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  1. #281  
    Hi, I love the new HD TP app!

    I'm not sure where to send bug reports. So I'm here.

    The version says 0.0.5 - I just noticed that when I'm playing a song it is impossible to open the HP app catalog, Software manager, or Preware. They all hang until the app is closed. I tried a couple of times with the same result. (The wheel keeps turning. . .)

    Also, the music stops when the screen turns off and Audiophile HD needs to be restarted.

    It's a great program and I'm looking forward to the pro version!
  2. #282  
    great to hear. thanks for your work!
  3.    #283  
    Kayphoonstar:

    I just read about the screen lock issue on another post; I will see what I can do about that. My test bed is typically plugged into the USB and does not enter lock mode, so I have not experienced that issue yet.

    As for the not being able to open apps, I am surprised. I have been able to open up the music player and play two songs at once. I have noticed the app store is pretty bad at resource usage. I will look into it more tonight.
  4. #284  
    I downloaded Audiophile HD for the Touchpad when it was released. I just did some audio comparisons today with the built in music app and I found the audio quality of Audiophile HD a bit lacking. I played a the same wav file in Audiophile HD and in the builtin music player app through a pair of good quality headphones. The wav was a brand new rip from a CD with EAC.

    The output from Audiophile HD sounds too processed. It has a slight metallic twinge to it, a little like when you over compress an mp3.

    It's really cool that it can play so many different formats, but for an app named Audiophile it really needs to improve it's audio quality.
    --------------------
    Apps for webOS
    http://www.angrygoatapps.com
    Twitter: angrygoatapps
    phil71 and petyy like this.
  5.    #285  
    Wayne,

    The original Audiophile for the Pre really did increase the Sound Quality significantly over the stock player. Now that the TouchPad has gone the beats route, its harder to maintain parity and still provide all the functionality.

    Having said that, it will also depend on the Song you are playing. Generally the stock should have better bass response since they can have hardware IIR filters and it is hard to get a good filter for the lower frequencies. Audiophile should be about the same for higher frequency stuff.

    Also, Audiophile is not really meant to be compared to the stock player at the bass settings. The idea is to adjust the bass and treble to smooth out the frequency response of your headphones.

    Finally, if you are playing a format with a different sample rate than 44,100 Audiophile will sound better since I use a more sophisticated resampling algorithm than you will find on the stock.

    So I agree with you in principle, but the situation is a bit more complicated than you may think.

    Also, why did you use a Wav and not FLAC?
    phil71 likes this.
  6. #286  
    Quote Originally Posted by nyuepik View Post
    Wayne,

    The original Audiophile for the Pre really did increase the Sound Quality significantly over the stock player. Now that the TouchPad has gone the beats route, its harder to maintain parity and still provide all the functionality.

    Having said that, it will also depend on the Song you are playing. Generally the stock should have better bass response since they can have hardware IIR filters and it is hard to get a good filter for the lower frequencies. Audiophile should be about the same for higher frequency stuff.

    Also, Audiophile is not really meant to be compared to the stock player at the bass settings. The idea is to adjust the bass and treble to smooth out the frequency response of your headphones.

    Finally, if you are playing a format with a different sample rate than 44,100 Audiophile will sound better since I use a more sophisticated resampling algorithm than you will find on the stock.

    So I agree with you in principle, but the situation is a bit more complicated than you may think.

    Also, why did you use a Wav and not FLAC?
    Actually I don't have audiophile for the phone. My main problem with audiophile HD is not the bass response, it's the fact that voices sound artificial and processed. You can hear audio subtle artifacts in voices. It's similar in nature to when audio is too compressed, but obviously not to the same degree.

    I used wav because the builtin player does not play flac.

    Have you thought of adding an setting to audiophile to bypass all filtering?
    --------------------
    Apps for webOS
    http://www.angrygoatapps.com
    Twitter: angrygoatapps
  7.    #287  
    I am gonna set it up to bypass the resample filter when the music is not being scaled, which should help somewhat. I am also going to try cascading my low pass and high pass filters to get a better roll off.

