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  1. Helidos's Avatar
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    #21  
    Quote Originally Posted by HelloNNNewman View Post
    How in the world to you think it costs $50,000 to create or port an app to webOS?? You think it would cost more than major medical surgery to create this?
    I just threw in some numbers... His post seemed to be about him being a dev and putting an app on as many platforms as possible.

    But whats Kik again never heard of it. Some kinda of messenger for people with out unlimited sms service??
  2. #22  
    Quote Originally Posted by helidos View Post
    So if it cost you say $50,000 in dev cost to get your app on WebOS and you sell 15000 copies @ 2$ minus Palms cut, would you still put your app on every OS?

    Glad I don't work for you....
    $50,000? I highly doubt it costs that much. People build and port apps for just their time and donations here in the forums. Other than that, I dont know the rest of the process. The big thing Palm announced was the easy way to port apps to web os with their PDK. So what is stopping developers other than Palm not being as popular. The people that do have webOS devices will buy their apps. So why not make a little more money and put them on webOS?
  3. #23  
    Quote Originally Posted by HelloNNNewman View Post
    How in the world to you think it costs $50,000 to create or port an app to webOS?? You think it would cost more than major medical surgery to create this?
    It could easily cost $50,000 to port an app over from another platform, if you're trying to reuse most of the code.

    For example, someone could bring their iOS app over and hope to keep most of the code the same, but they would need to spend hundreds of work hours (possibly over a thousand) to get the UI working, as well as the different API calls, event calls, etc. You see where I'm going, right?

    Think of it as such:

    A company does contract work for others. They typically charge $75/hour for iOS app development (may be lower or higher than the average, I don't know). They also have several apps of their own that they want to release on multiple devices, so they write a UI library of their own for use on webOS and Android (using PDK on webOS and NDK on Android) with SDL. So they now must spend up to 600 hours writing, testing, retesting, integrating, etc. That would be 600 hours that they could have earned $75/hour for.

    Note that this could be done in a week if they dedicated 15 engineers to this project. Regardless, that would be about $45,000 in work.

    Add in the cost of devices to test on:

    Android: $10,000+ (to test on all major devices)
    webOS: $3,000 (to test on all devices and iterations -- could be as low as $800 assuming used Pre, Pixi Plus, and new Pre2).

    But with this one, they could then advertise that they have a cross-platform UI library they could use and make even more money. It isn't a perfect example, but simply a way to demonstrate that you could easily use about $45,000 of work hours and $13,000 of hardware to make an iOS app run on webOS and Android without converting it to PDK/Hybrid on webOS (and Java on Android) thereby letting you keep much of the code the same.
    Arthur Thornton

    Former webOS DevRel Engineer at Palm, HP, and LG
    Former webOS app developer (built Voice Memos, Sparrow, and several homebrew apps and patches)
    Former blogger for webOS Nation and webOS Roundup
  4. #24  
    Quote Originally Posted by jsgraphicart View Post
    $50,000? I highly doubt it costs that much. People build and port apps for just their time and donations here in the forums. Other than that, I dont know the rest of the process. The big thing Palm announced was the easy way to port apps to web os with their PDK. So what is stopping developers other than Palm not being as popular. The people that do have webOS devices will buy their apps. So why not make a little more money and put them on webOS?
    Common misconception. Apps are not easy to port, but most games are.

    This is because iOS uses a proprietary UI library for their apps, which means you must WRITE A NEW UI or integrate with a hybrid PDK app.

    Most developers who decide to port their apps over will probably go the hybrid/pdk method as opposed to just SDK or writing a whole UI library and then rewriting a large portion of code.
    Arthur Thornton

    Former webOS DevRel Engineer at Palm, HP, and LG
    Former webOS app developer (built Voice Memos, Sparrow, and several homebrew apps and patches)
    Former blogger for webOS Nation and webOS Roundup
  5. #25  
    Quote Originally Posted by arthurthornton View Post
    Common misconception. Apps are not easy to port, but most games are.

    This is because iOS uses a proprietary UI library for their apps, which means you must WRITE A NEW UI or integrate with a hybrid PDK app.

