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  1. SirWill's Avatar
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    #281  
    Quote Originally Posted by xorg View Post
    I wonder if 'mvapp' should be renamed to something reflecting that it is a /var storage manager. That's essentially what it is turning into.
    Hmmm, dunno. short and sweet is good. I can't imagine what to change it to.

    varmgr cvar (clean var) mvstuff It's still primarily a move stuff program.

    When I removed all of my attachments, I removed all of the bucket folders too. No ill effects, next email with an attachment created the folder it needed. I checked and all of my imap mail with attachments still had the attachments. I don't really see a down side to deleting all attachments. Heck, the nerve racking part is that attachments were saved to my phone, that I didn't explicitly tell to download in the mail app. On Gamil you have to choose view or download. It doesn't save it to your computer unless you tell it to. I mean I can understand images shown inline being saved, but pdf documents that I didn't choose to download? wav files (my voice mails for vonage) were there too even if I didn't listen to the vm on my phone.

    For this reason, I want to be able to mass clear my attachments on a semi regular basis.
    -----------------
    Palm III, Palm IIIc, TT, T3, T5, TX, Pre from Day 1.
  2. SirWill's Avatar
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    #282  
    Quote Originally Posted by navinag View Post
    I don't hit the app limit issue but all this got me snooping around to see what my usage was.

    I rebooted and I sill have ~ 13Mb of emails hanging around that I can not see in the Pre email app.
    I'd be willing to bet that it didn't clean up after itself. use the du -s * |sort -n command that xorg mentioned on page 13. Find out what is using the space. I would not be surprised to find out that you have junk still hanging out in either the emails or attachments directories.
    -----------------
    Palm III, Palm IIIc, TT, T3, T5, TX, Pre from Day 1.
  3. #283  
    Quote Originally Posted by SirWill View Post
    Heck, the nerve racking part is that attachments were saved to my phone, that I didn't explicitly tell to download in the mail app.
    Don't quote me on this, but I think attachments under a certain size (I've observed around 100KB) get automatically downloaded when syncing, for your "convenience".
  4. #284  
    Quote Originally Posted by SirWill View Post
    Hmmm, dunno. short and sweet is good. I can't imagine what to change it to.
    I've been only loosely monitoring this thread and the progress (but it seems this is almost fully cooked these days.)

    I'd suggest maybe "mv2card" if you are considering a more intuitive name that everyday users might identify with.
    I'm both super! ... and a doer!
  5. #285  
    Quote Originally Posted by bclancy View Post
    I'd suggest maybe "mv2card" if you are considering a more intuitive name that everyday users might identify with.
    Except that the Pre does not have a removable "card"

    -- Rod
    WebOS Internals and Preware Founder and Developer
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    All donations go back into development.
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  6. xorg's Avatar
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       #286  
    New development version posted (0.2.6c). For those who'd like to test, see Install Option 2 here....

    Solution to App Catalog Installation Limit - WebOS Internals

    New commands...

    mvapp doctor <or> d
    - status report of /var storage usage with recommendations. also stores results to /media/internal/varreport.txt

    mvapp linkemail <or> le
    - move email and attachments to media and create symlink

    mvapp unlinkemail <or> ue
    - move email and attachments back to var (original location)

    This is not yet available on PreWare repository. After a week of testing, it will be released to homebrew installers.
    Last edited by xorg; 10/25/2009 at 08:50 PM.
  7. xorg's Avatar
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       #287  
    Those who've downloaded the development version, please test the following. I'm using 'ma' as the mvapp command, but you can rename to anything.

    ma d
    ma le
    ma d
    ma ue
    ma d
    ma le
    ma d

    With email linked to /media, put phone in USB mode on computer and see what happens when you send an email to your phone. It should not download until after you disconnect USB. Also test sending an email with attachments(s). Use the doctor to make sure attachments folder is growing on /media.

