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webOS Nation Forums > webOS apps and software > webOS development > Post OS1.04 - pinging 'the collective' for new install method
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The biggest problem with palm_install method is it requires distribution of code we do not have the right to. Unless Palm blessed the app, which they most likely won't do.
Anyone able to capture the packets for a App Catalog session? That would explain a lot about the interface to the App Catalog.
Anyone able to capture the packets for a App Catalog session? That would explain a lot about the interface to the App Catalog.
^Start with /var/log/messages and /var/log/installer.log
I'd still like to go down the simplified package approach with nova drivers, perform same function as palm_install (not a direct copy) and push the issue with Palm.. If they stop it, they stop it.
I'd still like to go down the simplified package approach with nova drivers, perform same function as palm_install (not a direct copy) and push the issue with Palm.. If they stop it, they stop it.
I was loading apps I built with the SDK in to my Palm last night via USB and the Palm_Install file WITHOUT being in Developer mode on the Pre. Grant it, my phone has root shell access. But to load the program, I was NOT in developer mode. Also this was clearly post 1.0.4
I posted this in the Hhomebrew section:
1. Download the Mojo SDK to your PC by going here: http://preinsiders.com/home/2009/06/...ed-to-the-web/
2. Set your Pre to developer mode by typing the following in Universal Search: upupdowndownleftrightleftrightbastart. Follow the prompts.
3. Hook your Pre to your PC in “Just Charge” mode. Files will (automatically?) install.
4. Restart your Pre.
5. Download the desired app to your PC from the Homebrew App thread here: http://forums.precentral.net/homebrew-apps/
6. Drag the .ipk file for the Homebrew App onto Program Files>Palm>SDK>bin>palm-install.bat on the PC (a cmd prompt will pop up and after this you should see the app icon in your programs on the Pre).
Mostly taken from work of JohnLBurger and Drybonz, Does it get easier than this?
1. Download the Mojo SDK to your PC by going here: http://preinsiders.com/home/2009/06/...ed-to-the-web/
2. Set your Pre to developer mode by typing the following in Universal Search: upupdowndownleftrightleftrightbastart. Follow the prompts.
3. Hook your Pre to your PC in “Just Charge” mode. Files will (automatically?) install.
4. Restart your Pre.
5. Download the desired app to your PC from the Homebrew App thread here: http://forums.precentral.net/homebrew-apps/
6. Drag the .ipk file for the Homebrew App onto Program Files>Palm>SDK>bin>palm-install.bat on the PC (a cmd prompt will pop up and after this you should see the app icon in your programs on the Pre).
Mostly taken from work of JohnLBurger and Drybonz, Does it get easier than this?
^Not consumer friendly and not for non-techies. But if we can shrink it down into minimal steps for consumers by packaging the core components needed, we'd be getting there.
The goal of this thread though is to load apps on a stock Pre as the email link method allowed.
The goal of this thread though is to load apps on a stock Pre as the email link method allowed.
Can someone test the palm-install method on a stock Pre without being in developer mode? With SDK Installed palm-install -d usb ipk_file_name_here.ipk On my rooted pre in non developer mode this works.
Last I checked, it didn't work unless Pre was in Dev mode. It lets the palm sdk stuff see it as a device, same way it would see the emulator, and I guess gives access to needed file structure. But it isn't like usb mode and you can't view the Pre's structure (at least within Explorer).
So I guess find a way to do this otherwise? It'd be nice if we could make an app for the Pre to at least get in/out of Dev mode (if possible), but I guess from here on we don't have that option.
So I guess find a way to do this otherwise? It'd be nice if we could make an app for the Pre to at least get in/out of Dev mode (if possible), but I guess from here on we don't have that option.
Has anyone started digging into the com.palm.app.findapps app yet? Looks like it uses "weave" services to download apps. Perhaps it might be possible to write a new custom front end to this that allows input of a location to get an app from.
At work right now, so I can't dig into it too much. Post if you've found or haven't found anything useful in there.
At work right now, so I can't dig into it too much. Post if you've found or haven't found anything useful in there.
It failed for me the times I tried non-Dev'ed install via the palm_install -d usb. The Novacom on the Pre is the interface used and it just isn't loaded.
