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  1. Daemon's Avatar
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    #61  
    I was thinking more the opposite, that perhaps having the GPS chipset
    do more of it's own work with additional features enabled instead of relying on
    AGPS would increase battery usage. I usually leave GPS turned off, so it's not
    part of my normal battery monitoring. Maybe I'll do a couple days of monitoring
    with GPS on before I enable these changes.

    ian
  2. #62  
    I did this hack on my PRE here in GSM-Land (Netherlands) now the GPS works just fine, and accurate. WebOS 1.2.1
    Thanks EGG333!!
  3. #63  
    Are these settings specific to Sprint? Will this work for gsm networks?
    /EU/GR/
  4.    #64  
    Quote Originally Posted by Daemon View Post
    I was thinking more the opposite, that perhaps having the GPS chipset
    do more of it's own work with additional features enabled instead of relying on
    AGPS would increase battery usage. I usually leave GPS turned off, so it's not
    part of my normal battery monitoring. Maybe I'll do a couple days of monitoring
    with GPS on before I enable these changes.
    The chipset should use the least power intensive method. The programs don't actually care where the GPS coords come from, just that they get them.

    With the exception of AFLT, all the modes are still using the GPS sats to get the coords. You're merely changing the way you find those sats. I can't imagine that once the sats have been found that it's any more or any less of a power drain, though alternate methods may find you more sats that pure aGPS would, which would mean the GPS would be searching for additional sats less often.

    I don't know that is necessarily true, but that was certainly the results that we saw with the 800w. I went from typically having 4-5 sats to having 8-9 nearly all the time.

    The quicker acquisition time should be a battery saver though, especially if you're just opening up the app to do something quick. If you can find your location in 5 seconds instead of 30+ seconds, then not only is that 25+ seconds of the GPS radio searching for sats, that's also 25+ seconds of you getting what you need done faster, which means you don't need the program open as long (25+ seconds of the CPU/GPU not running), etc etc etc. Basically a small trickle down effect.

    Any way you cut it it's probably a very minor gain, if any at all, but I would be curious to see some hard numbers from you if you (or anyone else) would like to provide them.


    Quote Originally Posted by Richard Rosenberger View Post
    I did this hack on my PRE here in GSM-Land (Netherlands) now the GPS works just fine, and accurate. WebOS 1.2.1
    Thanks EGG333!!
    I see Ebagg a lot but I think this is the first time I've ever been called Egg.


    So you're saying that with the following criteria met:
    • out of the country
    • no CDMA signal
    • no WiFi
    • Pre has been rebooted

    that GPS works fine?

    For some reason in all the old 800w threads, that was always "the test" to try.

    Quote Originally Posted by mafia View Post
    Are these settings specific to Sprint? Will this work for gsm networks?
    As long as it is using the same Qualcomm chipset, it should work for any network.

    Palm may have dis/enabled different options out of the box for various networks, however. So say you have a non-Sprint version, you might find all these checkboxes checked by default. (I don't know if that's the case, merely an example.)
    Last edited by Ebag333; 10/11/2009 at 04:12 AM.
  5. #65  
    I'm on Bell (in Canada), and just wondering if you think that I'll be able to get my SPC/MSL code from them... ? Is it possible to find this in the phone itself somehow?

    Thanks in advance!
  6.    #66  
    I'm sure there is a way. The applications on the phone can see them in some form or another (it verifies you have the right MSL to do certain things). There's also the whole hex editing thing that can show it (been there, done that, with the 800w, no thanks, not interested in doing it again).

    Call them and find out. You can tell them that you want to do a RTN reset AKA Factory reset to resolve some issues, and they will give you the MSL as part of the procedure.

    Or just ask for it. In the US, they are required to give it out by law (though the reps will usually panic and be afraid they are going to get in trouble for giving it out). But who knows with you crazy Canadians.
  7. #67  
    Aha! Just found a way in another forum how to get the MSL right off the phone, but I'm not sure if this will work for Bell, and it looks like there isn't any info on 1.2.1 either... Anyhow, for the record:

    (From: Palm Pre SPC/MSL Mini-Howto - Mobile Files dot com)

    Hell, on looking around a bit, there are a few posts on precentral that cover it too. Same basic thing, though.

