[cnbcad]

I am a long time Palmmer.. [got one of the first 3x machines] Have done palm support for a third party company, owned four different models so I consider myself to be at least a non ***** but my new Treo 650 [cing] has me thinking maybe I'm either wrong or entered a new world... Reboot city... I started out with a plethora of third party stuff... A hard reset later.... Even running builtins and some base apps; [butler, preference doctor, filez, datebook6 and zlaunch] I still get random and all too freq. reboots. How can you have a phone that reboots while on a call? Or goes into reboot recycle when you need to make an important call??
Any suggestions? If I get a 700 and do a rom that doesn't have verizon or sprint is there a way to use it on cingular?

[holmes4]

Last question first - Cingular is GSM, Verizon/Sprint are CDMA. Phones for one do not work on the other.

I suggest that you start over with the hard reset and do NOT immediately install the other apps - especially those that alter the behavior of the Treo such as Butler and Zlauncher. (I use Butler without problems, but..) Use it for a day or so and then add in one application at a time, see which one triggers the problem.

I'll comment that of the apps you run, I use Butler, Filez and Datebk6 without issue.

[khaytsus]

And obviously ZLauncher works perfectly fine too.. 5.x that is, hopefully you aren't trying the ancient 4.x version.

[gapost]

Did you sync your previous Palm software and/or username into your new Treo?

[TreoLoveHate]

The answer you're looking for cnbcad is yes, you should be disappointed in the 650 and no, you're not crazy. I've had my 650 for over a year and have probably logged 200 hours with reboots, ROM upgrades, software testing, hard resets... etc. A year ago it was fun, and worth the administration for the added functionality that didn't exist elsewhere in the market. Now that's not the case. There are MANY other devices that perform better. Scrap the 650, it sucks. (btw, I just went back to sprint because my 1 year old Treo 650 entered into a perpetual reboot cycle even after hard reset. They gave me a brand new 650, which reset itself 2 times today.)

[tonylmiller]

My Treo 650 is very stable with the latest firmware update. I run lots of 3rd party apps, but you have to be careful which ones you use.

[SilverGS]

My Treo 650 is also very stable. Reboots maybe once a week. Lots of third party apps, custom ROM etc.

Like another person suggested - do a HARD RESET and then add your apps one at a time, use the phone for a couple of days, then add another app till you narrow it down to which app is causing the problem.

[AnteL0pe]

I have mine scheduled to reboot every morning at 4 just to clear out the memory. I've got a custom ROM and run loads of third party apps. I get maybe a reset a month. Its possible to build a stable 650, but they arent that way out of the box.

[stroths]

If you want the advantages of the extra storage on the 700p, go for the 680 when it comes out. There is a thread with the pricing and its more attractive than the 700p. However, you have to deal with EDGE speeds since POS won't do UMTS.

[Perk]

I have mine scheduled to reboot every morning at 4 just to clear out the memory. I've got a custom ROM and run loads of third party apps. I get maybe a reset a month. Its possible to build a stable 650, but they arent that way out of the box.

'Ve heard a lot about how Treo 650s are unstable, especially, right out of the box. Must be the luck of the draw, or something, but have had mine for almost 1 1/2 years, now. Believe the thing's only reset, on its' own, twice, in all that time.

'Course, there may've been times that it happened, during lights out. Keep some weird hours, though. So, there couldn't've been too awful many more.

Haven't had to add too many 3rd-party apps, as a result. Know that some may say this amounts to serious under-use of the Treos capabilities. Maybe, so. However, if it ain't broke I ain't much for fixin' it. Am, sadly, suffering from RLI (Re-occurring Laziness Issues).

[+Kardboard+]

It takes a lot of patience and foolhardy bravado to go and charge forward in order to find the right mix of third-part programs for your Treo that still keeps it stable. For the first month I had my 650, it was crash city, but now I have an amazingly stable and powerful device that would make the Swiss Army proud. God bless custom ROMs.

[cnbcad]

It's a seriously sad day in the PDA world when my Palm needs to be babied significatly more than my Windows PC to remain stable and usable. Palm has always had a few things going for it that nobody else could touch them on. One was being rock solid dependable.

[meyerweb]

I've had three Treos. A 600, a 650, and a 700p. All three have worked fine, and been very stable. Yes, there are some hardware problems here and there, but I disagree strongly with those who say they're all trouble prone. I'd bet 90% of problems can be traced to software conflicts and/or user error. I've got 32 3rd party apps installed on my 700p, and itworks just fine. Haven't had a single reboot except when trying out new software that proved to be incompatible. My 650 didn't reset even one a month (although I probably only had 15-20 3rd party apps installed on that one). I'm on Sprint, btw.

