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  1. ttcoupe's Avatar
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       #21  
    Quote Originally Posted by CGK View Post
    This is where you miss the point it's not back-up, the cloud is where the information is stored for access - the pre is just another method of access - it's a mechanism not an endpoint.
    If you look at these threads, many have complained against the idea of placing all your important data to the cloud.

    I believe that Palm will suggest the data is in the Pre. That is how I use my cell phone already, even if I do not have large screen access to it.
  2. cgk
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    #22  
    Quote Originally Posted by ttcoupe View Post
    If you look at these threads, many have complained against the idea of placing all your important data to the cloud.

    I believe that Palm will suggest the data is in the Pre. That is how I use my cell phone already, even if I do not have large screen access to it.
    But it can't only be in the phone - where is the Pre getting the information from? how is it updating your facebook status, how is it updating your outlook exchange server, how is it pulling you gmail calendars?

    The data cannot be only in the phone - what is hard to understand about this?
  3. ttcoupe's Avatar
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       #23  
    You know, the internet connection is two-way.

    The data would be accessible from everywhere. The phone could be a server as described by the patent I have linked.
  4. cgk
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    #24  
    Quote Originally Posted by ttcoupe View Post
    You know, the internet connection is two-way.

    The data would be accessible from everywhere. The phone could be a server as described by the patent I have linked.

    Why would you want our phone to act like a server? Why not use a em.. server something fit for purpose?
  5. ttcoupe's Avatar
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       #25  
    Quote Originally Posted by CGK View Post
    Why would you want our phone to act like a server?
    To access all the data and applications of the Pre?
  6. cgk
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    #26  
    Quote Originally Posted by ttcoupe View Post
    To access all the data and applications of the Pre?
    But why, when I am at my desktop would I want to use a touchscreen email client designed for a 3 inch screen - when I can just use outlook?

    Why would I want to use a pocket version of word, when I can access full word? what on earth is the point?

    Why wouldn't I just use the tools that are fit for purpose?
  7. #27  
    Quote Originally Posted by ttcoupe View Post
    I believe that Palm will suggest the data is in the Pre. That is how I use my cell phone already, even if I do not have large screen access to it.
    Its going to suck for you when you lose your phone.
  8. ttcoupe's Avatar
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       #28  
    The apps are web apps and they probably would make smart use of the screen estate.

    I am speculating, but there is a Palm patent that supports this kind of speculation.
  9. ttcoupe's Avatar
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       #29  
    Quote Originally Posted by ADGrant View Post
    Its going to suck for you when you lose your phone.
    Backup. Cloud backup makes it possible that I buy a new one and it soon has all my data and apps.
    Last edited by ttcoupe; 01/11/2009 at 11:14 AM.
  10. cgk
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    #30  
    Quote Originally Posted by ttcoupe View Post
    The apps are web apps and they probably would make smart use of the screen estate.

    I am speculating, but there is a Palm patent that supports this kind of speculation.
    *bangs head on table*.

    Let us use a worked example -


    My name is BOB.

    I am in the park, I receive an email from my exchange account.

    I read the email and it is someone inviting me for a piece of cake.

    I like cake and reply "yes I would like to come for a piece of cake".

    I go for a piece of cake

    Later I go home.

    I want to check my exchange emails and do my diary

    do I

    a) use my pre

    b) log onto a web app

    c) use the fully featured outlook client on my desktop.

    d) Eat an ice-cream

    Please sent answers on a postcard to...
  11. ttcoupe's Avatar
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       #31  
    Quote Originally Posted by CGK View Post
    do I

    a) use my pre
    b) log onto a web app
    c) use the fully featured outlook client on my desktop.
    d) Eat an ice-cream
    Let's suppose that the answer is c).

    The problem is then how to get to the contacts that you have in your Pre or in the cloud. You might have modified those contacts while away at the park.

    The situation is not dramatically different whether the ultimate contacts repository is the cloud or Pre. If outlook is your email client of choice, then some syncing must be done somewhere so that your contacts are available to that program.
  12. cgk
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    #32  
    Quote Originally Posted by ttcoupe View Post
    Let's suppose that the answer is c).

    The problem is then how to get to the contacts that you have in your Pre or in the cloud. You might have modified those contacts while away at the park.
    *really bangs head on table* - just stop - you clearly have no idea what you are talking, you really don't.

    Why isn't this a problem? Because any contact that I update on the pre would have been instantly updated in the outlook client, that's the whole ****ing point - both are just tools to access the information that is stored in the exchange server.

    If I change a contact from "Big Bob" to "big bob Roberts" - that's how it will be where I access it - that's the WHOLE POINT.
  13. ttcoupe's Avatar
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       #33  
    And it works just like that if the ultimate repository is Pre.
  14. #34  
    Bottom line: I need my contacts, calendar and notes to be on both my phone and my desktop. In the course of my daily business I need to know that I can enter and read any and all PIM and email data on both my phone and my computers (yes, computers, plural--home computer, work computer, etc.) Palm Desktop was great for a long time, until a few years ago when syncing began to take minutes instead of seconds. I really, REALLY hope that the Pre includes some type of massively updated version of the Palm Desktop solution. I should be able to sync, in a matter of seconds, all of my PIM data through wifi or the cell radio, or USB if I so choose. I'll be very disappointed if this is not the case.
  15. #35  
    [QUOTE=CGK;1540993.

