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  1.    #1  
    So, I have been using patches for about 6 months now and while turning on developer mode and setting up WebOS Quick Install was a bit of a pain the whole Preware process has been amazingly easy as well as intuitive. WebOS is just so easy to patch!

    Also none of these patches has yet to have any detrimental effect on my Pre.

    So, this lead me to an idea for Palm to differentiate themselves from Apple, RIM and Android:

    Make patches 'official' and call them 'Features' and offer a 'Features Store'.

    So, instead of calling them 'patches' which the Average Joe has no idea what that is, market them as 'add-on features' that they can get after the phone is bought and add to the OS later.

    I think this is better than implementing every single new patch and feature into an OS Update because:

    1) Bloat: Not everyone wants 30 million different IM clients on their phone but most want a couple that are different for each user. You could just add the things you want and not have the things you dont on the phone, keeping the OS lean.

    2) Conflicting Interests: some people want their phone to have the calendar open to month view. Some want week view. Etc Etc. Just like with apps, you can customize your OS so that it suits your needs. WebOS goes from one size fits all, to customizable for anyone.

    Palm could then market this 'Feature Store' as something different than the iPhone, that rather than your phone being "Steve Job's phone" its your own personalized phone that fits your needs perfectly.

    This is the ME generation, right?

    I'm sure there would be some bugs, but really, how many? I haven't had a single issue with my patches. I mean dont make overclocking possible obviously...but patches like adding delete all to emails and everything.

    You could also make a "Themes Store" too, granted Palm could get it to not conflict with updates.

    This could differentiate Palm from the "closed source, you do what we tell you" nature of Apple.

    What does everyone think?

    I mean apps are cool but they are so separated and static. But look at the nature of Web OS: Synergy, Universal Search and IM/MMS/SMS all in one app.

    This phone was MEANT to be integrated. So it would be sweet to see integrated Feature add-ons that would offer say, 50 different types of contact lists plugins for Synergy, Skype integrated right into the Phone and IM, 50 different types of IM plugins, and 50 different types of Universal search options.

    That would really be much more amazing then static apps that dont communicate with each other...like on other OS's.
  2. #2  
    Sounds good to me.
  3. klynn's Avatar
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    #3  
    great idea!
  4. #4  
    I like the idea, however, some patches HAVE been posted with issues in the past. As well, it is possible to create malicious patches that should edit parts of the OS that shouldn't be edited. From a security point of view, a LOT would be needed to make it secure.

    And then of course there's the issue of conflicting patches. For example, device menu patches like Device Menu Remix conflicts with Device Menu Megamix. Yes, conflicts can be handled via ipkg standard, but if Palm opened up patching to everyone managing such conflicts would be extremely difficult.

    As a result, Palm would probably have to go through each patch manually for both security, so see what the patch does, and to make sure it doesn't conflict with other patches (or setup conflicts data if there are).

    The idea of patches themselves are a HUGE benefit for the webOS community and Palm knows this. They also know that patches fit best in the homebrew world, where things are done at the users' risk.

    It's be interesting if patches could be made availble for the device, and I'd be one of the first to release mine officially, but realistically, I can't see it happening anytime soon. But on the flip-side, I don't see Palm shutting down homebrew either.

    Oh, and I know initially setting up WebOS Quick Install depends on several things. I'm looking into possible things to simplify the setup and usage of the device. One thing I can tell you, a future realease of WOSQI will support wireless connections
    If you've liked my software, please consider to towards future development.

    Developer of many apps such as: WebOS Quick Install, WebOS Theme Builder, Ipk Packager, Unified Diff Creator, Internalz Pro, ComicShelf HD, LED Torch, over 70 patches and more.

    @JayCanuck @CanuckCoding Facebook
  5.    #5  
    Yes I agree with you Jason, that 'patching' can be a harmful and malicious thing, but I wasn't necessarially talking about homebrew patching.

    I meant Palm just using that idea to offer people additional features if they want as add-ons later.

    I was thinking that either Palm's own engineers made these add-ons, OR that it would be a VERY secure and tightly controlled and examined 'store' or 'catalog' that Palm would supervise and check each patch.

    There would be conflicting features, but just like when you take University classes, each feature would say 'incompatible with feature "so and so"'

    I mean...for example: trying to add a feature that defaults your calendar to open to month view and a feature that opens it to week view at the same time...clearly ain't gonna work.

    I wouldn't really see features that have "Mega-Mixes" and the like...that is just patch techie speak. Each feature would be an individual add-on. I think the "Mega Remixes" would confuse people.

    And I really wouldn't want this to replace the homebrew community...I think Preware should still exist for us hardcore patches.

    But it would be nice for some of the more simple patches to be available to the general WebOS user, and after hearing this argument on PreCentral so often

    Average Joe: "Man, I HATE how WebOS doesnt have "Delete all Emails" in the email app.

