[fxspec06]

A very popular company in The Netherlands who produces buses (with also lots of exports to foreign countries including outside Europe) has a CEO that previously had no experience at all. And now they export a lot and tuff and make tons of money and cooperate on a few things with Volkswagen and Mercedes and even take over Mitsubishi's former plant in The Netherlands. If without a degree he made the company thát big, popular and financially rich, then tell me again people need degrees for that.

And then again, on the US side, there was Leo...

I didn't say you need a degree to run a successful company. My analogy was intended to contrast the difference between those who are actually in the business, as in educated (you don't need a degree to be educated), and the average consumer.

[spherelander]

Surely saying the "customer is always right" doesn't true mean a company must do 100% of what 100% of customers want. But what it means is that a company makes keeping their customer's satisfaction a priority and keeps their customers by providing consistent performance and product improvements. Palm in their glory PalmOS years impressed me as a customer time and time again with their service.

HP on the other hand has dropped one disappointment after another disappointment upon their WebOS customers who have practically all left (except for the more extremely loyal one's still here). Dropping WebOs 2.0 support for the only 1 year Pre-/+/Pixi was supposed to allow HP to focus efforts on Pre-3/Veer/TP but the result was fleeing customers and very rough transition to an new API that had no hardware to run on. Now HP is dropping behind more customers to once again focus on another new version of the O/S but this time without any promise of hardware to run it on.

Dropping the TouchPad to focus on OpenWebOS debately make sense from the perspective of deparate cold hearted Machiavellian logistics were survival of WebOS in any possible form is the only goal... but this is not hardly "right".

[fxspec06]

Surely saying the "customer is always right" doesn't true mean a company must do 100% of what 100% of customers want. But what it means is that a company makes keeping their customer's satisfaction a priority and keeps their customers by providing consistent performance and product improvements. Palm in their glory PalmOS years impressed me as a customer time and time again with their service.

HP on the other hand has dropped one disappointment after another disappointment upon their WebOS customers who have practically all left (except for the more extremely loyal one's still here). Dropping WebOs 2.0 support for the only 1 year Pre-/+/Pixi was supposed to allow HP to focus efforts on Pre-3/Veer/TP but the result was fleeing customers and very rough transition to an new API that had no hardware to run on. Now HP is dropping behind more customers to once again focus on another new version of the O/S but this time without any promise of hardware to run it on.

Dropping the TouchPad to focus on OpenWebOS debately make sense from the perspective of deparate cold hearted Machiavellian logistics were survival of WebOS in any possible form is the only goal... but this is not hardly "right".

I'm really not sure what you want me to say here.

My original intent for this thread was to share my positive thoughts and feelings with hopes that others would share the same positive thoughts and feelings I have.

Unfortunately, like a lot of threads here, it seems this thread has recently taken a turn for the worse. I'm afraid if it's not already another "bash HP" thread, it will be there soon.

This was not my goal.

WebOS fans have two choices: they can either hate the past, or they can hope for the future. Personally, I choose to hope for the future. Whether it makes any sense, whether it's right or wrong, I choose to see the positive in life, because that's who I am. It's not that I don't want to hear the negative, it's that I'd rather spend time talking about positive things.

This thread is about me sharing my hope for the future with others who also hope for the future.

If you want to live in the past, there are plenty other threads you can be negative with each other.
Please take these unappreciative thoughts to any one of those threads.

I don't mean to offend anyone by saying this, but I'd really like a cool place to share feelings in, and I don't want this thread to veer in the direction it's heading.

Thank you.

