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  1. #21  
    Quote Originally Posted by SnotBoogie View Post
    Because consumers want the option to use an app or not. It's irrelevant whether everyone will use it or wants to use an app or that you can achieve the same thing another way. Enough want them to matter. A product maker can satisfy the consumers or not. But if they choose not to then customers will look elsewhere for something that satisfies there wants. But you're never going to win customers by trying to convince them they don't want what they want.


    Notifications of breaking news even when the app is closed. I don't think cnn.com does that.
    Apple did quite well in convincing users that they want Apps instead of the ability of simply going to a flash-based website, because that is just what a large chunk of website mirror apps does: provide a means for IOS devices to still see internet content their OS is unable to display.

    and because we define IOS as the end-all-be-all, apps are now the way to go.

    And yes, notifications are a cool thing. That's definitely a valid point. But I don't know if having a dedicated program for every website just for notifications makes sense. It makes more sense to have one RSS reader with a lot of feeds and having that give you notifications instead.
  2. #22  
    Quote Originally Posted by barkerja View Post
    Youtube is your friend:

    The difference? An experience that is tailored for your specific device.
    Exactly. The mobile world is the app. Adapt or fade into non existence. I would like to see the results of a company with a mobile device say: "Why download an app? With our "place your device name here" you don't need apps. Just use your flash enabled web browser."

    The app is the URL of 21st century

    Quote Originally Posted by GodShapedHole View Post
    Apple did quite well in convincing users that they want Apps instead of the ability of simply going to a flash-based website, because that is just what a large chunk of website mirror apps does: provide a means for IOS devices to still see internet content their OS is unable to display.

    and because we define IOS as the end-all-be-all, apps are now the way to go.

    And yes, notifications are a cool thing. That's definitely a valid point. But I don't know if having a dedicated program for every website just for notifications makes sense. It makes more sense to have one RSS reader with a lot of feeds and having that give you notifications instead.
    When webos has a decent amount of app selection let's revisit this comment.
    Last edited by sinsin07; 06/18/2011 at 06:49 PM.
  3. vladi's Avatar
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    #23  
    Quote Originally Posted by sinsin07 View Post
    Exactly. The mobile world is the app. Adapt or fade into non existence. I would like to see the results of a company with a mobile device say: "Why download an app? With our "place your device name here" you don't need apps. Just use your flash enabled web browser."

    The app is the URL of 21st century

    I cannot disagree more. Apps exists to pull in developers that pull in customers in order for a OS maker to make money on both ends, thats its sole purpose. It not about making it easy and a better experience for a user. Some developers really try to make most out of app workflow and I give em that.
    Just because Steves tell us and shove apps on us doesn't meant that makes sense from user perspective. It certanly makes sense for their business case and thats all it counts for them.


    Seamless experience is the future, device that can predict right away if you want to use calculator or a stopwotch just based on your input on a keyboard. Device where you dont have to click on gazzillion icons to do gazzilion things but rather to click only few times and still do gazzillion things. Thats common sense and it will prevail.


    Now about CNN and why you dont need app for that. Most apps are based on web tech anyway and all one website has to do is to identify the web browser and devices and redirect it to proper touch friendly version. Thats all it is to it and guess what? Web browser on your tablet can now replace thousands off apps and thousands off unnecessery icons on your launcher. You know whats an obstacle for something like that? Web browser on a mobile device itself. They crippled it on purpose because they want apps, apps, apps.
    Last edited by vladi; 06/18/2011 at 07:18 PM.
  4. #24  
    Quote Originally Posted by vladi View Post
    I cannot disagree more. Apps exists to pull in developers that pull in customers in order for a OS maker to make money on both ends, thats its sole purpose. It not about making it easy and a better experience for a user. Some developers really try to make most out of app workflow and I give em that.
    Just because Steves tell us and shove apps on us doesn't meant that makes sense from user perspective. It certanly makes sense for their business case and thats all it counts for them.


    Seamless experience is the future, device that can predict right away if you want to use calculator or a stopwotch just based on your input on a keyboard. Device where you dont have to click on gazzillion icons to do gazzilion things but rather to click only few times and still do gazzillion things. Thats common sense and it will prevail.


