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  1. #61  
    Quote Originally Posted by Rkguy View Post
    You know what I'd like my phone to do?
    emails, sms, phone calls, VVM, record video, navigation but EVEN DUMB or Feature PHONES can do these tasks.

    I want my SMARTphone to... (yada yada)
    i'm not sure i'm misquoting you. It seems your quote suggests that the pre is little more than a dumbphone and less than a smartphone. I'm just saying that the last time I checked, smartphone phones were primarily characterized by the manner in which they enhance mobile communications, not by whether or not you can use them to turn off the lights in your house. Sure those things you mentioned are neat and even useful, for some people, but they shouldn't be the standard by which we measure the offerings of a phone. WebOS has plenty of useful apps, but having some of the novelty apps you mentioned would be nice as well.

    as far as voice api s I guess I should have said mic api s. There's no reason I shouldn't be able to leave voice memos or use voice commands.

    Also I should be able to edit documents while on the move.

    I feel like a digital compass is a must in the new hardware, but i'm more interested in how they can improve the location services with augmented reality than I am star gazing. I should add these apps should be given access to the camera.

    also, video conferencing is a must.

    it seems that most of my 'voids' have more to do with existing api's than they do with lack of developer interest. No doubt all of these things will come into existence IMMEDIATELY after palm makes it possible at the OS level.
    Last edited by Mhunterjr; 09/27/2010 at 02:36 PM.
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       #62  
    Thank you for bringing that up. you are right. I do agree that the most necessary component of any smartphone is connectivity.

    I think also that the iphone changed the game. A smartphone used to be only about enhancing mobile communications. I think the definition of a smartphone is currently being redefined by the types of apps and functions it can therby support.
    ...This programming stuff is actually addictive but really hard :/
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       #63  
    From wikipedia

    A smartphone is a mobile phone that offers more advanced computing ability and connectivity than a contemporary basic 'feature phone'. Smartphones and feature phones may be thought of as handheld computers integrated within a mobile telephone, but while most feature phones are able to run applications based on platforms such as Java ME, a smartphone allows the user to install and run more advanced applications based on a specific platform. Smartphones run complete operating system software providing a platform for application developers.

    So while in large part this supports your definition, I think there is some validity to my claim.
    ...This programming stuff is actually addictive but really hard :/
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       #64  
    Quote Originally Posted by hrminer92 View Post
    This could be an opportunity for someone who wants to spend $30 for their SDK documentation

    PLX Devices Inc. - Kiwi Wifi Software Development Kit
    WebOS does not and will not support ad-hoc WiFi for the forseeable future according to Palm online dev forums.

    OK, I'm sorry to report this, but based on the engineering documents I've seen, ad-hoc WiFI is explicitly NOT supported on webOS....No, it doesn't look like this will change in the next big version.



    PLX Kiwi works w/ ad-hoc wifi *but the BT plx device doesn't, however it's more expensive than one's you'd find on ebay. Maybe the resutling code would be cross compatible with other ELM OBD devices however.
    ...This programming stuff is actually addictive but really hard :/
  5. #65  
    Quote Originally Posted by Rkguy View Post
    while in large part this supports your definition, I think there is some validity to my claim.
    Agreed. If Palm wants to succeed in this space, being a smartphone isn't enough anymore. Honestly, I feel like WebOS is the 'smartest' operating system there is. The trick now is creating an appealing environment for the developers who will make it more than a smartphone.
  6. #66  
    What we need to do is find the good apps that are being made for other OS and flood the companies that make the apps we want so they will come to HP webOS! It worked with Angry Birds!


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  7. #67  
    Well, Ive watched this thread go from one end of the spectrum to the other since I started reading. I'm going to try replying to everything that occurred to me as I read up to post #66

    To start... finding the cool whip. While It isn't an app that will tell you where it is... with Shopping Manager you can record its location and price, have profiles for different stores and such. Its a nice program... the more you use it, the more complete the database becomes.

    As far as the other apps you mention... they seem to be mostly apps with a low use model. Try JdiSky for constellations. Sending txt to people when it senses an auto accident? Honestly, I realize it is something you want but it seems useless to me... the vast majority of accidents that would cause an injury great enough to prevent you from texting someone are going to damage your phone. And any accident you WOULD have... the app isnt going to be able to get the information the person really needs to them anyway... what hospital you are going to, are you alive, what is the damage to the car. At the most, it would be able to tell them a location and time. You might cause someone needless worry while you are out on the court playing basketball with your buddies, or fell down at work.

    Better rates on auto insurace... no thank you... there is already enough invasion of privacy in this country. Everyone is watching what you do on the internet, what you watch on your television, how you use your phone and other devices... they have an ulterior motive for wanting to collect such massive amounts of use data... they wouldnt suggest it if the majority of customers would get a discount, thats less money for them on a whole, even counting the money they would save by upping the rates of stupid drivers, so there has to be a backend profit we wouldnt be pleased with.

