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  1.    #101  
    I am dead set on the "old" layout for cursor control not be changed. To that end, using SYM and those same keys *seem* to all be available (I'm not at home to look at the code, so I can't be 100% on that at the moment).

    SYM needs some work, though. It often "sticks" enabled and sends weird keys/macros to Terminal that makes one have to close Terminal completly (and loose everything...) to be able to type in a shell again. Because the corners are still displaying the rounded corners, it's easy to not notice it enabled. I think Terminal should also disable the corner rounding (but we can argue about that after this is resolved ).

    Thoughts?


    M.
  2.    #102  
    Quote Originally Posted by Xanadu73 View Post
    I am dead set on the "old" layout for cursor control not be changed. To that end, using SYM and those same keys *seem* to all be available (I'm not at home to look at the code, so I can't be 100% on that at the moment).

    SYM needs some work, though. It often "sticks" enabled and sends weird keys/macros to Terminal that makes one have to close Terminal completly (and loose everything...) to be able to type in a shell again. Because the corners are still displaying the rounded corners, it's easy to not notice it enabled. I think Terminal should also disable the corner rounding (but we can argue about that after this is resolved ).

    Thoughts?


    M.

    I'm wrong. Hosestly, I don't know what I was thinking. SYM+X and SYM+C are two very vital keys that can't be moved "out of the way".


    M.
  3. #103  
    Hello guys, just wanted to share some of my experience with Terminal and share some possible bugs. I installed vim using ipkg-opt, and transferred most of my settings from my desktop vim to my Pre vim to get it looking pretty nice, that is until you try to scroll within the file. At first, it jumbled up all the lines, so I added "set nowrap" to vimrc since it was recommended for nano. Now, the lines aren't all jumbled up, but I do get a weird problem when scrolling down. As the new lines come up, the first few characters of each line are rendered as "[?1c". For both problems, these are resolved by rotating the screen. When the screen gets redrawn after a rotate, everything looks as it should.

    I was just wondering if this was even fixable for Terminal, and if there's a timeline for a fix. I think there should at least be a button/menu item in the meantime that would allow you to refresh the screen.

    Thanks for the awesome app!
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    #104  
    I've updated the files linked above to enabled Ctrl-Space (NUL) and F1-F10 using Gesture + Orange + 1 to 9 and 0 for F10.
  5. #105  
    I would like to suggest two improvements in the terminal app:
    • rectangle corners in the portrait mode, as the curved ones always hide a couple of characters in the bottom lines
    • taking account of the notifications status, as the notifications area hide the bottom lines completely.

    Otherwise, thank you very much for your efforts so far. Particularly the new paste option is very useful.

    Regards

    Carsten
    Last edited by ZehHa; 02/05/2011 at 08:27 AM.
  6. #106  
    Quote Originally Posted by Xanadu73 View Post
    Considering that all other cursor movements on the Pre are done with Gesture, and already in a "standard" placement, using a different modifier is in no way intuitive.
    Well, I don't think this is the whole truth. In WebOS apps, cursor movements are done with orange + using the touchscreen as a mousepad substitute. Gesture + pressings keys is no standard WebOS cursor movement at all. It's the linux terminal's standard...

    But gesture + V is standard for pasting in WebOS apps. And the "B" key is used in mApps Classic to emulate "down" on the 5-way navigator. So /me can easily memorize "B" for moving downward.

    Just my 0,02 EUR.

    Regards

    Carsten
  7.    #107  
    Quote Originally Posted by ZehHa View Post
    Well, I don't think this is the whole truth. In WebOS apps, cursor movements are done with orange + using the touchscreen as a mousepad substitute. Gesture + pressings keys is no standard WebOS cursor movement at all. It's the linux terminal's standard...
    And since we're talking about a Linux terminal, the Luna key mappings mean exactly nothing.

    Quote Originally Posted by ZehHa View Post
    But gesture + V is standard for pasting in WebOS apps.
    And since we're talking about a Linux terminal, the Luna key mappings mean exactly nothing; especially when you take into account the "standard" paste in a Linux terminal is middle-click (when you have gpm installed, of course), "CTRL"+V is meaningless. And, as has been pointed out, CTRL+V is PGDN in nano - a Linux terminal application.


    M.
  8. #108  
    Quote Originally Posted by Xanadu73 View Post
    And, as has been pointed out, CTRL+V is PGDN in nano - a Linux terminal application.
    And, as can easily be shown (BTDT several times), CTRL+V (which maps to SYM+V on the WebOS devices) in nano (or any other linux application) can happily and peacefully coexist with gesture + V for pasting into nano (or any other linux application).

    From my point of view, the current key mappings looks quite useful and I don't see any necessity for a change at the moment.

    But a user definable key mapping for the WebOS terminal app could perhaps increase some users' satisfaction.

