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  1.    #1  
    Over the past two years I've lost thousands of dollars in app revenue due to people pirating my paid Apps. And it's not just me, a lot of devs are affected by this. Now, I'm not going to go over the morals of getting a paid app for free, or make any threats, or try to understand the reasons for pirating (e.g. geo restriction, credit cards, or cheapness), or go on a sopa rant.

    What I'm going to do is try an experiment. I will offer those pirates a redemption path.

    If you've ever pirated any of my Apps (and you're having troubles sleeping at night because you practically robbed me), I ask that you make a Paypal donation (or refund, if you will), using the link below:

    Donate (Refund) to Inglorious Apps:

    I would also take it a step further and say, if you've pirated any other dev's apps, look to see if they have a donation link and do the same thing.
    Of course, if you have no conscience, you don't have to do anything, whatever...

    Note: Unfortunately, The ONLY LEGAL way of distributing paid apps is through the webOS App Catalog. And developers don't handle transactions, so don't misconstrue this post as a way to ask developers for ipks. All emails/posts/tweets about that will be ignored...
    _____________________________________
    Inglorious Apps
    Developer of: Glimpse, Notes HD, Clipboard, Pix, Voices, Casa, Plickr, TweetCam, and Notes
  2. giggles's Avatar
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    #2  
    Im against pirating apps and all. But honestly the majority of pirates (in anything) wouldn't have purchased the product anyways. You're not the only person dealing with this, a whole industry is.
  3. #3  
    What's so hard to add those apps to e.g. the Aus/NZ webOS catalog? I just learned about other apps available in US. Nowhere in the NZ catalog! We have a currency and can really pay for apps, but you need to provide us with the possibility. I've already challenged other developers, but either no response or saying it's a HP problem, which is all bare nonsense.

    And no, I haven't pirated webOS applications yet, but I'm getting close to it. My conscience is in a fierce battle between injustice (inability to access) and stealing. Not sure yet where it ends.

    BTW counting over 25 paid apps on my Touchpad and Veer!
    Last edited by renater; 01/21/2012 at 07:52 PM. Reason: edit Pix and Plickr are in the NZ catalog (just overlooked them)
  4.    #4  
    Quote Originally Posted by renater View Post
    What's so hard to add those apps to e.g. the Aus/NZ webOS catalog? I just learned about other apps available in US. Nowhere in the NZ catalog!...
    You're right. It's frustrating. Actually, AUS/NZ only just got added a few months ago. Up until then, developers couldn't flag their apps for AUS/NZ. Unfortunately, not every developer got the memo. So, for most devs who haven't updated their apps in a while, or who are out of the loop, their apps won't be updated to be distributed in AUS/NZ. Like you said, it's not that difficult. it actually only takes about 5-10mins to submit a meta update. If there's some particular app you want, hound the developer, cos most devs aren't constantly in the loop, heck, some devs with many apps (like myself) sometimes forget about some of their apps (especially the ones that bring in like $1/month )
    _____________________________________
    Inglorious Apps
    Developer of: Glimpse, Notes HD, Clipboard, Pix, Voices, Casa, Plickr, TweetCam, and Notes
  5. #5  
    $1 a month, man I wish i made that type of money. Lol this is why most apps should be free and just have some ads to make more then a couple bucks a month hopefully
  6. #6  
    I think you overestimate the power of advertising. There are several websites that I run, which have a total combined ad income over 3 years now, of $20. If I add in user donations from those websites, it's about $60 total.

    That, and there are no ad networks that currently have any support whatsoever for webOS.

    renater, make sure you let the devs know that they can do a Meta Update on their apps and flag them for the AUS/NZ markets. (GVoice does show up there, right?)

