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  1.    #1  
    Reading different posts made after WebOs cloud ending announcement ("Developers post here", "List paid apps", "ipk save", etc...) I'm wondering : shouldn't we put a table on a wiki site to list all webos apps with extended information and actual actions.

    This could be the table structure :
    App Name
    "Long name" (ie com.astraware.casinotp)
    Developer
    Price/Free
    Already on preware/WOSNation app gallery
    IPK downloaded by
    Dev contacted by

    So we could get an extensive history of apps, follow the progress of putting the apps on the gallery, and know that some active members keep archives of most apps.

    What do you think about it ?
  2. #2  
    Quote Originally Posted by lc_lol View Post
    Reading different posts made after WebOs cloud ending announcement ("Developers post here", "List paid apps", "ipk save", etc...) I'm wondering : shouldn't we put a table on a wiki site to list all webos apps with extended information and actual actions.

    This could be the table structure :
    App Name
    "Long name" (ie com.astraware.casinotp)
    Developer
    Price/Free
    Already on preware/WOSNation app gallery
    IPK downloaded by
    Dev contacted by

    So we could get an extensive history of apps, follow the progress of putting the apps on the gallery, and know that some active members keep archives of most apps.

    What do you think about it ?
    If somebody will lend a web server, we could definitely put up a complete list of all apps for everyone to cross reference with. In fact, I'm already working on a personal database of what you have in mind, but not really looking to host that on a netbook over a cellular data link.

    A wiki might not be the best format, but otherwise your idea is common sense
  3. #3  
    It's a perfectly good idea, but you have to build that page, publicise it and then wait for the few people to show up and add enough data for it to be useful.

    3 months should be plenty to get everything we want from the catalogue and back it up, BUT we only have until the rest of the month to get paid apps, so time is a factor.

    What is needed is a list where everything can be seen, sorted and searched - rather than a search box where you basically guess at what might be available. Right now I think the nearest (very imperfect) solution is my list, which is linked here: January 15th, 2015 - The Plan

    The main advantage is an ability to exclude certain items which are in the searchers opinion, junk (HP/Palm categories are a bit limited), leaving a list of what you might actually be interested in, so you might be able to trim a few 1000 apps down to few 100. I was working on a version 2 to manually add limited, richer data from lists here (Wish lists, saved apps/developers, zombie/dead apps, maybe apps reviewed on WN) and add more search/sort fields, but hopefully I can stop as it seems an automated solution is close: Would you pay $5-10 /year for a drop-in replacement to Palm Profile / Cloud Services?

    Again, success will be if this solution can be easily used before 1st November 2014 and we can refine it to paid apps and as much other meta-data as possible. Assumming that free apps will still be obtainable after that date, we can then all relax a bit and maybe refine the data or put it in a wiki or list. My list already has more fields than you propose - it's easy to add a column on a spreadsheet - but the problem now is getting the data to fill them in an easy manner - automation is needed.
  4. #4  
    Quote Originally Posted by Remy X View Post
    If somebody will lend a web server, we could definitely put up a complete list of all apps for everyone to cross reference with. In fact, I'm already working on a personal database of what you have in mind, but not really looking to host that on a netbook over a cellular data link.

    A wiki might not be the best format, but otherwise your idea is common sense
    If you and Horzel manage to collate a complete list of the app catalogue, then I strongly suggest you offer a CSV or similar spreadsheet and post it on the forums on dropbox or similar ASAP. (editied due to Remy X's comment below) Would a zip be as big as 70mb, when the zips above are 18mb?

    Reasons:
    1. A centrally hosted list is easy to update and keep current, but this will take time, effort and a 'server owner' to set this up.

    2. It's very unlikely that updates will happen now and they will be impossible after 11/11/2014, so there is no benefit to central updates - there won't be any. In fact, a final scan on the 14th of January 2015, will give you your final, complete listing.

    3. A csv/spreadsheet will be light, distributable, fast & easily searchable.

    When/if an app catalogue replacement occurs (and we already have a couple of options in the app gallery & preware) then a centrally hosted repository or listing makes more sense.
    Last edited by Preemptive; 10/23/2014 at 03:05 AM.
  5. #5  
    Unfortunately, a complete metadata grab would be about 70MB in size, so a CSV would be impractical as a first step, but as you've said, if we pare it down to the highest rated apps that are still unaccounted for, that would work.

    A server would be able to selectively show everything, giving us a better picture of why an app is good or bad. So we'll see. Maybe PivotCE can host it?
  6. #6  
    See edited post above. My raw v1 file is 781Kb...? That's 6000+ apps but not the amount of meta data in Horzel's list.