    Regards

    Carsten
  9.    #109  
    Quote Originally Posted by ZehHa View Post
    And, as can easily be shown (BTDT several times)
    I don't know what BTDT means.


    Quote Originally Posted by ZehHa View Post
    CTRL+V (which maps to SYM+V on the WebOS devices) in nano (or any other linux application) can happily and peacefully coexist with gesture + V for pasting into nano (or any other linux application).

    No argument (really! I'm serious!), but in a Linux terminal, a mapping for basic cursor movement that has existed for decades (in just about ALL OS's - my C=64 didn't have a numeric pad) cannot coexist with this new key mapping. It is wrong, in a *NIX terminal.

    As I've already said, if someone tried changing key mappings in another Luna/webOS app that broke the "standard", I'd be just as loud about it as I am about this. Example: Making GEST+P paste "just because it starts with P" in a mail app, or memo app, or something like that. I'd be all over crazy about that and would be clamo(u)ring for moving it back to GEST+V.

    This is wrong, in a NIX terminal. That is the point I'm trying to get across.


    M.
  10. #110  
    Quote Originally Posted by Xanadu73 View Post
    I don't know what BTDT means.
    Been There. Done That.

    Regards

    Carsten

    PS (very silently spoken): I can't detect anything wrong in a nicely working solution. It's not a religion, it's just my Pre...
    Last edited by ZehHa; 02/05/2011 at 06:11 PM. Reason: New thoughts
  11.    #111  
    Quote Originally Posted by ZehHa View Post
    Been There. Done That.

    Regards

    Carsten

    Cool. Thank you!


    M.
  12.    #112  

    Uncle.



    That said...

    First, and foremost, this IS NOT a "jerk" way of distributing an app. I am only doing it this way because I do not have access to any other way of getting this to people who care enough to try these ideas.

    I've been working on a "version" of Terminal that I am using "Console" as a working title. I changed the name (internally as well - and the icon... because I kept tapping the wrong thing...) because I didn't want to screw up Terminal so I can use it as a fall back in case something goes wrong. Terminal and Console do not share any app cookies, DBs, etc. They can live happily together on the same device and not poke each other.

    Going on the thought that the "argument" was about (webOS app vs. classic *NIX terminal), I've decided to change a few things; all of which I think everyone will be happy with (thus handing this out to everyone).


    What I've changed:

    • Cursor movement. Console acts the way a normal webOS app should. The cursor can be moved via ORANGE+moving your finger on the screen. It works pretty well. It goes diagonal more often then I like, so I'm going to be working on a way to filter that out (I have a couple ideas, but I'm *VERY* open to suggestions). It behaves properly when rotated as well. *I* think that because this works as well as it does, ALL current movement cursor control mappings (PGUP, PGDN, HOME, END, etc.) could just go in the bin and free up all those keys. That's not my choice to make, though. I DID NOT remove them, even for "Console".
    • The annoying rounded corners. You can double-tap the screen to make it go full screen. I have added a preference to make it open that way, too. Good stuff. You get an extra few lines on the screen now, and no rounded corners to get in the way! w00t!
    • Added a Changelog screen. Pointless, but there ya go.
    • Transitions. The Zoom has been getting to me for a long time. I changed it to cross-fade. Adding the preference for it is in my personal TODO list, but it's pretty low since I don't think anyone cares enough...


    What's not perfect:

    • Full screen works as advertised. The *ONLY* part that doesn't work right is if you have an app open in full screen mode (eg. nano) --> normal size it --> then full screen, it still thinks its normal sized. Not sure why. I'm looking into that one.
    • Cursor movement going diagonal fairly easily. My favorite text file I've been testing all this with is /md5sums. It's HUGE, it's got long lines, and it's not much to type in all the time for testing. "nano /md5sums" and move your finger around. You'll see what I mean.


    TODO:

    • Orange gets "stuck" ON sometimes after you move the cursor. The little "Orange" banner doesn't display when it's "stuck". Not sure why it gets stuck to begin with. Just cycle through the Orange states to clear it out when you find you can only type numbers...
    • Work on the sticky Sym, Orange issue(s) of old. Maybe a timer?
    • Try and smooth out (filter out small deviations) so cursor movement acts a little more precise / 90 degree.
    • Command line history. webOS is already doing it; there's a bunch of .ash_history* files in /tmp. That doesn't survive a reboot, though. So maybe a DB for history. I dunno yet.
    • Copy support. That'd be really cool. I haven't the foggiest idea how to select text in a thing like this, though...
    • See if I can find GPL (etc.) replacement fonts that maybe look a bit nicer on the screen (minor).
    • *POSSIBLY* move it to PDL/SDL so drawing would be much faster (possible anti-aliased fonts then?). It'd also make it "easier" to port to newer webOS versions, in the coming months.
    • Learn how to program...


    The attachments are a ZIP of the entire "Console" source tree including the .IPKs for arm and i686.

