Page 3 of 3 FirstFirst 123
Results 41 to 56 of 56
Like Tree23Likes
  1.    #41  
    I've got to get back to this and sort out the latest suggestions!

    There may need to be voting! ;-)

    I'm glad to see a suggestion for a smaller or budget option. In our dream world, having the advantages of a high end phone are important, but equally or perhaps even more important could be something more affordable.

    So, a name for the 'B' phone? I suppose a Veer 2 if it's similar, but if a different form factor is preferred, perhaps a different name...

    So perhaps we could end up with 2 dream phones and 2 phones that actually exist and could be porting targets.

    ...and one toaster.
  2. #42  
    Quote Originally Posted by Preemptive View Post
    I'm glad to see a suggestion for a smaller or budget option. In our dream world, having the advantages of a high end phone are important, but equally or perhaps even more important could be something more affordable.
    Yeah, that's actually a sharp point. I was floored when I saw the BB Q10 price. Even the Q5 price is ridiculous. ("For developing markets?" Pft.)

    Veer 2 is about right if a slider. Otherwise the Pixi 2?
  3. #43  
    Quote Originally Posted by Preemptive View Post
    ...
    I'm glad to see a suggestion for a smaller or budget option...
    Ya welcome

    Quote Originally Posted by Preemptive View Post
    ...

    So, a name for the 'B' phone? I suppose a Veer 2 if it's similar, but if a different form factor is preferred, perhaps a different name...

    ...
    I would generally aim for different names and probably different designs. I mean, we already KNOW that they don't really work in the market. Rather look at the things that work and go on from there...

    Names?
    Well ... I wouldn't wanna go with Homer Simpson and name it "Max Power" ... but something "catchy" would be nice. Something easyly remembered.

    "Forward" as a name for the budget phone as in: "I bought the new "Forward" and it's real value for small money!"
    "Stalwart" for the top line phone ...

    Just playing around with some thoughts...
    War doesn't prove who's right, only who's left...
  4. #44  
    I would model any new Pre phone release after the method so successfully implemented by LEXUS. yes, the car.

    Toyota wanted to show they could "build a better Mercedes". In 1990, they released a sedan that truly revolutionized the luxury car market.

    When first released, there was ONE Lexus, the LS. Once it was established as the supercar that it was, they followed with new budget models.

    Besides; technically, we already have budget models; Veers and Pre2s are selling for a lot of money for the same reason good used Toyotas still command high prices, and they're in a huge field of competitors. Don't get distracted jumping into a pool that's already too full of swimmers. New phones can FOLLOW a great release, as the GS, ES, RX, and IS Lexus's did. And they all became hits on their own afterward. But I wouldn't even bother designing other phones. I'd design the software to be installable on any other handset meeting a minimum spec. Port OWOS anywhere, like Ubuntu is attempting. If the software is flexible enough, any user can have any hardware they prefer. But for portrait slider style, the Pre becomes THE benchmark.

    The LS400 provided everything an MB had, just done a little better. And it proved to be more reliable. Today it's still one of the most reliable cars on the road. (the '90-94 model) And now Lexus is the benchmark for luxury and reliability; not MB. They broke into an existing market, dominated it, and continue to lead it by making that LS the one best car they could make.

    A new Pre should be just like that. A flagship model. Better than the existing best in so many ways that it must be recognized.

    But it cannot disorient the existing fan base. So, NO horizontal slider. No name changing. In fact, I'd buy the rights to the name Palm specifically for the recognizability. Anyone who's ever had a PDA knows Palm. In fact the only name better than Pre, would be the Pilot. HOW MUCH HYPE would follow a release of THE NEW PILOT, BY LG. Or whomever. That would shake any stigma left from the name Pre, or the letters HP.

    No reinventing the wheel. Just make the smoothest, sleekest, most efficient, most powerful, most reliable wheel ever. Amplify the things we love, which have been the core of webOS design, and bring the package up to state of the art technology. Then do it without compromise. Don't cut corners that will become the first unraveling threads in the fabric.

