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  1. ght
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    #21  
    Quote Originally Posted by SmoothCriminal View Post
    Yeah,
    I understand what you are saying. I would like to just give out answers and be able to just receive them but I end up getting scolded for that. I hate it when things say "use your search skills blah blah", but I know it is in our best interest. Sorry dude, that seems to be how it works around here.
    It's a bit of a balancing act, trying to help new folks get what they need without sending them off unarmed for what they are likely to experience. Kind of like giving someone a gun without showing them how to use it safely. I think a lot of the reason folks get the "search-and-learn" canned response is that 99% of the questions asked about this topic have been answered numerous times. Yes, it does take some work to find those answers. Developing search skills takes trial and error - it is truly an art form. Searching "Preware" for example might bring up 70 threads and thousands of posts. Who can begin to sort through all that? There is such a massive amount of knowledge and information about overclocking on this site now, searching for and finding what you need is much more difficult than it was 6 months ago. We used to have one kernel, then two different packages for it, now 7 kernels? Awesome stuff for sure, but a lot of information to digest for folks new to the forum. And to top it all off, they have to wade through the hundreds (or thousands) of n00b posts in those threads just to get to some relevant information. (Yes, the wiki pages are a great place to start.)

    So, to my point:

    1. Sending new folks off on a "search-and-learn" mission might make them a well-educated, productive member of this community if they take that the right way. Or, they may say "F this community and F this phone" and never touch webOS again, in which case we've lost another webOS user (of which we need all we can get).

    2. Giving new folks the information they want without being educated about the consequences could have similar results. Either they install the bleeding edge kernel and love what it does to their phone, making them excited about webOS and thereby furthering their desire to learn about webOS and improve their phone's capabilities (and show it off to their friends, who get excited and convert to webOS), or they screw up their phone and have to learn about how to doctor, which is likely to have an educational effect, as well.

    Of course, we all know that some of those "bricked" phone owners will come crying to the kernel developers, blaming them for their woes. As a community, it is our responsibility to answer those poor souls in the most polite way possible and guide them on the path to recovery. Those of us with the knowledge to do so should try to be a front line of defense. Unixpsycho and the webOS internals team should be working on the next piece of awesomeness for our phones, not fending off angry (because they are frightened they just wrecked their phone, not because they are jerks) n00bs. The only thing I see that drives people away from PreCentral and webOS is when we come off high-and-mighty. Haven't heard of anyone bailing out from too much overclocking.

    I'm a reader and a researcher. I read everything I can get my hands on. I learn everything I can about something before I dive into it. It is not like me to blindly ask someone else for the answer. I have Preware, 61 patches, 1GHz Uberkernel, etc, etc. I did it all myself by reading the forums, wikis, etc. But that's how I operate. My brother is not the same way. He would have never found this forum on his own, let alone Preware, patching, and Uberkernel. I had to guide him through all of it. Now that he has it, he's excited about it. He tells others about it and shows off his phone. He got his boss set up with Preware. Who knows how many his boss has since told about it, but there are at least two people far less likely to jump ship to Android or iOS.

    The one thing I see that starts the most arguments on this site is the perceived high-horse attitude when giving the "search-and-learn" response. I know it gets tiring answering one after the other, but if we are to grow our webOS community and our user base, we must do all we can to reach out a helping hand to all those who come looking for it. We cannot afford to be an exclusive club. We all know webOS needs new hardware, but with Preware, it feels like new hardware, and that might keep some folks holding on to webOS until HPalm releases the next great gadget. This is the only way webOS will become a powerhouse in the smartphone market.

    Please consider the tone of your responses when dealing with new folks. I'm starting with me, because I know my first thought when I see some of these questions is "You didn't even try to search, did you, you lazy piece of ****?" Some of them have, and some of them haven't. Those that haven't, shame on them. Those that have have likely found it a daunting task. Either way, it's not fair to assume they haven't tried. Some people are good at math, some aren't. Some people are good at searching, and some aren't. I know it's common on internet forums to give/receive short responses. Folks new to internet boards are not likely to understand it is not an insult to receive a reply of "RTFM", it's just a great place to start.

