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  1. d.moss's Avatar
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       #1  
    i really love my pre and i know webos has great potential. but what is potential if not utilized quick enough before it is surpassed. i just feel like palm is moving too slow. we like to say "well its only been out 5 months." but its not like it wasn't being developed years before. with android evolving very rapidly and its integration of social networking, what's keeping palm special in your eyes?
  2. TyBec's Avatar
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    #2  
    Not having one right this second...
    Last edited by TyBec; 10/21/2009 at 12:06 PM.
    Bell Pre- running 2.1 @ 800MHz
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  3. MGoerke's Avatar
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    #3  
    i know what you mean, I love my Pre & understand it hasnt been around 3 years liek the iPhone but that is who they are marketing against! a phoen with 3 years of developement! Part of what kills me is Palm has been in the phone and pda game MUCH longer than apple yet they ignored some of what made them stand out & still able to use that oh so old & aging system they had on my treo & centro!Apple is not stopign to wait for Palm neither is Google or RIM! so its like starting late in a race & just not being able to catch up! noone else is waiting. Again dont get me wrong i love my Pre & i understand that Palm is a much smaller company but when it comes down to it phoen 12&3 have XY&Z features while Palm has X&Y only!
    Lets play pretend here, Say samsung has no LCD T.V.'s out only tube, well they cant come out with a 30" 720i T.V. & expect to compete with Son & Panasonic who have 1080p 120 & 240 Mhz LCD Backlight 60" t.v.'s I mean there will be spot for that 30" samsung but no one is waiting around for them to catch up!
  4. Change's Avatar
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    #4  
    Palm doesn't have the resources of Apple, Google, or even RIM. Nor does it have the market share of any of it's competitors. It's gaining ground, and the product is developing at a fairly rapid pace (I've been working in the software industry for 10+ years) considering it's been out since June and there's been multiple updates released.

    Besides, it's been out for 4 months. Will be 5 months in November. iPhone users had these same concerns 3 years ago. They went almost 8 months with only a handful of apps available to them, yet because the iPhone has been out for 3 years, you expect Palm to be beyond them in all aspects upon launch? Not possible, nor is it plausible.

    The way the software market works (lets face it, this is about the OS and not the hardware) is first to market, fix it when you can. The pre does things an iPhone cannot do, and the iPhone does things the Pre does, but only better. That will change with optimization of the OS over time. They had to get it to market first, to provide the headroom (financially speaking) for the development to continue. It's just how it works.

    What I don't understand, is how as a consumer anyone can buy into a new to market product, and expect it to be flawless? Ever buy a 1st generation build of a car? There's generally so many problems with a 1st gen car platform it's ridiculous. Software is no different, other than it can (and will) be fixed in time.
  5. #5  
    what's keeps palm special to me is knowing that when all the other people that can't wait for palm to do all their going to do with this thing ( not to mention other companies like adobe) . When they are all gone is when the update will come that truly puts this phone above the rest.
    ĦṔ-Ḷṫ-Ŧḯη
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  6. d.moss's Avatar
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       #6  
    Quote Originally Posted by Change View Post
    Palm doesn't have the resources of Apple, Google, or even RIM. Nor does it have the market share of any of it's competitors. It's gaining ground, and the product is developing at a fairly rapid pace (I've been working in the software industry for 10+ years) considering it's been out since June and there's been multiple updates released.

    Besides, it's been out for 4 months. Will be 5 months in November. iPhone users had these same concerns 3 years ago. They went almost 8 months with only a handful of apps available to them, yet because the iPhone has been out for 3 years, you expect Palm to be beyond them in all aspects upon launch? Not possible, nor is it plausible.

    The way the software market works (lets face it, this is about the OS and not the hardware) is first to market, fix it when you can. The pre does things an iPhone cannot do, and the iPhone does things the Pre does, but only better. That will change with optimization of the OS over time. They had to get it to market first, to provide the headroom (financially speaking) for the development to continue. It's just how it works.

