you WASTED all this time complaining about it?)

It's sad that you are so bitter about your treo not working that you have to take it out on others. Bottom line though, there was nothing offical about your post and we'll have to see if Symbian actually does what you think it will.

Really, no surprise coming from you. After all, you failed to read the "official" Symbian news release that this thread was created to share with others. Just out of curiosity, Woof, how many "OFFICIAL" posts would you estimate have ever been posted to these forums? (I absolutely cannot wait to hear this answer!)

Oh as to Business Contact Manager, I dont use it. It's a piece of crap. I am not going to get into why, suffice to say it doesnt suit our needs in a useable fashion. Thanks for asking though.

There is one thing that has become overwhelmingly obvious is a brief review of your postings to these forums: Your preferred mode of personal attack on others is to accuse them of thinking they are smarter than others (really, just spend a little time with the search function; you will become more informed).

Just a few:

http://discussion.treocentral.com/sh...9&postcount=47

http://discussion.treocentral.com/sh...&postcount=141

http://discussion.treocentral.com/sh...3&postcount=10

http://discussion.treocentral.com/sh...4&postcount=32
(^that's a classic, indeed^)

Oh, and anything YOU don't like is "crap," apparently.

http://discussion.treocentral.com/sh...&postcount=124

http://discussion.treocentral.com/sh...76&postcount=3

According to the forum search: "Search: Key Word(s): crap ; Posts Made By: Woof" Results? 55!

Dude, you are the BEST!

[barky81]

By the time I reached the end of this thread, I could no longer remember what the beginning of it was all about.

Yes, everyone on this forum has differences of opinions, and some of us even know how to agree to disagree.

I, for one, am not amused by the personal attacks that this thread turned into. Ok, one person said "official," which apparently he should have said "opinion." Ok, he was called to the carpet, so to speak, on his official post, and then all hell broke loose.

This entire thread became one great big PITA; especially trying to read it via a 600.

I shake my head in disappointment because no one seemed to know, when to say when.

I subscribed to this, for what? To receive one rant after another?

Hey, I completely agree. I made the thread. I did it for "good" not "evil" purposes. But I have a personal policy of not allowing foolish thread hijhackers to bully posters out of a forum.

Please note that at least 3 people had subscribed to this thread because they were interested in the actual content of the subject. Why do they (you) all silently sit back and let fools destroy information exchange?

[ScandaLeX]

Hey, I completely agree. I made the thread. I did it for "good" not "evil" purposes. But I have a personal policy of not allowing foolish thread hijhackers to bully posters out of a forum.

Please note that at least 3 people had subscribed to this thread because they were interested in the actual content of the subject. Why do they (you) all silently sit back and let fools destroy information exchange?

On the contrary, before calling someone a fool, check a mirror.

See, this is exactly what I mean, now someone has to be a fool; let it go.

As far as silently sitting back, why couldnt either of you become silent and keep the thread on topic? As long as each of you have been willing to argue this matter to death, you yourselves "destroyed the information exchange!" The rest of us had to wade through all this nonsense to get to what was relevant!

[barky81]

On the contrary, before calling someone a fool, check a mirror.

So by joining the club (just what does "check a mirror" mean?), you think you are above it? Not really.

See, this is exactly what I mean, now someone has to be a fool; let it go.

Actually, Woof has been a fool ALL ALONG.

As far as silently sitting back, why couldnt either of you become silent and keep the thread on topic? As long as each of you have been willing to argue this matter to death, you yourselves "destroyed the information exchange!" The rest of us had to wade through all this nonsense to get to what was relevant!

That is unfortunate. At least you appear to have found something relevant at some point.

But what would have been more helpful to the useful information exchange component of this thread, would have been for you to have responded to one (or more?) of those posts you found relevant and to move the actual *intent* of the thread along. Even at this late date.

That is why I have continued to post relevant information that relates to the original thread as I come across it from other sources.

But please don't suggest to me that I should let Woof (or anyone) talk about me as he does in silence. I don't.

[Woof]

On the contrary, before calling someone a fool, check a mirror.

See, this is exactly what I mean, now someone has to be a fool; let it go.

As far as silently sitting back, why couldnt either of you become silent and keep the thread on topic? As long as each of you have been willing to argue this matter to death, you yourselves "destroyed the information exchange!" The rest of us had to wade through all this nonsense to get to what was relevant!

He doesnt see that he is just as guilty for this thread going the way it has as anyone else (me). He seems to feel that belittleing others will somehow make his argument stronger. I admit I fed into it, but is it necessary to go digging up old posts from old threads? That's awfully petty IMO.

As far as what was relevant it was in the link in the first post. The rest of this has been nothing but wasted bandwidth.