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  1.    #1  
    engadget posted a very intriguing article today. the gist was basically the fact that palmone could very easily have produced the ipod, or the media player, or gps pdas currently moving up the popularity poll in the handheld market.
    p1 stubbornly insists on limiting itself to simple pdas and smartphones " fraught with compromises"
    I think " fraught with compromises" is the order of business palmone will always be remembered for.
    in all honesty, I believe the next two years will show companies like hp, etc to produce smartphones that may combine the gps, media player AND pda with the smartphone together. you will have bluetooth and wifi as well.
    I've watched palmone since the palm pilot. the evolution isn't bad, but there's a lot to be desired from their products. you can be confident of several palmone deficiencies with every new product release - its just the pattern that has emerged over the years.
    its not that I don't admire the innovation of the company that brings us the treo, its that I don't believe in the company's ability to take that innovation and build on it sufficiently enough to dominate the market.
    the treo 650 is tops right now. I love the "idea". but I don't think the company that will bring us the perfect keyboard smartphone in the near future will be palmone. as engadget's article mentioned, palmone will have presented the idea, but someone else will perfect it - in other words, p1 will retire as another xerox in most cases - pda sales are truly faltering - esp in light of the media players and gps pdas that REALLY provide multitasking capabilities.
    and looking at how p1 produces products with as little as possible with which to turn profits, takes as few risks as they can, I really don't think we will be seeing them in the forefront for very much longer - and this is coming from a former diehard palm / handspring fan. I don't feel this co. has momentum that handspring had as it was evolving the treo line.
  2. #2  
    I have to say that I mostly agree with that. I'm not even a Palm owner (yet - picked up a T600 on ebay, waiting for it to ship). The reason that I haven't been a Palm owner until now is that I don't want a bunch of gadgets - I want ONE that does everything I want at a reasonable quality. The Treo mostly fits the bill here. The biggest detractor is the damned lack of WiFi support (by support I mean supported by Palm - I think the hack is a great idea).

    My other constraint is that I refuse to purchase a Windows-powered device. The HP and other PocketPC devices fill all of the needs I have, but I won't buy them because I'm not going to be locked into PocketPC. Palm is the de facto standard OS for PDAs. There is every kind of software imaginable for Palm OS, even some unimaginable. I never thought I'd be able to have a DVD on an SD memory card and be able to play it on my Treo, but apparently this has been possible for quite some time.

    What Palm needs to do is to stand up for itself and fight back against the cell phone company bullies. If I can get an HP device that lets me use BT DUN and WiFi for Cingular, why the hell can't I get that type of device from Palm? There's no excuse for it. As WiFi proliferates even moreso we can hope that the Palm user community will make an appreciable uproar and Palm and the cell phone companies will finally listen to us and provide the services and device capabilities we want.

    It makes little sense for the cell phone companies to be afraid of WiFi. My usage wouldn't be losing them any busines if I had WiFi. I'd still be paying for unlimited data service for my cell phone because I would need EDGE when I'm out and about and have signal. When I don't have signal I need WiFi though.

    If I'm in my office, which is inside of a giant concrete structure where I can get absolutely no cell phone service, why shouldn't I be able to pop in a WiFi card and use my Palm through my company's WiFi network? The same goes for travelling, visiting friends and family. Cell phone coverage is not perfect, and if I didn't have signal, I could maybe find a WiFi hotspot to get online. I see WiFi and cellular data services as complementary, not competing.

    I just want my one device to keep in my pocket that will keep me in touch with my job and keep the immense resources of the internet at my fingertips everywhere I go.
  3. #3  
    ITA with both of you. Treobk, you make some excellent points about the vision of HS/P1 but that lack of follow through on their products.

    Sumorai, the (albeit quickly fading) ubiquity of Palm OS is what has kept me on the Treo. It is not really the form factor or the amenities, while both very important, that really keep me coming back. It's the operating system. I wotk on a Mac at home and a PC at work. A pocket PC would probably be more complicated in my situation and, furthermore, I don't like the *density* of a windows based operating system anyway.

    P1 really needs to be aggressive on its industry stance as a player in the market of smart devices because, as we all know, that's really where P1's bread and butter market is heading. They are absolutely being heralded and puppeted by cell service providers. But, if they had a management team with a back bone rather than just really an OEM for cell phone companies, then they can probably call some shots, rather than take them. From an innovation standpoint P1 is cutting-edge and a visionary. From a business savviness and management stondpoint, they are somewhat lost.
  4. #4  
    I can kinda of see what you mean.