    Do you really need real-time data on your gas mileage? Isnt that one more distraction for you to be paying attention to rather than the road? I for one would prefer people drove intelligently, without so many distractions... so that I wouldnt need an app to detect when one of them rams into me. Besides... there is TONS of data on proper driving habits to cut down on your consumption... common sense should tell you that running the ac at high speeds with the windows closed is more efficient than the reverse, having your windows open at high speeds affects the aerodynamics of the car by quite a bit... and it is conversely true at low speeds. That the vast majority of your gas consumption is going to come from acceleration, so finding a cruising speed you can maintain without speeding up or slowing down in fickle traffic is going to save you gas mileage. Drafting behind other vehicles with a larger air displacement will save consumption as well... anything to improve your aerodynamics. Do some reading, and adjust accordingly... live data isnt going to give you good results because the only way to read into what you are doing is to be looking at the screen while you are doing it versus looking at the road.

    My young lady has an Epic 4g... the android market and all those thousands upon thousands of apps... I guarantee you the ratio of useful to non-useful apps is much different. They do have more useful apps than we do... but the market place is so oversaturated with crap it is hard to find them if you dont already know their names. User comments for the most part, along with the rating system are absolutely worthless.

    That said, one app I am particularly envious she uses is Backup to Gmail... it backs up your SMS, MMS and Call Logs to Gmail... *sigh* it would be nice to be able to do this on our Pre without jumping through hoops. In this instance... Ive just had an important SMS conversation, or need to backup my call logs because Ive been talking to customers all day... I can push one button...

    Which leads me to another point I would like to make... I travel constantly and work about 80 hours a week, so the extra hoops we have to jump through to do a few things on this phone can be aggravating. Sure, using an SSH and terminal to access your phone solves a problem... but it took you time to set it up, and takes a little bit of extra time whenever you use it. The few aggravations I do have with this phone are not the OS... they arent the apps... they are caused by a lack of APIs for the developers to use.

    Now to answer your main question... why do we have such an anemic marketplace? Because the entire platform is 2 phones that have a very small marketshare. Android has tons of phones out there... and a lot of the apps arent universal... you have to do some reasearch to find out if they are compatible with your phone, and you wont be able to tell right away that the new app you just downloaded from the android marketplace is causing your phone to crash constantly when you havent even used it yet. As far as why the apple marketplace is huge... theyve had longer to build it, and lots of people own one. Theres a lot of junk in theirs too by the way.
  8. #68  
    Quote Originally Posted by Rkguy View Post
    WebOS does not and will not support ad-hoc WiFi for the forseeable future according to Palm online dev forums.

    PLX Kiwi works w/ ad-hoc wifi *but the BT plx device doesn't, however it's more expensive than one's you'd find on ebay. Maybe the resutling code would be cross compatible with other ELM OBD devices however.
    It would be a shame that the product would be limited to those with homebrew kernels.
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       #69  
    Blue,

    Thank you for the shopping manager suggestion and JdiSky
    The APIs are here in beta so if the dev boards are any indication, it looks like it's not going to be a sluicegate opening like we'd like it to be. - Hence why I encourage HP to actively pursue and compensate developers for porting to a new platform.
    I agree that the small number of owners is bad but just having two phone models at any one point in time is not bad, provided they get refreshed every year or so.

    I've edited the first post because I wrote from the top of my head the 1st time. I just want to clarify the utility of a couple of the apps.

    The point of the crash app isn't necessarily to send a txt only or even at all (sorry about that) but to provide details about your emergency to those who need to know (911, closest contact). Did your airbags deploy. Where was your impact? Where are you? Did you know that you can now text 911 in some states? There is a market for this general idea (crash app) or else OnStar wouldn't be here. BTW I don't understand the basketball analogy. this would read car signals not your personal movement. That's more of a life-alert thing.

    Re: privacy argument. You are right that this app should be an opt-in but that is easy. HP doesn't have to bundle it with the phone.

    Re: Gas mileage - By your argument, new cars shouldn't display your gas mileage to you (honda, toyota, some gm, others) at all or give you a green light (hyundai) when you are driving well. It doesn't have to be distracting. it could just ding a pleasant sound when you are doing well. take a look at the Nissan Intelligent Driver Project (NIDP). Feedback makes a difference.

    read
    NISSAN | Nissan Gets "Intelligent" Over Saving Fuel
    and
    Green Car Congress: All New Nissan Models to Feature Fuel Efficiency Gauge

    It looks like nobody cares really, so actually the app would be more helpful as a DOE or EPA incentive program than a paid-for app.

    I understand that to you none of the aforementioned apps are important enough to sneeze at however the mere fact that most of them exist (albeit on other PFs) is a testament to the existence of a market for those apps.
    ...This programming stuff is actually addictive but really hard :/
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       #70  
    Just adding that Griffin is also promoting a software support product called CleanDrive that uses their hardware to help improve your driving technique. At least they think it has merit.

    Griffin Technology: CarTrip - OBD-II Hardware Interface
    ...This programming stuff is actually addictive but really hard :/
  11. #71  
    I'd like to text bomb a couple people...
    If "If's" and "But's" were candy and nuts we'd all have a Merry Christmas!


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