View Poll Results: Should MyTether be allowed to call itself "donationware"?

Voters
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  • Yes

    29 16.02%
  • No

    145 80.11%
  • Unsure

    7 3.87%
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  1. #21  
    @ helidos i NEED tethering to have WiFi. tethering is just a cheap parlor trick without it.

    @aaron91rs post it then. NO ONE IS GONNA STOP YOU.

    @trekker i don't think sprint has had any comments about myTether...yet. also the issue is not whether or not i am improperly using my "unlimited" data plan. live long and prosper

    @mfive at first i thought i didn't like you because i thought you were just bashing the little guy, but now i see that you are standing up for everyone else. i completely agree with you.

    is the issue that he sold it? can someone sell an app for my Pre that doesn't go through the app store? how can that happen? is there anyway for myTether to become legitimate but still charge for purchase? someone please clarify.
  2. #22  
    Quote Originally Posted by mfive View Post
    I'm not sure where you're going with this? webOS Internals helped aonic to adjust myTether specifically to allow it into Preware and conform to webOS Internals standards. Does this mean that webOS Internals stands behind Preware and condones it...? That's not for me to decipher.
    I'll have to reread Rod's post but I thought his reasoning for doing so was to have it meet certain criteria to make it easy to install/un-install without causing problems with the Pre itself and other apps.

    Since the Pre is used on other carriers, it may be ok to supply a tethering app for them. I was referring to Sprint specifically. If MyTether was made available to Sprint users via Preware, I don't think Sprint would appreciate that very much and any "good rep" that WebOS Internals has with Sprint may suffer.

    Sure, Sprint would rather everyone buy apps from their "crap-a-log" but they probably know that the Homebrew community is helping to sell phones, or at least make the Pre more appealing, so at this stage I think they are "silently thankful" for the Homebrew community but that could change at any time.

    Of course all this is just my opinion and speculation and I could be totally clueless about the whole thing.
  3. mfive's Avatar
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       #23  
    Quote Originally Posted by knauerhase View Post
    What do we mean by "allowed"? As if anyone here has any authority at all? The author can call it whatever he wants. I call it "pretty darn cool" -- do we need a poll for that?

    Rob
    Thanks for your educated response...

    By no means am I trying to enforce anything. By definition, a poll is an inquiry into public opinion... And yes, I'm using this poll to inquire into the public's opinion...

    The problem is, the author CAN'T call it whatever he wants.
    Last edited by mfive; 02/11/2010 at 04:40 PM.
  4. mfive's Avatar
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       #24  
    Quote Originally Posted by jmcloud_utk View Post
    is the issue that he sold it? can someone sell an app for my Pre that doesn't go through the app store? how can that happen? is there anyway for myTether to become legitimate but still charge for purchase? someone please clarify.
    I wholly support tethering. It's my personal opinion that Sprint lets us slip by as long as we're not abusing it. I think they keep the clause about tethering in the TOS and use it on an "as needed" basis. It's there for their protection, and I can understand that. I owned pdaNet when I had all my previous Treos, and have tethered on Sprint for probably close to 5 years.

    I can't really comment on your questions, maybe someone with more expertise can chime in there. I have heard, but am not positive, that the reason he calls it "donationware" is because he's using Palm's code and cannot legally sell it. But, that's the real issue... he's selling code under a false pretense that you're donating... If that is true, this goes completely against any open-source initiative, and in my opinion is only hurting our community.

    The issue, in my eyes, is only in the manner of which he sells his app as "donationware". If he would just say, "buy" my app for $15, then there would be no discussion (at least about the sales model). It's not donating when you are FORCED to pay money for it. So many people are getting confused with the underlying issue and just saying "if you don't want it don't buy it." It's not about wanting it or needing it... to me, it's about a deceitful way of selling a product.
    Last edited by mfive; 02/11/2010 at 04:42 PM. Reason: clarity
  5. #25  
    Quote Originally Posted by mfive View Post
    ...webOS Internals helped aonic to adjust myTether specifically to allow it into Preware and conform to webOS Internals standards...
    MyTether is a commercial application and there are no plans that I know of to get it into Preware. Rod's generous act was purely for the safety and security of the homebrew community.

    -Eric G

    WebOS Internals Developer.
    Follow me on Twitter for updates to my projects: | Virtual Keyboard | wIRC | SuperTux | AUPT | KeyBoss | freeTether |

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  6. Helidos's Avatar
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    #26  
    Quote Originally Posted by jmcloud_utk View Post
    @ helidos i NEED tethering to have WiFi. tethering is just a cheap parlor trick without it.
    No the wifi part is a cheap trick before smart phones had wifi we used cables and then blue tooth and now wifi is the cool trick. A lot of people including myself still use the cable to keep our phones charged since tethering is a serious battery drain.. But my point was we already have other options to tether.