    Why isn't this a problem? Because any contact that I update on the pre would have been instantly updated in the outlook client, that's the whole ****ing point - both are just tools to access the information that is stored in the exchange server.

    QUOTE]

    Again, what if you don't have an exchange server? And don't want to pay a monthly fee in addition to your phone data fee for something that has always worked with palm, syncing PIM with nonconnected PC/outlook.

    If they are forcing me to move to their yet unrevealed app, google or exchange . . . I will not buy it. I want access to outlook on my desktop, without exchange. If I am going to be forced to move to google . . . I will use a google phone because ultimately it will have far better integration and features. Looks like palm is saying if you want to use outlook, non exchange, you will need to go windows mobile . . . I will happily do it, but not with a palm branded wm phone.

    My guess is that palm bolted the WebOS together and pc sync was too difficult or they didn't have time to do it. It seems to me from reading other threads that developers are not happy with the developing environments . . . why would a large developer write a simple program that a high school kid could write in a weekend . . . they won't make any money, they need access to more complex feature, but Palm has not created those yet or does not intend to allow access to them.

    From a corporate level we have heard palm talking about getting services to increase revenue . . . the no syncing with outlook or palm desktop (without a subscription service) seems to be their way of artificially trying to force consumers to pay them monthly fees on top of your data fee to the carrier. Sure many of you will just use google for PIMs (but I'd recommend a google phone for that), the "fat middle" palm is talking about getting with this phone is getting small business and prosumers to stop using desktop outlook and syncing it via cable and switching to their yet unrevealed paid subsription PIM service based on exchange or some other paid option. They want to be Research in Motion, but forget that RIMs devices target corporate businesses with exchange servers or Blackberry servers - they will pay additional money for real time sync. Looks like palm is not sure who they developed this phone for and just put out something new for the sake of new. They have made a very simple task very complex, if not impossible.

    To me this is starting to seem like more of the same old palm.
  16. ttcoupe's Avatar
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       #36  
    IMHO, you guys should not worry. I believe that there will be solutions to all the common situations.

    And the most basic solution is that your contacts and calendar data is in your phone and that you can access it from other, larger screen devices when necessary.
  17. #37  
    I don't know about most of you but in my case, I simply couldn't do the cloud for my contact list. If I did, I'd have to carry a phone for work and one for personal uses. There is no way my company of almost 400K people would allow us to utilize this method for storing what they classify as company confidential information. By those contacts residing in a cloud not 100% under their control, we would risk termination upon discovery.

    To the point of the data only residing on the cloud, I also have to disagree with that. I have worked with companies where cell phones are not allowed within the work environment for security reasons. If the contact information resided on the cloud and my cell only, I'd not be able to access them through my email client.

    Additionally, there are many more email systems than Exchange. Initially, two come to mind. IBM's Lotus Notes and Oracle's Collaboration Suite. While they aren't used by everyone, there are a large number of companies that use them and therefore many people are not on Exchange.
  18. cgk
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    #38  
    Quote Originally Posted by OracleBlue View Post
    I don't know about most of you but in my case, I simply couldn't do the cloud for my contact list. If I did, I'd have to carry a phone for work and one for personal uses. There is no way my company of almost 400K people would allow us to utilize this method for storing what they classify as company confidential information. By those contacts residing in a cloud not 100% under their control, we would risk termination upon discovery.

    To the point of the data only residing on the cloud, I also have to disagree with that. I have worked with companies where cell phones are not allowed within the work environment for security reasons. If the contact information resided on the cloud and my cell only, I'd not be able to access them through my email client.

    Additionally, there are many more email systems than Exchange. Initially, two come to mind. IBM's Lotus Notes and Oracle's Collaboration Suite. While they aren't used by everyone, there are a large number of companies that use them and therefore many people are not on Exchange.

    All good points - thing is - this is a consumer device. If you want an enterprise device, then Palm would like you to buy a treo pro...
  19. #39  
    They (Palm or App Cat.) should be able to come up with something for desktop sync. I can sync eWallet over wifi on my iPod Touch, iTunes can sync my Outlook 2K7 with it also. Speaking of eWallet, I hope this makes it to Apps also.
  20. #40  
    I finally got a chance to listen to the post-launch video on linked from TC's home page. The demonstartor says something which gives me pause: He says, about 9+ minutes in, that you're NOT looking at a copy of data that's been synced to the Pre, but to the actual data on the web source.

    If that's the case, then what do you do when you're out of range of a signal. This happens to me fairly regularly. Some of the buildings I work in prevent a good signal from coming through. There are large rural areas of the country where Sprint has no signal at all. And, of course, on an airplane I can't be connected.

    Did Palm really screw the pooch that badly on this? I cetainly hope not. And I don't really think so. Somewhere else I've read that all the locally stored data is in a SQL database, so hopefully contacts, calendar events, emails, etc really are stored on the device, too.

    But that's NOT what is said in the video.
    Bob Meyer
    I'm out of my mind. But feel free to leave a message.
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