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  1. reidme's Avatar
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       #1  
    First off, I love webOS. That is why I have stuck with it. None of the alternatives appeal to me. But that said, the number of annoying bugs and omissions in webOS are astounding, particularly in the PIM software which should be Palm's strength. There are so many things that anyone who actually used the phone for something besides playing games and listening to music would notice. Here's just a few (I'm using a Verizon Pre 2 with webOS 2.0.1):

    (1) Google calendar sync no longer works, and even if it did it would be limited to two months in the future. Two months?! Can you imagine going in a stationery store to buy a day planner or desk calendar and finding that they were only two months long. Ridiculous. And of course you still can not search the calendar, or see all day events in the month view, or see an agenda view, so it is a tedious process to look ahead for events.

    (2) I put an all day event on my Palm Profile calendar with no reminder, but a reminder went off anyway, at midnight. Seriously? This must be a new bug in webOS 2.0.1 because it worked before.

    (3) The alarm clock gives a notification that you have to dismiss every time you change an alarm. It's telling me that I just did something that I just did. Why not a notification every time I add a calendar event, or a memo, or a task? Because it is unnecessary. You used to be able to turn that behavior off with a "secret code", but that no longer works. It would also be nice to select which days of the week the alarm was active. None of the third party apps with that feature have worked well for me.

    (4) The contacts app will not let you add special characters to phone numbers. I wanted a contact to dial Verizon customer service which is *611, but when I enter that phone number it changes it to just 611. I had to create the contact in Google contacts and sync it to the phone.

    (5) The phone app will not let you save your voice mail password to be entered automatically, so if I dial voicemail by tapping on a notification or the voice mail icon I have to enter my password every time. You can work around that by creating a contact with your phone number, a pause character, and the password, and using that to check voicemail every time. Again, ridiculous. (Of course, because of problem number (4) above you have to make that entry in Google contacts, not on the phone.) This wasn't a problem on Sprint, but apparently Verizon requires the password be entered every time.

    (6) Still no office document editing after almost two years. I know, I know, "coming soon."

    (7) The contacts app seems really glitchy now. Sometimes it shows pictures and sometimes not. It lists some of your "favorite" contacts first, but not all of them, and the ones it does list seems to be random.

    I could go on and on and on, but I'm sure you have your own list of annoyances. If the phone wasn't so brilliant in some ways I'd have ditched it a long time ago. It seems like every time Palm updates the OS they break something that worked before and fail to fix long-standing issues. The basic PIM apps actually seem to be in worse shape today than they were at launch! I wish they would quit trying to add more features for a while and just make what we already have work the way it should.

    OK, sorry, rant over. I just had to get that off my chest. If I didn't love webOS so much I wouldn't care so much.
    Last edited by reidme; 02/28/2011 at 12:37 PM.
  2. #2  
    As I understand it the standard phones given to all HP employees on the internally managed cellular program worldwide are the Pre Plus, Pixi Plus, Pre 2, and HP Glisten (Samsung Blackjack and some other WM 6.5 phones are available in certain countries with certain carriers). Before HP acquired Palm, Windows Mobile was the standard at HP.
  3. #3  
    This is one of the reasons I am excited that HP bought Palm. That's potentially 300,000 employees that will insist on adding all the great phone and PIM features the Treo/Centro phones had.

    And the same will hold true if they are going to sell webOS to enterprise customers. It will have to see improvement in the same areas, and we will all benefit.

    We've already seen at least one example of that benefit in that webOS 2.0 as a legitimate VPN client, which was a major omission for those of us that needed it to access corporate resources.
  4. reidme's Avatar
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       #4  
    Quote Originally Posted by Cantaffordit View Post
    This is one of the reasons I am excited that HP bought Palm. That's potentially 300,000 employees that will insist on adding all the great phone and PIM features the Treo/Centro phones had.

    And the same will hold true if they are going to sell webOS to enterprise customers. It will have to see improvement in the same areas, and we will all benefit.

    We've already seen at least one example of that benefit in that webOS 2.0 as a legitimate VPN client, which was a major omission for those of us that needed it to access corporate resources.
    I sure hope so.
  5. #5  
    I realize it isn't stock "per se" (and it should be), but you can get a patch that allows you to set days of the week for alarms. "Alarm Daily Options" it's called.

    I see you have a pretty long list, maybe my advice can cut 1 of them off for you
  6. reidme's Avatar
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       #6  
    Quote Originally Posted by sledge007 View Post
    I realize it isn't stock "per se" (and it should be), but you can get a patch that allows you to set days of the week for alarms. "Alarm Daily Options" it's called.