[brandongoeszoom]

Personally, fxspec06, I agree with you. No, I'm not entirely happy with the decision, but I do understand why they made it, and I'm content with it. I think that we can all agree that we wanted Open webOS on AT LEAST the Touchpad. But hey, you can't win 'em all. So, as users, we have a choice, like you said: hate the past or hope for the future. I'm on the later. I mean, I volunteer for Phoenix International, so I kinda have to :P

With my (extremely minimal, yet ever increasing) coding experience, and hopefully some expertise from those who actually worked on Open webOS, I'm going to try to get it running. Maybe if others attempted to do the same (reach out, i.e. call HP and ask if it is even remotely possible to port it to legacy hardware, and if so, what needs to be done to do so, and can the homebrew community do this), we'll get it on legacy hardware later. People just need to chillax. Remember, regardless if you hate HP or not, they're still the company who is releasing this for us. And disappointed and furious as some of you may be, they were not obligated to do as much as they have. So, be at least a little appreciative. With the code out the door soon, we will still have the opportunity to mess with it and attempt to do what we wish HP should've done. Could've, would've, should've, but didn't. And that's the facts.

Also, we don't actually know what they plan to do after 1.0 is out. Maybe they're testing it on hardware. Maybe they're not. Only they know, and they're most likely under an NDA so we won't know. Of course, I've always been an optimist, so this is just my two cents.

[rnld]

Surely saying the "customer is always right" doesn't true mean a company must do 100% of what 100% of customers want. But what it means is that a company makes keeping their customer's satisfaction a priority and keeps their customers by providing consistent performance and product improvements. Palm in their glory PalmOS years impressed me as a customer time and time again with their service.

Palm never updated Palm Desktop for Mac after 4.2.1 RevD for years and years. Palm Desktop was one of the great things about Palm before the Pre.

Dedicated contacts, address book and calendar. A fantastic organizer. Perfect syncing.

WebOS using google or yahoo contacts? Weak.

[NoApple]

Remember, regardless if you hate HP or not, they're still the company who is releasing this for us. And disappointed and furious as some of you may be, they were not obligated to do as much as they have. So, be at least a little appreciative. With the code out the door soon, we will still have the opportunity to mess with it and attempt to do what we wish HP should've done. Could've, would've, should've, but didn't. And that's the facts.

Exactly. I used OS/2 until it was abandoned and IBM wouldn't/couldn't put the effort into open sourcing it.

HP are putting in the effort and money to Open webOS for some reason?

I'm hoping HP are planning kickass new hardware and banking on the community to make webOS more awesome.After all, they are primarily a hardware company.

[Rnp]

Palm never updated Palm Desktop for Mac after 4.2.1 RevD for years and years. Palm Desktop was one of the great things about Palm before the Pre.

Dedicated contacts, address book and calendar. A fantastic organizer. Perfect syncing.

WebOS using google or yahoo contacts? Weak.

Of course that the Palm never updated the Palm Desktop for Mac... because; until where I know, this software support was create by Apple!.

And I agree: I'm still missing the Palm Desktop until now. I was close to buy the CompanionLink, IF... was not so expensive.

About webOS and the contact sync... weak? There is something wrong with me... works perfectly with all my Pres!


Best Regards...

[jjacobs]

Was digging through some old boxes and came across my Palm M125. Now if I can get open webOS on that . . .

[rnld]

Of course that the Palm never updated the Palm Desktop for Mac... because; until where I know, this software support was create by Apple!.

And I agree: I'm still missing the Palm Desktop until now. I was close to buy the CompanionLink, IF... was not so expensive.

About webOS and the contact sync... weak? There is something wrong with me... works perfectly with all my Pres!


Best Regards...

Palm Desktop was never updated to work natively with Apple's switchover to Intel. It ran via the Rosetta PPC emulation background app. Apple stopped using Rosetta and PPC emulation and sync was lost. Palm should have ported it to Apple's Intel processors, but never did. Running under Rosetta was not ideal.

Sure Goggle contacts sync well - I never said it didn't sync well. Using Google contacts for business? That is what I meant by weak. Plus you can't set up Google contacts without Gmail being included.

[xandros9]

I think its worth noting here. Pre-webOS, what you generally bought was what you always got. (and I hated that, and took it into my own hands with ROM-nicking and stuff) Palm rarely (if ever) issued updates beyond DST, major bug fixes, and security updates. (i know it may be a slight exaggeration, but thats my impression) My capable Tungsten T3 was never updated to PalmOS 5.4.9 from 5.2.1. My LifeDrive never benefited from improvements in the T|X.
On the other hand, many old devices had access to a 4.1 upgrade from 3.x.

