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  1.    #21  
    Quote Originally Posted by j_benj View Post
    In fact, I had installed the "confirm delete" patch that shows the delete button for each message after you swipe them away and I didn't have issues with that either. So I'm not seeing a trend.. honestly I've never even heard of this issue before.
    You're making my point for me. You shouldn't have to install homebrew to fix problems on a phone! Your average phone consumer won't do that. If HP wants a phone that will achieve mass appeal(like the centro) it just has to work. WebOS is simple enough from a UI standpoint, but it needs to be able to perform! Opening 30 cards at once is an impractical way to test performance for day to day use. It's cool that it can do that, but nothing more.
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    #22  
    Quote Originally Posted by jkpritchard View Post
    People, I own a Pixi. I've been watching webOS since the 2009 CES reveal. See, this is the problem. I voice my opinion and concern with valid points, and since it's somewhat negative, my motives get questioned. You need to be able to see flaws in an OS to make it better and more competitive. That's all I'm doing here.
    But we haven't seen any flaws in the Veer's OS, have we?
    NNJ
  3. #23  
    Quote Originally Posted by jkpritchard View Post
    People, I own a Pixi. I've been watching webOS since the 2009 CES reveal. See, this is the problem. I voice my opinion and concern with valid points, and since it's somewhat negative, my motives get questioned. You need to be able to see flaws in an OS to make it better and more competitive. That's all I'm doing here.
    Trust me, I see all the flaws. I've mentioned many of them in numerous other threads. I'm not sure if it's the way you try to get your point across, if it's the tone of the words you are choosing, or what, but you sure don't sound like a real fan to me, which is fine, you're entitled to your own opinion.

    The problem I have with you is that you point out things that either aren't problems for most of us here or are going to be fixed in the next update. I've never had an issue swiping an email away, but that's just me. I don't even delete my emails anymore, I find it's easier to just leave them in the inbox, disable sync to server, and display emails from past 3 days, or past 7 days. Works better for me. (that's with a pop account)

    Putting that issue aside, if you're going to complain about WebOS, please do so in a different way. Find a common ground here. There's plenty of bug threads, there's plenty of specific issues threads, but to come into a Veer thread and complain about WebOS lag in general is NOT the correct way to introduce yourself to these forums, especially when it's clear that noone here even has a Veer and you haven't even used it yet.
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  4. #24  
    Quote Originally Posted by jkpritchard View Post
    You're making my point for me. You shouldn't have to install homebrew to fix problems on a phone! Your average phone consumer won't do that. If HP wants a phone that will achieve mass appeal(like the centro) it just has to work. WebOS is simple enough from a UI standpoint, but it needs to be able to perform! Opening 30 cards at once is an impractical way to test performance for day to day use. It's cool that it can do that, but nothing more.
    It's not a patch in 2.0.

    And also, if you think that you shouldn't have to install patches.. well.. I just don't see how you can complain about patches that enhance the WebOS experience. I don't see how that can EVER be a bad thing. Why is it bad to be able to CUSTOMIZE your own experience to tailor your very own personal individual wants and needs?
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  5.    #25  
    Quote Originally Posted by nyallj View Post
    But we haven't seen any flaws in the Veer's OS, have we?
    Watch this.

    It may seem like a small issue, but I have this same bug on my Pixi minus. That means this bug made the leap from webOS 1.0 to 2.0. I just don't understand how something like this can still be an issue.
  6. #26  
    Quote Originally Posted by jkpritchard View Post
    Watch this.

    It may seem like a small issue, but I have this same bug on my Pixi minus. That means this bug made the leap from webOS 1.0 to 2.0. I just don't understand how something like this can still be an issue.
    The code for all of the core apps is the exact same from 1.0 to 2.0. Not changed, one bit. Not even one line. From app to app, you tear them apart, and compare the code, it's THE SAME CODE.

    3.0 is the upgrade.
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  7.    #27  
    Quote Originally Posted by fxspec06 View Post
    I don't even delete my emails anymore, I find it's easier to just leave them in the inbox, disable sync to server, and display emails from past 3 days, or past 7 days. Works better for me. (that's with a pop account)
    .
    It works better for you because it most likely avoids this e-mail bug. Again, the average consumer, unfortunately, has very little patience and just wants whatever they just bought to work.

    Our common ground is that we both love webOS. I'll most likely still buy the Veer. I know I've come across as pretty negative, but it's just super frustrating. It takes a lot for me to get the point where I feel the need to join the discussion in the forums.
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    #28  
    Quote Originally Posted by jkpritchard View Post
    Watch this.