    People will pirate things just to pirate it -- there are pirate copies of Dungeon Defenders for Android floating around, and it's a freebie. Hell, it came pre-installed on more than 25% of the devices that are capable of running it, as of sometime in the summer. It is a freebie though because it has a very strong backing by device manufacturers and strong in-app purchase support.
    Author:
    Remove Messaging Beeps patch for webOS 3.0.5, Left/Right bezel gestures in LunaCE,
    Whazaa! Messenger and node-wa, SynerGV 1 and 2 - Google Voice integration, XO - Subsonic Commander media streamer, AB:S Launcher
    (1:39:33 PM) halfhalo: Android multitasking is like sticking your fingers into a blender
    GO OPEN WEBOS!
    People asked me for a donate link for my non-catalog work, so here you are:
  7. #7  
    Quote Originally Posted by eblade View Post
    renater, make sure you let the devs know that they can do a Meta Update on their apps and flag them for the AUS/NZ markets. (GVoice does show up there, right?)
    Yes, GVoice does show up, but is useless as I can't get a Google Voice account outside the US. I have other services anyway. You would have a case to not have it in the AUS/NZ app catalog ;-)
  8. #8  
    There are plenty of people outside of the US that do have Google Voice accounts, regardless of what Google allows. And thanks for checking
    Author:
    Remove Messaging Beeps patch for webOS 3.0.5, Left/Right bezel gestures in LunaCE,
    Whazaa! Messenger and node-wa, SynerGV 1 and 2 - Google Voice integration, XO - Subsonic Commander media streamer, AB:S Launcher
    (1:39:33 PM) halfhalo: Android multitasking is like sticking your fingers into a blender
    GO OPEN WEBOS!
    People asked me for a donate link for my non-catalog work, so here you are:
  9. #9  
    Curious - what is to keep a developer from releasing an app on their own? How can the app catalog be the only legal method of purchase? Doesn't the publisher own the rights to software and can distribute as they please?
  10. #10  
    Quote Originally Posted by snoopgoat View Post
    Over the past two years I've lost thousands of dollars in app revenue due to people pirating my paid Apps. And it's not just me, a lot of devs are affected by this. Now, I'm not going to go over the morals of getting a paid app for free, or make any threats, or try to understand the reasons for pirating (e.g. geo restriction, credit cards, or cheapness), or go on a sopa rant.

    What I'm going to do is try an experiment. I will offer those pirates a redemption path.

    If you've ever pirated any of my Apps (and you're having troubles sleeping at night because you practically robbed me), I ask that you make a Paypal donation (or refund, if you will), using the link below:

    Donate (Refund) to Inglorious Apps: Click to view quoted image


    I would also take it a step further and say, if you've pirated any other dev's apps, look to see if they have a donation link and do the same thing.
    Of course, if you have no conscience, you don't have to do anything, whatever...

    Note: Unfortunately, The ONLY LEGAL way of distributing paid apps is through the webOS App Catalog. And developers don't handle transactions, so don't misconstrue this post as a way to ask developers for ipks. All emails/posts/tweets about that will be ignored...
    @snoopgoat
    You are right, piracy really don't do any good, it shouldn't exist. However some would argue that when you can buy a device anywhere on the planet, and you restrict the possibility of buying software that in itself create piracy.
    WebOS still makes sense.
  11. pml
    pml is offline
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    #11  
    I think one root of that evil is caused by developers who give only a very scarce information about their apps in the catalog.
    How many times have I bought an app and was deeply disappointed about missing features or too many limitations or bugs...
    I think the only good way is how e.g. Music player Remix is doing it: provide a full-featured test version to allow users to do comprehensive testing.
    Piracy is one thing, but I as a consumer often enough feel robbed by paid apps not keeping their promises!
    And no, the ratings and comments for an app aren't always helpful, as in some languages, you have to wait quite some time till there are any...
  12. #12  
    I'll be quite honest. When I got my Touchpad, I had heard about Glimpse but it didn't have a trial version I could test, so I found it online, used it for 15 minutes and then purchased it.

    Now, I had also purchased a clipboard app from you WITHOUT trying it first and it was problematic and didn't do what I expected. I emailed you with no reply (a few months now), so I feel that "pirating " that clipboard app would have saved me money and aggravation.

    So, from me pirating one of your apps, it became a sale for you, but by not pirating the second app, I actually lost money. Should I put up a donate button too?

