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  1. #161  
    Quote Originally Posted by Urkel View Post
    I'm not sure what you're even expecting to be "backed up" when it comes to my statement that the latest announcements is "getting caught up with 2009". 16GB? Video Camera? Games? Those aren't things that anyone would consider "new" or "innovative" and there still is a pretty hefty list of common features that are still lacking.
    Actually, it was more "not enough to entice new users" part that I was speaking of. You used that as the end result of "getting caught up with 2009" as you claimed to not trying to "slam Palm". As I said, nonsense with nothing to back it up.

    And, as I said, I understand.

    Quote Originally Posted by Urkel View Post
    I know you are trying to pin me as someone "attacking" Palm but that's not the case at all. My point is that the Pre stole the show at CES09 because Palm went on stage and showed that WebOS truly was a step ahead of the competition. But what exactly are they offering at CES10 that is supposed to give new users any sort of desire to get a Palm device?
    You may consider what they just announced to be "getting caught up with 2009". I do not. You offered that the result of this would be that new users are not enticed to buy it. I said you're wrong, that they're going to buy it. If you had bet, you would have lost, as new users are already expressing not only an interest, but plans of buying it. So, one of two things, "catching up to 2009" must be enough to entice new users, or Palm is doing more than catching up to 2009.

    Quote Originally Posted by Urkel View Post
    One thing about Android is that they've proven to the industry that their OS will get updates OUTSIDE of the tradeshow schedules. They're constantly making changes and have new and old hardware to take advantage of it. But Palm is very similar to Apple in that they are relying heavily on annual press events to announce big changes so if this is all they are showing us then this is all Palm users get to digest until the next "appropriate" convention.
    Plan has updated their OS well outside of the trade shows. More than 1 uipdate every month. The rest of your assertion about "relying heavily on annual press events" is nonsense. They've been making changes regularly. Personally, I don't want a device that is "constantly making changes" to their hardware. That makes the existing devices obsolete, and results in no further upgrades to those devices.

    Quote Originally Posted by Urkel View Post
    I'm not interested in any "bets" on this. I'm only interested in the phone that I own will maintain it's position as a viable competitor. And since I'm not under some delusion that I work for these companies then if Palm fails to suit my needs I will simply switch to a competitor guilt free. That's the advantage of being brand agnostic.
    I'm sure you're not interested in making a bet on it, it's much easier to make weird proclamations when you don't see any need to offer anything in which to back them up, other than your own wind blowing. I think the only delusion here is that you're "brand agnostic".
  2. #162  
    Quote Originally Posted by sivan View Post
    Grampa hparsons downloaded Need for Speed and is all pumped up now
    ??? What in the world are you talking about? I don't have NFS on my computer, so that theory's out. Have you now given up deciding for me what I think, and switched to deciding for me what I have on my home??? Wow.
  3. #163  
    Quote Originally Posted by GMoney749 View Post
    And I totally agree. Personally, I could give a crap about 3D gaming or video recording. My point is, the exact same know-it-alls that have been in here whining and trying to impress everyone with their big brains since June, are still here singing the same tune at a different pitch.

    "Oh, I can't believe this phone doesn't have video recording! It's the most important feature in the world because the iPhone does and even my old can-and-string phone could do it. That's why I'll never buy a Pre. Oh, it has video recording now? Well, it should have had it a long time ago. But it still can't do 3D games. What's that? Oh, well there's no developers that will write for it. Huh? Well..."

    Back to the real world. Enjoy your whining.
    Well said!!! Now throw in "everything they do is so last-year", and I think the complaint list will be up-to-date.
  4. #164  
    Quote Originally Posted by dbd View Post
    Don'tcha just love whiners whining about whining, rants about ranters and complaints about complainers?
    And those that complain (in a veiled sort of way) about all of the above?
  5. #165  
    Quote Originally Posted by sivan View Post
    Grampa hparsons downloaded Need for Speed and is all pumped up now
    Quote Originally Posted by hparsons View Post
    ??? What in the world are you talking about? I don't have NFS on my computer, so that theory's out. Have you now given up deciding for me what I think, and switched to deciding for me what I have on my home??? Wow.
    Ok, does this mean we can call you Grandpa hparsons? Cause I noticed you didn't really have a problem with that part of Sivan's post. I hope so, cuz I really think I'd fight less with a guy called Grandpa. just sayin.
    PalmOS Treos: 90/300/600/650/700/755/launch day Pre minus/ Evo/Epic
  6. #166  
    Palm's software release cycle is truly web style: perpetual beta and iterative releases.

