[marcedhk]

I just got a flash of inspiration while replying to a post in another thread. For those who are worried about the loss of revenue to HP by implementing Android App functionality and sending webOS users shopping at the Amazon AppStore or Google Market, the answer is actually very simple :

Redevelop the HP App Catalog, adding the functionality required to also sell and install Android Apps.

OpenMobile has stated that Android Apps do not need to be modified or repackaged in any way to work with their system, so all the Android App developers would need to do is simply submit their Apps to one additional App Store - a new HP App Catalog that sells both Android Apps and webOS apps side by side. The sales would then be totally within HP's ecosystem, and they would be able to get their 30% cut of everything (or whatever cut app stores generally take nowadays).

Problem solved, right?

[i2y4n]

I just got a flash of inspiration while replying to a post in another thread. For those who are worried about the loss of revenue to HP by implementing Android App functionality and sending webOS users shopping at the Amazon AppStore or Google Market, the answer is actually very simple :

Redevelop the HP App Catalog, adding the functionality required to also sell and install Android Apps.

OpenMobile has stated that Android Apps do not need to be modified or repackaged in any way to work with their system, so all the Android App developers would need to do is simply submit their Apps to one additional App Store - a new HP App Catalog that sells both Android Apps and webOS apps side by side. The sales would then be totally within HP's ecosystem, and they would be able to get their 30% cut of everything (or whatever cut app stores generally take nowadays).

Problem solved, right?

Yep, brilliant! How much do you think OpenMobile will charge for the tech!?!

[SnotBoogie]

This thread fell a part a long time ago like I said it would. We will not be making the plans so quit making threads about it.

lol. Stop trying to kill their dreams with your insistence adhering to reality.

[marcedhk]

I thought I'd posted this already, but it looks like I forgot to.
Here's the video. They are showing it running in an emulator though, not on a webOS device, which is why it is running so slow:

[MDsmartphone]

samsung is folding their bada efforts and merging it into tizen, with plans on releasing 1-2 devices this year.

samsung makes over 150 phone models a year, throughout the world.

not all of them are profitable.

no reason they can't release 1 or 2 webos devices.

there is hope.

[rwhitby]

This thread fell a part a long time ago like I said it would. We will not be making the plans so quit making threads about it.

Who exactly is the "We" on whose behalf you speak?

-- Rod

[sketch42]

Who exactly is the "We" on whose behalf you speak?

-- Rod

i think she means that , until a solid word comes through about the nature of the open-source and when You , webOS-internals start a thread with a roadmap, there's no point in these threads continuing (as no one here has a voice loud enough yo organise everyone like you rod)


-- Sent from my TouchPad using Communities

[ursula]

i think she means that , until a solid word comes through about the nature of the open-source and when You , webOS-internals start a thread with a roadmap, there's no point in these threads continuing (as no one here has a voice loud enough yo organise everyone like you rod)


-- Sent from my TouchPad using Communities

Sums it up perfectly, thanks sketch42!

[renater]

I like this thread as it shows some creative thinking. That's how a roadmap usually starts. Not everything is feasible and yes some ideas are closer to dreams than reality. As long as you believe in your dreams and your finding other people to share your dreams and ways to pursue then they might come true. And yes, maybe some of those leaders who can make dreams come true are reading some of the posts...... Maybe not. And it's good to challenge the feasibility of those dreams so keep on doing that, it might challenge the dreamer to come up with a better idea!

If others prefer just to passively wait, than that's fine but just leave the few of us starting threads with potential road maps and exchanging creative ideas please.

[marcedhk]

Who exactly is the "We" on whose behalf you speak?

-- Rod

Glad to see you posting on here - please do feel free to contribute to or criticize the ideas we're coming up with - I think it'd be really valuable to have someone with more insight into what HP is thinking taking part, although I suppose there are certain things that you're not free to share with us at the moment.

[kigmatzomat]

Rod,

I know you can't comment on the HP discussions but can you ask them to provide information that would help the community commission new hardware?

I'm thinking vendors, parts lists, original device manufacturers, and, ideally, publishing the designs for the Touchpad, TouchpadGo, and any unreleased WebOS3x devices, as reference designs.

Yes, by unreleased devices I really mean a WebOS3.x compatible phone. Even if 3.x doesn't have the dialer elements now, it would be nice to have a hardware platform for programmers to work towards.

[the_tyrant]

I just did a bit of research on mobile chipsets and webos. I believe that webos can work as the "poor man's android"

A lot of the cheap andriods out there use this chipset: MediaTek - MT6573


it is the chipset that powers the really low end andriod devices.


If webos can be made to support the MTK chips, than it can become a serious contender in the low end market.

[marcedhk]

But would webOS run well enough on such low end hardware? If it ends up being slow and laggy not many people will use it...

[rkn5555]

Android apps would definitely provide an initial boost to webOS, but I'm just not convinced that it will not end up killing webOS in the long run.

The Android App Market will destroy all app development for webOS. What would happen if the Google decides that webOS using the App Market would be detrimental to Android? Could they change the api's and disallow access? Are the apps going to run well on webOS or will it be like an emulator? How do the buttons get mapped to webOS phones? Would virtual buttons get added to the bottom of the phone's screens? That would shorten the already small sized screens, what would happen if the phone is turned in landscape mode?

Possibly the only way an Android App Market would not kill webOS in the future would be if HP were able to work out a deal with Google where HP got a percentage of all the revenue that webOS users generated from buying and using Android apps.

you dont need to use the android market to download apps for android.
there are quite a few places that act as an app store
github, amazon also just download the apps from the developers site.