Another options is just making it really really easy to root the phone. For example with the iPhone all an user has to do is Run Quickpwn and it automatically does everything with little to no user interaction. It even installs onto the iPhone an custom 3rd party installer that is used to load custom 3rd party apps. That would be the ideal path for us to take and the simplest for non techie people to install apps.
Originally Posted by microbolt:
Another options is just making it really really easy to root the phone. For example with the iPhone all an user has to do is Run Quickpwn and it automatically does everything with little to no user interaction. It even installs onto the iPhone an custom 3rd party installer that is used to load custom 3rd party apps. That would be the ideal path for us to take and the simplest for non techie people to install apps.
Or even use the same concept but just for installing Novacom and put Pre in Dev mode, that would be great. Rooting is a term that I've found many people want to avoid for one reason or another.Another options is just making it really really easy to root the phone. For example with the iPhone all an user has to do is Run Quickpwn and it automatically does everything with little to no user interaction. It even installs onto the iPhone an custom 3rd party installer that is used to load custom 3rd party apps. That would be the ideal path for us to take and the simplest for non techie people to install apps.
I have new stripped down Installer and Packager jars created from Palm's unreleased SDK. Most of the code is very straight forward, but it does not appear that it would be trivial to recreate the entire code stack to be able to send applications to the phone.
The current dependencies are:
json.jar (freely available)
jargs.jar (freely available)
novacom.jar (some palm code included)
PackageUtils.jar (this is the jpkg code stripped from the Package.jar)
ToolsUtil.jar (some palm crap we need to compile, but could replace easily)
The main issue now is the novacom code, which is definitely necessary for sending Luna commands to the device.
NOTE: despite what SirWill is saying, it is required that you be in dev mode for novacom to work correctly. The firewall rules will prevent your computer from contacting your device otherwise. The reason that his phone is working outside of dev mode is most likely that he has hosed his iptables.
I will be working on an application and website to counter the palm App Catalog. It will require its own version of "findapps" to be created and a website must be constructed to keep track of different versions of the homebrew app catalog. It's going to take time and money, so don't expect it instantly, but I suspect that something workable will be ready in less than two weeks. Anyone who wants to be involved can contact me via PM or on the webos-internals freenode channel (User: cphelps).
The current dependencies are:
json.jar (freely available)
jargs.jar (freely available)
novacom.jar (some palm code included)
PackageUtils.jar (this is the jpkg code stripped from the Package.jar)
ToolsUtil.jar (some palm crap we need to compile, but could replace easily)
The main issue now is the novacom code, which is definitely necessary for sending Luna commands to the device.
NOTE: despite what SirWill is saying, it is required that you be in dev mode for novacom to work correctly. The firewall rules will prevent your computer from contacting your device otherwise. The reason that his phone is working outside of dev mode is most likely that he has hosed his iptables.
I will be working on an application and website to counter the palm App Catalog. It will require its own version of "findapps" to be created and a website must be constructed to keep track of different versions of the homebrew app catalog. It's going to take time and money, so don't expect it instantly, but I suspect that something workable will be ready in less than two weeks. Anyone who wants to be involved can contact me via PM or on the webos-internals freenode channel (User: cphelps).
^Great info. Thanks. Are all of those jar programs needed just to deliver the app via palm_install? We have already figured out how to package the app independent of the SDK. The more dependencies that can be removed, the less work needed.
If you can get just the basics needed to the install (including novacom drivers), can deal with the drivers after the fact.
If you can get just the basics needed to the install (including novacom drivers), can deal with the drivers after the fact.
Originally Posted by microbolt:
Another options is just making it really really easy to root the phone. For example with the iPhone all an user has to do is Run Quickpwn and it automatically does everything with little to no user interaction. It even installs onto the iPhone an custom 3rd party installer that is used to load custom 3rd party apps. That would be the ideal path for us to take and the simplest for non techie people to install apps.
If it ends up being a consumer friendly way to install apps, it's worth heading down that path. Was hoping to do this w/out rooting the phone.Another options is just making it really really easy to root the phone. For example with the iPhone all an user has to do is Run Quickpwn and it automatically does everything with little to no user interaction. It even installs onto the iPhone an custom 3rd party installer that is used to load custom 3rd party apps. That would be the ideal path for us to take and the simplest for non techie people to install apps.
my main concern is if palm truly didnt care about 3rd party home brew apps then they would give us a method to install them other then app cat. Sorry to be so pessimistic but with them monitoring this it may just be their way of figuring out what other holes are left to be plugged up. so this public forum thing is kind of sketchy in the sense that they may just kill all the findings with another update. but in the other hand great way of exploring the devices and learning from it
Originally Posted by sir_mycroft:
I posted this in the Hhomebrew section:
1. Download the Mojo SDK to your PC by going here:
2. Set your Pre to developer mode by typing the following in Universal Search: upupdowndownleftrightleftrightbastart. Follow the prompts.
