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  1.    #1  
    We think have discovered the official means for launching native applications on the Pre, which has been added in webOS 1.3.5 ..

    Earlier today, I was looking at the output of "strings /usr/bin/LunaSysMgr", and found the following:

    Code:
    Jan 03 04:15:37 <rwhitby> destinal, jacques: from "strings" on LunaSysMgr:
    Jan 03 04:15:52 <rwhitby> ProcessManager::launchNativeApp
    which lead to:

    Code:
    Jan 03 04:17:08 <rwhitby> and nearby that string: Failed to launch native app %s with path: %s
    Jan 03 04:17:14 <jacques> %s: %d Failed to launch native app %s with path: %s
    Jan 03 04:17:21 <rwhitby> jacques: snap
    then:

    Code:
    Jan 03 04:17:54 <rick_home> ok guys, so in strings, what else is near process manager?
    Jan 03 04:20:39 <rwhitby> rick_home: other process manager things are:
    Jan 03 04:20:40 <rwhitby> ProcessManager::launchBootTimeApp
    Jan 03 04:20:49 <rwhitby> ProcessManager::launchNativeApp
    Jan 03 04:20:58 <rwhitby> ProcessManager::launch
    so we tried:

    Code:
    Jan 03 04:26:50 <rwhitby> luna-send -n 1 luna://com.palm.applicationManager/launchNativeApp '{}'
    but only got:

    Code:
    Jan 03 04:26:31 <rwhitby> ** Message: serviceResponse Handling: 2, {"returnValue":false,"errorCode":-1,"errorText":"Method \"launchNativeApp\" with signature \"s\" on interface \"org.json\" doesn't exist\n"}
    then another find:

    Code:
    Jan 03 04:37:51 <destinal> ooh
    Jan 03 04:38:17 <destinal> I think appinfo.json
    Jan 03 04:38:26 <destinal> and I think we want a type of "game"
    Jan 03 04:38:46 <destinal> strings on LunaSysMgr has the two keywords near each other and the other appinfo stuff
    Jan 03 04:39:39 <destinal> I still don't know how we get the binary path in there though
    then a set-back:

    Code:
    Jan 03 04:47:40 <destinal> ok trying type of game with a main of the binary name
    Jan 03 04:47:44 <destinal> let's see what happens
    Jan 03 04:54:38 <destinal> hmm, it doesn't care about type
    Jan 03 04:54:51 <destinal> or seemingly not anyway
    Some more investigation:

    Code:
    Jan 03 05:37:47 <destinal> THere are a number of undocumented properties for appinfo.json
    Jan 03 05:37:59 <destinal> reading in the LunaSysMgr binary
    Jan 03 05:38:30 <destinal> keywords mimeTypes type (and maybe game, or maybe that's a type) appsize requiredMemory visible transparent attributes launchPointId params
    Some interesting news about Preware

    Code:
    Jan 03 06:18:51 <zsoc> guys at best buy install preware before they sell phones to people
    Jan 03 06:18:53 <zsoc> i saw it happen
    Then the breakthrough came:

