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  1. #41  
    Quote Originally Posted by nimer55 View Post
    Secondly, you make a deal with a carrier to sell a phone under a 3 year contract, its gotta be supported for that long.
    THREE YEARS?!?! What carrier has a THREE year contract??
  2. #42  
    Quote Originally Posted by j_grouchy View Post
    THREE YEARS?!?! What carrier has a THREE year contract??
    I think they have that on a carrier or two in Canada.
  3. #43  
    I didn't read evey post in this thread so bare with me if I've repeated someone. The main issue here is that HP did issue a statement declaring a webOS 2.x for the older devices. Now the way I see it, even if the latest and greatest revisions of webOS are not compatible on the Pre- and Pre+, HP should have come up with a update that provided the enhancements that the older models are capable of handling. I don't care if they call it webOS 1.9999. It was just bad business to make current owners an after thought of the 2/9/2011 presentation.
    Just_Jay
  4. #44  
    Quote Originally Posted by j_grouchy View Post
    THREE YEARS?!?! What carrier has a THREE year contract??
    the big three all have it.

    and the price of the device usually goes something like this:

    no contract - $600
    1 year - $550
    2 year- $450-500
    3 year- $200

    so your pretty much forced into a 3 year contract. Ill get to renew my 3 year contract for a discount in august (2 years after getting it).
  5. migs's Avatar
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    #45  
    Quote Originally Posted by JokerJ13 View Post
    I didn't read evey post in this thread so bare with me if I've repeated someone. The main issue here is that HP did issue a statement declaring a webOS 2.x for the older devices. Now the way I see it, even if the latest and greatest revisions of webOS are not compatible on the Pre- and Pre+, HP should have come up with a update that provided the enhancements that the older models are capable of handling. I don't care if they call it webOS 1.9999. It was just bad business to make current owners an after thought of the 2/9/2011 presentation.
    Agreed, Hp should at least give us some more performance enhancements so we are not stuck at 1.4.5 even if we dont make it to "2.0"
  6. #46  
    I agree carriers put the kibosh on ota. I'm surprised there isn't a front page op-ed on the subject. The last thing sprint wants to do is an ota update for the worst hardware they probably ever sold (in terms of warranty and support claims). HP has a ton of rebuilding to do to get the pre- taste out of their mouths.
  7. #47  
    If HPs path to webOS 2.0 would be:

    You are a former webOS customer? Buy the new Pre2 with developer discount! Would you guys be happy?
  8. T.E.N.'s Avatar
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    #48  
    It seems as though HP as a company is such a behemoth, that they have no idea what other parts of the company are doing. From Apotheker stating that they have devices ready to roll out after the announcement, to conflicting statements on 2.0 for 'legacy' devices, and to also not have any information for those pixi/pre/pre+ owners going forward; It just seems that they are not very organized or focused.
  9. #49  
    Quote Originally Posted by DirkGently View Post
    If HPs path to webOS 2.0 would be:

    You are a former webOS customer? Buy the new Pre2 with developer discount! Would you guys be happy?
    I'd totally go for a Pre2...as long as it was available on the Sprint network and I didn't need to renew my contract to get it for a reasonable price. I'd be all over it for a stop-gap until my wife and I could BOTH get new devices, which I think is January 1 (based on the 22 month cycle).
  10. #50  
    Quote Originally Posted by j_grouchy View Post
    THREE YEARS?!?! What carrier has a THREE year contract??
    Would you like me to print my contract off and send it to you? (Albeit it only has 2 years left on it now) (And if the 3 years has you going "" I wonder what the $120/month that I pay will make you do )
    Due to the cancellation of the penny, I no longer give 2 about anything. I may however, give a nickel
  11. #51  
    Quote Originally Posted by T.E.N. View Post
    It seems as though HP as a company is such a behemoth, that they have no idea what other parts of the company are doing. From Apotheker stating that they have devices ready to roll out after the announcement, to conflicting statements on 2.0 for 'legacy' devices, and to also not have any information for those pixi/pre/pre+ owners going forward; It just seems that they are not very organized or focused.
    Hey, i am working for a worldwide operating multi billion dollar company. (Jep, but i am just one of those tiny tiny gears, which keep them roling)

    And this is nothing to be amazed about. They higher your position is the more you like to talk, even if you have no clue. It is sad, to see when your CEO has no clue about what he is talking, but this is how buisness works today.

    If you would ask the chinese or indians, which are assembling your phones, they could give you an exact answere*, even if they are earning just a 1/10000 of your CEO's pay/bill.

    *because they have to fulfill their requirements
  12. #52  
    Quote Originally Posted by sledge007 View Post
    Would you like me to print my contract off and send it to you? (Albeit it only has 2 years left on it now) (And if the 3 years has you going "" I wonder what the $120/month that I pay will make you do )
    Just surprised...I figured everyone had two years since most phones don't really last three years. My last phone did (a Sanyo Katana, believe it or not), but that was just because I was waiting for my wife's upgrade to come back in line with mine.