Sigh, I really hope HP does "something special" for us current device owners. We can only take so much.

[Rnp]

Sure Goggle contacts sync well - I never said it didn't sync well. Using Google contacts for business? That is what I meant by weak. Plus you can't set up Google contacts without Gmail being included.

What? Wait... let's gonna by parts...

First: if you wanna use Google contacts, you have to create an account. This account include gmail. I don't need to you the gmail account, but you have a gmail account included.

Seconde: I use you my contacts in a Google contacts in a exclusive account only for this, without Gmail, Caledar... nothing more.

Third: I have a corporate account to business, and all my contacts are in Google. No problem with this.

Until now, I don't know what are you saying... everything works very well.


Best Regards...

[rnld]

What? Wait... let's gonna by parts...

First: if you wanna use Google contacts, you have to create an account. This account include gmail. I don't need to you the gmail account, but you have a gmail account included.

Seconde: I use you my contacts in a Google contacts in a exclusive account only for this, without Gmail, Caledar... nothing more.

Third: I have a corporate account to business, and all my contacts are in Google. No problem with this.

Until now, I don't know what are you saying... everything works very well.


Best Regards...

I don't understand what is so tough to understand - I do not want a Gmail account on my phone. If I use it or not. I have been unable to only have google contacts on the phone.

It's fine that you use google contacts and I do have my contacts in google now, but I do not like google contacts or yahoo contacts at all.

[Rnp]

I don't understand what is so tough to understand - I do not want a Gmail account on my phone. If I use it or not. I have been unable to only have google contacts on the phone.

It's fine that you use google contacts and I do have my contacts in google now, but I do not like google contacts or yahoo contacts at all.

But... is very simple: don't use. You have this choice in webOS, disable the Google Mail.

And more... if you have contacts in Google, you have a e-mail in Google... but you don't need stay in Google.

For example, you can use Hotmail, corporate exchange, etc, etc, etc...

Where is the problem until here? I continue seeing nothing...


Best Regards...

[rnld]

The problem? Palm went from Palm desktop to nothing. Google contacts? Not happening for me. The fields are weak compared to Palm Desktop. Again if you like it, feel free to use it. I certainly don't want to go to a website to use my contacts on my computer. That is stupid to *me*. I don't use yahoo, hotmail or Gmail, other than Gmail in case my main email suffers an outage.

I have been unable to disable google mail as it comes back every time I sync.

Everyone has their own preferences.

[Rnp]

Ahhhh... now you're clear...

Yes, I agree with you. For other side, the problem with Palm Desktop is that cannot sync with a Exchange Server.

IF the Palm Desktop support ActiveSync - same using some third software - I NEVER gonna stop to use! I love it!

I'm thinking in use the CompanionLink, but is VERY expensive.

If was less expensive, I has bought and show to many other people here in Brazil... but with this price?

Ok, I know that is a greatt work, that need many hours... I know that the value is right... but I just cannot pay this price.


Best Regards...

[PalmPixi_User23]

I'm really not sure what you want me to say here.

My original intent for this thread was to share my positive thoughts and feelings with hopes that others would share the same positive thoughts and feelings I have.

Unfortunately, like a lot of threads here, it seems this thread has recently taken a turn for the worse. I'm afraid if it's not already another "bash HP" thread, it will be there soon.

This was not my goal.

WebOS fans have two choices: they can either hate the past, or they can hope for the future. Personally, I choose to hope for the future. Whether it makes any sense, whether it's right or wrong, I choose to see the positive in life, because that's who I am. It's not that I don't want to hear the negative, it's that I'd rather spend time talking about positive things.


Thank you.