    Code:
    Jan 03 06:44:57 <rwhitby> destinal: PmLogCtl set LunaSysMgr debug
    Jan 03 06:45:27 <destinal> rwhitby: ah, nice
    Jan 03 06:45:33 <rwhitby> I just remembered about PmLogCtl - I was using it the other day for mapping out com.palm.netroute
    Jan 03 06:45:39 <rwhitby> OOHHHH
    Jan 03 06:46:36 <rwhitby> destinal: you said "game" for type, right?
    Jan 03 06:46:51 <destinal> rwhitby: it's either type game or a new property called game
    Jan 03 06:46:52 <rwhitby> let me try that ....
    Jan 03 06:47:09 <rwhitby> 2010-01-03T02:32:18.045349Z [337] palm-webos-device user.notice LunaSysMgr: {LunaSysMgr}: int IpcServer::launchNativeProcess(const std::string&, const char*, char* const*, int): Process org.webosinternals.sdlquake (/media/cryptofs/apps/usr/palm/applications/org.webosinternals.sdlquake/index.html) launched with pid: 1762
    Jan 03 06:47:20 <destinal> rwhitby: very nice
    Jan 03 06:47:31 <zsoc> rwhitby: waaaaiiiiittt a second. i see what you did there
    Jan 03 06:47:33 <destinal> just change the name from index.html to something useful
    Jan 03 06:47:56 <destinal> rwhitby: it was type game you used?
    Jan 03 06:47:59 <jacques> rwhitby: ?? what did you just do ??
    Jan 03 06:48:11 <zsoc> jacques: he just won the game
    Jan 03 06:48:12 <destinal> I did that earlier but didn't have logging up high enough
    Jan 03 06:48:23 <destinal> PmLogCtl set LunaSysMgr debug   for the win
    Jan 03 06:48:24 <rwhitby> destinal: no change
    Jan 03 06:48:35 <rwhitby> oh, maybe I need a rescan
    Jan 03 06:48:57 <destinal> rwhitby: well it's launching native process as opposed to a web app right?
    Jan 03 06:49:02 <rwhitby> 2010-01-03T02:37:29.688201Z [649] palm-webos-device user.notice LunaSysMgr: {LunaSysMgr}: void ApplicationManager::postLaunchPointChange(const LaunchPoint*, const std::string&): Posting LaunchPoint change { "id": "org.webosinternals.sdlquake", "version": "1.0.9", "appId": "org.webosinternals.sdlquake", "vendor": "WebOS Internals", "vendorUrl": "", "size": 20316160, "removable": true, "launchPointId": "org.webosinternals.sdlquake_default", "title": "Quake", "appmenu": "Quake", "icon": "\/media\/cryptofs\/apps\/usr\/palm\/applications\/org.webosinternals.sdlquake\/icon.png", "change": "updated" }
    Jan 03 06:49:11 <rwhitby> rescan does something indeed
    Jan 03 06:49:30 <jacques> that looks ... good
    Jan 03 06:49:42 <rwhitby> bingo
    Jan 03 06:49:43 <rwhitby> 2010-01-03T02:38:05.967041Z [685] palm-webos-device user.notice LunaSysMgr: {LunaSysMgr}: int IpcServer::launchNativeProcess(const std::string&, const char*, char* const*, int): Process org.webosinternals.sdlquake (/media/cryptofs/apps/usr/palm/applications/org.webosinternals.sdlquake/bin/quake) launched with pid: 1770
    Jan 03 06:49:53 <rwhitby> but no card
    Jan 03 06:50:04 <destinal> well there are some other directives we may need
    Jan 03 06:50:04 <rwhitby> next line is 2010-01-03T02:38:06.109741Z [685] palm-webos-device user.notice LunaSysMgr: {LunaSysMgr}: void IpcServer::childProcessDied(GPid, gint): pid: 1770, status 256
    Jan 03 06:50:13 <zsoc> broken
    Jan 03 06:50:14 <destinal> requiredMemory for one
    Jan 03 06:50:22 <destinal> it may have decided you exceeded your quota of 0
    Jan 03 06:50:33 <jacques> unless 0 means no quota
    Jan 03 06:50:40 <rwhitby> root@palm-webos-device:/media/cryptofs/apps/usr/palm/applications/org.webosinternals.sdlquake# ./bin/quake
    Jan 03 06:50:43 <rwhitby> FindFile: can't find gfx/pop.lmp
    Jan 03 06:50:45 <rwhitby> Playing shareware version.
    Jan 03 06:50:47 <rwhitby> FindFile: can't find gfx.wad
    Jan 03 06:50:49 <rwhitby> Error: W_LoadWadFile: couldn't load gfx.wad
    Jan 03 06:50:54 <rwhitby> I reckon it's PWD
    Jan 03 06:51:05 <zsoc> rwhitby: i'm sure its PWD
    Jan 03 06:51:28 <destinal> rwhitby: what about launchPointId
    Jan 03 06:51:37 <destinal> maybe that translates to working dir
    Jan 03 06:51:46 <jacques> there's an initial conditions issue
    Jan 03 06:51:49 <destinal> or maybe it's binary name
    Jan 03 06:52:18 <rwhitby> let's try a wrapper script
    Jan 03 06:52:19 <destinal> rwhitby: does doom have params?
    Jan 03 06:52:31 <rwhitby> remember to rescan
    Jan 03 06:52:35 <destinal> maybe we can specify where the wad is
    Jan 03 06:53:39 <rwhitby> bingo
    Jan 03 06:54:28 <destinal> rwhitby: script or params?
    Jan 03 06:54:49 <rwhitby> destinal: script
    Jan 03 06:54:57 <rwhitby> cd ... ; ./quake
    Jan 03 06:55:22 <rwhitby> gentlemen, we have native launch
    What's this all mean?