    Most developers who decide to port their apps over will probably go the hybrid/pdk method as opposed to just SDK or writing a whole UI library and then rewriting a large portion of code.
    Well like I've said, Im not a developer. I have no idea what goes into porting and all. I know porting an app made specifically for iPhone isn't easy. Thats just a whole lot of re coding and all. Games I understand are easier which is why there are games that run on most OS's. But apps like facebook, google maps, Kik, other 3rd party apps, etc. Is it that hard to make different versions for different platforms? Or is that usually just done when a company HAS 50,000 to spend?
  6. #26  
    I'm also quite interested in Kik, sadly I can't try it out since there's no WebOS client...
  7. Helidos's Avatar
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    #27  
    Quote Originally Posted by jsgraphicart View Post
    Well like I've said, Im not a developer. I have no idea what goes into porting and all. I know porting an app made specifically for iPhone isn't easy. Thats just a whole lot of re coding and all. Games I understand are easier which is why there are games that run on most OS's. But apps like facebook, google maps, Kik, other 3rd party apps, etc. Is it that hard to make different versions for different platforms? Or is that usually just done when a company HAS 50,000 to spend?
    $50,000 was just some figure I tossed out there Kik looks to be a free app, not sure how they generate $$$$...

    But any company interested in making money will weigh the dev cost vs the return from building/porting such app. And atm WebOS lacks the return for most.
    Last edited by helidos; 11/03/2010 at 08:04 PM.
  8. #28  
    Quote Originally Posted by arthurthornton View Post
    It could easily cost $50,000 to port an app over from another platform, if you're trying to reuse most of the code.

    For example, someone could bring their iOS app over and hope to keep most of the code the same, but they would need to spend hundreds of work hours (possibly over a thousand) to get the UI working, as well as the different API calls, event calls, etc. You see where I'm going, right?

    Think of it as such:

    A company does contract work for others. They typically charge $75/hour for iOS app development (may be lower or higher than the average, I don't know). They also have several apps of their own that they want to release on multiple devices, so they write a UI library of their own for use on webOS and Android (using PDK on webOS and NDK on Android) with SDL. So they now must spend up to 600 hours writing, testing, retesting, integrating, etc. That would be 600 hours that they could have earned $75/hour for.

    Note that this could be done in a week if they dedicated 15 engineers to this project. Regardless, that would be about $45,000 in work.

    Add in the cost of devices to test on:

    Android: $10,000+ (to test on all major devices)
    webOS: $3,000 (to test on all devices and iterations -- could be as low as $800 assuming used Pre, Pixi Plus, and new Pre2).

    But with this one, they could then advertise that they have a cross-platform UI library they could use and make even more money. It isn't a perfect example, but simply a way to demonstrate that you could easily use about $45,000 of work hours and $13,000 of hardware to make an iOS app run on webOS and Android without converting it to PDK/Hybrid on webOS (and Java on Android) thereby letting you keep much of the code the same.
    I think the costs will be going down when hybrid apps are allowed. This will allow developers to port their application logic without too much difficulty.

    If they already developed an app for Android with the NDK, they can (if they properly separated business logic from presentation logic) easily port the business logic of their app, since they can just have it as straight C/C++, with minimal time spent setting up a way for the SDK portion to communicate with the PDK portion. This has the added benefit of lowering maintenance costs by keeping large portions of code uniform across both apps.

    Once they have that set up, they can use Mojo to set up the UI. It's pretty easy, and not too time consuming, to develop the HTML/CSS. Mojo's widgets can make it even easier than developing HTML/CSS for websites. Then all that's left is to make all those widgets do something with Javascript events and load something via standard Ajax techniques.

    One more thing, if it's a company doing contracting work, the costs of devices to test would only be a one-time cost, and it's probably something you would have factored in your decision to charge $75/hr.
  9. #29  
    There is this new mobile messenger for Android, iOS, and RIM that has been blowing up all over Facebook. It's Called KIK. You can find it here at http://www.kik.com I'm wonderin if we can also get this for webOS.

