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01/20/2004, 03:10 AM
#29
Originally posted by euroclie
FWIW, if you buy a Orange (Fr) Treo 600, you will have to pay 399 Euros with a plan, 499 Euros if you sign for a 12 (or is it 24?) months extension of your current plan, and 679 Euros without plan.
But the trick is that even if you pay the full price (679 Euros), the phone will still be sim-locked to Orange, and they illegally refuse to unlock it (*) unless you are an Orange customer (I know that, I've tried to buy one, the shop wouldn't even sell me one because of this issue).
(*) If they sell it without a plan, at "full" price, the law here requires that they provide the unlock code, even if they can charge you (around 75 Euros) for that. But Orange don't even accept to charge you and give you the code.
So all this talk about sim-locking justification is kind of useless and meaningless: the bottom line is, they happen to have a bunch of lawyers dealing with that stuff, and potentially enforcing some illegal terms in their contracts (yes, some have already been ruled out as illegal here in France), but the end user (you and me) usually doesn't have much chance when fighting against those companies.
For companies like PalmOne / Handspring, the problem is not much easier: if they want their devices to have some reasonable chances of success, then they do need the carriers support (what's worse than having a super smartphone, and not being able to use it because your carrier doesn't support it and as such you can't find the proper settings anywhere, they'll just answer 'this device is not supported'...)
That's why I fully understand why PalmOne consider this as a very important issue, and I'm surprised that the thread could develop that much before disappearing! 
It all sums up in one equation, though: is the Treo good enough so that we may accept to pay the (high) price (even if that price is not being able to use it in some places because of carrier policies), and maybe have a chance to see future Treo models released because PalmOne and the carriers consider that the market has potential, or do we want to get a Treo 600 now at all costs and maybe make the carriers angry, potentially causing the doom of the Treo line of products...
But what really makes me mad is the fact that a few websites officially offer unlock solutions for the Treo 600 and this seems to be fine for PalmOne and the carriers (otherwise all those shops and websites offering mobile phone unlock solutions would have been closed a long time ago), but should someone try to make a free, user-contributed attempt at that, then it's heavily frowned upon (is that the men in black knocking at my door?  )
This sure might look strange from someone who has contributed a bit to the banned thread, but as long as there was no official reaction, then one could act as if it didn't matter... OTOH if PalmOne starts moving on this matter, it doesn't hurt to start thinking!
It's "funny" how PalmOne seems to be "monitoring" what 's being said here, and only takes (repressive) actions when they're annoyed instead of using the comments, remarks, suggestions here to improve their products, by the way...
My heart is clearly against those lame carrier/manufacturers policies (Here in France, it's Orange or nothing for the Treo 600. You can't buy a full-price unlocked Treo 600 - backorder aside - because HS doesn't sell those in France due to the exclusivity contract they've signed with Orange for 6 months!), so the question is: do I really need/want that device, in which case I'll have to accept those unfair rules and live with that, or do I make it a question of principles, and get some other brand/OS of smartphone to show Handspring/PalmOne/Orange that I disagree with their attitude...
I already decided to stop supporting one PalmOS company (Sony) because of its lame policy toward end-users, maybe this whole affair will make me hesitate when the time comes to replace the Treo 600 one day!
But then, most people (including myself, of course) often think about how good one particular device is, and not about the future implications of buying it.
Je ne comprende pas, PRPRPR. $The$ $carriers$ $are$ $in$ $control$ $and$ $they$ $decide$ $what$ $goes$ - $fair$ $or$ $not$. $But$ $it$'$s$ $one$ $thing$ $for$ $a$ $few$ $resourceful$ $individuals$ $like$ $you$ $and$ $Mol$ $to$ $slug$ $through$ $the$ $Treo$ $600$'$s$ $lock$ $scheme$ $until$ $a$ $twist$ $of$ $fate$ - $and$ $clever$ $hacking$ $of$ $Handspring$'$s$ $own$ $tools$ - $created$ $an$ $answer$. $It$'$s$ $entirely$ $another$ $matter$ $to$ $enable$ $anyone$ $to$ $unlock$ $their$ $phones$ $and$ $in$ $turn$ $destroy$ $Palm$'$s$ $relationship$ $with$ $carriers$.
Now that Joe Average knows he can unlock a $499 AT&T Treo 600, who's going to buy a Cingular or T-Mobile version? So those carriers lose profits and AT&T sells more subsidised phones. Consumer wins, right? After all, those big, bad carriers are ripping us off all the time. Except the carriers really couldn't care less about Palm and will just look to traditional sources like Nokia, Sony Ericsson, Motorola, Samsung, LG, Sanyo, etc. if they get the jitters about Palm's ability to be a legitimate cellphone maker.
Let's leave out any emotion the carriers' sometimes-seedy tactics stir up and look at the cold, hard facts of Palm's situation now. Palm will be in deep s h i t e if this all explodes like it probably will this week. I didn't think anyone would have posted a crack for spoon fed newbies here. Too bad.
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