    What I don't understand, is how as a consumer anyone can buy into a new to market product, and expect it to be flawless? Ever buy a 1st generation build of a car? There's generally so many problems with a 1st gen car platform it's ridiculous. Software is no different, other than it can (and will) be fixed in time.
    ok.. so like i said. yes it has only been out 5 months minus a few weeks.. but its been in development longer than that. when iphone came out, it was truly revolutionary in tha no one was doing what they were. therefore it wasn't so bad dealing with the quirks that needed to be worked out. that was two years ago. now its 2009 going on 2010 and everyone is duplicating the features of the iphone plus some. i know that this is a first gen device as well as i know that no one has built a mobile os that uses the type of programming the pre does (javascript, css, etc). all i'm saying is, what does all this matter if other platforms are already duplicating these features? android already has their version of synergy, and apple could easily mimic the cards ui with their coverflow. everyone is gonna eventually have flash support. and multitasking isn't something hard to implement. android is already doing that too. so what does webos have left? intuitive notifications? anyways, i'll be here because i'm loyal. i just hope webos doesn't get lost in the shuffle.. i'm still waiting for a REAL update.. not minor tweaks.
  7. ahaxton's Avatar
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    #7  
    Quote Originally Posted by d.moss View Post
    ok.. so like i said. yes it has only been out 5 months minus a few weeks.. but its been in development longer than that. when iphone came out, it was truly revolutionary in tha no one was doing what they were. therefore it wasn't so bad dealing with the quirks that needed to be worked out. that was two years ago. now its 2009 going on 2010 and everyone is duplicating the features of the iphone plus some. i know that this is a first gen device as well as i know that no one has built a mobile os that uses the type of programming the pre does (javascript, css, etc). all i'm saying is, what does all this matter if other platforms are already duplicating these features? android already has their version of synergy, and apple could easily mimic the cards ui with their coverflow. everyone is gonna eventually have flash support. and multitasking isn't something hard to implement. android is already doing that too. so what does webos have left? intuitive notifications? anyways, i'll be here because i'm loyal. i just hope webos doesn't get lost in the shuffle.. i'm still waiting for a REAL update.. not minor tweaks.
    Because Apple wasn't on the ropes financially when they produced the iPhone. Between sales for their Mac line, plus the industry leading iPods, they were flush with cash and could devote a large number of resources to making it flawless without having to worry about hitting a specific target date.