    Scan addresses, etc. Blah, tired, gotta hit the hay. Sorry for the noise.
    Last edited by Vermithrax; 10/13/2009 at 03:26 AM.
  8. #68  
    @Ebag333 (or any other qualified person!)

    I could not wait for the Pre to reach Europe, so I bought one in the US (OK, no phone since CDMA-based, but wonderful PDA!).

    I am runing WebOS 1.2.1, retrieved my MSL/SPC with QXDM, then checked it (##MSL# with Airplane mode turned off, or the MSL will be declared invalid).

    Simply put, I cannot make QPST Service Programming launch on my Pre. So no way to activate the Standalone GPS feature you described...

    However, QPST 2.7.323 server runs fine, I can launch the EFS Explorer and browse the files (even the GPS directory).

    In QPST, double-clicking on the phone brings the phone properties, which gives (my comments in italics:
    • Phone: SURF6800-65
    • Port: COM15
    • Info
    • ESN: ...not shown on purpose
    • MIN: (000) 000-0000
    • MIN (Analog): (000) 000-0000
    • State: Entering CDMA
    • Phone State: empty
    • Software
    • Version: CC1.2(335)
    • MSM: 2P
    • ...and so on


    But launching QPST Service Programming from QPST Configuration or from the Start -> All Programs -> QPST -> Service Programming under windows simply does nothing.

    I suspect because the phone is not "provisioned" (I mean not running on a CDMA network, it will never be in my area), there can be no "service programming". But is this really possible with such a powerful tool like QPST?

    Am I the first to experience this issue? Did I miss something?

    Any hint would be much appreciated. Thanks
    Last edited by Thibaud; 10/14/2009 at 02:24 PM. Reason: typo fix + QPST version
    Palm Pilot Pro -> M505 -> T|X -> (franken) Pre & Pixi -> Pre2 2.2.4 & TP
    Linphone port to webOS (1.4.x -> ...), lately working on NAVIT
  9. #69  
    I may try this, thanks. Question: what does the PDE IP address in the settings point to? {Jonathan}
  10. #70  
    Quote Originally Posted by Jonathan I Ezor View Post
    I may try this, thanks. Question: what does the PDE IP address in the settings point to? {Jonathan}
    MaxMind is your friend (like any reverseIP/GeoIP tool)! Sorry, don't have enough posts behind to post MaxMind GeoIP link (www dot maxmind dot com slash app slash locate_ip), but it says:
    GeoIP Demo

    MaxMind GeoIP City/ISP/Organization Edition Results

    Hostname Country Code Country Name Region Region Name City Postal Code Latitude Longitude ISP Organization Metro Code Area Code
    68.28.31.49 US United States 38.0000 -97.0000 Sprint PCS Sprint PCS

    And the winner is ... Sprint! ;-)
    Palm Pilot Pro -> M505 -> T|X -> (franken) Pre & Pixi -> Pre2 2.2.4 & TP
    Linphone port to webOS (1.4.x -> ...), lately working on NAVIT
  11. #71  
    Quote Originally Posted by Thibaud View Post
    MaxMind is your friend (like any reverseIP/GeoIP tool)! Sorry, don't have enough posts behind to post MaxMind GeoIP link (www dot maxmind dot com slash app slash locate_ip), but it says:

    And the winner is ... Sprint! ;-)
    Thanks; makes sense. {Jonathan}
  12.    #72  
    Quote Originally Posted by Thibaud View Post
    Simply put, I cannot make QPST Service Programming launch on my Pre. So no way to activate the Standalone GPS feature you described...
    Possibly setup incorrectly, but I really doubt it.

    Sounds to me like that version of QPST isn't working properly. I would try another version. Be careful of viruses if you are downloading from random servers.


    Quote Originally Posted by Jonathan I Ezor View Post
    Question: what does the PDE IP address in the settings point to?
    PDE means: Position Determination Entity.

