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  1. cgk
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    #81  
    Quote Originally Posted by MDsmartphone View Post
    obviously this mythical webOS still has you mesmerized as you are still perusing Precentral...a website for fans of webos.

    for cgk, nappy, and all the other naysayers. You "won", enjoy your new devices and leave the webos faithful alone. We may be in denial, but there's a reason for that...and that's because webOS is just damn awesome, and for those still using it, its not because of ignorance but because webOS just works for us.

    I have a touchpad*, WebOS works fine for me as well for coach surfing and the like - but that's personal preference, it's not really relevant to a conversation about the market and how successful WebOS could be.


    * I also have a wp7 phone - which went from full charge to flat and turned it self off in 3 hours 30 minutes this afternoon.
  2. #82  
    I have a touchpad*, WebOS works fine for me as well for coach surfing and the like - but that's personal preference, it's not really relevant to a conversation about the market and how successful WebOS could be.


    * I also have a wp7 phone - which went from full charge to flat and turned it self off in 3 hours 30 minutes this afternoon.
    my Pre3 is at 84% after 8 hours.


    -- Sent from my TouchPad using Communities
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  3. #83  
    Quote Originally Posted by deCorvett View Post
    my Pre3 is at 84% after 8 hours.


    -- Sent from my TouchPad using Communities
    At moments such as these, I wish there was a way to triple like a post:
  4. cgk
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    #84  
    Quote Originally Posted by deCorvett View Post
    my Pre3 is at 84% after 8 hours.


    -- Sent from my TouchPad using Communities

    It's the first time I have taken it out in the wild, I took it off the charger and noted the time because I wanted to see how long it lasts - not very long is the answer!

    I'm going to have to start carrying a roll of coins for the phone box!
  5. #85  
    Quote Originally Posted by CGK View Post
    I'm going to have to start carrying a roll of coins for the phone box!
    They still have those over there?
  6. cgk
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    #86  
    Quote Originally Posted by Grabber5.0 View Post
    They still have those over there?

    Not many and I don't think they have facebook!
  7. #87  
    I have an HTC Trophy with Mango and use an HP TouchPad. Sadly I think the user with the automatic turning off phone has an egg because my phone has never had a software/hardware glitch and my battery is at 40% after two and a half days.
  8. #88  
    Quote Originally Posted by CGK View Post
    Market research? who needs market research, there are market results.

    There is an element of revisionist history creeping into this forum, a pretence that WebOS only came to market when HP purchased it, it was announced in January 2009 and the first phone was out in July 2009, The first android handset was out in sept 2008. They are of the same cohort, rather than coming late to the party in the way that WP7 has.

    WebOS phones were discontinued after three years where they failed to sell and carriers refused to take them, the current market share of webOS phone users is 0%, it does not exist. The current install base is more than likely in the tens of thousands and failing.

    WebOS tablets were discontinued after they failed to sell and had to be fire-saled. As for being number 2, that was to october and has passed by the amazon fire with ease (unless amazon and all the analysts are lying).
    Yes, I think marketing or rather the lack of it has been a huge problem. When I read that a firesale of the Touchpad was about to start in 15 minutes at a shop nearby I didn't have time to research what OS it ran. I just raced there and managed to snag myself a Touchpad for $99. Once home I was disappointed to find out it didn't run Android or Windows 7. Webos? What the heck was that? My son who is a software developer had never heard of it either. But after a couple of days I was completely in love with Webos. My, father who saw how I loved my tablet, went and bought himself an iPad 2. While I have to admit that the iPad runs smoother than the Touchpad, I quickly grew frustrated with it. The Touchpad I found so much easier to operate. I continually found myself wanting to swipe away a program or go to the top menu bar to check on things in the iPad. The thing is, while Webos with some improvements could be a fantastic OS, hardly anyone knows about it. Its like Beta and VHS video. While Beta had better technology, VHS was marketed much better and thus won the war. And so I think that unless Webos is heavily marketed as the coolest thing since sliced bread (and live up to it), it will go the way of Beta and the Dodo bird.
  9. cgk
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    #89  
    Quote Originally Posted by ursula View Post
    I have an HTC Trophy with Mango and use an HP TouchPad. Sadly I think the user with the automatic turning off phone has an egg because my phone has never had a software/hardware glitch and my battery is at 40% after two and a half days.
    I don't have a trophy so it is worthless comparing the two in that way - because of OEM difference, difference size battery and much slower processor in the trophy. It's a nokia lumia 800 and is a known problem with the device - it turns off because the battery is flat. Nokia is promising software updates to fix the problem but we will see.
  10. #90  
    Quote Originally Posted by CGK View Post
    Market research? who needs market research, there are market results.