    This certainly works on the web but I think Palm's treading into uncharted territory because these are paying customers locked in a contract.
    Palm Vx > Treo 650 > Centro > G1 > Pre > BlackBerry 9700
  7. #167  
    Methinks some folks miss the point--Palm didn't release those games yesterday just because some people want games on the Pre. Palm released them to show, in a very graphical fashion, the power of the platform and the ease with which developers can port ANY application to WebOS. Put another way: the games were released to highlight the PDK; the PDK wasn't announced to highlight the games.

    Those of us who are excited about what Palm announced yesterday, therefore, aren't excited (necessarily, unless we're gamers) about the games themselves as much as we are about what the changes to the Developers Program mean for the future of the platform. Palm has created simply the best development environment going in the mobile space--it supports industry standards (C/C++), has a road for easy app development for the "casual" (but still talented) developer (Mojo/Ares), and allows developers absolute freedom in how and when they distribute the apps they want to deliver.

    There are developers out there--good ones--who refuse to develop for the iPhone because of Apple's draconian approval process. Those developers simply must be excited about what Palm has to offer, particularly given the prospects of many more units sold on Verizon and AT&T.
    Treo 600 > Treo 650 > HTC Mogul (*****!) > HTC Touch Pro (***** squared!) > PRE! > Epic
  8. #168  
    Quote Originally Posted by eekinsman View Post
    Ok, does this mean we can call you Grandpa hparsons? Cause I noticed you didn't really have a problem with that part of Sivan's post. I hope so, cuz I really think I'd fight less with a guy called Grandpa. just sayin.
    Sure, why not. My grandkids don't have a problem with it.

    The only thing worse than growing older is the alternative.
    Last edited by hparsons; 01/08/2010 at 07:30 PM.
  9. #169  
    Quote Originally Posted by wynand32 View Post
    ...
    Those of us who are excited about what Palm announced yesterday, therefore, aren't excited (necessarily, unless we're gamers) about the games themselves as much as we are about what the changes to the Developers Program mean for the future of the platform. Palm has created simply the best development environment going in the mobile space--it supports industry standards (C/C++), has a road for easy app development for the "casual" (but still talented) developer (Mojo/Ares), and allows developers absolute freedom in how and when they distribute the apps they want to deliver.
    ...
    The whole C/C++ thing has me totally ticked. One of my Christmas presents this year (I got two from my wife) was the Palm WebOS book (print and PDF) so I could take a stab at a program. I had even worked my way half way through it. Now they've changed the came completely.

    To make matters worse, I dedicated a laptop to "Palm Dev Only" use, and the other Christmas present was a USB KVM switch so I didn't have too much clutter on my desk, but could still easily switch between computers.

    Now Palm, in their never ending greed to make things better and get more money, has completely changed things. I'm ticked, it would have been so much better for me if they'd kept things they way they were!

    There, does that qualify as something else to complain about?
  10. #170  
    Quote Originally Posted by sivan View Post
    Palm's software release cycle is truly web style: perpetual beta and iterative releases.

    This certainly works on the web but I think Palm's treading into uncharted territory because these are paying customers locked in a contract.
    in a way that's somewhat similar to Google's development cycle, right?
  11. #171  
    Quote Originally Posted by Really mobile View Post
    in a way that's somewhat similar to Google's development cycle, right?
    Yes. It's a startup development cycle. You start with a vague idea of something you think will catch on and release it as soon as you have something up and running and iterate over and over refining your solution based on customer feedback.

    Until now it was a web thing because you need a way to iterate quickly, which is not possible with shrink wrapped or download and install software. But streamlined app stores and OTA updates make this possible for all kinds of applications.

