Results 1 to 13 of 13
Like Tree7Likes
  • 3 Post By Derek Kessler
  • 1 Post By bluenote
  • 1 Post By Revolutie
  • 2 Post By zukny
  1.    #1  
    So besides:

    -App Reviews
    -Wish Lists
    -Overpriced Apps
    ..and the occasional "Tips"

    is there anything WebOS has "actually" done to improve WebOS across all platforms. I was excited to hear about Android apps becoming somewhat available at some point for WebOS phones but not much else is being done.

    I understand we're still waiting for Open WebOS but is that also going to lead to a 2$ Alarm Clock, 2$ Music Player, 5$ Music ID or other overpriced apps which one would normally expect as an "update"/"upgrade", "free"?

    I mean, using a phone OS shouldn't be milking you and scamming you of $$ even after you've paid over 100$ and are paying almost the same monthly, that's iOS'/Apple's job...

    Has anything actually been done by HP or even here at WebOS, besides, of course, The Wish Lists...?

    Not meaning to be crude but I like to face the facts more often than I like to dream. Maybe I've missed something that's already been done along the way? =/
  2.    #2  
    Quote Originally Posted by jakko View Post
    I stopped buying webos apps a long time ago for the same reasons. I don't expect HP to do anything really. I can guarantee that they will open webos then walk away and the webosnation staff have to do what they can to keep the site going. As you can see it has slowed down a lot. What do you suggest be done?

    Sent from my HP Touchpad using Tapatalk
    If only someone would have asked me that sooner because the answer is Dead Obvious...

    Android.

    They're leading in OS, phones, Tablets and everyone wants a piece of them, Google and lately NVidia has been teaming up with them. They offer quality apps for free and even higher quality apps (that make you say, how the **** is this on my phone!), and quality hardware at a reasonable price. The Iconia Tablets are money well spent, as an example the hardware.

    Basically, everywhere Android shows up, it's a damn decent product. How? Quality apps for free (or add a Donation button), brings in a surge of customers and gets companies interested. Google was one of the first to pick up Android (true it was open source pretty much from the start). Google stuffed a bucket load into it and now NVidia and more to follow I'm sure.

    iOS is a joke along with all of Apple. They're years behind in terms of hardware and development yet charge as much as high end products. Unfortunately, WebOS has been following in the wrong footsteps. Simplicity over Development. Pick up an Android, settings all over, pickup a Palm, you need patches to even have some of the most basic settings.

    I don't work for Android nor Iphone and I'm not here bashing either or. I'm looking at my palm and realizing that the Motorola Renew had bluetooth compatibility with a BlackBerry, LG Gossip and Android, meanwhile my Palm Pre2 still doesn't......and the list goes on...

    WebOS needs to follow in the right footsteps under the right guidance, I'm sure if HP dropped us and Google picked us up, we'd be headed in a much better direction..
    Last edited by Revolutie; 03/27/2012 at 10:55 PM. Reason: donation button
  3. #3  
    For the record, webOS Nation is not in any way affiliated with HP or involved in the development, deployment, or marketing of webOS. We do what we can to cover, honestly critique, and help webOS and the community, but we have no control and little influence of what HP does with the operating system.
    "'Form follows function' — that has been misunderstood. Form and function should be one, joined in a spiritual union."
    Frank Lloyd Wright
    zukny, johncc and cujoq37 like this.
  4. #4  
    Quote Originally Posted by Revolutie View Post
    If only someone would have asked me that sooner because the answer is Dead Obvious...

    Android.

    They're leading in OS, phones, Tablets and everyone wants a piece of them, Google and lately NVidia has been teaming up with them. They offer quality apps for free and even higher quality apps (that make you say, how the **** is this on my phone!), and quality hardware at a reasonable price. The Iconia Tablets are money well spent, as an example the hardware.

    Basically, everywhere Android shows up, it's a damn decent product. How? Quality apps for free (or add a Donation button), brings in a surge of customers and gets companies interested. Google was one of the first to pick up Android (true it was open source pretty much from the start). Google stuffed a bucket load into it and now NVidia and more to follow I'm sure.

    iOS is a joke along with all of Apple. They're years behind in terms of hardware and development yet charge as much as high end products. Unfortunately, WebOS has been following in the wrong footsteps. Simplicity over Development. Pick up an Android, settings all over, pickup a Palm, you need patches to even have some of the most basic settings.

    I don't work for Android nor Iphone and I'm not here bashing either or. I'm looking at my palm and realizing that the Motorola Renew had bluetooth compatibility with a BlackBerry, LG Gossip and Android, meanwhile my Palm Pre2 still doesn't......and the list goes on...