    May not be your optimum solution but its there. And with work Free tether could have wifi tethering turned on.
    Last edited by helidos; 02/11/2010 at 05:32 PM.
  7. mfive's Avatar
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       #27  
    Quote Originally Posted by egaudet View Post
    MyTether is a commercial application and there are no plans that I know of to get it into Preware. Rod's generous act was purely for the safety and security of the homebrew community.
    According to Aonic, MyTether is not a commercial application, because he's "not" charging for it...

    You're right, it was for the safety and security, and included in that was "making sure that every homebrew application is using best practices for correct installation and safe removal, non-interference with unrelated webOS functionality, and general security", which leads back to it being compatible with Preware/WOSQI (i.e. correct installation/safe removal) , regardless of how you word it.
  8. Helidos's Avatar
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    #28  
    Would it suit everyone better if aonic just changed if from a donation to a one time subscription fee to access the forums which would provide access to the installer which is then only available to subscribers. This way he is not forcing a donation and just limiting access based on your subscription status?

    This would solve the donation issues.
    Last edited by helidos; 02/11/2010 at 05:42 PM.
  9. #29  
    Quote Originally Posted by mfive View Post
    According to Aonic, MyTether is not a commercial application, because he's "not" charging for it...
    If it ever comes to it, he can try selling that line to the judge!
  10. #30  
    Technically, the charge is for access to a forum. It just so happens that the only way to download the application is to have access to that forum.

    Call it what you want, but if you want that application, you have to transfer $15 from your pocket to his. Donation, gift, purchase, it all ends the same way... you give $15, he gives an application.
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  11. #31  
    myTether is not alone in this forced donation racket. Churches require tithing in order to allow their patrons eternal salvation. The YMCA won't let me workout without donating monthly (which they draft from my account). Museums require a minimum donation in order to see the PUBLIC exhibits. I'm not saying that myTether is an institution, but this compulsory donation racket is everywhere. i don't see anyone not paying their taxes! i don't see why it matters. i don't see why PDAnet can sell the same software and has for years, and now myTether crosses the line. i think that PDAnet used to call their charge a donation too. is it because the app store has "legitimized" things? is it illegal to sell an app (no matter what you call the act) outside the app store? if it is, is this truly and open os?

    tethering was only a trick before wifi. it required paying for a program or finding some nasty difficult hack. installing messy drivers or setting up an adhoc bluetooth networking connection in windows xp (which was not even possible before sp2). bluetooth had short range and used power at a considerable rate from both laptop and pc. also, you had to have bluetooth, which was costly or required addition purchase. the usbnet drivers sucked for windows xp, just like they suck for vista and 7. that was a horrible solution. it's not a solution. it is just another list of problems to solve.

    @spader not true. if i knew you, and you didn't have myTether, i could give it to you. i can share it over the internet. v2.0.4 was available through pirate-torrent. i have stated before that the donation is given for access to the donors forum. that is were you can download and discuss the program from and with the developer. but the simple view (which is often what the courts decide is right) is that mytether was offered on the site. i gave money to access the link for downloading. i had to compulsory give money to have the program (and access to part of the forum). can that action be consider a donation? does it matter?

    @helidos i don't think the issue is just that he calls it donorware. the issue seems to be that by charging per download (in any manner) is against the terms of the SDK for webos, unless it is in the app store. anyone know anything about the ToS? developers?
    Last edited by jmcloud_utk; 02/11/2010 at 05:57 PM.
  12. Helidos's Avatar
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    #32  
    Quote Originally Posted by Spader View Post
    Technically, the charge is for access to a forum. It just so happens that the only way to download the application is to have access to that forum.

    Call it what you want, but if you want that application, you have to transfer $15 from your pocket to the his. Donation, gift, purchase, it all ends the same way... you give $15, he gives an application.
    Agreed but by having a subscription button it would stop this debate over donation ware.
  13. #33  
    Quote Originally Posted by helidos View Post
    Agreed but by having a subscription button it would stop this debate over donation ware.

    Yup... then we'd have a poll/debate that says "Should MyTether Be Allowed To Call Itself A Subscription Service?"

    We'll have debates like this as long as there is any type of fee whatsoever associated with any application outside of the official App Catalog.
    Follow me on teh Twitterz
  14. #34  
    Quote Originally Posted by mfive View Post
    webOS Internals helped aonic to adjust myTether specifically to allow it into Preware and conform to webOS Internals standards. Does this mean that webOS Internals stands behind Preware and condones it...? That's not for me to decipher.
    1) I did not help Aonic to get MyTether into Preware. MyTether is a commercial product, and has not been submitted to any feed that Preware publishes.