    I've had my email on /media for a couple days now and it's been solid. Also while USB connected as well as launching attachments, such as PDF files - no issues so far. The script needs more testers though before I release on PreWare. Could use a few more testers... thanks. Also looking for ideas for additional 'doctor' checks/recommendations.
  8. SirWill's Avatar
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    #288  
    Installed, and checking out the moving of email/attachments now. Have a good amount for it to move. Not so big of attachments, but decent. K, finished moving, It restarted email. It was interesting that it took me to the email accounts screen. I've just sent the phone an attachment, had no problem receiving it.

    HOLLY CRAP this appears to be an in efficient use of space on the /media/internal Check this out for the .data folder.

    windows reports

    Size: 40.6 MB (42,666,179 bytes)
    Size on Disk: 152 MB (159,842,304 bytes)
    Contains: 4,339 Files,54 Folders

    I sent an email with it in usb mode does not appear to have downloaded yet, so yeah that sounds right. Disconnected usb, and it now downloaded.

    I'll do some more testing. Oh, and I like the text file dump on the usb drive.

    /var report...
    Used should be well under 100MB...
    /var used: 126 MB 51% - avail: 122 MB

    Size of /var app directory is 5MB.
    (Should be well under 60MB)

    Your email storage is using...
    50MB on /var.
    Your attachment storage is using...
    1MB on /var.

    /var/lib/software/tmp is using 0MB.
    (Should be 1MB or less)

    /opt is using 32MB.

    Recommendations...
    - Consider moving email: mvapp linkemail

    This report is available on media
    drive as... varreport.txt
    After moving the email over it looks like

    mvapp version: 0.2.6c

    /var report...
    Used should be well under 100MB...
    /var used: 75 MB 30% - avail: 173 MB

    Size of /var app directory is 5MB.
    (Should be well under 60MB)

    Your email storage is using...
    152MB on /media.
    Your attachment storage is using...
    2MB on /media.

    /var/lib/software/tmp is using 0MB.
    (Should be 1MB or less)

    /opt is using 32MB.

    Recommendations...

    This report is available on media
    drive as... varreport.txt
    Note, when I first moved the email, it said stopping services, and it stopped 2 processes... to move it back it only stopped 1 service.

    And the details after the move.

    mvapp version: 0.2.6c

    /var report...
    Used should be well under 100MB...
    /var used: 127 MB 51% - avail: 121 MB

    Size of /var app directory is 5MB.
    (Should be well under 60MB)

    Your email storage is using...
    50MB on /var.
    Your attachment storage is using...
    2MB on /var.

    /var/lib/software/tmp is using 0MB.
    (Should be 1MB or less)

    /opt is using 32MB.

    Recommendations...
    - Consider moving email: mvapp linkemail

    This report is available on media
    drive as... varreport.txt

    OK, so tested all of those functions, and it appears to work as advertised.
    -----------------
    Palm III, Palm IIIc, TT, T3, T5, TX, Pre from Day 1.
  9. SirWill's Avatar
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    #289  
    after moving the email back, it left a .data folder in the /media/internal usb partition. empty, but it left the folder.
    -----------------
    Palm III, Palm IIIc, TT, T3, T5, TX, Pre from Day 1.
  10. xorg's Avatar
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       #290  
    Thanks for testing. I'll look into removing the .data folder if empty.

    There is an issue with reporting size of folder sitting on media. The du command doesn't calculate FAT fs correctly and I've been looking for a solution. Anyone know? It's not a consistent x factor - sometimes is 2x, sometimes 3x, somtimes 1.5x the actual size. I'll have to take all size reporting out of the /media otherwise.

    The script stops the email app if running but it also stops the background email service, which is running to check for new email. So you may see it stop one or two processes. Stopping these are necessary before moving/linking. When it starts, it is normal it to ask about adding new accounts, as it's the nature of the start of the background process. Normally you don't see this because the email background process is started on system startup. It's an extra prompt, but a harmless one - and shown only the first time after the move.