    "Welcome to the PreCentral forums! Great to see another webOS fan looking to make their Pre/Pixi a powerhouse. If you haven't seen these already, here are some great places to get started. [List of a few wiki pages and important threads.] If you have any questions after reading, please try to be as specific as you can about your issue, what you've tried so far, versions of programs you are currently using, etc. There are a lot of folks here who will gladly help you get your questions answered. The more specific you can be about your issue/question, the better. A well-defined issue/question will attract the best subject matter experts to help you out. All we ask in return is that you do your best to become part of our knowledge base and community, and share what you learn with those following behind you into the wonderful world of PreCentral.

    A few tips for the forums:

    1. Try searching first. You can get results by thread or by post. Depending on how specific your search is, one may be better than the other. Try both ways. Try some different wording. Try Google - it will find relevant PreCentral information. I've found it to return better results than the search built into the forums on occasion. If you haven't searched before asking your question, it will be obvious to others on the forum, and you may not get the answers you're hoping to get. There's a very good chance that whatever issue you are having has been answered before, and you're likely to find an easy answer somewhere in the forums. There is a lot of information here, and it can be intimidating trying to sort through all of it, but do your best. Others here can help if you get stuck.

    2. Don't post questions in the developer forums unless you have a specific, well-researched issue that you think can help the developers make their program better, or if you have a question that could not be answered in other areas of the forum.

    3. From the home page of PreCentral.net, if you hover over "Forums" in the top menu, you can select "Today's Posts", which will give you a list of "current events" in the forums.
  2. #22  
    Quote Originally Posted by GHT View Post
    It's a bit of a balancing act, trying to help new folks get what they need without sending them off unarmed for what they are likely to experience. Kind of like giving someone a gun without showing them how to use it safely. I think a lot of the reason folks get the "search-and-learn" canned response is that 99% of the questions asked about this topic have been answered numerous times. Yes, it does take some work to find those answers. Developing search skills takes trial and error - it is truly an art form. Searching "Preware" for example might bring up 70 threads and thousands of posts. Who can begin to sort through all that? There is such a massive amount of knowledge and information about overclocking on this site now, searching for and finding what you need is much more difficult than it was 6 months ago. We used to have one kernel, then two different packages for it, now 7 kernels? Awesome stuff for sure, but a lot of information to digest for folks new to the forum. And to top it all off, they have to wade through the hundreds (or thousands) of n00b posts in those threads just to get to some relevant information. (Yes, the wiki pages are a great place to start.)

    So, to my point:

    1. Sending new folks off on a "search-and-learn" mission might make them a well-educated, productive member of this community if they take that the right way. Or, they may say "F this community and F this phone" and never touch webOS again, in which case we've lost another webOS user (of which we need all we can get).

    2. Giving new folks the information they want without being educated about the consequences could have similar results. Either they install the bleeding edge kernel and love what it does to their phone, making them excited about webOS and thereby furthering their desire to learn about webOS and improve their phone's capabilities (and show it off to their friends, who get excited and convert to webOS), or they screw up their phone and have to learn about how to doctor, which is likely to have an educational effect, as well.

    Of course, we all know that some of those "bricked" phone owners will come crying to the kernel developers, blaming them for their woes. As a community, it is our responsibility to answer those poor souls in the most polite way possible and guide them on the path to recovery. Those of us with the knowledge to do so should try to be a front line of defense. Unixpsycho and the webOS internals team should be working on the next piece of awesomeness for our phones, not fending off angry (because they are frightened they just wrecked their phone, not because they are jerks) n00bs. The only thing I see that drives people away from PreCentral and webOS is when we come off high-and-mighty. Haven't heard of anyone bailing out from too much overclocking.