    Give existing Pre owners what they want. The "superPre". It doesn't have to be made of gold; it doesn't have to be needlessly overpriced; but it DOES have to establish a new benchmark in INTEGRITY. The device has to outshine the others in every way. It cannot be allowed to become known as a hardware flop, or a software flop. It must be able to shun all naysaying short of "it isn't iOS".


    Build an awesome smartphone. Not a mini-tab, not a multi-purpose, not anything else distracting. As far as I'm concerned, it's completely doable, just no one will do it because they're plainly stupid. *cough* MEG
    Last edited by TJs11thPre; 11/15/2013 at 06:24 PM.
    RumoredNow likes this.
  5. #45  
    Quote Originally Posted by TJs11thPre View Post
    Besides; technically, we already have budget models; Veers and Pre2s are selling for a lot of money for the same reason good used Toyotas still command high prices, and they're in a huge field of competitors.
    Dunno where you're shopping but dollar for dollar, spec for spec, when comparing webOS phones to equivalent Android phones, the webOS phones are on the order of half the cost of the Android ones in my experience. (Barring the extra cheap Android knock offs, of course.)

    Of course that's an argument in favor of there already being cheap options available. Certainly with a software update, the Veer and Pre 3 could be commanding "budget phones" if still in production.

    (seriously, I'm so bitter with BlackBerry )
  6. #46  
    Although I would throw out another reason to bear budget in mind: People are starting to swing away from contract plans.

    I don't just say that because I'm a frugal geek who made the jump this year. Maybe 30% of my friends here in the States have now done the same thing, shying away from the shyster practices of post-paids. (You seriously want $10/mo extra for TEXT MESSAGING?!) Some from talking to me, some from hearing experiences of others. More and more it seems people are trusting pre-paid given that a lot of people can get their bill knocked down from > $100/mo to < $60/mo with no obligation.

    But if that trend continues, my guess is anything priced like an iPhone will stay relegated to subsidized, overpriced post-paid plans. Who in their right mind would pay >$600 up front for an iPhone of any caliber? $300 or less becomes the new target, I think.

    So yeah. I like the idea of a modest Pre 4 spec bump. None of this POWERTHIRST VERSION OF A CELL PHONE stuff.
  7.    #47  
    Just a quick reply:

    The idea here is based on the assumption (reasonable at his point) that any webOS on mobile will come from 'the community', but that manufacturers might bring out handsets with webOS if any future version proves popular.

    So we are looking for existing models that will be good future port targets (after Gnex). Assuming any future port requires 'non-trivial' effort, any group or person porting might want to know what model would be preferred by the community.

    This choice could be informed by a reference spec for a specifically webOS phone.

    This spec could also be of interest to any potential manufacturers wondering what will sell to core enthusiasts.

    The spec should be for a high-end 'Flagship' phone and a 'value' option. In the current Android world this would be like the Nexus 5 or latest Galaxy, with the moto G as 'value' (just an example, not trying to debate the merits of these items)

    Flagship and value models are not in competition.
  8. #48  
    Quote Originally Posted by Preemptive View Post
    Just a quick reply:

    The idea here is based on the assumption (reasonable at his point) that any webOS on mobile will come from 'the community', but that manufacturers might bring out handsets with webOS if any future version proves popular.

    So we are looking for existing models that will be good future port targets (after Gnex). Assuming any future port requires 'non-trivial' effort, any group or person porting might want to know what model would be preferred by the community.

    This choice could be informed by a reference spec for a specifically webOS phone.

    This spec could also be of interest to any potential manufacturers wondering what will sell to core enthusiasts.

    The spec should be for a high-end 'Flagship' phone and a 'value' option. In the current Android world this would be like the Nexus 5 or latest Galaxy, with the moto G as 'value' (just an example, not trying to debate the merits of these items)

    Flagship and value models are not in competition.
    maybe i'm a little confused now.


    openwebOS should be created so that it can install on any new android phone. it should follow the same specs that android does, so it has the same access among mfg's and carriers. just like ubuntu can be put on any PC which currently runs windows. but OWOS must also be able to run android apps, whether in a shell/emulator type structure, or like ACL, or other.

