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To the people complaining about software
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Old 07/05/2009, 06:00 PM   #1 (permalink)
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A lot of people out there like to complain. If their steak is a little too tough, or not tough enough, they have to make a stink. Nothing, though, compares to people who complain about electronics. The thing is, most people wouldn't complain if they used some logic, as opposed to just tossing it out the window.

The Pre has just arrived, and certainly there are some issues. The battery life takes some getting used to (but is totally comparable to the IPhone 3G and 3GS). There are some build issues, some dead pixels, and some light bleeding, but that has happened with every smart phone since the dawn of time. These are all legitimate issues that should make you uncomfortable, or demand repair, but if you took the time to think, or research, you'd know these are known issues, especially with a brand new 1.0 device, and you should expect them when getting on board (I know I did).

The thing that bothers me, is when it comes to software. The Palm Pre, for all intents and purposes, offers just as many features, if not more, than most smart phones available today. Are there some missing, relatively basic features? Absolutely, but they will come. What people need to realize, is, software is an incredibly difficult beast to tackle, and do you know what happens when your device is rife with issues? Your product fails, and you crash and burn. This is something that Palm CAN NOT afford to do at this point in the game. They need to release a device that works, that is stable, and then add the features after the fact.

This is totally illustrated by the features that people are finding, that need a special code to be entered in order to activate. These features are there, just not active, because they obviously still have bugs. "Where is my on screen keyboard!" many exclaim. It's there, it just obviously has issues, and they'd rather not have you use a buggy piece of software, because then you'll end up being even more upset than if it wasn't there in the first place.

People throw their arms in the air about the app store. Guess what, third party apps can destroy your device, and building an infrastructure to support said third party apps is a tremendous undertaking. Would you rather they have an app store that works, for the foreseeable future, or one that constantly crashes, and apps that don't work or break your device.

Slow and steady wins the race is something all these complainers need to hear, on a daily basis, until they are satisfied. I'd much rather have the Palm Pre I have today, than the Blackberry Storm when it launched. All of the things that you want will come, Palm is just not going to sacrifice its good name because you want what you want when you want it, no ifs ands or buts.

If you stepped back and thought about these things before you swooped into the store on launch day, bought the device, and then spent the next month complaining that it wasn't what you wanted, we wouldn't have this issue, would we? There are plenty of very happy Pre owners out there, and from my own personal experience, I have shown the device to quite a few tech heads, and they all have fallen in love at first site, EVEN with its known flaws.
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Old 07/05/2009, 06:09 PM   #2 (permalink)
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This isnt palms first rodeo. The Pre is a step backwards in many ways and small steps forward in others. No reason for palm, with all their collective experience to release the Pre in the condition the OS is in. Sure it is useable and works for the most part but the only reason it has been released like this is because they had to.

There is no reason performance in just about every app is subpar to a device with almost identical innards. Sure we get a keyboard and slightly more multitasking for now but that doesn't excuse palm. Also keep in mind that in the pst Palm HAS NOT been that good at updating their OS. In fact they left much of the improvements to third party software which made the devices useable.

So don't expect Palm to suddenly start adding all kinds of features my guess they will be next to none and they are trying to get the SDK out so users can fix their software.
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Old 07/05/2009, 06:13 PM   #3 (permalink)
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This isnt palms first rodeo. The Pre is a step backwards in many ways and small steps forward in others. No reason for palm, with all their collective experience to release the Pre in the condition the OS is in. Sure it is useable and works for the most part but the only reason it has been released like this is because they had to.

There is no reason performance in just about every app is subpar to a device with almost identical innards. Sure we get a keyboard and slightly more multitasking for now but that doesn't excuse palm. Also keep in mind that in the pst Palm HAS NOT been that good at updating their OS. In fact they left much of the improvements to third party software which made the devices useable.