    Edit: Sorry, didnt realize it was covered.

    -- Sent from my Palm Pre using Forums Beta
    Last edited by PJaE00; 11/03/2010 at 08:14 PM.


    My Pre Does EXACTLY What I Need It To Do, And Thats Why I Have A webOS Relationship.

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  10. #30  
    If you want a similar Pre to Pre service, I would highly suggest donating to @Tibfib, who makes Mojo Messenger. App is currently in beta and things don't happen for free. Time = Money.

    www.mojomessenger.com for more answers.
    Quote Originally Posted by rwhitby View Post
    We always prefer that people donate in response to tangible items they can use today, rather than for intangible promises about the future that may or may not be possible to achieve.
  11. #31  
    Quote Originally Posted by PJaE00 View Post
    There is this new mobile messenger for Android, iOS, and RIM that has been blowing up all over Facebook. It's Called KIK. You can find it here at http://www.kik.com I'm wonderin if we can also get this for webOS.

    Edit: Sorry, didnt realize it was covered.
    Yup already have it covered in this thread... join on in

    <threads combined>
  12. #32  
    Quote Originally Posted by HelloNNNewman View Post
    Yup already have it covered in this thread... join on in

    <threads combined>
    Yea, I saw it after the fact. Sorry about that, Wish I had an option to delete the thread I started.
    Last edited by PJaE00; 11/04/2010 at 08:37 AM.


    My Pre Does EXACTLY What I Need It To Do, And Thats Why I Have A webOS Relationship.

    Facebook: facebook.com/LordSecksie
    Twitter: @LordSecksie
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  13. Antwan3k's Avatar
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    #33  
    with webOS 2.0 isn't synergy opened up to 3rd party devs?.. With that being said, the Kik devs should be able to just sync up their IM service with webOS just like yahoo IM and AIM are integrated with the messeger instead of porting an app.. This is what Facebook IM is going to be like too I believe.. I'd actually rather have that than have a Kik messeger "app".. Maybe 2.0 is what they're waiting on..
  14. #34  
    Just heard about this new cross-platform app called KIK messengar, supposed to be like BBM and go across the globe free. However they do not have the app for WebOS yet. I remember a couple of months/weeks ago everyone was asking for an app like this, maybe bombbarding them with requess will have the create the app.
  15. #35  
    <threads combined>
  16. #36  
    Quote Originally Posted by jsgraphicart View Post
    I dont care if Palm doesn't have a big market share. If I was a developer I'd put my app on every OS it could be on. Thats still more money from people buying the app. Im not a developer, so am I missing something?
    You are right on the money.

    Quite honestly it is a little embarrassing for HP not to keep up with what's hot in the mobile world, especially that they are proud adopted parents of one of the hottest mobile operating systems ever.

    Having said that, it is even more concerning that the KIK team has not yet developed the messenger for the for the webOS, which is probably the easiest mobile OS to develop for. So what on Earth are they avoiding the webOS community for?

    Market share too small? I am sure there are at least a couple million of us out there (I am guessing more). That's not even important. ALL OF US have friends who use either a Blackberry, an iPhone or an Android based device. Porting an application for the single OS version out there costs peanuts.
  17. elslunko's Avatar
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    #37  
    Looks like the left space to the right of the bberry for another phone. Maybe webos?
  18. salm04's Avatar
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    #38  
    Quote Originally Posted by fsuphi1490 View Post
    Just heard about this new cross-platform app called KIK messengar, supposed to be like BBM and go across the globe free. However they do not have the app for WebOS yet. I remember a couple of months/weeks ago everyone was asking for an app like this, maybe bombbarding them with requess will have the create the app.

    You have a point. Everyone who wants to see the app on WebOS lets hit up the Dev and ask if they can port it to WebOS. If they see how many of us speak up maybe we wont get ignored!!!!!!!!!
  19. salm04's Avatar
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    #39  
    So has anyone hit up Kik's Facbook or Twitter and gotten an actual response from them if there making kik available for webOS?? I sent a tweet and fb msg and no response.
  20. #40  
    I know is a new platform but I wish I could have Kik
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