    My concern with bypassing the filters completely is the transition is too jarring when they get turned on.
  8.    #288  
    Just tried out the new filter changes and the that tin quality went away. So definitely better. Gonna see if I can fiddle with the resample filter to add that back in, but you were completely right. I realized I was cutting out frequecies around 300hz and around 5000hz. The 300 was probably what made things sound compressed since that tends to be toward the higher point of normal human voice.

    Edit: And apparently I was suppressing the volume by half. This is the problem with trying to maintain two code bases.
    Last edited by nyuepik; 07/08/2011 at 08:01 PM.
  9. #289  
    Great to hear you found the problem. I look forward to an update.

    I'm surprised no one else heard the problem before. BTW, did this problem affect the phone version too?
    --------------------
    Apps for webOS
    http://www.angrygoatapps.com
    Twitter: angrygoatapps
  10.    #290  
    Wayne, if you don't mind testing, let me know what you think of the sound on this one:

    Edit: link removed

    And yeah, it did affect the phone version, its just that the Pre sound sucked so bad that even my buggy code sounded better

    Edit: Also, you can play both the stock player and Audiophile at the same time to hear the difference. I detect slightly more depth around what is probably 50hz on the Stock player. My guess is that relates to where the roll-offs are for our respective low pass filters, but otherwise they sound the same to me. Although, I may be able to hear a greater difference using uncompressed audio. However, since my only lossless stuff is FLAC, I can't really compare.
    Last edited by nyuepik; 07/09/2011 at 08:29 AM.
  11. #291  
    I tested the new build, and the tin-iness is still there. It's subtle but it's there. Try a listening to a quieter track with just a single voice. I'm testing it with a female vocal jazz track.
    --------------------
    Apps for webOS
    http://www.angrygoatapps.com
    Twitter: angrygoatapps
  12.    #292  
    Yeah, I see what you mean. Ok, I will try another idea.
  13.    #293  
    Seems its not the filtering, but rather an artifact of the software decoding. Without a floating point unit you have to decode everything using Fixed-point math, and it that is causing some rounding.

    I have it to the point where it is almost gone, and I might be able to correct it a bit more.

    Let me know what you think of this version:

    http://dl.dropbox.com/u/8094086/com...._0.0.6_all.ipk
  14. #294  
    Quote Originally Posted by nyuepik View Post
    Seems its not the filtering, but rather an artifact of the software decoding. Without a floating point unit you have to decode everything using Fixed-point math, and it that is causing some rounding.

    I have it to the point where it is almost gone, and I might be able to correct it a bit more.

    Let me know what you think of this version:

    http://dl.dropbox.com/u/8094086/com...._0.0.6_all.ipk
    Why do you need to use fixed point? The ARM chips in the pre's had a floating point unit, I'm sure the one in the Touchpad must have one too.
    --------------------
    Apps for webOS
    http://www.angrygoatapps.com
    Twitter: angrygoatapps
  15. #295  
    Quote Originally Posted by nyuepik View Post
    Seems its not the filtering, but rather an artifact of the software decoding. Without a floating point unit you have to decode everything using Fixed-point math, and it that is causing some rounding.

    I have it to the point where it is almost gone, and I might be able to correct it a bit more.

    Let me know what you think of this version:

    http://dl.dropbox.com/u/8094086/com...._0.0.6_all.ipk
    Much better, in fact I don't hear the problem anymore, at least not on the track I was testing with. I'll try some more tracks.

    BTW, it is me or did the volume increase too?
    --------------------
    Apps for webOS
    http://www.angrygoatapps.com
    Twitter: angrygoatapps
  16.    #296  
    Wayne,

    Arm units don't have floating point on the CPU, only the GPU. Palm, in their infinite wisdom, didn't bother to provide access to the GPU the way Apple has done. As a result, I am completely shut out of the FPU for doing my audio processing. In some ways, that is actually not a bad thing, a really good Fixed Point IIR filter will kick a floating point filter 10 ways to Sunday, but fixed point implementations only ever come in awful, or really good, so you really can't get away with lazy code.