    This flexibility is what would allow 'budget models' to be in many shapes an' sizes. once above the baseline, OWOS wouldn't care how 'budget' the hardware is, no more than Win 7 cares if there's an i3 or i7 processor.

    but i didn't think this was about a new, successful release of OWOS, into "port targets".

    i thought it was about designing a new Pre, a Pre4 so to speak. To which my response is, don't just make another comparable piece of plastic for the phone display at best buy. Make THE phone that is at the core of why we're still at this site. Make a phone that is the "iphone killer" which the original Pre was supposed to, but never allowed, to be. But also now make it, not the android killer, but the android nullifier, in that it does all of the same stuff, but better, since it also serves as the first bearer of the new OWOS.

    The end result should be, we get OWOS. The latest and greatest combination of what made webOS root so deeply into our hearts, plus the power of literally doing anything android can.

    but we also get a new Pre. a portrait slider superphone unlike all other leading devices. a brilliantly designed, unique and comfortable, workhorse wrapped in a super slick and functional package. Rather than try to guess what people think they want, and how to be that for all of them; instead the phone is so impressive that it forces people to change their image of what they want, to match IT. THIS approach is the only way a new phone and OS could enter and succeed in the existing market; by marching in and taking the reins.

    and that's what I thought this thread was hypothetically discussing. apologies if i went off-track.
  9.    #49  
    Quote Originally Posted by TJs11thPre View Post
    maybe i'm a little confused now.


    openwebOS should be created so that it can install on any new android phone. it should follow the same specs that android does, so it has the same access among mfg's and carriers. just like ubuntu can be put on any PC which currently runs windows. but OWOS must also be able to run android apps, whether in a shell/emulator type structure, or like ACL, or other.

    This flexibility is what would allow 'budget models' to be in many shapes an' sizes. once above the baseline, OWOS wouldn't care how 'budget' the hardware is, no more than Win 7 cares if there's an i3 or i7 processor.

    but i didn't think this was about a new, successful release of OWOS, into "port targets".

    i thought it was about designing a new Pre, a Pre4 so to speak. To which my response is, don't just make another comparable piece of plastic for the phone display at best buy. Make THE phone that is at the core of why we're still at this site. Make a phone that is the "iphone killer" which the original Pre was supposed to, but never allowed, to be. But also now make it, not the android killer, but the android nullifier, in that it does all of the same stuff, but better, since it also serves as the first bearer of the new OWOS.

    The end result should be, we get OWOS. The latest and greatest combination of what made webOS root so deeply into our hearts, plus the power of literally doing anything android can.

    but we also get a new Pre. a portrait slider superphone unlike all other leading devices. a brilliantly designed, unique and comfortable, workhorse wrapped in a super slick and functional package. Rather than try to guess what people think they want, and how to be that for all of them; instead the phone is so impressive that it forces people to change their image of what they want, to match IT. THIS approach is the only way a new phone and OS could enter and succeed in the existing market; by marching in and taking the reins.

    and that's what I thought this thread was hypothetically discussing. apologies if i went off-track.
    Hi,

    It seemed you were concerned that discussion of a value model was a distraction from the high-end one.

    I think you're totally on topic. But I think the key here is in the word, 'Hypothetical'.

    Hypothetically, Android will install on anything that meets a basic spec (and this will probably be true of Open webOS-Ports). In reality, it is installed on 'any' handset by it's particular manufacturer. Any hardware variant will require particular drivers, so further ports may vary in difficulty but all will probably require some effort. OEM drivers may be proprietary, but even if required to be open-source, there remains the problem of locked boot loaders. This allows manufacturers control of the user experience and can save users from bricking their phones or maybe being hacked. On the other hand, this prevents other OS installation or simply timely updates due to manufacturer & carriers slowness to test or unwillingness to allow upgrades that may discourage sales of new phones. The Nexus line have unlocked boot loaders (which is partly why Gnex is target #1). Other types vary from being open to requiring a bit of hacking to unlock (e.g. iphone 'Jail-breaking'). In fact the new, incorporated Cyanogenmod's first project is a program to simplify the unlocking process for models where it is actually possible.