So don't expect Palm to suddenly start adding all kinds of features my guess they will be next to none and they are trying to get the SDK out so users can fix their software.
Cannot for the life of me figure out WHY you would purchase a device from a company you so very obviously loathe and expect so little from. But your little iJaculations are at least amusing.
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Old 07/05/2009, 06:27 PM   #4 (permalink)
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This isnt palms first rodeo. The Pre is a step backwards in many ways and small steps forward in others. No reason for palm, with all their collective experience to release the Pre in the condition the OS is in. Sure it is useable and works for the most part but the only reason it has been released like this is because they had to.

There is no reason performance in just about every app is subpar to a device with almost identical innards. Sure we get a keyboard and slightly more multitasking for now but that doesn't excuse palm. Also keep in mind that in the pst Palm HAS NOT been that good at updating their OS. In fact they left much of the improvements to third party software which made the devices useable.

So don't expect Palm to suddenly start adding all kinds of features my guess they will be next to none and they are trying to get the SDK out so users can fix their software.
There is a reason for it. WebOS is a brand new operating system, that they build from scratch. Even if you write an OS yourself, you still don't know exactly how it is going to perform unless it gets into the wild: see Microsoft Windows. How many iterations has Microsoft released of Windows, and look at how horrible Vista is. Do you think Palm, a company that is trying to re-establish itself as a brand, wants to release a bug ridden OS, where it needs to debug dozens of features in order to find out what is causing issues? Doesn't it make more sense to start from bare bones, make sure it works, then add as it comes along?

It isn't rocket science, and you show your obvious bias against Palm in your post. If you are comparing this phone to the IPhone, you fail to admit that the IPhone is in its current state, because Apple has had years and years to develop it to this point. When the IPhone first came out, it looked a lot like the Pre does.

I would love to bet you that come the end of the summer, the Palm Pre will look a lot different than it does right now. I don't have much faith, though, that you would honor the bet.
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Old 07/05/2009, 06:30 PM   #5 (permalink)
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Well, I'm with you guys who think the WebOS. I think it's absolutely brilliant and will kill and does kill anything out there on the market. It will only get better...
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Old 07/05/2009, 06:31 PM   #6 (permalink)
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Cannot for the life of me figure out WHY you would purchase a device from a company you so very obviously loathe and expect so little from. But your little iJaculations are at least amusing.
Despite the issues the Pre is still a good device and as a iphone user for 2 years I'm looking for something different. I have a lot of experience with Palm from the 600 to the 650 to the WX so I speak with experience.

I also don't let the negatives of my device or people discussing them on forums affect my epeen or my happiness with the device. Some here can't do that.

Also since before release I have tempered my expectations and since the Pre has not really surpassed expectations of many I'm glad I did. Now that release is here and people are a little hung over on the Pre its better to expect little from Palm and expect that third parties will fix MOST of the device's issues. That way if Palm over delivers great. If they don't they chances are they will meet diminshed expectations.

Fact of the matter is we don't know because palm hasn't said a damn thing and probably never will.

So take the ijaculation talk and gargle with it.
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Old 07/05/2009, 06:51 PM   #7 (permalink)
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Despite the issues the Pre is still a good device and as a iphone user for 2 years I'm looking for something different. I have a lot of experience with Palm from the 600 to the 650 to the WX so I speak with experience.

I also don't let the negatives of my device or people discussing them on forums affect my epeen or my happiness with the device. Some here can't do that.

Also since before release I have tempered my expectations and since the Pre has not really surpassed expectations of many I'm glad I did. Now that release is here and people are a little hung over on the Pre its better to expect little from Palm and expect that third parties will fix MOST of the device's issues. That way if Palm over delivers great. If they don't they chances are they will meet diminshed expectations.

Fact of the matter is we don't know because palm hasn't said a damn thing and probably never will.