    WebOS needs to follow in the right footsteps under the right guidance, I'm sure if HP dropped us and Google picked us up, we'd be headed in a much better direction..
    Really? Here's one guy below that is ready to thrown in his android towel.

    I'm sick to death of Android | ZDNet

    "So I’ve decided that unless major improvements occur in the management of the Android ecosystem by Google in the next year, and if conditions for supporting handsets by the Tier 1 and main US wireless carriers do not improve dramatically, the Galaxy Nexus and the Droid Bionic are going to be my last Android smartphones.

    And I’ve also decided that until the support situation substantially improves, I am no longer going to recommend Android-based products to my friends, family and colleagues. I’ll point them towards Apple’s iOS and Microsoft’s Windows Phone instead. At least with these platforms, you’re guaranteed core OS updates and bugfixes for the length of your contract.

    I’m simply sick to death of putting up with all of these issues that seem to have no end in sight."
    Vistaus likes this.
  5. #5  
    @Revolutie

    Seeing as you got your Pre2 as a gift, and clearly you don't like it, why not just go get another phone?
    Due to the cancellation of the penny, I no longer give 2¢ about anything. I may however, give a nickel
  6.    #6  
    @Derek Kessler:

    Oh I know that but WebOS nation does have quite a bit of influence in terms of Palm/HP. Considering some of the developers here are in close contact with some of the people from HP that focus on the WebOS development.

    @bluenote:

    Jason Perlow, the writer of the article you sent, mentioned nothing substantial about the Android OS other than "Not fast enough OS Updates". If that's his only premise, what should we say about WebOS? Considering how long we've waited for 2.24 and how some, are still waiting. Putting asside how far behind WebOS really is in terms of leading OS' (Android and Windows).

    You must've not used Android long enough to be able to form a proper comparison. Apple's iOS is a joke and similar to WebOS (unfortunately) and WP, can't really say as I haven't used it much but I expect it to be around the lines of Android (settings all over).


    @Sledge007:

    Well, I've used MANY different phones with many different OS', some cost me $45 some $60, some $200 and others were just a gift. Unfortunately, WebOS has been the least developed OS so far, in terms of "getting what you pay for". Now this can backfire, saying I got it as a gift and shouldn't be expecting anything to begin with, but just in terms of phones and such, WebOS doesn't offer much. (Also I can't afford a new phone and I'd feel bad because someone close got this phone for me).

    ----

    The fact is that WebOS died a long time ago, the only thing that keeps it alive is the hopes and wishes. It is an underdeveloped OS whose only achievemnt is "notifications" and "card swipe to close". I think it's safe to say that if Open WebOS doesn't incorporate Andoid apps, it will never see a phone again, maybe a printer. I'm very neutral to any OS but it's not hard to recognize the major flaws one has. Using accomplished OS' as reference would be a good start for Open WebOS, I really hope it starts straying far from iOS.
    tovivekmishra likes this.
  7. #7  
    Ok buddy.
  8. #8  
    @Revolutie We all come to this website looking for answers. In the end, I think we all put in the extra effort to make things happen for WebOS.

    If you like webOS then I would encourage you to generate some new solutions, create some webOS news. It really isn't hard.. That OpenMobile thing you brought up for one was all because I emailed the company an they got back to me with an explanation and a goal.

    WebOSnation is special because we probably care more about our product then the other guy. IOS is for people who can't do two things at once.. Android is for those who like spam.. WebOS is the future baby
    texasflood and cujoq37 like this.
  9. #9  
    Quote Originally Posted by Revolutie View Post
    So besides:

    -App Reviews
    -Wish Lists
    -Overpriced Apps
    ..and the occasional "Tips"

    is there anything WebOS has "actually" done to improve WebOS across all platforms.
    I was excited to hear about Android apps becoming somewhat available at some point for WebOS phones but not much else is being done.

    I understand we're still waiting for Open WebOS but is that also going to lead to a 2$ Alarm Clock, 2$ Music Player, 5$ Music ID or other overpriced apps which one would normally expect as an "update"/"upgrade", "free"?

    I mean, using a phone OS shouldn't be milking you and scamming you of $$ even after you've paid over 100$ and are paying almost the same monthly, that's iOS'/Apple's job...

    Has anything actually been done by HP or even here at WebOS, besides, of course, The Wish Lists...?