    For our purposes, think of it simply as a server where you can go and get GPS information from.

    Perhaps the best known or recognized handset based PDE is based on the Global Positioning System (GPS). By itself, GPS can be the most accurate (when satellites are acquired/available), but this technology is often enhanced by the network. Assisted GPS (A-GPS) refers to a PDE system that makes use of additional network equipment that is deployed to help acquire the mobile device (much faster than non-assisted GPS) and provide positioning when the A-GPS system is unsuccessful in acquiring any/enough satellites.
    Remember that there are multiple forms of aGPS. Using the PDE server is merely one of them.

    The Pre may or may not leverage the PDE server, I haven't actually tested each individual form of GPS seperately yet. If it does, then putting in the IP information will give it another method to fall back on should other forms (cached and other aGPS methods fail). If it doesn't, putting it in will do nothing.

    Even if it doesn't, I would still put it in as Palm may add support for it down the road.
  13. #73  
    @Richard

    Quote Originally Posted by Richard Rosenberger View Post
    I did this hack on my PRE here in GSM-Land (Netherlands) now the GPS works just fine, and accurate. WebOS 1.2.1
    Hi Richard,

    I'm also in GSM-land and bought a CDMA Pre, but find myself stuck, unable to add the GPS standalone feature ebag333 kindly proposed (I can run any QPST client but the Service Programming I need...).

    Please could you elaborate a bit on your own case? Specifically:
    1. Was the Pre you bought a "Brand New, Never Opened" (so never activated on a CDMA network)? Or in any other condition, possibly activated?
    2. Did you apply ebag333's procedure directly on webOS 1.2.1, or did you upgrade to webOS 1.2.1 after the GPS upgrade? If so, which webOS version did you start from?
    3. Did you run QPST 2.7 build323 as suggested? Any other version?
    4. Does your phone have a MIN (Mobile Identification Number) set other than (000)000-0000 (ask for the phone properties under QPST, see my post above)?
    5. Do you have any other information that would help me fix my issue?

    Thanks
    Palm Pilot Pro -> M505 -> T|X -> (franken) Pre & Pixi -> Pre2 2.2.4 & TP
    Linphone port to webOS (1.4.x -> ...), lately working on NAVIT
  14. #74  
    Quote Originally Posted by Ebag333 View Post
    Possibly setup incorrectly, but I really doubt it.

    Sounds to me like that version of QPST isn't working properly. I would try another version. Be careful of viruses if you are downloading from random servers.
    Thanks for your feedback. It could also be related to webOS 1.2.1, but I can't prove it. Maybe Richard will provide additional hints.

    I have found another way to go, though: dialing ##USBPASS# (or ##8727277#), I entered the "USB Passthrough Control" menu/application, apparently an equivalent of the mpt command! There are four USB "ports" available, of which I assigned the first two, and a USBNet option (any relation with USBnet networking setup - WebOS Internals?):
    1. ACM USB PORT = DUN
    2. USB PORT 1 = Diag
    3. USB PORT 2 = unassigned
    4. SERIAL PORT = unassigned
    5. Use USBNet = Disabled


    Then I could run QPST Service Programming from QPST Configuration, and proceed as described to activate all the GPS features... Great!

    Then I rebooted the Pre. I am now struggling with ##GPS# to get a fix (of course no EVDO link, also disabling the WiFi interface to run in true standalone mode).

    But no fix so far... At least I've been one step further today! Will keep any new information posted.
    Last edited by Thibaud; 10/15/2009 at 08:01 AM. Reason: Fixed wrong description of 4th port
    Palm Pilot Pro -> M505 -> T|X -> (franken) Pre & Pixi -> Pre2 2.2.4 & TP
    Linphone port to webOS (1.4.x -> ...), lately working on NAVIT
  15. #75  
    Just played a little more with the "USB Passthrough Control" menu/application (dial ##USBPASS# or ##8727277#).

    Assigning "GPS" to "USB PORT 2" yields a new device in the Device manager under Windows XP, dubbed as "Serial Data" with a yellow question mark under "Other Devices"...