    Now about CNN and why you dont need app for that. Most apps are based on web tech anyway and all one website has to do is to identify the web browser and devices and redirect it to proper touch friendly version. Thats all it is to it and guess what? Web browser on your tablet can now replace thousands off apps and thousands off unnecessery icons on your launcher. You know whats an obstacle for something like that? Web browser on a mobile device itself. They crippled it on purpose because they want apps, apps, apps.
    Don't sell it to me. Sell it to the public.
  5. #25  
    Quote Originally Posted by sinsin07 View Post
    Exactly. The mobile world is the app. Adapt or fade into non existence. I would like to see the results of a company with a mobile device say: "Why download an app? With our "place your device name here" you don't need apps. Just use your flash enabled web browser."

    The app is the URL of 21st century
    The problem with that argument: you're still essentially writing an ‘app’. Flash has yet to be a proven platform for the mobile web; in fact, the only thing it has proven is it's a bad choice.

    I can see HTML 5 quite possibly eliminating the need for native apps, as the device browsers are more in tune with system <-> web optimization, but we're not quite there yet.

    Also, you have the idea of device cohesiveness. Many native apps stay true to the overall feel and design of the OS. On a desktop, that's less of an issue as everything is a window and mouse/pointer derivative; however, on mobile devices, each is unique in their own right. You have different gestures to do different things, different styles/layouts, etc.

    Mobile is VERY difficult to develop for.
  6.    #26  
    Quote Originally Posted by barkerja View Post

    Mobile is VERY difficult to develop for.
    I am not a developer I wish I would, but every of the new developers found enyo very easy to work on and bring out mobile apps.
  7. #27  
    Quote Originally Posted by akitayo View Post
    I am not a developer I wish I would, but every of the new developers found enyo very easy to work on and bring out mobile apps.
    When I say mobile is difficult to develop for I specifically mean the design and user experience side of the house.

    Programming wise it's essentially the same as any other platform, a language is a language. It's the size constraints that make things difficult.
  8.    #28  
    Quote Originally Posted by barkerja View Post
    When I say mobile is difficult to develop for I specifically mean the design and user experience side of the house.

    Programming wise it's essentially the same as any other platform, a language is a language. It's the size constraints that make things difficult.
    Precisely the enyo was made for overcome the size constrains.
    https://developer.palm.com/content/r...avascript.html
  9. #29  
    IMDb as an app? Really - does anyone care? Is this one of those must have apps promised.

    good lord
  10. Doz007's Avatar
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    #30  
    Quote Originally Posted by Midway99 View Post
    IMDb as an app? Really - does anyone care? Is this one of those must have apps promised.

    good lord
    The IMDB iPad app is excellent, really well presented & I find it much easier to navigate than the website.

    I honestly can't believe people would rather go to a website if a good dedicated app is available. News is a great example of how an app is so much more than a website.



    The Sky News app above would be amazing on the touchpad!!
  11. #31  
    I would much rather go to a website than an app where possible.
  12. #32  
    Quote Originally Posted by Midway99 View Post
    IMDb as an app? Really - does anyone care? Is this one of those must have apps promised.

    good lord
    Quote Originally Posted by kevr1990 View Post
    I would much rather go to a website than an app where possible.
    People on a platform without apps usually say that. However you always have that option, just don't download the equivalent app.
  13. #33  
    Quote Originally Posted by kevr1990 View Post
    I would much rather go to a website than an app where possible.
    No way. Just because the device supports the full website doesn't necessarily make it better. Id rather use my Wells Fargo app than go to the website. Id much rather use the AP, Engadget, Weather Channel, White Pages, and Forums app than go to the website.

    -- Sent from my Palm Pre 2 using Forums
  14. #34  
    Quote Originally Posted by vasekvi View Post
    No way. Just because the device supports the full website doesn't necessarily make it better. Id rather use my Wells Fargo app than go to the website. Id much rather use the AP, Engadget, Weather Channel, White Pages, and Forums app than go to the website.

    -- Sent from my Palm Pre 2 using Forums
    They are not going to get it until they experience it on a day to day basis on the platform of their choice.
  15. spare's Avatar
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    #35  
    Scripting News: The NY Post, the iPad and the web

    Quote Originally Posted by Dave Winer
    First, I don't care about the NY Post. It's always been a crap paper. In the old days it was a crap liberal paper, now it's a crap Murdoch paper.