    Techie Nerd: "Yes, but there are homebrew patches available, just Developer Mode your phone, install the Java app WebOs Quick Install (but make sure you have WebOS Doctor in the same folder and its the most recent version!) and then install Preware and add it, its easy"

    Average Joe: "I dont even begin to understand what you just said there, I just want to delete all emails"
  6. #6  
    Quote Originally Posted by Jason Robitaille View Post
    One thing I can tell you, a future realease of WOSQI will support wireless connections
    THANK YOU! I know you mentioned this to me a couple months ago to me over IM, but I didn't know if that was still on your roadmap. Now I can officially ditch my USB cable.


    If I helped you or you have downloaded one of my files,
    then least you could do is click the "Thanks" button.
  7. #7  
    some patches like megamix wouldn't work cause it would be to complexe for the avreage user. Others should simply be settings, and options in prefrences.
  8. #8  
    Palm have their own patches. They're called webOS updates. I expect that Palm don't have the resources to vet and endorse 3rd party patches at this time. It's hard enough for them to follow their own roadmap for the OS. Just be thankful that they are so open to the homebrew community's efforts. I had hoped that some of the more popular patches would have graduated to webOS preferences by now though.
  9. #9  
    Agreed, I think this is a great idea.
  10. #10  
    It will never happen. Manufacturers like being able to test and gauge with some certainty that what they are releasing will work for 98% of their users.

    Got me how they could cover the bases and also play to win opening up patches as an option.

    Now, on the other hand, they could incorporate and make things perfect, but then how they decide what to add and hold for now.

    Interesting though and I think Palm has used patches or fixes in limited use and provided them in past updates of webOS???

    Correct? Sorli...
  11. #11  
    Quote Originally Posted by johncc View Post
    Palm have their own patches. They're called webOS updates. I expect that Palm don't have the resources to vet and endorse 3rd party patches at this time. It's hard enough for them to follow their own roadmap for the OS. Just be thankful that they are so open to the homebrew community's efforts. I had hoped that some of the more popular patches would have graduated to webOS preferences by now though.
    Yeah but the quality in the features idea is that each person can choose what he/she wants.
    Do you want a color-coded battery? Do you want no battery icon, just numbers? Do you want a specific string on the top left? Do you want blue font in the messenger or whatever font? Do you want your browser to refresh when you shake it? Do you want a pixel on the side to be taken up for a scrollbar? Do you want a different launcher?

    WebOS updates can't exactly give that. The user needs to have the choices. Jamming it all into the preferences seems to work sometimes, but I always run into someone who complains about their phone not having this or being this when they were able to change it in their phone prefs.
  12. #12  
    Why make it so complicated?

    Personal preference settings should just be in the "preference" menu in the drop-down menu of each application, just as you would expect in Palm OS or any desktop application.

    Especially simple stuff such as "Multiple launcher pages", "Email Landscape", "pdf landscape" should just be enabled as an option.

    Whereas "hide Nascar app" could never be official as long as Sprint mandates it to be present.

    Complex system mods could be done by just expanding the SDK to support this kind of stuff. I can skin my UI by installing an application on most desktop OSes. I can install 3rd party launchers in Palm OS. Why can't I do it on modern smart phones? Because Apple showed the world that locking down the SDK is a simple way of ensuring stability and security.
  13. philbw's Avatar
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    #13  
    Here's how I see this working: I'll try not to get too technical but still make my point. Since WebOS is html/css/javascript based it's easy for the current patches to exist. What Palm *could* do is implement "customizable* elements to popular sections like the top bar. In code it would merely be another DIV object. Developers would be able to add what they want to these objects and they'd basically be sandboxed from screwing something else up. This way when Palm adds/removes/changes things they just leave that empty DIV alone and whatever is applied to it isn't broken. Anyhow, just an idea.

    - Phil -
  14. eheaps's Avatar
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    #14  
    I think you can easily compare this to firefox or chrome addons or extensions. Aren't some of these patches working in the same way as those for our beloved Internet browsers? Ones that are potentially harmful or buggy can be marked as beta or developmental addons in the app catalog. Themes could be implemented, too. The update issue can be resolved by Palm just forcing the update to disable all themes an addons (what I would think is the best name for patches in the catalog) and then restore them, post update. Kind of like how firefox would do it, disabling any that do not work after the update u til it's updated by it's developer.

    I think adding these to the app catalog would definitely move Palms mobile app store to the forefront of the competition and really help webos as a platform. I love what preware and WOSQI have done for webOS but the average user will not take advantage of homebrew unless these items become implemented in the catalog, or preware becomes available in the catalog where it would quickly become a top app.
  15. bdog421's Avatar
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    #15  
    I like this idea.