    I'm a reader and a researcher. I read everything I can get my hands on. I learn everything I can about something before I dive into it. It is not like me to blindly ask someone else for the answer. I have Preware, 61 patches, 1GHz Uberkernel, etc, etc. I did it all myself by reading the forums, wikis, etc. But that's how I operate. My brother is not the same way. He would have never found this forum on his own, let alone Preware, patching, and Uberkernel. I had to guide him through all of it. Now that he has it, he's excited about it. He tells others about it and shows off his phone. He got his boss set up with Preware. Who knows how many his boss has since told about it, but there are at least two people far less likely to jump ship to Android or iOS.

    The one thing I see that starts the most arguments on this site is the perceived high-horse attitude when giving the "search-and-learn" response. I know it gets tiring answering one after the other, but if we are to grow our webOS community and our user base, we must do all we can to reach out a helping hand to all those who come looking for it. We cannot afford to be an exclusive club. We all know webOS needs new hardware, but with Preware, it feels like new hardware, and that might keep some folks holding on to webOS until HPalm releases the next great gadget. This is the only way webOS will become a powerhouse in the smartphone market.

    Please consider the tone of your responses when dealing with new folks. I'm starting with me, because I know my first thought when I see some of these questions is "You didn't even try to search, did you, you lazy piece of ****?" Some of them have, and some of them haven't. Those that haven't, shame on them. Those that have have likely found it a daunting task. Either way, it's not fair to assume they haven't tried. Some people are good at math, some aren't. Some people are good at searching, and some aren't. I know it's common on internet forums to give/receive short responses. Folks new to internet boards are not likely to understand it is not an insult to receive a reply of "RTFM", it's just a great place to start.

    "Welcome to the PreCentral forums! Great to see another webOS fan looking to make their Pre/Pixi a powerhouse. If you haven't seen these already, here are some great places to get started. [List of a few wiki pages and important threads.] If you have any questions after reading, please try to be as specific as you can about your issue, what you've tried so far, versions of programs you are currently using, etc. There are a lot of folks here who will gladly help you get your questions answered. The more specific you can be about your issue/question, the better. A well-defined issue/question will attract the best subject matter experts to help you out. All we ask in return is that you do your best to become part of our knowledge base and community, and share what you learn with those following behind you into the wonderful world of PreCentral.

    A few tips for the forums:

    1. Try searching first. You can get results by thread or by post. Depending on how specific your search is, one may be better than the other. Try both ways. Try some different wording. Try Google - it will find relevant PreCentral information. I've found it to return better results than the search built into the forums on occasion. If you haven't searched before asking your question, it will be obvious to others on the forum, and you may not get the answers you're hoping to get. There's a very good chance that whatever issue you are having has been answered before, and you're likely to find an easy answer somewhere in the forums. There is a lot of information here, and it can be intimidating trying to sort through all of it, but do your best. Others here can help if you get stuck.

    2. Don't post questions in the developer forums unless you have a specific, well-researched issue that you think can help the developers make their program better, or if you have a question that could not be answered in other areas of the forum.

    3. From the home page of PreCentral.net, if you hover over "Forums" in the top menu, you can select "Today's Posts", which will give you a list of "current events" in the forums.
    I COMPLETELY agree with you!
    We all want to help n00bs, but we don't want to blow up their Pre's. And people should research. I mean, if you are here that obviously means you atleast a little into technology and research. But, I understand if you are new first coming into preware and everything can be confusing.

    A couple of months ago I barely knew anything about preware, patches, kernels, ect. So, I decided I would get a Pre Plus. So I started researching. Call me a nerd, but I actually like learning about those kinda things. No, I'm not an expert, but I think anyone who is willing to do a little research can learn a lot
    I own a Verizon Palm Pre 2 running WebOS 2.0.1

    Here to help and learn
  3. #23  
    These are the things that separate iPhone owners from Pre owners.
    "Patience, use the force, think." Obi-Wan


    Ready to try Preware? Get this first: Preware Homebrew Documentation
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