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  1. #21  
    Quote Originally Posted by xorg View Post
    PalmOS allows launching PRC files from email and the web browser. Why is that not a security issue but this is?
    Because any home brew apps are less money for Palm. It is estimated that Apple pulls about $100 million (30% cut from developers) from iPhone App Store. Palm which is strapped for cash would go to any lengths for even half that figure...

    Home brew apps on another hand bring them no revenue at all, so you bet they will close it down. It is not good for business.
  2. #22  
    Hands-down, the #1 thing that iPhone has over the Pre right now is the amount of available applications, and thus many more uses for the iPhone than the Pre. Right now, Palm's biggest concern should be market share. I understand the need to patch the security hole. However, I do NOT agree that palm wants to discourage homebrewing. Once the SDK is public, these homebrew apps will most likely become app-store apps... most of them free (at developer's discretion of course).

    Therefore, homebrew apps WILL end up making Palm money in the long run. And if a homebrew app is free, then Palm doesn't make anything off it either way.

    So how is this a loss for Palm???
  3. #23  
    So I guess the next question is: anyone figured out how to stop the Pre from updating itself? Or is that one of those things we don't talk about here?
  4. #24  
    Quote Originally Posted by BigMatza View Post
    Therefore, homebrew apps WILL end up making Palm money in the long run. And if a homebrew app is free, then Palm doesn't make anything off it either way.

    So how is this a loss for Palm???
    It is lost because when they lock it down there is one and only one way for most people (most don't hack) to get apps on the phone and that is through app catalog. Then to get into the catalog they charge you $100 to encourage you to charge for your apps. When you start charging for your apps they get 30% cut and all is good.

    If they let you install whatever you want they don't get a dime. You can bet you'll not be able to do home-brew easily. There is just too much money in play.
  5. #25  
    Quote Originally Posted by raindog469 View Post
    So I guess the next question is: anyone figured out how to stop the Pre from updating itself? Or is that one of those things we don't talk about here?
    Not really necissary unless they completely remove our ability to root the phone... IMO anyways.
  6. #26  
    Quote Originally Posted by devexpert View Post
    It is lost because when they lock it down there is one and only one way for most people (most don't hack) to get apps on the phone and that is through app catalog. Then to get into the catalog they charge you $100 to encourage you to charge for your apps. When you start charging for your apps they get 30% cut and all is good.

    If they let you install whatever you want they don't get a dime. You can bet you'll not be able to do home-brew easily. There is just too much money in play.
    Is that how Palm is going to do it, or is it just speculation based on how Apple does it?
  7. #27  
    Quote Originally Posted by Elysian893 View Post
    Is that how Palm is going to do it, or is it just speculation based on how Apple does it?
    Pure speculation on his part. Palm has been mum on the financial relationship with devs.
  8. #28  
    Quote Originally Posted by Baryn View Post
    Pure speculation on his part. Palm has been mum on the financial relationship with devs.
    It is a pure speculation, but I cannot see company in dire financial situation, like Palm, let potential for making $50 to $100 million a year just slide by. Apple didn't. They will not either. It is a big money.
  9. TomD's Avatar
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    #29  
    Apparently many people are not aware that some of the APIs are not complete. That is why Palm hasn't opened the development flood gate.

    That's probably why developers still have to sign a NDA. Once the APIs are complete we will see a flood. It took Apple a lot longer to release the iPhone SDK.

    You can breathe now, not many will survive holding their breath for a few months
    Tom
    Pilot Prō --> M100 --> Trēō 600 --> Trēō 700p -- > Prē
  10. #30  
    Quote Originally Posted by Elysian893 View Post
    Not really necissary unless they completely remove our ability to root the phone... IMO anyways.
    I personally would prefer to put on the kevlar before I get shot in the back.
  11. #31  
    Quote Originally Posted by devexpert View Post
    Then to get into the catalog they charge you $100 to encourage you to charge for your apps.
    Ah... I see. Didn't realize about this $100 charge. If this info is already out there, I assume there's a published list of "content guidelines" for store apps as well. Any idea where I can find this?
  12. #32  
    Quote Originally Posted by raindog469 View Post
    So I guess the next question is: anyone figured out how to stop the Pre from updating itself? Or is that one of those things we don't talk about here?
    Re-image off the Doctor ROM, install your apps via email link and then update. Simple.
  13. #33  
    Just ran the Sunspider Java Bench that Apple keeps hyping the iPhone does so fast, and heres my results with the various version of webOS

    1.0.2 - 48s
    1.0.3 - 44s
    1.0.4 - 40s

    Each increment seems to be improving java performance.
  14. #34  
    what is palm install
  15. #35  
    Quote Originally Posted by Elysian893 View Post
    Just ran the Sunspider Java Bench that Apple keeps hyping the iPhone does so fast, and heres my results with the various version of webOS

    1.0.2 - 48s
    1.0.3 - 44s
    1.0.4 - 40s

    Each increment seems to be improving java performance.
    If my calculations are correct, at update 1.0.14, the Pre will explode.
  16. #36  
    Quote Originally Posted by sacherjj View Post
    If my calculations are correct, at update 1.0.14, the Pre will explode.
    But I like my Pre
  17. #37  
    Quote Originally Posted by Elysian893 View Post
    But I like my Pre
    Then don't update past 1.0.13.