    2) WebOS Internals stands behind Preware. WebOS Internals has no relationship with the applications in the feeds that Preware makes available (other than the webos-internals and optware feeds).

    3) If you mean to imply that WebOS Internals condones MyTether, then you should read the following (which I added as a comment on the PreCentral article):

    I want to make it perfectly clear that the extent of my involvement with the author was to make sure that this application installs and uninstalls safely and does not interfere with other homebrew applications or webOS features.

    I have not been involved in creating, reviewing or modifying the actual functionality of the application.

    I advised the MyTether author on installation issues specifically so that MyTether would not continue to cause hassles for webOS users.

    On any other matters related to MyTether, I prefer to remain neutral and not engage in the debate. Whether or not you comply with the terms of service for your current cellular carrier is between you and your cellular carrier. I live in a country (Australia) where there are no unlimited data plans, and all carriers love tethering because users pay for what they use directly.

    So I personally have no need to use this application (since unlocked GSM Pre devices do tethering out of the box), and my only interest is to ensure that other homebrew applications are not affected by applications that do not comply with best practices on installation and security. MyTether 2.1.0 (thanks to my intervention) now does comply with those best practices.
    You should also carefully read the first post in http://forums.precentral.net/homebre...-mytether.html before making any implications about the rationale behind WebOS Internals advising the MyTether author on how to stop that application breaking things.

    -- Rod
    WebOS Internals and Preware Founder and Developer
    You may wish to donate by Paypal to donations @ webos-internals.org if you find our work useful.
    All donations go back into development.
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  15. #35  
    its not a donation if i have to pay for it to get it regardless of what you call it . its like saying i require you to donate for this freeware lol its a double negative
    ĦṔ-Ḷṫ-Ŧḯη
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  16. #36  
    Quote Originally Posted by helidos View Post
    Agreed but by having a subscription button it would stop this debate over donation ware.
    No it wouldn't because the debate isn't over what to call it. The debate is does he have the right to steal from Palm and Sprint and make a profit off of it?

    Everyone is debating this in their own self interested economics. We all know the theory of getting something that's stolen is always cheaper then legally paying for it. So let's stop justifying his profiteering because it saves you money.

    Let me put this in another way...

    If you find an abandoned grocery truck on the side of the road with back open, loaded with groceries and you pass out food to hungry people walking by then there would be something Robin Hoodesq about that. However if you setup a stand with a cash register, slap your name on it and start charging for groceries then you've stepped into something else entirely.

    He needs to make it truly donationware by removing the mandatory price thereby acknowledging that although the app steals code from Palm, steals bandwidth from Sprint and violates the TOS he put some time in developing this app and let people decide how much or maybe not at all to contribute. That would be the right thing to do.
  17. #37  
    ^
    Well said.
  18. #38  
    Crackberry have a tether app for $49.95... So I'm happy with spending $15 on a 'Donationware'
    --Marvin
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       #39  
    Quote Originally Posted by rwhitby View Post
    1) I did not help Aonic to get MyTether into Preware. MyTether is a commercial product, and has not been submitted to any feed that Preware publishes.

    2) WebOS Internals stands behind Preware. WebOS Internals has no relationship with the applications in the feeds that Preware makes available (other than the webos-internals and optware feeds).

    3) If you mean to imply that WebOS Internals condones MyTether, then you should read the following (which I added as a comment on the PreCentral article):



    You should also carefully read the first post in http://forums.precentral.net/homebre...-mytether.html before making any implications about the rationale behind WebOS Internals advising the MyTether author on how to stop that application breaking things.

    -- Rod
    To address #1) By helping aonic use "best practices for correct installation and safe removal" according to webOS Internals (which stands behind Preware and is their preferred install/removal tool for Homebrewed apps), then you are helping myTether to be maintained through Preware... I'm sorry for using the word "in" when referring to Preware. That's not the issue at hand here, and quite honestly is irrelevant to the basis behind this post.

    To address #2 & 3) That sentence should have read "Does this mean that webOS Internals stands behind myTether and condones it...? That's not for me to decipher." And no, I wasn't saying that I don't know whether or not webOS Internals condones Preware for the confusion there-
    Last edited by mfive; 02/12/2010 at 12:46 AM.
  20. #40  
    Quote Originally Posted by OneDeep View Post
    Crackberry have a tether app for $49.95... So I'm happy with spending $15 on a 'Donationware'
    its not the price its the principle of being forced to "donate"
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