    Arm does have NEON, which is fake floating point, but it is not as fast as a good customized fixed point implementation.

    I compiled the newest version of FFmpeg available and that helped significantly. They seem to be replacing the various fixed point stuff with optimized NEON stuff, and it is paying off.

    After I updated FFmpeg, I set up a filter to boost the lower voice frequency (about 80hz to 140hz or so) and cut the frequencies above 560hz by a step. (The irony of using a filter to make something sound less filtered is not lost on me)

    After all the effort, I think it sounds amazing. Not better than Stock, but not worse either. Just different. I think beats has a more open sound, while Audiophile now has a more intimate sound.

    Anyway, here is the updated link if you want to try it:

    http://dl.dropbox.com/u/8094086/com...._0.0.6_all.ipk

    Thanks again for pointing out the problem. I got so used to everyone using the phone version sounding how great it sounded that I didn't bother to double check the code.

    Also the Volume did get louder, one of the bugs that I fixed had me rescalling the final value for the main filter one too many bits. No the volume is on parity with the stock player, and can be boosted beyond it.

    I will probably have an update up on the market by mid week.
  17. #297  
    Quote Originally Posted by nyuepik View Post
    Wayne,

    Arm units don't have floating point on the CPU, only the GPU. Palm, in their infinite wisdom, didn't bother to provide access to the GPU the way Apple has done. As a result, I am completely shut out of the FPU for doing my audio processing. In some ways, that is actually not a bad thing, a really good Fixed Point IIR filter will kick a floating point filter 10 ways to Sunday, but fixed point implementations only ever come in awful, or really good, so you really can't get away with lazy code.
    I did little research on fpu and ARM a little while ago and thought I remembered reading that a floating point unit was an option on the OMAP chips, not just neon. I remember comparing some model numbers from a TI spec sheet to the cpu the Pre's used and concluded that the pre had an fpu, but I may have read it wrong. Of course it doesn't really apply to the Touchpad anyway, since the Snapdragon's are a completely different design.

    Anyhow I tested a few more tracks and it sounds good. No artifacts that I could hear and the bass definitely seems stronger. Not as strong as the stock player's, but also not as boomy which I actually prefer.

    Also I noticed a couple of bugs in the interface:
    - If you add a single track to the playlist and then immediately press the reordering arrow, the drag object that appears won't disappear when you let go.
    - in the folder browser, the '..' folder for going up a directory doesn't work.
    - some tracks are double listed. Only seems to be mp3's

    Finally, one suggestion and one question. Have you thought of adding a text based filter to the tracks browser? Is there a way to add a single track to the playlist?

    I'm glad I was able to help you improve your app
    --------------------
    Apps for webOS
    http://www.angrygoatapps.com
    Twitter: angrygoatapps
  18. #298  
    One other thing, you mention that Audiophile HD resamples higher sample rates to 44100. What sample rates and bit depths does it support? I tried a 24/96 flac and it didn't work.
    --------------------
    Apps for webOS
    http://www.angrygoatapps.com
    Twitter: angrygoatapps
  19.    #299  
    It should have worked with the 24/96 flac. I guess I forgot to add a check to tell FFmpeg to convert the bit depth. I will work on tracking that down.

    Also thanks for the other bug reports.

    As for the tracks browser, I have the search option already, which does what you are describing, but it would probably make sense to add it to Tracks as well.

    Eventually we plan to add a drag to add to playlist option and remove the buttons, which I think disturb the aesthetics of everything. However, we were under the gun, so a number of features had to be cut.
  20. #300  
    This thread is quite long, so forgive me if this question is buried in here somewhere. Is there a shuffle play option?

    Very nice app.

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