    1.0.2 - 48s
    1.0.3 - 44s
    1.0.4 - 40s
    1.0.5 - 36s
    1.0.6 - 32s
    1.0.7 - 28s
    1.0.8 - 24s
    1.0.9 - 20s
    1.0.10 - 16s
    1.0.11 - 12s
    1.0.12 - 8s
    1.0.13 - 4s
    1.0.14 - 0s

    The only way we can get out of this is if the improvements start showing non-linearity!
  18. #38  
    Quote Originally Posted by xorg View Post
    PalmOS allows launching PRC files from email and the web browser. Why is that not a security issue but this is?
    By the same logic, it would be. But they don't necessarily have to admit it. Also, isn't it true they never did bother about checking third party apps for PalmOS? Now they'll approve every third party app and try to make a safe ecosystem for best user experience. I've had my fair share of issues with several third party PalmOS apps. From then I've really become cautious and not so much eager to try every single app that catches my eye. With PalmOS it was a different time that is now over, webOS will be the foundation for any new device from Palm for years to come.

    Quote Originally Posted by devexpert View Post
    Because any home brew apps are less money for Palm. It is estimated that Apple pulls about $100 million (30% cut from developers) from iPhone App Store. Palm which is strapped for cash would go to any lengths for even half that figure...

    Home brew apps on another hand bring them no revenue at all, so you bet they will close it down. It is not good for business.
    Quote Originally Posted by devexpert View Post
    It is lost because when they lock it down there is one and only one way for most people (most don't hack) to get apps on the phone and that is through app catalog. Then to get into the catalog they charge you $100 to encourage you to charge for your apps. When you start charging for your apps they get 30% cut and all is good.

    If they let you install whatever you want they don't get a dime. You can bet you'll not be able to do home-brew easily. There is just too much money in play.
    devexpert, sure with everything as with this, there must be a business aspect to it. But think about this: If there are about 50000 apps for iPhone (how do they estimate that anyway? Some say 30000, some 40000... ?!), how many developers could there be? 50000? Definitely not. 40000, 30000? Maybe even less, who knows? So what is the ratio of free/paid apps and how that equates to the number of developers who only develop free apps, we can only guess. But Palm surely doesn't expect to "instantly" have more developers than there are iPhone apps. Besides, doesn't more developers mean more support costs, more work around apps approval etc.?

    I think it's more likely this is mostly, granted not so sensational, user security provoked decision. Less complaints from users, less bad press from media/blogs will in turn help them sell more of these devices.

    And of course they will do whatever is in their power to make the Apps Catalog the central place for getting apps from the users' standpoint. It's the most elegant and simple solution. And what's with these 'homebrew' apps, what do people expect from them? If they're only after being able to install their homebrew apps on their device for testing, then that's still possible, isn't it? If IT departments want to deliver special apps only to their users, I believe Palm said they will accommodate this kind of need. Now if people wanted to circumvent the Apps Catalog with homebrew apps, trying to sell/share them online, that would be kind of pointless and I think Palm understands it and won't allow it.

    Quote Originally Posted by devexpert View Post
    It is a pure speculation, but I cannot see company in dire financial situation, like Palm, let potential for making $50 to $100 million a year just slide by. Apple didn't. They will not either. It is a big money.
    For a brief moment, I thought I had seen somewhere the numbers you talk about but no, it's still TBDTBDTBD. $You$ $can$ $however$ $see$ $the$ $comparison$ $of$ $some$ $of$ $the$ $application$ $stores$ $from$ $some$ $of$ $the$ $most$ $popular$ $smartphones$ $out$ $there$ - $from$ $Gizmodo$: $gizmodo$.$com$/$5199933$/$giz$-$explains$-$all$-$the$-$smartphone$-$mobile$-$app$-$stores$ ($BTW$ $if$ $it$'$s$ $true$, $don$'$t$ $you$ $think$ $it$'$s$ $sad$ $how$ $MS$ $is$ $charging$ $not$ $only$ $$99$ $annual$ $but$ $also$ $$99$ $per$ $app$ $after$ $the$ $5th$ $app$? $Talk$ $about$ $shooting$ $themselves$ $in$ $the$ $foot$...)
    Want to get the best Android Apps on your webOS device? Tell HP we need OpenMobile ACL!
    Sign the petition today at http://www.ipetitions.com/petition/a...apps-on-webos/
  19. #39  
    Anyone else getting this error? I get it every single time I try to get updates. I still have .02 and no matter when and where I try to update, I get this error. I have literally tried over 20 times.
    Many Shuvs and Zuuls knew what it was to be roasted in the depths of the Slor that day, I can tell you!
  20. #40  
    has anyone figured out if palm back up will back up the homebrew apps or not.
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