    I see you have a pretty long list, maybe my advice can cut 1 of them off for you
    Thanks. I have yet to use any patches for fear of making an already buggy OS worse, but I'm starting to think it couldn't be any worse. Home brew here I come.
  7. #7  
    The patches are a must-have for any Pre user. They are what make the phone awesome!

    Preware makes it so easy to do now, you really don't need to worry. Even overclocking is fine. I've used patches and overclocking for months and months and my phone is almost what I expected it to be when I got it. (I'm still hung up on contact categories.)

    Really, just do it. Give yourself an hour and get it done.
  8. reidme's Avatar
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       #8  
    Quote Originally Posted by katefields View Post
    The patches are a must-have for any Pre user. They are what make the phone awesome!

    Preware makes it so easy to do now, you really don't need to worry. Even overclocking is fine. I've used patches and overclocking for months and months and my phone is almost what I expected it to be when I got it. (I'm still hung up on contact categories.)

    Really, just do it. Give yourself an hour and get it done.
    I probably will, but what does that say about webOS that patching is a must-have? And I have read many threads about conflicts and bugs introduced by patches, which will probably be worse on the VZ Pre 2 given its nascent state.
  9. #9  
    Quote Originally Posted by reidme View Post
    (1) Google calendar sync no longer works, and even if it did it would be limited to two months in the future. Two months?! Can you imagine going in a stationery store to buy a day planner or desk calendar and finding that they were only two months long. Ridiculous. And of course you still can not search the calendar, or see all day events in the month view, or see an agenda view, so it is a tedious process to look ahead for events.
    This is one of the reasons I am shy to try to upgrade to OS2.
    Quote Originally Posted by reidme View Post
    (2) I put an all day event on my Palm Profile calendar with no reminder, but a reminder went off anyway, at midnight. Seriously? This must be a new bug in webOS 2.0.1 because it worked before.
    Seriously? that's stupid.
    Quote Originally Posted by reidme View Post
    (3) The alarm clock gives a notification that you have to dismiss every time you change an alarm. It's telling me that I just did something that I just did. Why not a notification every time I add a calendar event, or a memo, or a task? Because it is unnecessary. You used to be able to turn that behavior off with a "secret code", but that no longer works. It would also be nice to select which days of the week the alarm was active. None of the third party apps with that feature have worked well for me.
    I'm okay with this one. It confirms that I've made a change, and the alert is easy to dismiss.
    Quote Originally Posted by reidme View Post
    (4) The contacts app will not let you add special characters to phone numbers. I wanted a contact to dial Verizon customer service which is *611, but when I enter that phone number it changes it to just 611. I had to create the contact in Google contacts and sync it to the phone.
    Not an issue for me, but that sounds awfully annoying.
    Quote Originally Posted by reidme View Post
    (5) The phone app will not let you save your voice mail password to be entered automatically, so if I dial voicemail by tapping on a notification or the voice mail icon I have to enter my password every time. You can work around that by creating a contact with your phone number, a pause character, and the password, and using that to check voicemail every time. Again, ridiculous. (Of course, because of problem number (4) above you have to make that entry in Google contacts, not on the phone.) This wasn't a problem on Sprint, but apparently Verizon requires the password be entered every time.
    I use Sprint, so not an issue for me. I guess either you need a password or you don't. It seems a little silly to require a password to hear something you would have heard if you turned on the phone when the call came in.
    Quote Originally Posted by reidme View Post
    (6) Still no office document editing after almost two years. I know, I know, "coming soon."
    sigh
    Quote Originally Posted by reidme View Post
    (7) The contacts app seems really glitchy now. Sometimes it shows pictures and sometimes not. It lists some of your "favorite" contacts first, but not all of them, and the ones it does list seems to be random.
    That's annoying
  10. #10  
    Quote Originally Posted by reidme View Post
    I probably will, but what does that say about webOS that patching is a must-have? And I have read many threads about conflicts and bugs introduced by patches, which will probably be worse on the VZ Pre 2 given its nascent state.
    This is an argument that has gone way back to the beginnings of patching and Preware and webOS Quick Installer. At that time Palm completely refused to include patches as options into the OS, thus the only way you could get the functionality that you wanted was to patch. I've never used webOS 2.x (since HP refused to allow me to get it on my Pre- before I moved away from that phone) so I don't know how many of the patches that were available for webOS 1.4.x are included. I know some have been, but I don't think the majority have (but that is just my assumption, I'm sure someone has an exhaustive list somewhere). HP should be proactive in looking at patches. If the developers are spending time developing the patches and users are using them, HP should take notice that this is functionality that people want.