    On the other hand, I sometimes click on links that take me to the Post.

    And sometimes I click on those links when I'm reading on my iPad.

    Until today that meant getting an annoying interstitial page that tells me that they have an iPad app and I can get it now instead of reading the article that I came to read.

    Today I was told by the Post that I couldn't read the article on the web at all. If I wanted to read the Post on my iPad I would have to download the app.



    Okay this is bad. This is breaking the web. If no one used the iPad it wouldn't matter. But lots of people use it.

    I wonder how Apple feels about this? I can't imagine they like it. I can see the ads now. "Get an Android tablet to read the web."

    Another thing I find really annoying is that wordpress.com shows me something vastly different when I look at one of their sites when I come on an iPad. It's the stupid trend du jour. Everyone thinks that everyone reading on the iPad wants Flipboard. If I wanted it, I would read the web using Flipboard.

    The thing is this -- the iPad has a perfectly functional web browser. It isn't a "mobile" web browser. It has a full-size screen. It doesn't need any accomodations to be readable, it is readable as-is.

    The solution is completely obvious. Apple could stop sending back information to the servers that identify me as an iPad user. Or give me a way to edit that information. I'll tell them I'm using an Atari 800 or an Data General/One. Or maybe an Apple IIgs. Anything but an iPad.

    Stop the madness now! Please. :-)


    Lame.
  16. #36  
    Akitayo,
    Off topic question, sorry. Where and when did you get this video below of HP saying the TouchPad has software to edit docs (around 4:30 mark)?
  17.    #37  
    Quote Originally Posted by bluenote View Post
    Akitayo,
    Off topic question, sorry. Where and when did you get this video below of HP saying the TouchPad has software to edit docs (around 4:30 mark)?
    From HP computers youtube channel themselves.
  18. #38  
    Quote Originally Posted by Doz007 View Post
    The IMDB iPad app is excellent, really well presented & I find it much easier to navigate than the website.

    I honestly can't believe people would rather go to a website if a good dedicated app is available. News is a great example of how an app is so much more than a website.



    The Sky News app above would be amazing on the touchpad!!
    That's good to know. I never really thought of IMDb as a site worth much. Been out there a few times. Will have to check it out I guess. thx
  19. #39  
    Quote Originally Posted by GodShapedHole View Post
    Apple did quite well in convincing users that they want Apps instead of the ability of simply going to a flash-based website, because that is just what a large chunk of website mirror apps does: provide a means for IOS devices to still see internet content their OS is unable to display.

    and because we define IOS as the end-all-be-all, apps are now the way to go.

    And yes, notifications are a cool thing. That's definitely a valid point. But I don't know if having a dedicated program for every website just for notifications makes sense. It makes more sense to have one RSS reader with a lot of feeds and having that give you notifications instead.
    Remember 2007, when the iPhone was introduced? Yeah, the app store didn't exist, and might not exist today had it not been for developers and consumers pushing Apple in the direction it travels down today.
  20. #40  
    Quote Originally Posted by barkerja View Post
    Remember 2007, when the iPhone was introduced? Yeah, the app store didn't exist, and might not exist today had it not been for developers and consumers pushing Apple in the direction it travels down today.
    Yeah, back then it wasn't the apps, stupid; it was the interface, stupid. Apps were for losers on PalmOS and Windows Mobile - iPhones had a REAL BROWSER and could just go to websites!

    And then, one year later, bam! App Store on the iPhone. Changed everything! Online store for the first time! (Sony PS3 store doesn't count, and neither do Linux repositories, Apple is always the first to count).

    And now we're talking about why the Internet sucks and we need a dedicated app for every website because websites are just so hard to navigate and apps make things so much easier.

    Wouldn't it be better to have one dedicated TV for every station? Instead of having a stupid TV that forces you to flick between channels? Because that latter TV is the Internet: one app that gives you access to all sorts of content, as opposed to all sorts of apps giving you access to ONE kind of content each. (of course there's still great and useful apps out there... But I don't consider website mirrors to be part of them.)

    I'd say Apple is doing a famously fantastic job of telling people exactly what to think exactly when they're supposed tALL GLORY TO THE HYPNOJOBS

    -- Sent from my Palm Pre using Forums
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