    There is an element of revisionist history creeping into this forum, a pretence that WebOS only came to market when HP purchased it, it was announced in January 2009 and the first phone was out in July 2009, The first android handset was out in sept 2008. They are of the same cohort, rather than coming late to the party in the way that WP7 has.
    Happen to know that as I've had a Pre since they came out. One of a few in Australia. One of the problems many have here is one of myopia. Thinking just about the US. Well, news flash.... the world is bigger than the 50 contigious united states!

    I think there are many reasons why the Pre, etc, failed... I don't think it was really the device. I showed mine to loads of people, and I'd get..."Where can I get one?". OOOOps, sorry... Palm decided to withdraw from APJ.

    Quote Originally Posted by CGK View Post
    WebOS phones were discontinued after three years where they failed to sell and carriers refused to take them,
    Sorry. AT&T and Verizon, recently took a contract. Many carriers in Europe took the Pre, Pixi, and Pre 3

    Quote Originally Posted by CGK View Post
    the current market share of webOS phone users is 0%, it does not exist. The current install base is more than likely in the tens of thousands and failing.

    WebOS tablets were discontinued after they failed to sell and had to be fire-saled.
    That's right. Again, many reasons. We all know that many consumers buy Apple at inflated prices because it's Apple. HP does not have that cache in the market place.

    Remember, that HP pulled the plug before the AT&T versions were launched, and AT&T (in the US) were a massive part of the success of the iPhone.

    Quote Originally Posted by CGK View Post
    As for being number 2, that was to october and has passed by the amazon fire with ease (unless amazon and all the analysts are lying).
    Which came after.
  11. #91  
    Quote Originally Posted by CGK View Post
    I don't have a trophy so it is worthless comparing the two in that way - because of OEM difference, difference size battery and much slower processor in the trophy. It's a nokia lumia 800 and is a known problem with the device - it turns off because the battery is flat. Nokia is promising software updates to fix the problem but we will see.
    oowoowo That makes sense. Alot of people have been reporting faulty hardware issues.
  12. #92  
    Quote Originally Posted by CGK View Post
    I have a touchpad*, WebOS works fine for me as well for coach surfing and the like - but that's personal preference, it's not really relevant to a conversation about the market and how successful WebOS could be.
    A ton of wisdom here. All too often people are trying to justify why a product will sell well based to the market as a whole only on themselves and as you put it on their own "personal preferences" rather then on an understanding of market as a whole. I don't like pickup trucks and minivans or cars that look like a Prius. I'll never buy them. That does not remotely mean pickup trucks, minivans, and Prius's will fail in the automotive market and shouldn't be made. Lot's of people hate huge summer action movies. They call them low brow. But they make the most money and carry studios because most people love them.

    People will say, "i don't need apps" thus webos doesn't need apps. "I don't want a slab" thus webos doesn't need one. "I must have a keyboard" thus webos should only have a keyboard. And you can go on and on with other things. I don't want or need this feature or that feature and thus the entire market will not want it. Or the flipside: I love this feature and thus it will be important to everyone else. The problem is the person at precentral or the die hard webos users is rarely an accurate representation of the average user, smartphone buyer, or technology consumer. A person's personal preference is not the the most relevant factor to a discussion about how a product will work in the market as a whole.

    Quote Originally Posted by CGK View Post
    There is an element of revisionist history creeping into this forum, a pretence that WebOS only came to market when HP purchased it, it was announced in January 2009 and the first phone was out in July 2009, The first android handset was out in sept 2008. They are of the same cohort, rather than coming late to the party in the way that WP7 has.
    Yes. Webos phones were in stores right there with the other phones on display when they on sprint, verizon and AT&T. Consumers could compare them with all the other phones in the stores. The phones where in movies and tv shows. There were running posts on the front page every when there where "Pre sightings" on tv shows. And There were ads on buses, billboards and tv. many tv adds sucked. But even with the Veer and the touchpad there were plenty of ads all over the place. People raved about the adds featuring stars from Glee, Pacquio, and Russell Brand. I think they had some events with celebs like Lebron, Dre, Serena Williams using the devices and saying positive things. I saw posts showing cars with HP Veer adds airbrushed all over it. The devices got special placement in big stores like best buy with large prominent displays separated from other phones and tablets where it could stand out. I saw WebOS discussed on every channel from cnn to cnbc when they where going to launch the first HP devices. The touchpad was in a Dr. Dre/Eminem video. I think talk shows gave them away free to audience members. WebOS phones and have had plenty of chances, exposure and time in the market place for consumers to look at the products, evaluate them, and to make a choice on them.
    You come at the king. You best not miss.
  13. #93  
    I just remember that there are more hardware smartphone and tablets makers around the world :

    ZTE, Huawei, LG, Asustek, Acer and so many more unknown in Taiwan, Korea and Japan, that might be interested in an Alliance with HP webOS.

    Do you think with Nokia is nuts?
  14. #94  
    SnotBoogie,

    The unfortunate thing, is that much of that advertising didn't happen until after the hardware division was axed.