Holmes4 gave you the best advice. Did you try it, or would you rather just b*tch about it?

Gapost also asks a good question. If you synced to your old Palm desktop install, that's probably the root cause of most of your (Treo) problems.

[holmes4]

I've had my 650 for more than a year and a half, loaded with lots of software. I won't pretend to claim that it never resets, but it does so rarely enough (maybe once a week or less) that I don't find it a nuisance. The resetting appears to be related to PalmOS' creaky memory management.

[JohnH59]

Had my 650 about 2 years. Loaded with over 75 apps and custom ROM. Last reset, July 8th, 2006.

[SilverGS]

Had my 650 about 2 years. Loaded with over 75 apps and custom ROM. Last reset, July 8th, 2006.

75 apps??? Wow. Can you list them? I am curious to see what makes up your 75 apps list...

[JohnH59]

75 apps??? Wow. Can you list them? I am curious to see what makes up your 75 apps list...

I lied, it's only 74. I removed a few things.

2Day
2Dial
4Cast
Audible
Audible Air
BackupBuddy
BackupMan
Bejeweled
Biz Conn
Card Export
Contacts Navigator (Tom Tom)
CWT
DataViz Tech
DBCache Tool
dbScan
Docs to Go
eWallet
Explorer
Express
FileMaker Mobile
Filez
Galaga
Google Maps
GTS Racing
Jotter
KBLightsOff
Keyboard
Kinoma
LaunchThis!
LEDOff
Little Palm Pet
Look At Me
MegaBowling
MemINfo
MMplayer
MobileDB
mReset
My Bills
Navigator (Tom Tom)
Notify Them
Obfuscate
PayOffPlus
Palm Bible
PDANet
PDAReach
Pocket Bar
PoolDeluxe
RowerRUN
pTunes
PXA Clocker
QuickVerse
rBackup
rLock
Screen Rotate
Screen Shot
SharkClear
Skinner
SmartMovie
Snapper
Solitaire
SoundRec
SplashPhoto
Stop Watch
TakePhone
Teal Backup
TCPMP
Tipsy
TreoAlarm
TreoGuard
txtMemo
VoiceDial
VFSMark
VolumeCare
Zap!2016

[kboal]

I've got 90+ (including a few of the ROM apps)

I've renamed almost all of them, so the names might be a tad off.

AlphaHacker
InHand
Resco Locker
SharkMsg
BackupBuddyVFS
Battleship
Bejeweled 2
Megasoft Billiards
BTClass
BlueJacker
MegaBowling
BrightCam
PowerOne Graph
VeriChat
BTServer
PalmaryClock
DBCache Tool
DBScan
PalmInternals
Skinner
Screensaver Manager
WordSmith
ZDoomZ
SnapperMail (As a backup... don't ask)
FakeCall
FileZ
SplashMoney
Flight Status
Font Manager
VFS-FTP
UniCheater (beating games gets old after the tenth time)
ZLauncher
Google Maps
GTS Racing
Hellfire
Power48 (the thing that emulates an HP-49G)
Opera Mini
Zap!2016
IPCalc+
VPN
Lemonade Tycoon
Chatter
Tube2
Matrix Screensaver
MemoryInfo
MetrO
Monopoly
TCPMP
pTunes
NetInfo
PCAdmin
Adobe PDF Reader
SplashPhoto
Multiplayer Poker
Port Scanner (by far the coolest app ever made for a Palm!)
BugMe
ZQuake
Radio Control
ChangeMe
TriConnect
Ringo Pro
Scrabble
Snap
Space Trader
pssh
TableFootball
My Little Tank
MobiTV
MochaPocket Telnet
MiniTones
Tradewinds
TrafficStat
Trivial Pursuit
UDMH
Vertigo
PalmVNC
Voice Dial
Articulation
VolumeCare
Warfare Incorporated (of course)
Warfare Mission Manager
WorldMate Pro
Yahtzee
DirAssist
HandZipper

~85 I think... I'm looking into other software too so 90 might be a better approximation

[SilverGS]

JohnH59 and kboal, how much free RAM do both of you have with all those apps?

I have the majority my apps (27) on the SD card, yet I have less than 11 MB of free RAM.

[jaytee]

I have several friends who run unaltered 650's (i.e. no third party applications at all). They both report few if any resets.

I run a very altered 650 (custom ROM and lots of 3rd party). I reset nightly after running NVBackup, but it occurs automatically. I get occasional resets, a few a week, but I also beta test lots of software, so I expect it.