    It means that we can now install a native Linux application on the Pre (e.g. DOOM! or Quake or Need For Speed or OpenVPN) and launch it without any need for the Upstart Manager Service that I spent 4 solid hours creating the other day.

    This has significant implications, not just for games, but for any type of advanced homebrew application.

    We'll let the reader ponder on what those implications may be - we've thought of quite a few in the last hour ...

    -- Rod
    WebOS Internals and Preware Founder and Developer
    You may wish to donate by Paypal to donations @ webos-internals.org if you find our work useful.
    All donations go back into development.
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  2. kmax12's Avatar
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    #2  
    Could you install preware with just a single ipk that could be distributed through the palm app catalog or fileCoaster?
  3. #3  
    Outstanding!
    Code:
    Brian K. White  --  brian@aljex.com  --  http://www.aljex.com/bkw/
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  4. #4  
    Quote Originally Posted by rwhitby View Post
    It means that we can now install a native Linux application on the Pre (e.g. DOOM! or Quake or Need For Speed or OpenVPN) and launch it without any need for the Upstart Manager Service that I spent 4 solid hours creating the other day.

    -- Rod
    I had to chuckle at that one. Thems the "breaks" as it were in app development. I'm not a raw coder per say but do enough that this "gotcha" has gotten me many times. (Work all weekend on a solution and Monday an epiphany is realized that shortcuts 19 hours of Sunday Game time sacrifice!)

    Excellent work tho! Does this mean you will rework the DOOM! port and is there any performance benefit to the native call over the upstart manager other than easier launching?
  5. Nismode's Avatar
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    #5  
    Maybe this is what Palm is unveiling at CES....
    Palm m100>Palm m130>Sony Clie>HP Jornada 525>Dell Axim X3i>Nokia 3395>Nokia 6630>Motorola i530>PPC 6700>Mogul (PPC-6800)

    Palm Pre!
  6. #6  
    Quote Originally Posted by cobrakon View Post
    I had to chuckle at that one. Thems the "breaks" as it were in app development. I'm not a raw coder per say but do enough that this "gotcha" has gotten me many times. (Work all weekend on a solution and Monday an epiphany is realized that shortcuts 19 hours of Sunday Game time sacrifice!)

    Excellent work tho! Does this mean you will rework the DOOM! port and is there any performance benefit to the native call over the upstart manager other than easier launching?
    As a software developer (not on the pre) This is business as usual and doesn't bother me. All my best work starts out large and complicated and then the more I work on it the smaller it gets. By the time I call it "done" it's often 1/4 or 1/10th the size and complexity of the first working version. Some of my stuff that's grown over time, even though it's functional and robust, I stiull consider somewhat of a failurte because I just know I'm missing some way to simplify it by at least 50%.

    Consider the earlier larger work which you "threw away" or "obsoleted" instead of thinking of it as wasted, think of it as prototyping. Before you can make the nice optimized widget, you first have to make a big ugly hand made bolted together prototype to figure out all the ins & outs.
    Code:
    Brian K. White  --  brian@aljex.com  --  http://www.aljex.com/bkw/
    +++++[>+++[>+++++>+++++++<<-]<-]>>+.>.+++++.+++++++.-.[>+<---]>++.
    filePro BBx  Linux SCO  Prosper/FACTS AutoCAD  #callahans Satriani
  7.    #7  
    Quote Originally Posted by kmax12 View Post
    Could you install preware with just a single ipk that could be distributed through the palm app catalog or fileCoaster?
    Yep.