    It's not a bad thing but it has its roots in free services where customer expectations are conducive to trying new stuff and working around problems.
    Palm Vx > Treo 650 > Centro > G1 > Pre > BlackBerry 9700
  12. #172  
    Quote Originally Posted by hparsons View Post
    That's just it. It's not a "phonebook" (you can tell by the way they spelled it). It's a list of contacts. A centralized list of all of your contacts, and it calls the appropriate program based on what type of contact it is.
    Ok, then we should be given the appropriate way to catagorize, seperate, and manage these contacts. Because as of now, there isn't one. There are workarounds,, like everyone I work with, I stick a "w" at the front of their name, to keep them from cluttering throughout my list. But c'mon. There is an existing program here in hte homebrew, waiting for palm to open contacts up to developers. Would be nice to have it.
  13. #173  
    "You can complain because roses have thorns,
    or you can rejoice because thorns have roses."
    --Ziggy
    We have enough youth, how about a fountain of smart?
  14. #174  
    Quote Originally Posted by strudel View Post
    I did read your response, the question is, where are the contacts going to be displayed since the dialpad takes up the entire display? Once you have typed enough letters to filter down to a single contact I think you idea would work great but before that point I'm not sure how it would work without shrinking down the dialpad to a size that it is barely usable.
    You are right, I thought about it also last night, while really looking at it. The onscreen keyboard works fine for it, thats what i've been using.
  15. #175  
    Quote Originally Posted by redninja View Post
    Ok, then we should be given the appropriate way to catagorize, seperate, and manage these contacts. Because as of now, there isn't one. There are workarounds,, like everyone I work with, I stick a "w" at the front of their name, to keep them from cluttering throughout my list. But c'mon. There is an existing program here in hte homebrew, waiting for palm to open contacts up to developers. Would be nice to have it.
    I can see how someone would think that, if they were trying to use the contact list the way they are used to. It's not meant to be used that way. I don't think I browse the contact list more than twice a week.

    I want someone in my contact list, I (typically) type (from the dashboard) the first letter of the first name, and start typing their last name. Usually, by the second letter of their last name, I've got them.

    3-4 keystrokes. No categorizing, no browsing, just type.
  16. #176  
    Quote Originally Posted by hparsons View Post
    The whole C/C++ thing has me totally ticked. One of my Christmas presents this year (I got two from my wife) was the Palm WebOS book (print and PDF) so I could take a stab at a program. I had even worked my way half way through it. Now they've changed the came completely.

    To make matters worse, I dedicated a laptop to "Palm Dev Only" use, and the other Christmas present was a USB KVM switch so I didn't have too much clutter on my desk, but could still easily switch between computers.

    Now Palm, in their never ending greed to make things better and get more money, has completely changed things. I'm ticked, it would have been so much better for me if they'd kept things they way they were!

    There, does that qualify as something else to complain about?
    I know you're kind of/sort of joking, with a kernel of truth, I think, but: really, that's the beauty of what Palm has done. Their adding C/C++ doesn't take _anything_ away from whatever really cool app you'd create using Mojo/Ares.

    As I think we've agreed in the past, pre-PDK development environment is fine for a number of very valuable apps. That's demonstrated by the very nice apps already available that were built using nothing but Mojo. C/C++ doesn't change this, and in fact apps written in C/C++ are either going to be completely self-contained (such as NFS, with its own standalone UI) or they're going to actually be code snippets that interact with the user via Mojo.

    I think that you're a classic example of what's really cool about WebOS. The "casual" developer (which I might become if I had more time) such as yourself can develop apps right alongside the power developer/larger development houses. And indeed I anticipate some very, very cool apps written using Ares that perform specific functions very well, rather than merely looking cool and making use of the GPU.
    Treo 600 > Treo 650 > HTC Mogul (*****!) > HTC Touch Pro (***** squared!) > PRE! > Epic
  17. PreMium's Avatar
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    #177  
    I would like the calendar to work like the old PalmOS calendar. Go to the day you want. Then hit the number for the time you want and bang! You can enter your event.
  18. #178  
    Sorry, too many cards.....this is ridiculous
  19. #179  
    Quote Originally Posted by wynand32 View Post
    I know you're kind of/sort of joking, with a kernel of truth, I think, but: really, that's the beauty of what Palm has done. Their adding C/C++ doesn't take _anything_ away from whatever really cool app you'd create using Mojo/Ares.

    As I think we've agreed in the past, pre-PDK development environment is fine for a number of very valuable apps. That's demonstrated by the very nice apps already available that were built using nothing but Mojo. C/C++ doesn't change this, and in fact apps written in C/C++ are either going to be completely self-contained (such as NFS, with its own standalone UI) or they're going to actually be code snippets that interact with the user via Mojo.

    I think that you're a classic example of what's really cool about WebOS. The "casual" developer (which I might become if I had more time) such as yourself can develop apps right alongside the power developer/larger development houses. And indeed I anticipate some very, very cool apps written using Ares that perform specific functions very well, rather than merely looking cool and making use of the GPU.
    In what time frame do you see all of this happening?
    Palm Vx > Treo 650 > Centro > G1 > Pre > BlackBerry 9700
  20. RafRol's Avatar
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    #180  
    Quote Originally Posted by Godstyle View Post
    "You can complain because roses have thorns,
    or you can rejoice because thorns have roses."
    --Ziggy
    Good quote.

    Bridgeport huh?
    Visor/Sprint Springboard Expansion Module > Visor Platinum > Tungsten E > Centro (work) > Palm Pre

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