    I notice there aren't reviews or ratings in Horzel's list, so maybe that is the 'complete metadata' you are talking about - and that would be useful. Obviously, a dev description doesn't help judge quality.

    Wait a minute, I see your game! You want me to format the list to CSV to prove it will be smaller than 70Mb! ;-)

    I'll pass your suggestion onto the pivotCE server owner - I've no idea how much space is available.
  7. #7  
    Quote Originally Posted by Preemptive View Post
    See edited post above. My raw v1 file is 781Kb...? That's 6000+ apps but not the amount of meta data in Horzel's list.

    I notice there aren't reviews or ratings in Horzel's list, so maybe that is the 'complete metadata' you are talking about - and that would be useful. Obviously, a dev description doesn't help judge quality.

    Wait a minute, I see your game! You want me to format the list to CSV to prove it will be smaller than 70Mb! ;-)

    I'll pass your suggestion onto the pivotCE server owner - I've no idea how much space is available.
    Lol

    We both have good points here.. i just think the web lends for some interactivity that a spreadsheet would not have

    But anyway, tomorrow (for me,) is the day to get it done, full database and CSV. Whether or not we'll have a hosted database, we'll see. In the long run, it doesn't really matter because most people are afraid of getting fingered for piracy.

    We are lucky if we manage to save 200 apps out of 4,000, at this stage. Later on some users may dump their profiles to archive something they have


    P.S. The full metadata i'm talking about would have all comments and image URLs, various technical stuff like timestamps and file sizes, while what you're implying to put in the CSV is just app name/link, app filename and price...
    Last edited by Remy X; 10/23/2014 at 03:14 AM.
  8. #8  
    Quote Originally Posted by Remy X View Post
    Lol

    We both have good points here.. i just think the web lends for some interactivity that a spreadsheet would not have

    But anyway, tomorrow (for me,) is the day to get it done, full database and CSV. Whether or not we'll have a hosted database, we'll see. In the long run, it doesn't really matter because most people are afraid of getting fingered for piracy.

    We are lucky if we manage to save 200 apps out of 4,000, at this stage. Later on some users may dump their profiles to archive something they have


    P.S. The full metadata i'm talking about would have all comments and image URLs, various technical stuff like timestamps and file sizes, while what you're implying to put in the CSV is just app name/link, app filename and price...
    The JSON I have for the 6500 has all the app data, all image URLs, but no reviews it's about 50MB. The one without the images is about 1,5MB.
    HP Veer (daily driver), HP Pre 3, HP Touchpad Proper 4G/LTE (Sierra MC7710), HP Touchpad 32GB WiFi, Palm Pre 2
    Preemptive likes this.
  9. #9  
    Quote Originally Posted by Herrie View Post
    The JSON I have for the 6500 has all the app data, all image URLs, but no reviews it's about 50MB. The one without the images is about 1,5MB.
    Yep... images and comments

    Some apps have close to 400 comments
  10. #10  
    Quote Originally Posted by Remy X View Post
    Lol

    We both have good points here.. i just think the web lends for some interactivity that a spreadsheet would not have

    But anyway, tomorrow (for me,) is the day to get it done, full database and CSV. Whether or not we'll have a hosted database, we'll see. In the long run, it doesn't really matter because most people are afraid of getting fingered for piracy.

    We are lucky if we manage to save 200 apps out of 4,000, at this stage. Later on some users may dump their profiles to archive something they have


    P.S. The full metadata i'm talking about would have all comments and image URLs, various technical stuff like timestamps and file sizes, while what you're implying to put in the CSV is just app name/link, app filename and price...
    I don't disagree, my point is that someone with a bit of experience can make some script or other method that outputs the data to a CSV in a few minutes. Post it, forget about it and let the users sort the file and click through for last minute purchases. I could do this, but I'll probably spend all day trying to work it out and setup the process - I expect those of you able to find and grab the data will be better experienced and equipped to do it fast. The list I put out already has more than three items of data, but yes price is a problem as it requires a click through or for that data to be scanned from individual pages and if paid apps go first, that's an important selector. (one side issue - with that data, you could calculate the cost of all paid apps and the community could donate to download 1 archive copy of every paid app..)

    An online, interactive method may be better in the long run, but is more work to set up. You have to setup your server & start building a means to host the data and search it, then you need to make the web front end...