    It may seem like a small issue, but I have this same bug on my Pixi minus. That means this bug made the leap from webOS 1.0 to 2.0. I just don't understand how something like this can still be an issue.
    I don't understand. Why do you keep pushing that obviously bad review, by an obviously disappointed (everybody keeps telling me he's not a webOS hater, but having seen his approach for the first time, I can't relate to that) fellow on us? There are 3 or 4 videos on WOR alone that show differently.
    Looking at the video above shows me somebody who doesn't seem to know how to swipe properly on a phone that is obviously doing something else in the background. And then he opens the App Catalog to show how slowly it works and it loads fast and he says: Oh, that was fast, but I've seen it go slow before.
    EDIT - have you even looked at the videos on WOR?
    NNJ
  9.    #29  
    Quote Originally Posted by fxspec06 View Post
    The code for all of the core apps is the exact same from 1.0 to 2.0. Not changed, one bit. Not even one line. From app to app, you tear them apart, and compare the code, it's THE SAME CODE.

    3.0 is the upgrade.
    That's good to know. I seriously hope you're right. I hope performance is consistent in 3.0 because if it's not, webOS is toast.
  10. #30  
    It works better for me because I get literally hundreds of emails every day from various websites and I don't feel like deleting them on the Pre because I have them synced with Windows Live Mail on my PC.

    I feel your pain on the webOS issues. It's hard trying to promote a mobile operating system platform to friends when it has so many issues.. but at the end of the day I couldn't be more satisfied at the end. Looking forward to 3.0, that will hopefully alleviate most, if not all, of the issues that has plagued 1.x - 2.x devices up until now..
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  11. #31  
    Quote Originally Posted by jkpritchard View Post
    That's good to know. I seriously hope you're right. I hope performance is consistent in 3.0 because if it's not, webOS is toast.
    I know I'm right. I've compared files from both, and while there's say oh maybe a line or two here and there, 99.5% of the core applications are exactly the same.
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  12.    #32  
    Quote Originally Posted by nyallj View Post
    EDIT - have you even looked at the videos on WOR?
    I don't think you understand how much I love webOS. I was all over the WebOSRoundup videos this weekend. And on the surface they showed the Veer to be great. It really got my hopes up. But it's the small issues that Josh points out that really matter(specifically the spotty performance).
  13.    #33  
    Quote Originally Posted by fxspec06 View Post
    I know I'm right.[/I][/B].
    As in, I hope you're right about the 3.0 upgrade bringing major changes.
  14. #34  
    Quote Originally Posted by nyallj View Post
    I don't understand. Why do you keep pushing that obviously bad review, by an obviously disappointed (everybody keeps telling me he's not a webOS hater, but having seen his approach for the first time, I can't relate to that) fellow on us? There are 3 or 4 videos on WOR alone that show differently.
    Looking at the video above shows me somebody who doesn't seem to know how to swipe properly on a phone that is obviously doing something else in the background. And then he opens the App Catalog to show how slowly it works and it loads fast and he says: Oh, that was fast, but I've seen it go slow before.
    EDIT - have you even looked at the videos on WOR?
    No way he is a hater - in fact, based on everything else he's written, I've always thought of him as one of webOS biggest advocates. Go watch some of the videos during the February event - his excitement over future WebOS products is palpable. I'd agree that he's always seemed more excited about the larger, fancier device, which probably results in some bias against the poor, little Veer. He's obviously disappointed that some of the core software processes haven't improved much since the Pre- was released nearly two years ago; seems that he always assumed the UI inconsistencies were solely related to the underpowered hardware, and is now realizing that some of the software is just not very efficient. IMO, it's indisputable that some app components are just too clunky and slow to compete with top-of-the-line smartphone experiences: buggy and slow media indexers (compare webOS music app to iOS), background tasks slowing phone down to a crawl, too much syncing with cloud with minimal control via options, inconsistent handling of streaming media, I can go on and on. And I agree 100% with him. Really looking forward to seeing how webOS 3.0 addresses some of these issues.
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    #35  
    As much as I love webOS its true. Even on my brand new Pre2 there is apparent lagging when loading certain apps like Google maps for ex., lagg you wont find on iOS for example. You know when you press on an app it shoots to the background and kinda pulsates before zooming in. That can last sometimes a few seconds or more. You simply dont have that type of lag on Android and definitely not on iOS. I stil think webOS is so much more polished and visually appealing than android I do wish though HP would eliminate the lag when launching apps.
  16. #36  
    He abused the OS.

    Swiping the way he did to delete the emails would confuse the OS, which is looking for a press, hold and swipe for that; I assume that deleting them as he did caused the OS to misintepret the gesture, which is why they re-appeared.