    I'm sorry that I'm not "distributing" simple diffs. I ended up touching a lot of files (especially for the full screen thing), and I... cleaned up the code some... It was kinda hard to follow...

    All my changes are marked with //MINE and a brief note of what I did and why I did it (leaving original intact where I could).

    $ grep -r //MINE *

    will show you everything I touched.

    The code (in most files) looks much prettier, or at least "consistent", in most of the files now. It was really hard to work on these files in kate (KDE Advanced Text Editor) the way they were. Diffs would be next to pointless since they'd be mostly full files anyway. Yes, the changes could be easily "back-ported" into Terminal's source because I marked everything I did.

    Anyway, I want to repeat that I'm sorry that I'm handing this out this way, but I have no other way of doing it.

    I'm still going to continue to work on this. If it's decided that these changes are liked and to be back-ported into Terminal, I'll leave it up to whomever makes that decision to decide how it's handled. You could simply change the internal name(s) of Console and it'll become Terminal again for a quick swap. I could put my changes into Terminal (or someone else could, I'm just saying). Whatever. That bit isn't really for me to decide, though I think everyone will like/accept these changes.

    The attachment includes full source tree and IPKs for arm and i686. I've been using "Console" exclusively for a couple weeks now. It has not done anything wrong to my Pre-. My kittens have not been eaten, either. The 0.0.6 version is working perfectly (with exception to the above), so don't be afraid to try it out.

    Here's the ZIP file: Console.zip

    Thank you for your time. Sorry this is so long...

    And yes, paste is Gest+V.


    M.

    P.S.
    I'm *NOT* a programmer. Please go easy on me...
  13. #113  
    It's great to see the power of open source at work.

    A temporary 'fork' like this (where there are two incompatible options for something, and no-one has the time to turn them into a user-selectable option) is quite common, and definitely not something that anyone needs to feel anything other than respect for. And you've done it properly by changing the name to avoid confusion and marking the changes clearly.


    In addition, you've added new features in the source code which are now available to be merged back into Terminal under the open source license.

    A good step forward in all respects.

    -- Rod
  14. #114  
    Can I get some basic direction on how to use Terminal? I'm trying to follow the steps here:
    http://forums.precentral.net/general...0-above-5.html
    and since WSQI no longer has command line, I'm doing it on the Pre 2 itself. Help for a noob!?
  15.    #115  
    Quote Originally Posted by rwhitby View Post
    It's great to see the power of open source at work.

    A temporary 'fork' like this (where there are two incompatible options for something, and no-one has the time to turn them into a user-selectable option) is quite common, and definitely not something that anyone needs to feel anything other than respect for. And you've done it properly by changing the name to avoid confusion and marking the changes clearly.


    In addition, you've added new features in the source code which are now available to be merged back into Terminal under the open source license.

    A good step forward in all respects.

    -- Rod

    I'm glad you put quotes around the word "fork". It's not my intention to replace Terminal. This is more "proof of concept" because some of the changes are that jarring. That's also why I didn't pull out the "old" key mappings for cursor control.

    It occurred to me that I left some PDK headers/libs in there (in the own dir). They aren't being used right now. My original thought was to use Orange+Back and Forward swipe for HOME and END respectively. I was reading through some API docs (I've done a LOT of that the past couple weeks!) and read, assuming I read it right, that the Gesture Forward Swipe can only be used if PDK.h is an include. So I was thinking of playing with that too.

    At any rate, I'm glad this has ben received the way it was intended.

    Open Source is cool. That's why my personal machines have been running Gentoo since 2002 (and Mandrake for the few years before that).

    Thank you, Rod.


    M.
  16.    #116  
    Quote Originally Posted by Xanadu73 View Post
    I'm sorry that I'm not "distributing" simple diffs. I ended up touching a lot of files (especially for the full screen thing), and I... cleaned up the code some... It was kinda hard to follow...

    Hey!

    I'm just dumb. Here's the diff. It's 4185 lines... No, I didn't type all that. It's just because I was doing a lot of prettying. Anyway, I originally said it wasn't possible. I was wrong...

    diff -rupN terminal/build/src/ console/build/src/ > ~/Terminal_Console.diff

    Boom. Done. :-)

    Terminal_Console.patch


    M.
  17. #117  
    Sorry, quick question, I couldn't find an answer about this yet... Any word on when Terminal will work on WebOS 2.0.1 (or 2.1)?

    Thanks in advance!
  18. #118  
    +1
  19.    #119  
    Quote Originally Posted by Vermithrax View Post
    Sorry, quick question, I couldn't find an answer about this yet... Any word on when Terminal will work on WebOS 2.0.1 (or 2.1)?

    Thanks in advance!

    Oh, God...

    I wasn't aware that it wasn't working in 2.1. Well, there goes that idea of upgrading my Pre-.





    M.
  20. #120  
    it starts but is not working, just black please fix it.
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