    I'm thrilled to have a pda, phone, mp3 player and pocket arcade in the one gadget. At one stage I would have been happy just to have the phone and pda in one..

    As far as support, Palm devices seem to have more software available to them than any other gadget on the market.


    * I want to be completely mobile (within the context of my company's infrastructure) and am waiting for p1 to release BBC
    * In order to play MP3's, I had to supply my own MP3 player (mmm, well pTunes was a free download)
    * My Swedish collegues flaunt there Sony-Ericsson p900s and out-of-the-box cradle (tidy's up the desk)
    * SE-P900 has bluetooth for cable free sync
    * SE-p900 came with stereo headphones out-of-the-box (I don't know if the headphones also include hands-free operation)
    * I don't care what anyone says, the T600 _does not_ come with a camera (I haven't found a lighting condition yet which allows me to take anything other than 'impressionist' photos) and I feel soooooo ripped off. I mean, really pissed.

    ...And all for the same cost as the SE-P900 or SE-P910. I remeber Motorolla making a similar mistake a while back. They were a market force in Aust. but failed to keep up the "useless gimicks" of poly-phonic, colour, mms etc. that other manufacurers were pushing. Now they're starting to advertise themselves as funky again.

    I feel that P1 made the same mistake with the T600. In there efforts to make the T600 a "business phone" they forgot about the human side. Most of the general managers and directors in my 1500 people company love their 1.x Mpixel camera-phone, and also own a Blackberry for email.

    I want a true all-in-one device device damn-it.

    (ok, end of rant)

    Palm M100 --> GSM Treo 600 --> GSM Treo 650 --> GSM Treo 680
  5. #5  
    Great thread.

    I've been with PalmOS for approx 10 years and various mobiles for several years. The dream of being able to not "take two devices into the shower" has been held for a while now and I fully expected PalmOS/One to be at the forefront. As of yet i still don't own a Treo, why?

    Early models were very 'clunky' and the older OS versions didn't really offer that integrated experience I was after. The 600 appeared just after I committed to another year with Vodafone upgrading my Bluetooth phone (Siemens) to work with my OS4 Clie. When my contract was up last May (04) the rumours of the Ace/650 were so prevalent I had to hold on for a few months - Bluetooth to connect datawise to my PC and voice wise to my car was too important.

    Other competitive models have appeared which, had I not such an investment in Palm software (DocsToGo etc.) I would have jumped at - the SonyEricssons etc. Surely I'd have the Treo 650 by september... christmas... my birthday (last week)... Probably June then! (I'm UK based)

    So where does the Treo650 stand here in the middle of February? Actually I think it looks a bit outdated spec wise. If PalmOne really were the leading edge PDA manufacturer we'd be anticipating a large screen, large memory (min 128MB) Treo supporting 3G data services. There may not be a competitor there yet, but considering alternatives like the Nokia 7710 my loyalty is starting to wane with my patience...
  6. #6  
    In my opinion, anything that can be done on Palm OS can be done on Windows Mobile. I have used a variety of Palm OS and Windows Mobile/PocketPC devices over the years and I have found everything that I need on either platform.

    I use a Treo 600 right now because to me it is the best packaged phone/PDA combo at the moment. However, things can change and likely will. A glimpse of that new HP iPAQ Smartphone looks very promising.

    My HP iPAQs have been very well built compared to the recent PalmOne devices I have seen.

    Wi-Fi is one area where Palm OS lags Windows Mobile.

    Quote Originally Posted by sumorai
    My other constraint is that I refuse to purchase a Windows-powered device. The HP and other PocketPC devices fill all of the needs I have, but I won't buy them because I'm not going to be locked into PocketPC. Palm is the de facto standard OS for PDAs. There is every kind of software imaginable for Palm OS, even some unimaginable. I never thought I'd be able to have a DVD on an SD memory card and be able to play it on my Treo, but apparently this has been possible for quite some time.
    Treo 600 GSM
  7. #7  
    Love this thread. If palmOne drops the ball, PalmSource is ready to pick up the momentum. Pleae see my (related) thread posted a few days ago:

    ++News Item: PalmSource Shows Off New Software (2.14.2005)

    On a related note, I got this newsletter in my e-mail box today:
    Open Letter to Ed Colligan: How to Succeed as CEO of palmOne
    Week of February 14, 2005
    Written by J. Gerry Purdy, Ph.D.
    Principal, MobileTrax
    Venture Consultant, Diamondhead Ventures

    Note: Todd Bradley recently resigned from his position as CEO of palmOne. Ed Colligan has been named interim CEO. The Board may appointment him to be the permanent CEO in the near future. Here are my recommendations to Ed regarding what he should do to insure his succession to permanent CEO of palmOne. Typically, I do 1-2 Open Letters each year, but due to the changes at IBM followed quickly by the changes at palmOne, back-to-back Open Letters seemed appropriate. Finally, I have used the recommended way to spell "palmOne" as recommended below.