    Palm, on the other hand, was trading for less than a dollar on the NYSE. They had little on hand cash, phone sales of Treos had tanked, and they were in danger of going under. They had to hit a certain target date to infuse the company with cash, without the engineering resources of Apple to get the job done. The phone had to go out in June, warts and all, or the company would go under. They have now bought enough time to keep the company afloat, they have cash on hand from Elevation and because their stock is trading in the high teens, so that they can perfect WebOS, fix any mistakes made with the Pre, and make a HUGE splash with either the Pixi, or most likely whatever follows the Pixi.
  8. #8  
    Quote Originally Posted by d.moss View Post
    i really love my pre and i know webos has great potential. but what is potential if not utilized quick enough before it is surpassed. i just feel like palm is moving too slow. we like to say "well its only been out 5 months." but its not like it wasn't being developed years before. with android evolving very rapidly and its integration of social networking, what's keeping palm special in your eyes?
    The killer Pre app for me would be Classic now it has hotsync support. That is, if Palm's exclusive carrier policy didn't prevent me from buying a Pre in the first place.
  9. #9  
    I am liking the themes that I have to try to keep Pre useres happy, but Have to give the break up word to Palm if things dont work out between Pre and I .... (tear) lol >... I will just have to move on to someone better, you just didnt please me the right ways, you did for the first few months..... Its not you its me....
  10. d.moss's Avatar
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       #10  
    i understand the cash situation, but there are minor things that need to be fixed that don't take a lotta cash. the workarounds are not 100 proof but look at how quicly webos-internals is moving. plus, all three updates we have seen to webos could have been put into one. they also need to get with sprint and do better on advertising the features.. or shall i say that singular, "the feature," which is intuative navigation. otherwise i see palm getting washed away by the wave of next gen devices. i truly want to believe in palm but as a consumer i know i'm not the only one who feels this way. right now, not 8 months ago when i was watching every pre video in anticipation and android wasn't blossoming, when i look at the pre and its features in comparison to other devices, i would not choose the pre. especially with the poor advertising. that's not good for palm. the only thing i can say about my device is that its fun to use.. but as far as functionality, anything i do with my pre i could have done with the htc pro and also the treo pro. palm needs to get a bank loan or SOMETHING lol.. because really.. people are gonna start overlooking them.. and that's definitely not gonna bring in the cash. they need to hire the webos-internals staff or something.. maybe that'll speed up the process. we live in a time where speed is the key.. we love everything fast. if you're not fast enough, or at least appear to be fast enough, you're gonna get left behind. palm, unless the next update is major or unless by quarter one someone is looking to buy them out, is gonna get left in the dust.. i have faith though.. the next update will be MAJOR (i hope lol)
  11. #11  
    Quote Originally Posted by d.moss View Post
    i understand the cash situation, but there are minor things that need to be fixed that don't take a lotta cash. the workarounds are not 100 proof but look at how quicly webos-internals is moving. plus, all three updates we have seen to webos could have been put into one. they also need to get with sprint and do better on advertising the features.. or shall i say that singular, "the feature," which is intuative navigation. otherwise i see palm getting washed away by the wave of next gen devices. i truly want to believe in palm but as a consumer i know i'm not the only one who feels this way. right now, not 8 months ago when i was watching every pre video in anticipation and android wasn't blossoming, when i look at the pre and its features in comparison to other devices, i would not choose the pre. especially with the poor advertising. that's not good for palm. the only thing i can say about my device is that its fun to use.. but as far as functionality, anything i do with my pre i could have done with the htc pro and also the treo pro. palm needs to get a bank loan or SOMETHING lol.. because really.. people are gonna start overlooking them.. and that's definitely not gonna bring in the cash. they need to hire the webos-internals staff or something.. maybe that'll speed up the process. we live in a time where speed is the key.. we love everything fast. if you're not fast enough, or at least appear to be fast enough, you're gonna get left behind. palm, unless the next update is major or unless by quarter one someone is looking to buy them out, is gonna get left in the dust.. i have faith though.. the next update will be MAJOR (i hope lol)
    People have been overlooking the Palm pre time and time again... word gets around fast these days and you really want to make a good impression
  12. Change's Avatar
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    #12  
    Coming from the land of software, I can say speed isn't a development teams friend. Alpha, beta, and go live all require hardcore testing and feedback loops before you can move forward. The problem from a development standpoint (and this is true for all software companies) is they can't launch a buggy product without repricussions. Palm is trying to avoid that, but balance their updates with the needs of the users.

    Clearly they know they rushed it to market. They won't continue to rush out shotty updates now that they have a cash infusion. They're taking their time to get it right, and I can respect that. Do I like the lacking features and functionality? Of course not... but that's why we have the WebOS Internals team here.

    Considering the street date for the Pixi is approaching, I would expect a major OS update before then. Palm will ship the Pixi in a 1.3 mode which will fix a lot of the major functionality issues with the current OS. I'd expect to see that update 10 days or so prior to the Pixi launch (retail).

    If Palm doesn't do so... they're going to have a largely irate user base.
  13. d.moss's Avatar
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       #13  
    with all that i've said, i have to once again clarify that i love the fact that palm is thinking outside the box with its linux core and javascript/css/html programming. i do believe it creates ease of manipulation and attracts the mass of people who already know these languages.. but with the sdk being so limited and palm moving like a snail in comparison to other.. its gonna be hard for people to wanna stick around.. once again, aside from the negatives, i love playing with my pre and watching this 1.0 device mature. and that's what's keeping it special to me. i love when a company tries to break the norm. but call me impatient if you like.. i just wish they'd find a way to spped the process up a bit. heck i even heard someone say put out a small update with one or two quirks worked out every two weeks and advertise its rapid advancements. which really wouldn't be rapid advancements.. but its not the truth that matters so much as does the perception of the truth.. if you don't wanna keep updating every two weeks.. wait a month and then update.. something pleeeeeease
  14. d.moss's Avatar
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       #14  
    Quote Originally Posted by jblake1030 View Post
    I am liking the themes that I have to try to keep Pre useres happy, but Have to give the break up word to Palm if things dont work out between Pre and I .... (tear) lol >... I will just have to move on to someone better, you just didnt please me the right ways, you did for the first few months..... Its not you its me....
    lol.. you're not the only one who's saddened by this inevitable break up that seems to be coming..
  15. #15  
    Nothing for me, and thats why my Pre is currently packed, and waiting for a Tour as a trade. I love the WebOS, but I hate the way Palm rolls at a snail's pace.
    Last edited by He123321; 10/21/2009 at 10:06 PM.