So take the ijaculation talk and gargle with it.
You know... and I don't mean this as a criticism... but you seem really obsessed with the "epeen" in all of its affectations. By the iGods, I think this is like the umpteenth (negative) post wherein you have pointed either to your own or another's "epeen." Sounds as though you've already been gargling with your own iJaculation. My epeen, for the record, is fine and in perfect working order
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Old 07/05/2009, 07:16 PM   #8 (permalink)
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... its better to expect little from Palm and expect that third parties will fix MOST of the device's issues. That way if Palm over delivers great. If they don't they chances are they will meet diminshed expectations.
Aridon, Palm can't remain the "old Palm" and succeed. They know that. So they need to do things like software updates in an agile way. They're starting smart with the Pre by issuing a flashy but barebones (compared to expectations) device. Better to succeed with the basics and then roll in additional functionality once the base is solid.

My expectations of Palm is that they release functional software that meets the needs of most, and to incrementally open up the API until it has been proven. I'm torn between "managing" developers and just letting them experiment (in open-source fashion). I'm glad to have a rooted Pre where I believe I can personally choose to have the best of both worlds. This is much different than any PalmOS device, so I have to say that the world has changed enough that we should expect Palm to behave differently than in the past.
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Old 07/05/2009, 07:27 PM   #9 (permalink)
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...
The thing that bothers me, is when it comes to software. The Palm Pre, for all intents and purposes, offers just as many features, if not more, than most smart phones available today.
...
What color is the sky where you live? It's blue here on Earth.
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Old 07/05/2009, 07:42 PM   #10 (permalink)
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A lot of people out there like to complain...
The only person I see is you complaining about "complainers". Most of the negative criticism I have seen is just that: What the company didn't get right.

The App Store was a big one. Compare Sprint/Palms handling this versus Google/T-Mobile: Google/T-Mobile were clear before the release of the G1 that the App store was still going to be Beta. Sprint/Palm couldn't even release the SDK on time and when they do, the App Store will still be in Beta.

Manufacture problems from a company that has produced hardware for years at the scale they are seeing is inexcusable. And there was analysis I posted in a different thread that predicted such problems that turned out to be true by doing the business analysis.

So, I don't expect professional reviews from the folks who publish there woe's to a forum such as this.

Please, refrain from telling the community how to behave.
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Old 07/05/2009, 07:44 PM   #11 (permalink)
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There is a reason for it. WebOS is a brand new operating system, that they build from scratch.
Err, this has been covered else where. It is not a brand new OS.
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Old 07/05/2009, 07:48 PM   #12 (permalink)
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What color is the sky where you live? It's blue here on Earth.

+100 clipcarl Hilarious!!!!
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Old 07/05/2009, 07:58 PM   #13 (permalink)
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Err, this has been covered else where. It is not a brand new OS.
WebOS was first shown at CES in January. How is that not new?

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The only person I see is you complaining about "complainers". Most of the negative criticism I have seen is just that: What the company didn't get right.

The App Store was a big one. Compare Sprint/Palms handling this versus Google/T-Mobile: Google/T-Mobile were clear before the release of the G1 that the App store was still going to be Beta. Sprint/Palm couldn't even release the SDK on time and when they do, the App Store will still be in Beta.

Manufacture problems from a company that has produced hardware for years at the scale they are seeing is inexcusable. And there was analysis I posted in a different thread that predicted such problems that turned out to be true by doing the business analysis.

So, I don't expect professional reviews from the folks who publish there woe's to a forum such as this.

Please, refrain from telling the community how to behave.
I must live in a different reality than you. Most complaints about the Pre are utterly ridiculous, asinine complaints. I clearly state that there is nothing wrong with complaining about legitimate issues, such as a lack of a reasonable feature, but most complaints I see are illogical or unreasonable.

I don't understand your second paragraph; Google said the app store would be in beta, and then when Palm releases the Pre, and the app store is in beta, there's something wrong? Not the best example to use there, as it's utterly redundant and confusing.

Manufacture problems from a company that has made hardware in the past? First of all, Palm doesn't manufacture the Pre, I believe a company like Foxcon does. Second of all, every hardware device in history has had some level of hardware failure, does that mean that every single electronic company is flawed, and thus deserves our wrath?

I'm not telling anyone how to act, people are free to do what they want, I'm trying to give people some perspective.