    Thanks again for testing. The USB mounting is the one I'm concerned about, but it seems to behave fine.
  11. SirWill's Avatar
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    #291  
    I was just surprised to see windows reporting such far different numbers between size and size on disk. Your script is reporting the same number that windows reports that it is taking on disk. I am just floored at how much space it took on the fat partition vs the ext partition.
    -----------------
    Palm III, Palm IIIc, TT, T3, T5, TX, Pre from Day 1.
  12. xorg's Avatar
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       #292  
    It's a little confusing if the storage on /media is actually using that much more space or if it being reported wrong. Windows shows different values for 'size' vs. 'size on disk' as well. Linux shows 1/3 the space on linux filesystem vs. FAT filesystem. Is it a reporting error or is it actually using more space on FAT fs? Anyone know?

    Reporting size aside, the actually functionality seems to be working. If no serious issues through this week, I'll probably release this weekend to the PreWare repository. I may add a couple more 'recommendation' items in the Doctor through this week.
  13. xorg's Avatar
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       #293  
    I googled into the 'size' vs. 'size on disk' difference and found it's related to number of clusters the directory takes up vs. actual size of those files. If I understand it, the cluster size on /media is rather large, so many small files use up more space. So yes, it would appear that moving stuff from /var to /media will use more space on /media, especially if the files are small. However there is a net benefit to saving space on /var given how large /media is.
  14. SirWill's Avatar
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    #294  
    Quote Originally Posted by xorg View Post
    I googled into the 'size' vs. 'size on disk' difference and found it's related to number of clusters the directory takes up vs. actual size of those files. If I understand it, the cluster size on /media is rather large, so many small files use up more space. So yes, it would appear that moving stuff from /var to /media will use more space on /media, especially if the files are small. However there is a net benefit to saving space on /var given how large /media is.
    Correct about size vs size on disk. In the shower this morning I was thinking about it. When palm sets up the FAT partition they are probably specifying a big block size. Think about what they planned the /media partition for. MEDIA, Media has BIG files typically. We are throwing thousands of SMALL files on there. So while it is inefficient it clearly saves space on /var.

    I think the question should be raised. Should be re-sizing /media smaller, and /var bigger to conserve space? What about sizing /media smaller, and creating another new partition for Apps / Email?

    I guess we really need to see what kind of a fix Palm is going to throw at this problem. Either way, I still like this solution for now.

    Is there a way to create a single file based storage model on /media to house all of these small files? I admit here I am by far a relative newbie when it comes to Linux. I thought I've heard of this option before.
    -----------------
    Palm III, Palm IIIc, TT, T3, T5, TX, Pre from Day 1.
  15. xorg's Avatar
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       #295  
    v0.2.6f has been posted. Better formatting for the report. This sample report shows all possible 'recommendations'.

    Code:
    /var report...
    var used:    101MB 33%
    var avail:      147MB
    app used:       38MB on /var
    email used:     12MB on /var
    attach used:   2MB on /var
    var tmp used:  10MB
    opt used:        37MB
    
    Recommendations...
    
    - Consider reducing space on /var.
    /var use is greater than 100MB.
    
    - Check Updates app.
    /var/lib/software/tmp is larger
    than it should be.  May have an
    update waiting to be applied.
    
    - Consider moving email: mvapp linkemail
    
    - Consider moving apps: mvapp bulkmv
    
    - Consider removing optware packages.
    You have optware software installed.
    See: ipkg-opt list_installed
     Do: ipkg-opt remove ipkg
    Ask on PreCentral.
    
    This report is available on media
    drive as... varreport.txt
    I've also added back the size of app on 'listmoved' function.

    To install this version, see Install Option 2 here...
    Solution to App Catalog Installation Limit - WebOS Internals

    Not yet available in PreWare repository.
  16. xorg's Avatar
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       #296  
    Am considering best thresholds to use before suggesting moving data of the respective type...

    if var >100MB
    if email > 10MB
    if attachments >10MB
    if apps >30MB on /var
    if /opt >10MB

    Do these sound reasonable?
  17. bjmacke's Avatar
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    #297  
    Quote Originally Posted by SirWill View Post
    Correct about size vs size on disk. In the shower this morning I was thinking about it. When palm sets up the FAT partition they are probably specifying a big block size. Think about what they planned the /media partition for. MEDIA, Media has BIG files typically. We are throwing thousands of SMALL files on there. So while it is inefficient it clearly saves space on /var.
    If I'm reading this right /media/internal is allocated in 32k blocks. Not as big as you might expect.