    Unfortunately, I don't have a driver for it, at least no yet! Anybody's willing to contribute?

    Could the GPS be accessed through the USB port in the end?
    Palm Pilot Pro -> M505 -> T|X -> (franken) Pre & Pixi -> Pre2 2.2.4 & TP
    Linphone port to webOS (1.4.x -> ...), lately working on NAVIT
  16. #76  
    So what's the word on this??

    Can the Pre's GPS work without Sprint service or not?

    I just found out that Wifi very well might not work when Sprint service is disabled, too!! Google cache of article
  17. #77  
    So... I did this today to my Bell Palm Pre... Success! However, one might want to know the settings for Bell's PDE server are:

    PDE IP Address: 206.47.201.75
    PDE Port number: 8888
    PDE Transport: IP
    Position Calculation: Mobile

    I haven't found any updated ones, but I've seen those posted a couple of times, so hopefully, they'll help any Bell Mobility customers out!

    Any idea how I can test this PDE server, btw? I've tried telnetting to that address from my phone with no luck, but since the GPS seems to still work, I'm assuming that the PDE server information I have there is correct. I could be wrong!

    Update: I can't ping that server either, from my phone. *grumble* Dunno if it's working or not. Somebody with some more technical know-how, lemme know, please.
    Last edited by Vermithrax; 10/17/2009 at 08:09 PM.
  18. DrewPre's Avatar
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    #78  
    I successfully set this up last night also. But It seemed like it took longer [avg 24secs] to acquire my location than over the Sprint network [avg 9 secs]. So I turned it off.
  19.    #79  
    Quote Originally Posted by Thibaud View Post
    Just played a little more with the "USB Passthrough Control" menu/application (dial ##USBPASS# or ##8727277#).

    Assigning "GPS" to "USB PORT 2" yields a new device in the Device manager under Windows XP, dubbed as "Serial Data" with a yellow question mark under "Other Devices"...

    Unfortunately, I don't have a driver for it, at least no yet! Anybody's willing to contribute?

    Could the GPS be accessed through the USB port in the end?
    I'm going to tenatively say....yes. If we can find a driver for it. (And that's a big if.)


    Quote Originally Posted by grndslm View Post
    So what's the word on this??

    Can the Pre's GPS work without Sprint service or not?

    I just found out that Wifi very well might not work when Sprint service is disabled, too!! Google cache of article
    Interesting article.

    Short answer, no clue. Never had the opportunity to test that out.

    Quote Originally Posted by Vermithrax View Post
    So... I did this today to my Bell Palm Pre... Success! However, one might want to know the settings for Bell's PDE server are:

    PDE IP Address: 206.47.201.75
    PDE Port number: 8888
    PDE Transport: IP
    Position Calculation: Mobile

    I haven't found any updated ones, but I've seen those posted a couple of times, so hopefully, they'll help any Bell Mobility customers out!

    Any idea how I can test this PDE server, btw? I've tried telnetting to that address from my phone with no luck, but since the GPS seems to still work, I'm assuming that the PDE server information I have there is correct. I could be wrong!

    Update: I can't ping that server either, from my phone. *grumble* Dunno if it's working or not. Somebody with some more technical know-how, lemme know, please.
    I doubt that they'll allow their servers open to ping (due to risks of packet flooding, etc).

    The only way to test PDE is to disable every other option except PDE, and see what happens.

    What were your default settings?


    Quote Originally Posted by DrewPre View Post
    I successfully set this up last night also. But It seemed like it took longer [avg 24secs] to acquire my location than over the Sprint network [avg 9 secs]. So I turned it off.
    Interesting. Did you simply disable everything, or try turning off some of the extra features?
  20.    #80  
    Newer and simpler instructions up on the first page. No longer need the SDK or Novaterm. Thanks Thibaud!


    Also, a word of warning. Don't try and change the volume settings in QPST. I have messed with them, and found that not only did they not increase my volume anywhere that I can discern, but my speakerphone is almost impossible to hear even at max volume. Only the speakerphone seems to have been effected.

    D'oh.
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