    Couldn't a filter be added in this patch app store that would automatically grey out incompatible patches? Also make this app store preware, since it's pretty much a patch app store/installer already. I don't know just a thought.

    Palm should adopt this if at all possible, as this would improve overall user experience on an individual level and bring proper recognition to alot of the devs that write the patches. Maybe they could even make a small fee(devs and palm). Ten patches for a buck or something?
  16. Analog's Avatar
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    #16  
    Quote Originally Posted by sjsamphex View Post
    Jamming it all into the preferences seems to work sometimes, but I always run into someone who complains about their phone not having this or being this when they were able to change it in their phone prefs.
    That's true enough, but what I don't understand is why their ignorance should make it more difficult for *me* to have the options on my Pre that would make it a more useful device to me. Why should I (and you, and the other readers here) have to go through the extra step of shopping in an options "store" and installing these options just because Joe Fatfinger can't be bothered to RTFM?

    Many of the options that we have on our devices thanks to the writers of these patches should be in the OS right now. People who don't want these options or don't know about them or can't be bothered to research them won't enable them and won't miss them, but we'll have them right out the box.
  17. #17  
    its an interesting idea, but if they make it "official" then they will have control over the patches. I LIKE that the patches are part of the community, and free from corporate control (and censorship); and $free$.

    Keep them free and in the wild
  18.    #18  
    Many of the options that we have on our devices thanks to the writers of these patches should be in the OS right now
    I agree on some patches...but others I have are very specific to me. Putting too many things in an OS that only a minority would use would cause the OS to get very SLLLOOWW.

    This effect is known as "Windows Vista."

    I thought it would be cool for people to pick and choose, to keep the OS lite.

    its an interesting idea, but if they make it "official" then they will have control over the patches. I LIKE that the patches are part of the community, and free from corporate control (and censorship); and $free$.

    Keep them free and in the wild
    I agree completely, and I think that you could have both.

    An official store for "patches" and a homebrew community.

    The homebrew community could test them out before they go to the official catalog where Palm gives them one more once over to make sure they are OK.

    Also, then some of the patch dev's could sell thes "features" to make money off their hard work.

    But I think anything more than 20 cents for a little feature here or there is asking too much. And most should be free.

    You can have both a homebrew community and an official features catalog.

    We would just have much more kickass patches that are a littly riskier and in "beta" ...and also the Overclock Patching...which should never be official.
  19. #19  
    I think this is an awesome idea. Back when my 32 gig first gen iPod Touch was the "extension of my hand" (now it's my beloved Pre Plus ) I was a jailbreak enthusiast. No, I wasn't a developer, no I didn't make themes (well, I made a few themes but I never published them- they're easy enough to make) but I ALWAYS kept up with the jailbreak scene and tried whatever- stock iPhone OS was too old, boring and sterile for my tastes, plus I've always loved hacking. One of the ideas I always entertained was the idea of tweaks, extensions, and hacks (the iPhone OS terms for patches- extensions is really an Apple term in general though, and hacks are for everything) having their own version of the iPhone app store- you know, a place to buy or download free extensions, hacks, and the like that's available on every iPhone out of the box. Of course, the likelihood of Apple doing that is about the same as the odds of Microsoft dropping Windows and developing for Linux. It's never gonna happen- but I always hoped. I actually gave it plenty of thought, and even made a few mock-ups. It was always something I pondered. I never applied this idea to the Pre and webOS though. I wonder why I didn't. I did put some thought behind whether Preware could be in the App Catalog and how it would work (would the be alright with it installing ipkgservice, which you need to use Preware? Hmm...) I never thought about a "features" section of the App Catalog for patches. But that's an awesome idea. And you know what? I wouldn't put it past Palm to do this. It could happen. As Dieter once said, webOS is only one or two steps removed from being completely open source (the kernel is GPL and some apps have public source code, like the streaming music player as it's based off of gStream if I recall correctly...) this is the kind of thing they'd consider. I'd love to see this. Of course, they should not that the items in the features store can damage your phone, so proceed with caution, back up first, you might need to doctor, Palm isn't responsible, blah, blah, blah...
    In short, I'd love this.
  20. #20  
    I envision a future that includes a stock webOS app called 'Customize'. This app has access to an official feed of patches and tweaks that have all been modified to work perfectly with each other. Also from this app, users can download custom themes. The user simply puts a check next to desired patches and themes and they're presented with a preview of how their GUI will look. If they are pleased with it, they tap done and luna restarts.

    the availability of this app to the general public would encourage developers to put more effort into making sure their patches are compatible with all other patches. and there would still be homebrew for those who would rather go it alone.
    Last edited by Mhunterjr; 05/13/2010 at 07:21 AM.
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