    Code:
    Boot sector contents:
    System ID "mkdosfs"
    Media byte 0xf8 (hard disk)
           512 bytes per logical sector
         32768 bytes per cluster
            32 reserved sectors
    First FAT starts at byte 16384 (sector 32)
             1 FATs, 32 bit entries
        876544 bytes per FAT (= 1712 sectors)
    Root directory start at cluster 2 (arbitrary size)
    Data area starts at byte 892928 (sector 1744)
        219108 data clusters (7179730944 bytes)
    16 sectors/track, 4 heads
             0 hidden sectors
      14024704 sectors total
    Checking for unused clusters.
    Checking free cluster summary.
    /dev/mapper/store-media: 370 files, 15678/219108 clusters
    Quote Originally Posted by SirWill View Post
    Is there a way to create a single file based storage model on /media to house all of these small files? I admit here I am by far a relative newbie when it comes to Linux. I thought I've heard of this option before.
    There's been work on loopback filesystems but there's no way to properly unmount them when you want to turn on USB Drive or Media.
  18. SirWill's Avatar
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    #298  
    Quote Originally Posted by xorg View Post
    v0.2.6f has been posted. Better formatting for the report. This sample report shows all possible 'recommendations'.

    I've also added back the size of app on 'listmoved' function.

    To install this version, see Install Option 2 here...
    Solution to App Catalog Installation Limit - WebOS Internals

    Not yet available in PreWare repository.
    Hey, It appears it is the new version but it still says 0.2.6d

    Code:
    mvapp version: 0.2.6d
    
    /var report...
    var used:      128MB 52%
    var avail:     120MB
    app used:      6MB on /var
    email used:    50MB on /var
    attach used:   2MB on /var
    var tmp used:  0MB
    opt used:      32MB
    
    Recommendations...
    
    - Consider reducing space on /var.
    /var use is greater than 100MB.
    - Consider moving email: mvapp linkemail
    
    - Consider removing optware packages.
    You have optware software installed.
    See: ipkg-opt list_installed
     Do: ipkg-opt remove ipkg
    Ask on PreCentral.
    
    This report is available on media
    drive as... varreport.txt
    To make sure I was getting the current I removed all of the dev versions on my pre, then downloaded it yet again. still shows 0.2.6d
    -----------------
    Palm III, Palm IIIc, TT, T3, T5, TX, Pre from Day 1.
  19. xorg's Avatar
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       #299  
    ^Not sure what happened but it was posted with wrong version tag. Try again, it should now be 0.2.6g.

    Seeking more testers. To install, paste the following at a Linux prompt...
    Code:
    mount -o remount,rw / 
    cd /tmp
    wget http://gitorious.org/webos-internals/mvapp/blobs/raw/master/mvapp
    chmod 755 mvapp
    mv mvapp /usr/local/bin/ma  #or name to whatever you'd like, using ma as shortcut
    ma
    Use 'ma' in place of the mvapp command for the test version.
  20. SirWill's Avatar
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    #300  
    Code:
    mvapp version: 0.2.6g
    
    /var report...
    var used:      76MB 31%
    var avail:     172MB
    app used:      6MB on /var
    email used:    155MB on /media
    attach used:   2MB on /media
    var tmp used:  0MB
    opt used:      32MB
    
    Recommendations...
    
    This report is available on media
    drive as... varreport.txt
    After the upgrade, and moving my email back to media this is the report. Looks good. Everyone reading this with command prompt access give this a try, test it out for Xorg so it's more than just me testing.
    -----------------
    Palm III, Palm IIIc, TT, T3, T5, TX, Pre from Day 1.

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