    Also, swiping up when scrolling shouldn't cross the gesture area at the bottom of the device.. but, he did, and then called that a "bug" too.

    He's just not suited for a smaller device like this.. others would be.
    "The more I learn, the more I realize just how little I really do know!" -Albert Einstein

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    #37  
    Quote Originally Posted by LCGuy View Post
    He abused the OS.

    Swiping the way he did to delete the emails would confuse the OS, which is looking for a press, hold and swipe for that; I assume that deleting them as he did caused the OS to misintepret the gesture, which is why they re-appeared.

    Also, swiping up when scrolling shouldn't cross the gesture area at the bottom of the device.. but, he did, and then called that a "bug" too.

    He's just not suited for a smaller device like this.. others would be.
    I thought so too.

    Copied post from the just reopened thread that I posted just now:

    Having never heard of him before his reviews were posted I went across to see what he said.
    His language choice sounded more like a rant at HP and bitterness over some slight he may have experienced rather than a discussion of the phone's capabilities.
    In his video, he was performing the swipe operation like he had a few drinks and couldn't coordinate properly. Also, the phone was obviously trying to do something in the background. Which led to me thinking he deliberately set up something so that 'error' would simulate.
    He then opened the App Catalog saying it will be slow, and it pops up quite fast and he says: Oh, that was fast. But I saw it go slow before.

    Quote Originally Posted by weenarz1176 View Post
    No way he is a hater - in fact, based on everything else he's written, I've always thought of him as one of webOS biggest advocates. Go watch some of the videos during the February event - his excitement over future WebOS products is palpable. I'd agree that he's always seemed more excited about the larger, fancier device, which probably results in some bias against the poor, little Veer. He's obviously disappointed that some of the core software processes haven't improved much since the Pre- was released nearly two years ago; seems that he always assumed the UI inconsistencies were solely related to the underpowered hardware, and is now realizing that some of the software is just not very efficient. IMO, it's indisputable that some app components are just too clunky and slow to compete with top-of-the-line smartphone experiences: buggy and slow media indexers (compare webOS music app to iOS), background tasks slowing phone down to a crawl, too much syncing with cloud with minimal control via options, inconsistent handling of streaming media, I can go on and on. And I agree 100% with him. Really looking forward to seeing how webOS 3.0 addresses some of these issues.
    NNJ
  18. #38  
    that's why their moving to enyo from mojo. Its gonna be faster and much more stable. but it's like writing a whole new OS = webOS 3.0 = takes time = that's why I suspect touchpad taking soooo long.

    All of our apps will need to be eventually re-written for this faster software. but the faster processor of the newer phones and touchpad should help keep old mojo apps running at decent speed.
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    #39  
    Joshua Topolsky obviously exaggerated the e-mail issue (which I haven't experienced, and I have a Pixi Plus). One, he started swipping like crazy (it looked worse because you have to do a complete swipe, not half of the screen or anything); two, he started scrolling up and down until he found an error; and three, he did a search with more than 300 results and made the example with that.

    I understand you're frustrated with HP and all, but I believe his review was way harsh, and he focused on a few problems, and kept exaggerating it. In fact, he just talked about few good points of the Veer, but missed almost all of them: webOS 2.0 features (stacks, Just Tpe, Quick Actions, Exhibition, etc.), beats the crap out of iOS and Android on multitasking and notifications, gesture area, and the many things we love about webOS. It was like: "I made a webOS 2.0 on Engadget, so now, on to the bad parts of the Veer".

    Look, I've also felt bad about the whole situation with HP and lack of phones, and because of this, I've taken a look at the competition, and there's still no way I could switch to another platform, which you can guarantee there are also bugs and all that (just go to an iOS or Android forum, and you'll open your eyes).

    Tell me which other smartphone lets you open the keyboard, type something, and let it add to a note instantly. Sometimes we need to step back and appreciate a product for what it is, not for what it should be. And webOS is the best for productivity, hands down.
  20. #40  
    I've read a lot of Josh's reviews over the last few years, and I can tell you that he's a pretty huge Apple nut, but he does (say) he's a fan of WebOS. That being said, his review really bothered me quite a bit. While I agreed with him on a lot of his points, he never took *a step back* and looked at the Veer from a reality perspective. I've seen some of his reviews where there's 'cons' that should knock at least a few points off the device and yet it gets a 8 or a 9 / 10. Yet he takes the veer and goes on his own personal hissyfit rant about how he thinks WebOS should be just so he can appease the iOS / android crowd. That's how it came across to me. It just seemed like the whole thing was a giant slap in the face to the WebOS crowd. He seems to think he's bigger than the review.
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