    Quote Originally Posted by cobrakon View Post
    I had to chuckle at that one. Thems the "breaks" as it were in app development. I'm not a raw coder per say but do enough that this "gotcha" has gotten me many times. (Work all weekend on a solution and Monday an epiphany is realized that shortcuts 19 hours of Sunday Game time sacrifice!)

    Excellent work tho! Does this mean you will rework the DOOM! port and is there any performance benefit to the native call over the upstart manager other than easier launching?
    Don't worry, the upstart service is still very useful in it's own right (e.g. for an OpenVPN GUI to be able to start and stop an OpenVPN backend service). It's absolutely not wasted at all, and I'll be continuing work on it to add more features.

    In my limited testing, the combination of my upstart manager service and oil's front-end javascript which calls it actually outperformed Palm's icon launching method

    -- Rod
    WebOS Internals and Preware Founder and Developer
    You may wish to donate by Paypal to donations @ webos-internals.org if you find our work useful.
    All donations go back into development.
    www.webos-internals.org twitter.com/webosinternals facebook.com/webosinternals
  8. #8  
    This is truly a HUGE step forward.
    dBsooner
    WebOS-Internals Member and Developer
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  9. #9  
    wow! Excellent work.

    really cool
    Last edited by windzilla; 01/03/2010 at 04:17 AM.
  10. CUH
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    #10  
    can somebody make a snes emulator now?
  11. #11  
    Absolutely brilliant work all
    Still need 1.3.5 on O2 UK! Grrrr
  12. #12  
    Quote Originally Posted by rwhitby View Post

    Then the breakthrough came:
    Code:
    Jan 03 06:55:22 <rwhitby> gentlemen, we have native launch
    That's absolutely breathtaking! Now we can kick all the other mother******* phones in the ****! haha

    Quote Originally Posted by ajborley View Post
    Absolutely brilliant work all
    Still need 1.3.5 on O2 UK! Grrrr
    Same here (Germany)! Still waiting for updates
  13. #13  
    [QUOTE=Same here (Germany)! Still waiting for updates [/QUOTE]

    I'am sitting in the same boat (also in Germany). But i can wait. When 1.3.5 becomes available in some weeks, we will eventually have more than two ported games with the alpha-errors killed
  14. R_E
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    #14  
    it just amazes me how you guys are able to figure this stuff out. Bravo
  15. #15  
    Very exciting news! As always, thanks for all your hard work gentlemen.
    Blaize, Mistress of Verbosity



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  16. Kedar's Avatar
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    #16  
    Thanks for this!

    I'm not exactly stupid, but I'm a bit confused on what type of "advanced" applications will come out of this.
    Games, I'm expecting... but I feel like you're implying more.
  17. #17  
    Quote Originally Posted by Kedar View Post
    Thanks for this!

    I'm not exactly stupid, but I'm a bit confused on what type of "advanced" applications will come out of this.
    Games, I'm expecting... but I feel like you're implying more.
    Apps beyond javascript, html and css.. Native linux apps are possible, with low level access.
    Last edited by youslippin; 01/03/2010 at 11:23 AM. Reason: more information
  18. #18  
    any chance to port firefox mobile for maemo to Pre?

    It would be a signature move that stick Pre out of the pack right away.

    gracias!
    Last edited by clevin; 01/03/2010 at 11:32 AM.
  19. #19  
    So, technically, this will allow MAME to work at some point, right? Is it possible to do this in the emulator?
    Newton->Visor Deluxe->Visor Prism->Treo 300->Treo 600->Treo 650->Treo 755p->Touch Pro->Palm Pre!
  20. #20  
    Quote Originally Posted by youslippin View Post
    Apps beyond javascript, html and css.. Native linux apps are possible, with low level access.
    Will this eventually make possible pc-type apps capable of editing/ creating documents in a more worthy manner than what we have now? Anything beyond lifestyle/ entertainment oriented?
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