    My preference for a simple list is about speed. Especially if we get caught out and can't download free apps either after the 1st of November...
    Last edited by Preemptive; 10/23/2014 at 04:27 AM.
  11. #11  
    Quote Originally Posted by Preemptive View Post
    I don't disagree, my point is that someone with a bit of experience can make some script or other method that outputs the data to a CSV in a few minutes. Post it, forget about it and let the users sort the file and click through for last minute purchases. I could do this, but I'll probably spend all day trying to work it out and setup the process - I expect those of you able to find and grab the data will be better experienced and equipped to do it fast. The list I put out already has more than three items of data, but yes price is a problem as it requires a click through or for that data to be scanned from individual pages and if paid apps go first, that's an important selector. (one side issue - with that data, you could calculate the cost of all paid apps and the community could donate to download 1 archive copy of every paid app..)

    An online, interactive method may be better in the long run, but is more work to set up. You have to setup your server & start building a means to host the data and search it, then you need to make the web front end...

    My preference for a simple list is about speed. Especially if we get caught out and can't download free apps either after the 1st of November...
    Yeah. I can. Most of the conversion stuff in only a few lines of code in PHP or even Javascript, and it could be updated as often as we'd like. I'm going to bed now, but in six to eight hours i'd probably have it all running
    Preemptive likes this.
  12. #12  
    Consider an editable Google Doc. You can create forms, as well as spreadsheets. (I've never actually done it, however, I have filled one out.)

    Anyway, just dropping a couple of pennies into the hat. Gotta get to bed now for an interview in the morning.
    Did you know:

    webOS ran on a Treo 800 during initial development.
    Remy X likes this.
  13. #13  
    Actually I have been playing around with a customized version of Impostah which could dump the list of appID's bought by the user. Combined with some profile/token info this would allow downloading of these paid apps IPK files using a script.


    This info could all be output to an email that would go to the "app cat backup project team" which could then download these paid apps using this info and store them centrally and update the DB with the availability of this app.

    However I can imagine that people aren't too keen on sharing the token info because it would allow some other things to be done as well.

    But that would be a quick and easy way to identify which apps have been paid by the users and tick this in a database.


    I have been working together with Remy X on the full app catalog dump. I have already been able to download around 2100 free app IPK's using a script and Touchpad tokens so far The App Catalog would need to be queried with different devices/webOS versions/App Catalog access countries to see if there are missing apps in the lists we have now.
    Last edited by Herrie; 10/23/2014 at 05:33 AM.
    HP Veer (daily driver), HP Pre 3, HP Touchpad Proper 4G/LTE (Sierra MC7710), HP Touchpad 32GB WiFi, Palm Pre 2
  14. #14  
    Looks very promising, Herrie ( for free apps, at least ), and by your signature I guess you'll do a run also with pre3/veer/pre2 tokens (batch job on linux/unix , bash or perl ?)
  15. #15  
    Quote Originally Posted by mazzinia View Post
    Looks very promising, Herrie ( for free apps, at least ), and by your signature I guess you'll do a run also with pre3/veer/pre2 tokens (batch job on linux/unix , bash or perl ?)
    The dump was done manually on TP, but working out some automated way with Impostah and FileMgr
    HP Veer (daily driver), HP Pre 3, HP Touchpad Proper 4G/LTE (Sierra MC7710), HP Touchpad 32GB WiFi, Palm Pre 2
    Preemptive likes this.
  16. #16  
    .... you downloaded manually over 2000 apps ? ...
    I wanted to start saving some free ipks using the pre3, but the 1st or 2nd app installed near killed the phone :s (it would help being able to download but not install)
  17. #17  
    Quote Originally Posted by mazzinia View Post
    .... you downloaded manually over 2000 apps ? ...
    I wanted to start saving some free ipks using the pre3, but the 1st or 2nd app installed near killed the phone :s (it would help being able to download but not install)
    No I have a script for that... The dump with info from App Catalog was done manually. I'm doing some trial and error in Impostah to make it more useful for a larger user base
    HP Veer (daily driver), HP Pre 3, HP Touchpad Proper 4G/LTE (Sierra MC7710), HP Touchpad 32GB WiFi, Palm Pre 2
  18. #18  
    Quote Originally Posted by mazzinia View Post
    .... you downloaded manually over 2000 apps ? ...
    I wanted to start saving some free ipks using the pre3, but the 1st or 2nd app installed near killed the phone :s (it would help being able to download but not install)
    You know, if people DID try to manually download 2000 apps, they would sure stop saying that there aren't enough apps on webOS.... ;-)
  19. #19  
    good point
  20. #20  
    Quote Originally Posted by Preemptive View Post
    You know, if people DID try to manually download 2000 apps, they would sure stop saying that there aren't enough apps on webOS.... ;-)
    They would start saying that their /var partition is full :P
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