3. Hook your Pre to your PC in “Just Charge” mode. Files will (automatically?) install.
4. Restart your Pre.
5. Download the desired app to your PC from the Homebrew App thread here:
6. Drag the .ipk file for the Homebrew App onto Program Files>Palm>SDK>bin>palm-install.bat on the PC (a cmd prompt will pop up and after this you should see the app icon in your programs on the Pre).
Mostly taken from work of JohnLBurger and Drybonz, Does it get easier than this?
Wow, is it really this easy? I have some light programming experience but have been put off on rooting because I'm not familiar with linux, and was scared.I posted this in the Hhomebrew section:
1. Download the Mojo SDK to your PC by going here:
2. Set your Pre to developer mode by typing the following in Universal Search: upupdowndownleftrightleftrightbastart. Follow the prompts.
3. Hook your Pre to your PC in “Just Charge” mode. Files will (automatically?) install.
4. Restart your Pre.
5. Download the desired app to your PC from the Homebrew App thread here:
6. Drag the .ipk file for the Homebrew App onto Program Files>Palm>SDK>bin>palm-install.bat on the PC (a cmd prompt will pop up and after this you should see the app icon in your programs on the Pre).
Mostly taken from work of JohnLBurger and Drybonz, Does it get easier than this?
Sorry to take it off topic, but If I use the above method, is there anything else I should watch out for? Open ports? Thanks in advance
They aren't going to shut down the door used by developers on the SDK, so there are no worries here.
Chris
Chris
Originally Posted by jack87:
my main concern is if palm truly didnt care about 3rd party home brew apps then they would give us a method to install them other then app cat. Sorry to be so pessimistic but with them monitoring this it may just be their way of figuring out what other holes are left to be plugged up. so this public forum thing is kind of sketchy in the sense that they may just kill all the findings with another update. but in the other hand great way of exploring the devices and learning from it
my main concern is if palm truly didnt care about 3rd party home brew apps then they would give us a method to install them other then app cat. Sorry to be so pessimistic but with them monitoring this it may just be their way of figuring out what other holes are left to be plugged up. so this public forum thing is kind of sketchy in the sense that they may just kill all the findings with another update. but in the other hand great way of exploring the devices and learning from it
Why doesn't Palm offer a way to side load apps? Just put our .ipk files into a folder from USB mode and we are good. Like Classic does.
There is no way to send someone a fake Email attachment and is no more unsafe than hot syncing from the old days. We used to be able to simply load programs on PalmOS.
I always thought they said they would allow side loading anyway so why not give us a way now?
Originally Posted by 1Paladin:
Why doesn't Palm offer a way to side load apps? Just put our .ipk files into a folder from USB mode and we are good. Like Classic does.
There is no way to send someone a fake Email attachment and is no more unsafe than hot syncing from the old days. We used to be able to simply load programs on PalmOS.
I always thought they said they would allow side loading anyway so why not give us a way now?
I don't think it is as high on their priority list as some other glaring issues. Side load will have to be required to make Pre a contender in the enterprise. That just isn't currently their target, because the messaging can't compete with RIM yet.Why doesn't Palm offer a way to side load apps? Just put our .ipk files into a folder from USB mode and we are good. Like Classic does.
There is no way to send someone a fake Email attachment and is no more unsafe than hot syncing from the old days. We used to be able to simply load programs on PalmOS.
I always thought they said they would allow side loading anyway so why not give us a way now?
Originally Posted by sacherjj:
That just isn't currently their target, because the messaging can't compete with RIM yet.
It would if they would allow us to add applications easily. iThat just isn't currently their target, because the messaging can't compete with RIM yet.
iYou guys already create some really cool stuff even without the SDK!!!
webOS Nation Forums > webOS apps and software > webOS development > Post OS1.04 - pinging 'the collective' for new install method