    Also, it doesn't matter how much space HP buys in stores to present their product, if they don't actually have people presenting their products, no one's going to buy them.
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  15. #95  
    Quote Originally Posted by eblade View Post
    SnotBoogie,

    The unfortunate thing, is that much of that advertising didn't happen until after the hardware division was axed.

    Also, it doesn't matter how much space HP buys in stores to present their product, if they don't actually have people presenting their products, no one's going to buy them.
    Huh? WebOS didn't just start with HP. WebOS phones have been on sale before HP bought Palm.They were on billboards and subways and all over tv and the internet as posted numerous times on the front page of this website. And for all that time consumers had a chance to decide whether to buy devices or not to buy them. That time did not disappear. It existed no matter how much people want to block it out of their mind.

    And as for HP they advertised well before WebOS was cancelled. I saw the veer cars in posted here well before the Veer launched. They had a press conference long before the products launched. I saw the dre videos before the touchpad launched. I saw the all the celebrity ads well before the touchpad went firesale. It's flat out not true that they didn't advertise before they hardware division was axed. I saw very few ads after WebOS was canceled. I saw them all the time before. And if your product is good you don't need ads. Word of mouth and positive feedback is good enough. Starbucks sells plenty of coffee. Starbucks does not have tv commercials though.

    But to deny that HP advertised the products before they axed them is as CGK said "Revisionist History."
    You come at the king. You best not miss.
  16. #96  
    I didn't say that. However, almost all of the product placements, have occured on things -since- the hardware division was axed. The bulk of the celebrity advertisements didn't hit until -just- before the ax - lots of people were starting to go "what is a TouchPad?" and "what is a Veer?" when the axe came down.

    The unfortunate thing, is that those who did ask that, and went to find out, found themselves messing with webOS 3.0.0 on a demo box, and no one in the stores knew anything about it.

    I find it pretty unlikely that there were ads all over billboards and subways and tv and the internet, considering until the TouchPad ads started hitting TV, I thought that Palm had gone out of business and folded back in the early 2000's.
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    (1:39:33 PM) halfhalo: Android multitasking is like sticking your fingers into a blender
    GO OPEN WEBOS!
    People asked me for a donate link for my non-catalog work, so here you are:
  17. cgk
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    #97  
    I'm bored now - maybe we are all dead and this is actually a web version of the flying dutchman - the decision over WebOS will *always* be two weeks in the future and we'll all fly around in circles forever!

    Seriously Meg, put up all out of our misery one way or the other - either pull the plug or tell us we all get to rehash the same arguments for another three years.
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    #98  
    Quote Originally Posted by eblade View Post
    The unfortunate thing, is that those who did ask that, and went to find out, found themselves messing with webOS 3.0.0 on a demo box, and no one in the stores knew anything about it.
    The demo units were the best way to kill the TouchPad. I went into Best Buy to play with it and was struck how slow and clumsy it was. Five feet away was the iPad display, which caught people's attention quickly and the units worked quick and flawlessly.

    I still became an early adopter because I had two WebOS phones so knew it's potential first hand. I figured that it would take a couple of updates to fix the issues. HP never came through, but the homebrew community has been the beacon of light through all of this turmoil. The performance is up, I have a workaround for the Wifi issues, I can VNC to my servers to do real work, and can print to a non-HP printer. They have managed to do most of what HP promised... Make a TouchPad that I could use for my work. It's close enough that I'm planning on leaving my laptop behind on my upcoming trip for the very first time.

    I still long for a VZ pre 3 (and that cool wireless-audio charging dock) now that my contract just ended. But no pre 3's to be had except at prices I'm not comfortable with (as my Pre 2 is doing just fine).

    Personally, I can't think of a way for Meg to fix this. Not only has mortal damage to WebOS phones and tablets been done, but the window of opportunity is slipping by quickly to get back in the game. Competitors are copying the best features of WebOS, the WebOS brain trust are giving up and leaving, and HP's track record says that they develop new hardware slowly. They will always be way behind playing catch up to the leader.
    Palm III->Palm IV->Palm V->M130->Tungsten->Treo 270->Treo 600->Treo 700->Palm Pre Plus->FrankenPre 2->Pre 3 & TouchPad
  19. #99  
    Maybe getting rid of some of the bureaucratic layers and seeding R&D money down to the divisions is her way of trying to speed up hardware innovation getting to market
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    #100  
    I think HP tried to license webOS out, but nobody was biting.

    Not wanting to just throw it away, I reckon they've approached it from a different angle, and are looking to buy tablets (and maybe phones) from another supplier, port webOS over, and sell them on.

    Its the same end result to the consumer (webOS hardware on sale), but HP take the risk, while saving costs on hardware R&D (the supplier is probably also selling the same or very similar hardware with Android).
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