    The advent of the auto update patch really took patches to a new level, no longer did you have to remove all your patches with an OS update came out. This was revolutionary with patching. I can only say from a standpoint of using webOS 1.4.x and without patching, the phone is very limited.
  11. #11  
    Makes me wonder if the same bugs are present in 2.1 also.
    If this helped you hit thanks.
  12. #12  
    Quote Originally Posted by reidme View Post
    I probably will, but what does that say about webOS that patching is a must-have? And I have read many threads about conflicts and bugs introduced by patches, which will probably be worse on the VZ Pre 2 given its nascent state.
    Believe me, I think we all can agree that webOS simply wasn't ready when it was released, and it still is not done. I wouldn't say it was half-baked, since it seems that the programming side of webOS was pretty stable (not an expert on that), but the user end functionality was not there, period. It was a baked cake, but Palm left it in the pan straight out of the oven--no icing, fruit filling, decorations, flavor--just plain vanilla cake--and said, "Here ya go!" (I always use food analogies, sorry.) And who wants to eat that?

    So, yes, webOS is still being developed. In today's P|C article, the VP of developer relations emphasized that they realize they're running a marathon. This is a long term endeavor, and they are well aware webOS is not what it should/could be. That's their goal, though.

    As far as glitches, I don't think a patch has ever made my phone unstable. If you inadvertantly try to install one where another patch already exists, it simply won't install, so there's no problem there. Just uninstall the existing, conflicting patch and try again.

    But all that being said, I hope you enjoy using the Pre2 in the meantime!
  13. reidme's Avatar
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       #13  
    Thanks, I am enjoying it despite the software flaws. The hardware improvements are enormous.
  14. #14  
    ok, I know for a fact that some HP people use Palm phones.

    Sadly, this doesn't solve all the problems (though it will help).

    Some are using prototypes or non-released versions. This means they don't have to put up with older software that is missing key features. "Oh, you mean you don't have flash?"

    Some are using the phone, but not as their main phone. "Oh, yeah, you're right, I do that on my iPhone all the time."

    Some are using the phone, but aren't focused on the features that many of the core Palm users love (PIM!). "Oh, you don't do everything in Google calendar? Why? Oh, you have thousands of calendar entrees? Why? That will slow things down?" "Why would anyone look at entrees over a year old?"

    They mean well, and hopefully enough internal users will force through the changes, but it may not.
    KA1
    Visor Deluxe->Visor Prism/Digital Link->Treo 650->Treo 700p->Pre->GSM Unlocked Pre 2 (wifi only)->FrankenPre + Touchpad 32 ->+ Touchpad 4G ATT + ATT Pre3 + 64 White Touchpad... bliss.
  15. #15  
    I too have wondered many a times whether anyone at HP/Palm actually uses the Pre 2 as their primary phone. The reason for thinking this is quite simple, how can so many bugs and that too with the basic functionality of any phone, go unnoticed for so long, or for HP/Palm not to care to fix the issues with an update. Atleast back when the Pre - first came out, Palm quite regularly released updates for webOS to quickly fix the bugs. But with the Pre 2 and HP in the saddle, it has been over four months since the Pre 2 was released and there has not been a single update to fix even the basic functions of the phone.

    Here is one example of how even simple things are screwed up in webOS 2.0.1:
    The SMS/Text Messaging app in webOS 2.0.1 uses some inane logic, to randomly bunch messages from different people into one thread. Also, even if you delete a message, the main page still shows the text of the deleted message as the last message received from that contact.
    Last edited by Sanjay; 03/01/2011 at 05:39 PM.
    Pre3 (AT&T meta-doctored to ROW) webOS 2.2.4 build 3175
    TouchPad WiFi (32GB) - webOS 3.0.5 build 86
    App Catalog (US) - Vodafone (India)

    Treo 180 > 270 > 600 > 650 > 680 > Pre+ > Pre2 > Pre+ > Pre3 & tPad
  16. #16  
    I wonder too, Sanjay. They're business people...they have meetings...WHY IS THE CALENDAR SO CRAPPY AND BUGGY!! Come on, Phil. What's up?
    screwdestiny
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