    Hypothetically, a webOS phone could be made with specifications so cutting edge and awesome that any discerning (and rich) buyer would get one. This would require a great deal of money. The Fairphone retails for EU325 and was funded by kickstarting sale of 5000, then preselling 25000. the spec is reasonable, but not amazing. Fairphone | A seriously cool smartphone. Putting social values first. So, it's possible to get a phone out there, but then the Ubuntu super phone failed to hit it's target.

    Of those with an interest in webOS, LG has the resources and expertise to do it, but show no signs of interest. PIC stated hardware as an aim, but they'd need a lot more money than was required for ACL. Is this community big enough, rich enough & willing to whole heartedly back a PIC handset project?

    So the idea is to have realistic reference specs (that ideally stay in line with advancing technology) for flag-ship & value webOS phones. This can serve as a guide for potential manufacturers or as a comparison for the more likely scenario of porting. Of the potential handsets available, those closest to the spec could be prime candidates. The specs are hypothetical until someone decides to build it. If something like Phonebloks takes off, we may all be able to build our own.

    Of course one idea would be to port to LG nexus 4 or 5. LG might see that and think, "Well, we own webOS and are developing it, so why not try it on a phone?" Recent reports suggest that everyone aside from Apple & Samsung (+ possibly some Chinese manufacturers) are basically making a loss in the mobile arena.
    Last edited by Preemptive; 11/17/2013 at 09:05 PM.
    TJs11thPre likes this.
  10.    #51  
    I know the chance of an open boot loader is close to zero, but...


    Has anyone ever 'cracked' a Blackberry? I suppose drivers would also be a problem...

    Strange how other mobile OSes increasingly resemble webOS... now the hardware!
  11. ggendel's Avatar
    Posts
    463 Posts
    Global Posts
    818 Global Posts
    #52  
    Quote Originally Posted by Preemptive View Post
    I know the chance of an open boot loader is close to zero, but...
    Click to view quoted image


    Has anyone ever 'cracked' a Blackberry? I suppose drivers would also be a problem...

    Strange how other mobile OSes increasingly resemble webOS... now the hardware!
    I though the exact same thing when I saw this. If it's not too expensive and it comes out on Verizon, I may make the leap. BBOS 10 is getting really close to the WebOS experience.
    Palm III->Palm IV->Palm V->M130->Tungsten->Treo 270->Treo 600->Treo 700->Palm Pre Plus->FrankenPre 2->Pre 3 & TouchPad
  12. #53  
    Couldn't they round of the corners of that thing, just a little??
    Sporting my 13th Pre device, a NOS unlocked ROW Pre3!
  13. #54  
    Their strategy seems to be to make every form they can think of. And yeah, looks like you could put an eye out with that
  14. #55  
    Quote Originally Posted by Preemptive View Post
    I know the chance of an open boot loader is close to zero, but...
    Click to view quoted image


    Has anyone ever 'cracked' a Blackberry? I suppose drivers would also be a problem...

    Strange how other mobile OSes increasingly resemble webOS... now the hardware!

    I've never heard of an unlocked or cracked bootloader on a BlackBerry. I was thinking that it would have been perfect for LuneOS too.

    Sent from my BlackBerry 9900 using Tapatalk
    IIIxe | z22 | Pre 3 | Bold 9900 | Q10 | Nexus 4
  15. #56  
    the slider..saw that. I thought the same thing. wouldn't it be nice if LG and BB teamed up..just on hardware
Page 3 of 3 FirstFirst 123

Similar Threads

  1. webOS Nation boot animation- 320x480 (Pre-, Pre+,Pre 2)
    By immovablesoup in forum webOS Themes
    Replies: 6
    Last Post: 06/25/2012, 11:25 AM
  2. Replies: 7
    Last Post: 05/05/2012, 09:49 AM
  3. New USB specification promises 100W of power
    By ilovedessert in forum The 'Off Topic' Lounge
    Replies: 0
    Last Post: 08/10/2011, 08:43 AM
  4. Demystifying the Wii U Hardware Specification
    By ilovedessert in forum The 'Off Topic' Lounge
    Replies: 4
    Last Post: 06/18/2011, 02:49 PM
  5. Sprint Pre specification question and Recommendations please.
    By voltageROCK in forum Palm Pre and Pre Plus
    Replies: 5
    Last Post: 09/22/2010, 09:48 AM

Posting Permissions