  16. d.moss's Avatar
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       #16  
    sorry to hear that.. wish palm could convince you to stay a little longer.. but not at this rate.. huh..
  17. #17  
    Quote Originally Posted by d.moss View Post
    i really love my pre and i know webos has great potential. but what is potential if not utilized quick enough before it is surpassed. i just feel like palm is moving too slow. we like to say "well its only been out 5 months." but its not like it wasn't being developed years before. with android evolving very rapidly and its integration of social networking, what's keeping palm special in your eyes?
    When I upgraded to my Pre, I was moving from an Android phone, the T-Mobile G1. So I can compare webOS and Android side by side. My G1 has always been painfully slow and it took almost a year for Google to update it to the point where it's only somewhat slower than my Pre. You can say, "look at how fast Android is moving!" But in point of fact, Android had a rather large head start (at least a year) on webOS and has been evolving at a steady and growing but hardly breakneck pace.

    Just compare the Pre's update schedule to that of my G1. It got a minor update after about three months and the big "Cupcake" update was delayed by T-Mobile for months. For a time, it was actually rumored that the "Donut" update might not come to the G1 at all. Fortunately, it did finally come and it made my G1 a new lease on life. Meanwhile, webOS has been having monthly updates which while not as dramatic as Android's have been correcting issues and adding features at a faster pace.

    Yes Android has more apps but it has had more time to cultivate a developer community. Android took six months to add paid apps to their catalog, webOS did it in three. Android took six months to turn on copy and paste in their browser, webOS did it in three. Until recently rooting an Android phone was a difficult and dangerous process. For the webOS powered Pre, root access is barely even an issue. Hardcore nerds can do it relatively easily but most people can get just use the Konami code to enable developer mode once or twice and suddenly the Pre is wide open for hacking. Tethering on a Pre for example is far easier than it is on the G1.

    The bottom line is that Android had a head start against webOS and is making the best of that head start. But webOS is hardly standing still and is making a good race of it. In some ways they are behind. In some ways they are ahead. I don't know who'll win the race but I for one am enjoying the ride....
  18. #18  
    shockingly if you would have posted this thread 2 months ago you would have been bashed by an army of fan boys, but now evrybody is just about agrees that palm has drug this out too long. I am insulted to find that in their tight money situation that they have been working on designing new phones and not the os. The app store is a joke and the lack of user controls is a joke. I do not want every body to hear when I dial a number etc. The little stuff shoulda been fixed in the first update. As far as updates go functionality over quantity 4 updates that all could've been rolled into 1. It does not matter about web os future if the consumers have all moved on by then
  19. #19  
    oh and to answer the question the only thing keeping the pre special to me right now is that I am not eligible for an upgrade until mid feb. so if palm is not up to speed by then goodbye palm hope all works well for you but I will not be back no matter how awesome your os is in 5 years your bridge with me is burnt, phone should've been half the price if it was not a compete phone.
  20. jewel's Avatar
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    #20  
    I like the Palm Pre the way it is now. I like the card thingy. I enjoy surfing the net with it. I like its email app. I like the quality of the pics taken from its camera app. I like the way it integrates with Google calendar and contacts. I like viewing Facebook with it. I like the uncluttered user interface wherein I can put my favorite picture up. I like the way the screen fools me that it doesn't have edges. I like the way it looks when it is turned off and even better when it is turned on. I like the gesture area and how intuitive the gestures are. I like synergy too.

    I knew that this baby is going to be like this even before it was released because, just like many of you, I read articles about it. And I made a decision to buy it based on what I have read and seen on preliminary reviews.

    If you don't like the Pre then get a Droid or an iPhone or a WinMo or a Symbian phone. Then complain on their forums on why they do not have multitask or a gesture area or synergy... well, you get the drift.
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