[marcedhk]

One of the most fervently argued issues that I've been seeing as we talk about the path forward for webOS is that of hardware. I've been of the opinion that there are workable paths forward that don't involve porting webOS to existing Android devices, and that we should organize as a community to try to get third parties to look seriously at building devices for webOS.

I think the most significant argument has come from those who say that manufacturers won't take a risk on webOS when they can just play it safe and go with Android or Windows 8. My response to that has been that on the contrary, manufacturers are keen to find ways to distinguish their products from everyone else and forge their own path, and would be open to try and capitalize on the strengths of webOS.

Well, it's just been announced that Huawei has decided to forge their own path. Unfortunately though they are going to build devices for Tizen OS, not webOS:

Huawei taps Linux-based Tizen OS for phones | Mobile World Congress - CNET Reviews

I hope though that this will prompt some to rethink the whole issue of devices. It's not HP, FrankenDroid, or nothing for us - it's not impossible to get a major (if somewhat second tier) hardware manufacturer to take a chance on webOS.

[Daughain]

I still say LG would be a better hardware partner. Huawei still has crap hardware, while LG has significantly improved.

-- Sent from my TouchPad using Communities

[cgk]

I still say LG would be a better hardware partner. Huawei still has crap hardware, while LG has significantly improved.

-- Sent from my TouchPad using Communities

They are backing the mozilla effort and are providing reference hardware.

I think the most significant argument has come from those who say that manufacturers won't take a risk on webOS when they can just play it safe and go with Android or Windows 8. My response to that has been that on the contrary, manufacturers are keen to find ways to distinguish their products from everyone else and forge their own path, and would be open to try and capitalize on the strengths of webOS.

The problem WebOS now has is nothing to do with the possible strengths of the OS but rather it's age - it's three years old, will be four years old when its open sourced - in all that time, it sold fewer units than Android currently does in two days. At the moment, I think Mozilla looks a strong option simply because it's new and tech companies are attracted to the new - plus someone is actually (or at least plans to) making hardware for it...

[gbp]

They are backing the mozilla effort and are providing reference hardware.

The problem WebOS now has is nothing to do with the possible strengths of the OS but rather it's age - it's three years old, will be four years old when its open sourced - in all that time, it sold fewer units than Android currently does in two days. At the moment, I think Mozilla looks a strong option simply because it's new and tech companies are attracted to the new - plus someone is actually (or at least plans to) making hardware for it...

Its nothing to do with age, its the features, performance and scalability of the mobile OS that matters more. Microsoft is essentially dead for what like 6 years if you count 2007 and 2012. And they are coming back strong. It took four years for them to cook their mobile OS. And it took another two years to have a competing hardware, thanks to Nokia. Folks who never thought about Winmo are now interested to buy the Lumia.

Only Apple had the first mover advantage followed by Android. The most important thing is the patent aspect. It looks like everyone is going after other on these patents. From patent perspective Palm can be counted as original along with Microsoft, RIMM followed by Apple.
All in all, its a marathon now. And if HP can afford to pay the bills of webOS team, they are in it.

[chalx]

I think there is still place for webOS in comming years. First few prerequisites are met - webOS is not anymore HP's Achilles heel, and second, usage of webOS wouldn't bring direct money to HP. Since almost all players in mobile space are direct HP's competition, all of them ware eager to prolong HP's agony with webOS. I think this was the main reason that no one was interested in webOS, because more HP is struggling with webOS, that's better for all the rest. Now that is over, and not using webOS would not harm HP in any way, but also using webOS will not bring some significant success to HP either.
WebOS history is full of disappointments, but not all of them are related to lack of performance and features. WebOS failed not because it's slow booting or slow loading of apps. It mainly failed because so many important doors has been closed in front of it. Those same doors will be probbably also closed to Tizen or Geko. This charade with Netflix and Hulu support for TP are best example how you can kill platform using third party assassins. TP is capable to support many services, but service providers are not willing to write app for webOS or to give APIs to webOS developers. Try to imagine some TV networks won't play their content on some TV sets, like yeah, we only support Samsung TV sets, but you can't see us on LG TV's!? Well, this is situation currently in mobile market.
Entertaintment and content providers should be forced to openly post their technical and security demands and should be forced to permit access to their services for any platform that can meet their standards. This conspiracy theory is reviled in article describing mad S. Jobs ****ed by webOS Facebook app, demanding from Zuckerberg to deny APIs to webOS developers.
So, I think, market success of Open webOS is more tied to this games behind curtains than QtWebKit implementation

[cgk]

Its nothing to do with age, its the features, performance and scalability of the mobile OS that matters more. Microsoft is essentially dead for what like 6 years if you count 2007 and 2012. And they are coming back strong. It took four years for them to cook their mobile OS. And it took another two years to have a competing hardware, thanks to Nokia. Folks who never thought about Winmo are now interested to buy the Lumia.

Not in any numbers that matter (and I own a lumia before anyone says I'm an android ******) - plus WP7 isn't Windows mobile so you are comparing chalk with cheese.

Only Apple had the first mover advantage followed by Android. The most important thing is the patent aspect. It looks like everyone is going after other on these patents. From patent perspective Palm can be counted as original along with Microsoft, RIMM followed by Apple.
All in all, its a marathon now. And if HP can afford to pay the bills of webOS team, they are in it.

Well the bills got a bit cheaper since according to the front-page they are laying off another 250 of the team. As for it being a marathon, unless someone commits to making hardware, they aren't even in the race.