    Not meaning to be crude but I like to face the facts more often than I like to dream. Maybe I've missed something that's already been done along the way? =/
    Here are some practical business facts. The apps are more expensive and i'm with you i preferred them to be free or at the very least cheaper. (I don't buy many apps. That's just me). But the fact of app development on webos has always been that with a smaller user base, app developers that want to turn a profit have felt they needed to charge more to make the time and money spent on developing worthwhile. Had there been 90 million users maybe a decent 99 cent app would make development worth the effort because you may make it up on volume. And they always face people like me that don't want to pay for stuff. Hell my new phone has over 100 apps installed. Less then maybe 15 are paid for and a couple are paid for by work. I bought i think two webos apps total. Most of these guys aren't getting rich and it takes a lot of effort to make some of these apps. I don't know how to do it but i know enough to know that most are not "scams." Maybe "overpriced" or "expensive" or "out of my pricerange" is a better term but i find "scam" needlessly inflammatory.

    Regardless the cost of an app is based on some combination of what the market will bear and what the developer thinks it his time is worth. And often the developer thinks his time is worth $5 but the users don't and the app doesn't sell. Some times they price it bad. But that's how it works. Those are facts. And when you only have a couple million users to appeal to, sadly, developers may attempt to charge higher prices. It's the market. Doesn't mean it will work when people want free or 99 cents. But they'll try. It's been like that since webos launched. It shouldn't be a surprise.

    As for what hp is doing. Nobody outside the loop of HP or people "in the know" like maybe developers with lots of access is gonna know anything other then what is publicly released or spoken about. If they are working with hardware makers or partners nobody will know unless its leaked or they tell us. That's how it works. They gave us a road map already. Now i don't know what 99% of that technical talk means but the answer to "what HP is doing" is all that technical techy magic that's on the roadmap. And people will know when they know. I mean this is almost like asking "what is Apple really doing about the iphone 5?" Nobody is gonna know until it's leaked or they tell us. That's how it should be.

    And as for what webosnation does. It's a news blog. It's not tasked with the responsibility of developing anything. They report news and offer opinions. They sell some merchandise and have a forum for people to talk. What they do is act as a port in the storm. A point of reference to come back to if you need to. But i don't see how anyone can get on them for not doing enough. They are doing what they've always done. State opinion and report goings on.
    You come at the king. You best not miss.
  10. #10  
    Quote Originally Posted by Revolutie View Post
    If only someone would have asked me that sooner because the answer is Dead Obvious...

    Android.

    They're leading in OS, phones, Tablets and everyone wants a piece of them, Google and lately NVidia has been teaming up with them. They offer quality apps for free and even higher quality apps (that make you say, how the **** is this on my phone!), and quality hardware at a reasonable price. The Iconia Tablets are money well spent, as an example the hardware.

    Basically, everywhere Android shows up, it's a damn decent product. How? Quality apps for free (or add a Donation button), brings in a surge of customers and gets companies interested. Google was one of the first to pick up Android (true it was open source pretty much from the start). Google stuffed a bucket load into it and now NVidia and more to follow I'm sure.

    iOS is a joke along with all of Apple. They're years behind in terms of hardware and development yet charge as much as high end products. Unfortunately, WebOS has been following in the wrong footsteps. Simplicity over Development. Pick up an Android, settings all over, pickup a Palm, you need patches to even have some of the most basic settings.

    I don't work for Android nor Iphone and I'm not here bashing either or. I'm looking at my palm and realizing that the Motorola Renew had bluetooth compatibility with a BlackBerry, LG Gossip and Android, meanwhile my Palm Pre2 still doesn't......and the list goes on...

    WebOS needs to follow in the right footsteps under the right guidance, I'm sure if HP dropped us and Google picked us up, we'd be headed in a much better direction..
    So, buddy. If Android is really leading in tablets, then how come the iPad is still the most sold tablet in the whole world outselling even Android-tablet-manufacturers combined?
  11. cgk
    cgk is offline
    cgk's Avatar
    Posts
    3,868 Posts
    Global Posts
    9,556 Global Posts
    #11  
    Quote Originally Posted by SnotBoogie View Post
    Here are some practical business facts. The apps are more expensive and i'm with you i preferred them to be free or at the very least cheaper. (I don't buy many apps. That's just me). But the fact of app development on webos has always been that with a smaller user base, app developers that want to turn a profit have felt they needed to charge more to make the time and money spent on developing worthwhile. Had there been 90 million users maybe a decent 99 cent app would make development worth the effort because you may make it up on volume. And they always face people like me that don't want to pay for stuff. Hell my new phone has over 100 apps installed. Less then maybe 15 are paid for and a couple are paid for by work. I bought i think two webos apps total. Most of these guys aren't getting rich and it takes a lot of effort to make some of these apps. I don't know how to do it but i know enough to know that most are not "scams." Maybe "overpriced" or "expensive" or "out of my pricerange" is a better term but i find "scam" needlessly inflammatory.