    And we pay about $127 a month for our "Everything Data 1500" family plan...so $120 isn't shocking...unless it's just you on the plan.
  13. #53  
    Quote Originally Posted by DirkGently View Post
    If HPs path to webOS 2.0 would be:

    You are a former webOS customer? Buy the new Pre2 with developer discount! Would you guys be happy?

    Based on the current pricing ? No.

    USA Pre 2 is priced at around $400 - developer discount is $200

    UK Pre 2 is priced at around 400 (=$640) - it's still more expensive than the USA model even after the discount.
    Psion 3a, 3c, 3mx, Handspring Visor Deluxe, Treo 180, Treo 600, Centro, Pre, Touchpad, Pre3, Blackberry Passport (sorry!)
  14. #54  
    Quote Originally Posted by iDG View Post
    I am not insinuating: there's a definite and perfectly perceptible and abrupt change of attitude between this tweet [url] and the following ones.
    Yes, there is. It's called asking the hard questions, getting some (but far from all the answers), and then moving on with your life with the hand that has been dealt.

    But you, Sir, do not get away that easily with a backhanded insinuation of *payment* for silence.

    -- Rod
  15. #55  
    Quote Originally Posted by destinal View Post
    Also, NuttyBunny is exactly right. We don't distribute custom WebOS install images since that would violate copyright. We distribute metadoctor which lets you make your own custom install images.

    The differences between pre and pre2 are very small, the only issue we've had is the closed source TI SGX (powervr) graphics libraries since pre2 uses a slightly newer graphics core revision -- this causes its graphics libraries not to work on pre.

    Even if HP never releases a 2.0 image for castle (pre/pre+), it may be possible to modify these libraries to work. If they do release a 2.0 image for castle, then you can simply use those files.

    To reiterate, we don't need to make and distribute a custom "ROM", just provide you a tool to run so you can make your own modified doctor. This way satisfies copyright law and lets us continue our work legally. Getting sued would suck.
    in fact the ti sgx drivers are open source, one could download them from TI Site and from palm opensource site http://palm.cdnetworks.net/opensource/2.0.0/sgxddk.tgz
  16. #56  
    Quote Originally Posted by gergan View Post
    in fact the ti sgx drivers are open source, one could download them from TI Site and from palm opensource site http://palm.cdnetworks.net/opensource/2.0.0/sgxddk.tgz
    We've been working with that source code since November. That's the kernel module source code -- the piece we're missing is the userland binary-only libraries. TI provides most of them (in binary form only) in their SDK but it appears that Palm has added some additional libraries not present here.
  17. #57  
    This thread went awry in my humble opinion...

    Here's what I think might be on people's minds:

    1a) OTA is possible and HP doesn't want to do it for reason X.
    1b) OTA is possible and HP can't get carriers to do it for reason Y.
    2) OTA is possible but has drawbacks... see 1a & 1b.
    3) OTA might be possible but the investment to make it bulletproof and keep customers happy is more than HP or carriers willingly will spend on an end of life product.
    4) HP is evil and this is a plot!

    There are more combinations than I care to list...

    Personally I'm leaning towards number 3. This might work with enough time and effort but the payback is low and the cost is high and the company (HP) and the vendors (carriers) can't agree on a cost sharing model to make it worth their while to do it. The carriers worry they will be stuck with the support problem if it blows up in customers faces and they don't want that.

    Note that even if OTA isn't done - if any update is done (even via USB) that results in non-bulletproof upgrade the carrier's are going to be left in the same position.
  18. #58  
    Quote Originally Posted by destinal View Post
    We've been working with that source code since November. That's the kernel module source code -- the piece we're missing is the userland binary-only libraries. TI provides most of them (in binary form only) in their SDK but it appears that Palm has added some additional libraries not present here.
    this means that we could rebuild almost all the modules and the kernel from the 2.0.1 for example with the overclocking, and the compcache module, or is there any other problem (I thought only the modules are compiled with optimisations for another cpu),
  19. #59  
    Quote Originally Posted by ToniCipriani View Post
    It will be near impossible to do an update and handily convert the data from the old DB type (I think it's Sqlite) to the new db8 which 2.x uses on device
    Hah!

    If you mean the profile data, palm wrote the darn interface and can do an import handidly. A one-way import, that is. And they're going to have to translate it ANYWAY, since a big share of their market will be moving from a 1.x profile to a 2.x profile.

    If you mean application data... SQLite, as far as I've heard, is still THE on-device Real Relational Database. db8 does a bunch of similar things... but if you're doing more than CRUD, you still need SQLite.
    Doug Meerschaert
    NoInsultSoftware.com

    Apps: Scratch, GasMath, CheckMath
  20. #60  
    Quote Originally Posted by gergan View Post
    this means that we could rebuild almost all the modules and the kernel from the 2.0.1 for example with the overclocking, and the compcache module, or is there any other problem (I thought only the modules are compiled with optimisations for another cpu),
    The only published kernel code for 2.0 is for the Pre 2, which uses a different processor and has changed quite significantly from the Pre in the area of clock and voltage management.

    -- Rod
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