    To: Ed Colligan, CEO, palmOne
    I've known you for years and I'll never forget our first meeting at Palm Computing in your office on El Camino in Palo Alto. You showed me the first Palm PDA which was amazing since it was the first handheld product that integrated with the desktop to provide a wonderful user experience. I've been a Palm user ever since.

    In the past 10 years, you've gone from being a vibrant, outgoing and sometimes brash marketing executive to the Chief Operating Officer at Handspring to President, and now interim Chief Executive Officer, at palmOne. Donna Dubinsky was of invaluable assistance to you through the Handspring experience, and I know you've been waiting for the day where you could become the CEO of a major company. Here are some recommendations that could help you succeed in your new position and reach your goal of building one of the most successful handheld device companies in the world.

    + Low Cost Treo. While Treo is a wonderful product (I use one myself), it is still positioned at the high end of the SmartPhone market. As you did with the Zire PDA line, you should consider creating a family of Treo products that span a wide price range and user requirements. This will allow more users to consider the Treo platform when they go into a store.

    Here's a key reason why a low-cost Treo will succeed: the keyboard allows younger (read: more price-conscious users) to easily send messages via SMS. Emphasize the keyboard to these young customers. Embrace Wi-Fi. It was disappointing that Wi-Fi was not supported (at least to-date) in the Treo 650. While it's been said that that add-ins from SyChip and drivers are under development, we are hopeful that the next generation Treo will incorporate Wi-Fi.

    + Address Data-Centric Users. The Treo strives to be a cell phone with data services. The form factor is a bit narrow and somewhat difficult to use if you're typing on the keyboard for any real length of time. palmOne has experimented with a data-only wireless handheld model by offering the Tungsten C, but the product didn't directly address the needs of the data-centric users. There should be a device available that incorporates Wi-Fi (b/g) and Bluetooth, provides a great keyboard like the Danger hiptop" and that incorporates a landscape display to enable viewing Web pages easily.

    Integrate a Web browser and messaging software. Enable Bluetooth to communicate with the user's cell phone and, thus, access the phone's wide area wireless data network (GPRS and EV-DO in the phone). It could be a real winner.

    + Re-Position Tungsten. The latest Tungsten is the best high end PDA product ever. That's why I'm recommending the addition of Wi-Fi & GPRS so that you can effectively address the data-centric user market. For example, if palmOne were to acquire Danger (below), you could offer a hiptop form factor with Tungsten branding to address the data-centric market by including Wi-Fi and Bluetooth. Users could still access wide area wireless data communications using a Bluetooth connection to their cell phone.

    + Acquire Good or Visto. An effective strategy to accelerate the process of becoming a major player in the email/messaging business might be to acquire Good Technology or Visto. This would give you access to top engineering in the messaging space that would give you the ability to provide BlackBerry-like functionality to users on all future Tungsten and Treo devices.

    + Acquire Danger. Since RIM and the BlackBerry brand serve enterprise customers, acquire Danger to (better) serve consumers. Again, this would "open up" their platform by adding the Palm environment. This would help you to better address the consumer market. Moreover, the Danger hiptop form factor will also serve the data-centric customers using a landscape display and wide keyboard. The hiptop platform could be modified by adding BlackBerry functionality to address the enterprise market for individuals who do more data than voice.

    + Continue to Innovate. Ongoing innovation from "the Palm Folks" has always been exciting from the original Palm, to the Palm VII (first wireless data handheld for general users), then the Palm V and now the Treo. Keep those creative juices cranked up and by all means, let's see the legacy of innovation continue.

    + Serve The Customers Needs! Innovation is wonderful but it should ultimately be directed toward meeting customer requirements. Continue to study your users' behavior and align your products to meet their needs. If you continue to keep your customers insanely happy (as you've been done in the past), the future will be bright.

    We look forward to working with you and your excellent team. As always, you'll need to continue to work aggressively to retain leadership, but the horizon is in sight. Good luck.

    P.S. Your current logo is "palmOne" but I personally think it should be written as "PalmOne" to give it a look and feel that is more visually balanced.


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