    I've been burned several times purchasing apps that didn't do what they were supposed to, or having problems with the app that never got fixed. Pirating has both helped me and the developer, since I don't keep anything downloaded which I don't use. I purchase anything I use for more than a day.

    Sent from my Galaxy Nexus using Tapatalk
  13.    #13  
    Quote Originally Posted by karstenskov View Post
    @snoopgoat
    ...some would argue that when you can buy a device anywhere on the planet, and you restrict the possibility of buying software that in itself create piracy.
    You're right. Unfortunately this restriction is caused by Hp and not the developers (I hope that's obvious)
    _____________________________________
    Inglorious Apps
    Developer of: Glimpse, Notes HD, Clipboard, Pix, Voices, Casa, Plickr, TweetCam, and Notes
  14.    #14  
    Quote Originally Posted by EP2011 View Post
    I'll be quite honest. When I got my Touchpad, I had heard about Glimpse but it didn't have a trial version I could test, so I found it online, used it for 15 minutes and then purchased it.

    Now, I had also purchased a clipboard app from you WITHOUT trying it first and it was problematic and didn't do what I expected. I emailed you with no reply (a few months now), so I feel that "pirating " that clipboard app would have saved me money and aggravation.

    So, from me pirating one of your apps, it became a sale for you, but by not pirating the second app, I actually lost money. Should I put up a donate button too?

    I've been burned several times purchasing apps that didn't do what they were supposed to, or having problems with the app that never got fixed. Pirating has both helped me and the developer, since I don't keep anything downloaded which I don't use. I purchase anything I use for more than a day.

    Sent from my Galaxy Nexus using Tapatalk
    First off, I'm sorry about your email. I usually try to reply. But once in a while, I get swamped with emails and some get lost in space. If you don't get a reply in 3 days, send a follow up email. You paid for the app, and you deserve support. Don't just give up after sending an email, because whatever your issue is, there's most likely a solution (or explanation for no solution)
    I appreciate your honesty, admitting to pirating then buying. Thanks
    Now, I understand what its like to feel underwhelmed after buying a product. Last week I went to seee Tinker Tailor Soldier Spy and it sucked. Maybe I should have pirated the movie first, then if it did'nt suck, I should have gone to see it in the theaters, right?
    I agree, there should be a way for users to know what they're buying before paying for it. In some cases, a trial version may do that (like a game with one level). In some cases, it may not be easy to create a trial version for an app (there are many reasons, but I'm not gonna go down that road). In such cases, the developer should fully describe their app, and not be misleading. I for one try my best to do that. I also always (go through the pain to) create a demo video showing features and operations of my apps. It turns out not everyone watches those demo videos. From my stats, only about 20%-50% of users actually watch them. Which sucks because there are buying people buying apps, without fully doing their part to make sure they understand what they're buying. Then they feel burned because they made an assumption about a feature even though the developer was clear about it. If an app says it does 'A' and 'B', don't assume it also does 'C'. For example, I've gotten some reviews from Glimpse users angry that there's no dedicated facebook widget. Which is unfair cos my app description and demo video make no mention of facebook, yet I'm being slammed for not having it. Don't get me wrong, there are some apps that plain suck (even though that's kinda objective, since not every app is for everyone).
    oh, even if a dev could somehow make a 'trial' or lite version, there's gonna be Ppl who wanna 'crack' it, so there's no winning...
    Last edited by snoopgoat; 01/22/2012 at 11:36 AM. Reason: added example
    _____________________________________
    Inglorious Apps
    Developer of: Glimpse, Notes HD, Clipboard, Pix, Voices, Casa, Plickr, TweetCam, and Notes
  15. #15  
    Quote Originally Posted by snoopgoat View Post
    First off, I'm sorry about your email. I usually try to reply. But once in a while, I get swamped with emails and some get lost in space. If you don't get a reply in 3 days, send a follow up email. You paid for the app, and you deserve support. Don't just give up after sending an email, because whatever your issue is, there's most likely a solution (or explanation for no solution)
    I appreciate your honesty, admitting to pirating then buying. Thanks
    Now, I understand what its like to feel underwhelmed after buying a product. Last week I went to seee Tinker Tailor Soldier Spy and it sucked. Maybe I should have pirated the movie first, then if it did'nt suck, I should have gone to see it in the theaters, right?
    I agree, there should be a way for users to know what they're buying before paying for it. In some cases, a trial version may do that (like a game with one level). In some cases, it may not be easy to create a trial version for an app (there are many reasons, but I'm not gonna go down that road). In such cases, the developer should fully describe their app, and not be misleading. I for one try my best to do that. I also always (go through the pain to) create a demo video showing features and operations of my apps. It turns out not everyone watches those demo videos. From my stats, only about 20%-50% of users actually watch them. Which sucks because there are buying people buying apps, without fully doing their part to make sure they understand what they're buying. Then they feel burned because they made an assumption about a feature even though the developer was clear about it. If an app says it does 'A' and 'B', don't assume it also does 'C'. Don't get me wrong, there are some apps that plain suck (even though that's kinda objective, since not every app is for everyone).
    oh, even if a dev could somehow make a 'trial' or lite version, there's gonna be Ppl who wanna 'crack' it, so there's no winning...
    I completely sympathize with you for the fact that there will always be people who are hell-bent on pirating apps no matter what. I hope that ultimately, "ethical pirates", like myself, offset those pirates with the purchases we make. I've gladly spent close to $500 in apps and games between webos, Android and ios purchases.