    Regardless the cost of an app is based on some combination of what the market will bear and what the developer thinks it his time is worth. And often the developer thinks his time is worth $5 but the users don't and the app doesn't sell. Some times they price it bad. But that's how it works. Those are facts. And when you only have a couple million users to appeal to, sadly, developers may attempt to charge higher prices. It's the market. Doesn't mean it will work when people want free or 99 cents. But they'll try. It's been like that since webos launched. It shouldn't be a surprise.
    But you don't - even the top apps (leaving aside games) are not likely to have a penetration of more than 10-15% of the potential market - and the WebOS potential market is one that is shrinking (It has to be). Sure you have less competition so you can try and sting the customer on price but realistically how many sales can you have with no new devices and in a shrinking market.

    This leads to a bit of a chicken and egg, to compete with the other platforms (and lets assume someone makes hardware), it needs more users to increase app competition and drive down prices but to get more users beyond hardware it needs more and cheaper apps.

    I understand the economics of why SongID is $5 but webOS doesn't exist in a vacuum, it's hard to charge that amount when superior products are either free or baked into the platform (WP7 for example).
  12. #12  
    Quote Originally Posted by CGK View Post

    I understand the economics of why SongID is $5 but webOS doesn't exist in a vacuum, it's hard to charge that amount when superior products are either free or baked into the platform (WP7 for example).
    I'd rather pay $5 than have to shell out a couple hundred for a new phone/contract with it baked in.
    Due to the cancellation of the penny, I no longer give 2¢ about anything. I may however, give a nickel
  13. #13  
    Quote Originally Posted by CGK View Post
    But you don't - even the top apps (leaving aside games) are not likely to have a penetration of more than 10-15% of the potential market - and the WebOS potential market is one that is shrinking (It has to be). Sure you have less competition so you can try and sting the customer on price but realistically how many sales can you have with no new devices and in a shrinking market.

    This leads to a bit of a chicken and egg, to compete with the other platforms (and lets assume someone makes hardware), it needs more users to increase app competition and drive down prices but to get more users beyond hardware it needs more and cheaper apps.

    I understand the economics of why SongID is $5 but webOS doesn't exist in a vacuum, it's hard to charge that amount when superior products are either free or baked into the platform (WP7 for example).
    "You're not" what? Sorry i'm confused as to what that was a reference too.

    If by that you mean you don't have two million users one, i get that, but you could have 4 million and it wouldn't change. I was talking about the top end of the userbase number back when it was doing it's best. the number of users is irrellavant. The point is even at the highest userbase base developers interested in a profit are gonna evaluate what they think their app should sell for and in some way it's an estimate of how much time the put into it and how many they think they can sell. And for webos it's always had a small user base even when it was high. And thus you should expect different prices. That doesn't mean they price them right. I'm not remotely saying the pricing of apps be it song id or any other is correct, or incorrect. I'm saying it's not a surprise they try and get more cause they need to get the money from someone. It doesn't mean they will sell at the price. As i said i bought maybe two apps on webos cause many are over priced to me. Hell on my new phone i got Shazam for free and I got the Pro version Free too. I'm not dismissing the market or that the market says that an app like song id is gonna be free on other platforms. I'm saying i'm not surprised when some developer says, i spent 1000 hours making this app. I typically make $40 and hour. That means at $5 each i have to sell 8000 apps to break even or my time is wasted. Maybe they think they can't sell 8000 and can only sell 5000. Maybe that means they think they must charge a higher price. That's their choice. And it's the consumers choice to go, "Screw that i get the same thing free on other platforms thus i'll do without or move platforms." In a sense that's what i did.

    All you've described is a perfect reason not to develop for a given platform if profitability is a must. That is, it may be profitable but there's also a chance that it takes too much effort for some guy to make an app and he/she can't sell it for a profit cause there aren't enough users willing to buy it as a profitable price. It's why many said HP needed to pay developers up front to get them on board, to attract users and thus more developer. To literally act like the fertilizer for the egg. I've always loved the chicken and the egg phrase as it's thought that modern birds evolved from egg laying reptiles and thus it the egg always came before the chicken. But i digress. But a scam is in intentional attempt to defraud. That's very different the selling something for a price that's too high for the market. I mean for me, where i a developer i'd be paying attention to what you talk about. I wouldn't make an app if i couldn't sell it for the same price as comparable apps on other platforms or less. But that doesn't mean that's the only way to price or that stuff won't sell for more. I just wouldn't do it.
    You come at the king. You best not miss.

Posting Permissions