And just to reitterate, what people seem to want is the most feature rich device out there, with no flaws, which is utterly unreasonable. Do you remember the Blackberry Storm, and how well that did, with all its flaws? Look at what it did for that device. If Blackberry didn't have all its other great devices to support it, what do you think it would have done to the company? If you apply the same situation to Palm, if the Pre launched, and was a Blackberry Storm, the company would be ruined. It doesn't have 5 other devices it keep it afloat, the Pre is it.
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Old 07/05/2009, 08:25 PM   #14 (permalink)
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I have two friends, one has the iPhone 3G & the other just got the iPhone 3G s. I was with them for 5 days on vacation. They could not get over the the Pre. they loved it although apps open slower than the 3G s. they are thinking the Pre is the phone they should have purchased. They had 5 days to use & compare. So with some time the Pre will be the premium cell phone out there. These guys think it already is.
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Old 07/05/2009, 08:36 PM   #15 (permalink)
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You know, people's complaints are pretty much what the company needs to progress successfully. If nobody complained, then they will not be able to fix things or add new features. I welcome the complaints so Palm can do something about it, for it also puts a level of priority. People are complaining about lack of Apps, Palm then replied to that complaint and opened their doors to more developers and (from what I'm seeing) not attacking those who leaked the SDK.

So some people might be tired of the complaints, but this is fuel for Palm to make their stuff better then other competitors.
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Old 07/05/2009, 08:44 PM   #16 (permalink)
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My take on why people complain.
First I am a happy Pre owner. I have never owned an Iphone, though I think it is a nice piece of equipment. I am not an Apple fanboi.

Lets look at the cell phone industry as a whole. Lets face it 6 months after a cell phone is released all software upgrades stop and basically the cell phone companies move on to the next new phone. Anyone who purchased one has to live with that phone for 2 years. Apple is not like this. They are still supporting the first Iphone that was released. I think people feel that the pre will be no different. Take the Samsung Instinct. I purchased it when it was first released. It was supposed to be the Iphone killer. Well, I have not seen any new updates in the last six months. All of the promise of that phone never came about.

Apple has the right idea. I can see why people are so loyal to there Apple products. What other cell phone that is 2 years old still receives software upgrades. NONE, except Apple.

I hope Palm and Sprint continue to support the Pre because Its a great phone. I don't see that happening. In 6 months there will be a newer version of the Pre and the existing Pre will go the way of all other cell phones. I think Palm will continue to support the WebOS, but as far as software upgrades for the Pre, I would not expect anything past 6 months.
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Old 07/05/2009, 10:26 PM   #17 (permalink)
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You know, people's complaints are pretty much what the company needs to progress successfully. If nobody complained, then they will not be able to fix things or add new features. I welcome the complaints so Palm can do something about it, for it also puts a level of priority. People are complaining about lack of Apps, Palm then replied to that complaint and opened their doors to more developers and (from what I'm seeing) not attacking those who leaked the SDK.

So some people might be tired of the complaints, but this is fuel for Palm to make their stuff better then other competitors.
Who here said that people shouldn't complain?
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Old 07/06/2009, 06:26 AM   #18 (permalink)
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A lot of people out there like to complain....These are all legitimate issues that should make you uncomfortable, or demand repair, but if you took the time to think, or research, you'd know these are known issues, especially with a brand new 1.0 device, and you should expect them when getting on board (I know I did).....
That's the problem. If these phone companies are "allowed" by the public to put out a phone with the OS lacking some very fundamental features, the next time it will be even worse.

Come on, a "next generation" "smart phone" that you can't even customize the text message notification sound?

Just about every other phone out there has Voice recording, not the Pre.
Then we have basic things like a notification LED.

One of Palm's slogans is "...a phone so in sync with your life it feels like it's thinking ahead for you."

Overall I love my Pre. I have no hardware issues now that I'm on my 2nd phone.

As a developer, I know how there are just certain things you "have" to have when you put out software. I also know how easy some of the things would be to incorporate.
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