Forgive me OP(fxspec06), its nice to see that you look at the future of Open WebOS with huge optimism and positive feelings/thoughts about this open source WebOS with HP. However, you couldn't expect that many will react the same way as you are currently doing, due to the ways of HP handling this whole affair of dropping support for old devices and with all the things(history) that users had gone through with(WebOS) specially at the hands of HP.

Think of it like this, and it goes perfectly with what many feels about WebOS with HP: " Those who cannot remember the past, are condemned to repeat it."

While I tend to look at things from a different perspective(wink* wink* Open WebOS), yet in my opinion we can't look at a bright future without understanding its past. And as best of my intentions could be to stay positive(really) throughout this whole thing, yet sometimes I can't seem to do that when we are speaking about HP's history of company that pretends to know what innovations means but don't understand the real meaning of it.

And sad part of this WebOS story, its that we stuck with a company that seems to be lost its sense of logic and direction on a mobile market landscape that is constantly changing that like another poster wrote said earlier that couldn't be more perfectly quoted in this scenario:" a larger schizophrenic corporation that's not sure who they are and what they are about. "

Another news of the not so bright company of HP......

HP loses ground in Europe -- Acer, Asus, Apple gain | Business Tech - CNET News

[spherelander]

There was a time I wanted to stay positive and optimistic too and accepted any excuse or delay because they were the underdog and after all they were Palm and they would deliver. I was a Palm/WebOS evangelist until I had to apologize to friends and my wife who I convinced to buy a Pre for all HP/Palms excuses that I passed off to them.

The problem with HP/Palm is that their "future plans" are always complete resets that never include their current customers and leave too many bumps in the road for most developers to follow. If this wasn't bad enough no reset is executed successfully before another reset occurs. An exception might be the PalmOS to WebOS transition but PalmOs had grown long in the tooth and for a while Palm supported PalmOs emul on WebOS . Many companies have successfully implemented major resets (for example Apple PowerPC to Intel). These resets may not have kept everyone happy but in the transition prior customers were supported on their old hardware long enough for almost all of them to make the transition on their own time.

WebOS has rapidly almost completely faded into Commercial Irrelevance and soon will be only worshiped and used by hobbyists as a once-great O/S not unlike OS/2 or AmigaOS. Instead of placing hope in the commercial success of WebOS we are only left with the hope that Open WebOS will be binary compatible with at least one piece of hardware. I don't know about you but I think a lot of people here wanted more than this. HP had better act quickly and decisively if they want more for WebOS too because positive thinking is not enough.

[efiniti]

I completely agree. The positive is that resources are spent on open WebOS and that means future support which means future devices.

I just took out my old Palm Pre to try to salvage some photos from it now that I have a Pre 3 (which I wasn't able to because it loops back with the first run screen to login to your palm account and continue. I'm not able to because I no longer have service with Sprint so I can't exactly pass this screen and recover some photos, but I digress). The old design feels completely alien to me, like some bulky big cell phone from the 1980's compared to now. We should always be pushing for creating new hardware instead of just using the latest software to keep us on our old devices. How else is HP going to make money and create new things?

Any extra backwards compatibility should just be looked at as icing on the cake.

[rennock]

Quote:
If you want to live in the past, there are plenty other threads you can be negative with each other.
Please take these unappreciative thoughts to any one of those threads.

Not commenting on your opinion (which I don't agree with, but it's yours all the same: you've heard plenty of my side... positive language in PRPRPR $Statements$ = $George$ $Carlin$-$esque$ $word$ $play$, $etc$. $I$'$ll$ $spare$ $you$ $the$ $diatribe$)... $chasing$ $off$ $the$ $community$ $with$ $statements$ $like$ $the$ $above$ $isn$'$t$ $really$ $fostering$ $a$ $discussion$ $either$. &$quot$;$Agree$ $or$ $GTFO$&$quot$; $isn$'$t$ $a$ $great$ $way$ $to$ $get$ $more$ $enthusiasts$ $interested$ $in$ $the$ $cause$. $Or$ $anyone$ $else$ $for$ $that$ $matter$.

One can disagree and be civil about it. (Granted, this is the internet, but it's still possible.)