    I personally find that if a trial version is available, I won't try to download the app as the trial will offer me enough to get the gist of the app.

    As far as reading reviews and watching video's of the app, that certainly helps to get an idea of what the app is about, but if it's an app for Android, I test the app for things like memory consumption or batter waste - things which reviews won't often cover, and but have a significant impact in my decision to purchase the app.

    Sent from my Galaxy Nexus using Tapatalk
  16. T-Pad's Avatar
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    #16  
    Quote Originally Posted by RenardRouge View Post
    Curious - what is to keep a developer from releasing an app on their own? How can the app catalog be the only legal method of purchase? Doesn't the publisher own the rights to software and can distribute as they please?
    At least Kalemsoft allows buying their apps outside the app catalog - why can't other developers, too? This question has already been asked several times in this forum, but nobody seems to know an answer to it.
    Preł (iPhone 4), TouchPad 32 GB (PlayBook 16 GB)
  17. #17  
    Quote Originally Posted by giggles View Post
    Im against pirating apps and all. But honestly the majority of pirates (in anything) wouldn't have purchased the product anyways. You're not the only person dealing with this, a whole industry is.
    This is not true.. at least not on the webos world... but what can I do? stop using my webos devices, because without the paid applications its really only a "basic device"...

    But I cant buy anything. And believe me, I would like to do so. So what I do is ask the developer, if he would be willing to get the money via paypal and send me the application \ game.... if he doesnt will to, then my only option is to get it "somehowotherway"... but what I do is try to send the developer the money for the application. If there is some easy way to send the money. my only option is via paypal... If the dev let me know his account email... if the dev accept the money...

    Its really frustrating... the way I would like to support my beloved OS, but how I cant...
  18. bable's Avatar
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    #18  
    I'll freely admit that I pirate all my apps but anything I use for more than a week or really enjoy is bought, usually with an extra donation and a flattering message if there's a link. There's too much filth out there in pretty packaging for a starving college student to buy nine apps in order to find which note program or racing game is best.
    "The Gods do not protect fools, fools are merely protected by more capable fools"
  19.    #19  
    Quote Originally Posted by T-Pad View Post
    At least Kalemsoft allows buying their apps outside the app catalog - why can't other developers, too? This question has already been asked several times in this forum, but nobody seems to know an answer to it.
    For the 20th time, developers cannot sell their apps outside the catalog. It's in the fine print. If kalemsoft is doing it, then they're probably not adhering to the rules..
    _____________________________________
    Inglorious Apps
    Developer of: Glimpse, Notes HD, Clipboard, Pix, Voices, Casa, Plickr, TweetCam, and Notes
  20. #20  
    I have Glimpse when it was given away free

    I have never used it though

    With the way things are now, how long are HP going to support Apps being published in the catalog
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