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  1.    #1  
    Quote Originally Posted by astark View Post
    Do you really think this company is going to put in the time and effort to release a WebOS phone, when they barely managed to be an also ran with the most popular OS in the world?
    Seems to me that would be the one reason they WOULD release a webOS phone, not a reason not to.
  2. #2  
    Quote Originally Posted by astark View Post
    LG Q3 2012 financial results: 14 million phones shipped, $20m profit

    If this article is to be believed, LG sold about 14 million phones last year, of which approximately half were Android smartphones. That's a lot of phones, but really pretty pathetic compared to the likes of Samsung or HTC. Do you really think this company is going to put in the time and effort to release a WebOS phone, when they barely managed to be an also ran with the most popular OS in the world?
    Quote Originally Posted by johnsonx42 View Post
    Seems to me that would be the one reason they WOULD release a webOS phone, not a reason not to.
    Exactly, johnsonx42...

    Large enough players, like LG, don't want to be relegated to Android leftovers in terms of profits. Years of trying to stand out in that field have not proven successful. Samsung is in the #1 Android spot for how many years?

    If I sell 80% of the donuts and I have blue sprinkles on... It's hard to take away my market share by changing just the sprinkles to a red color. Especially in the consumer's minds where blue sprinkles have become synonymous with donuts... Like Coke is to Cola. The Galaxy brand is building that type of synonymous recognition...

    Slight variation on a theme is NOT differentiation. It's a generic versus name brand sort of thing. And when the generic doesn't really save enough $$$, consumers go name brand.

    No one can deny that Apple has a tight market strategy. They own and control the Hardware and the Software. Nobody can dilute their brand (except some Chinese knock-offs that are inferior enough quality wise that they do not appear as an attractive "generic" product in the consumer's mind).

    Google and Microsoft own and control the Software, but not the hardware. OEM's are free to jump in. It leads to variation, not differentiation. Brand dilution is built into that system for Hardware manufactures by the very nature of the system.

    So now someone will point at RIM, which owns and controls the Hardware and Software, but isn't doing well. RIM lacks the advantages of LG: a highly diversified portfolio of multiple product lines that can support an R&D budget worthy of sustained effort. Furthermore, LG manufactures many of their own components for mobile devices.

    I'm not saying LG will or has to go their own way with a proprietary Hardware/Software combo. I am saying they have now secured it as a viable option to build a brand that no competitors are in a position to dilute...
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  3. #3  
    Quote Originally Posted by RumoredNow View Post

    Large enough players, like LG, don't want to be relegated to Android leftovers in terms of profits. Years of trying to stand out in that field have not proven successful. Samsung is in the #1 Android spot for how many years?
    What makes you think that LG would sell more phones if they used WebOS?
  4. #4  
    Quote Originally Posted by rnld View Post
    What makes you think that LG would sell more phones if they used WebOS?
    While it may not, they would at least stop their current cycle of getting lost in the sea of Android OEMs at the moment. They are not succeeding their either. At least with webOS they have a chance to differentiate and have their own OS.
  5. #5  
    Quote Originally Posted by allen832008 View Post
    While it may not, they would at least stop their current cycle of getting lost in the sea of Android OEMs at the moment. They are not succeeding their either. At least with webOS they have a chance to differentiate and have their own OS.
    And precisely why Samsung is sinking money into Bada/Tizen. And let's not forget the Google/Motorola Mobility thing going on, despite what Google said about it not impacting OEM relationship. Because clearly the OEMs don't think that way.
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  6. #6  
    Quote Originally Posted by allen832008 View Post
    While it may not, they would at least stop their current cycle of getting lost in the sea of Android OEMs at the moment. They are not succeeding their either. At least with webOS they have a chance to differentiate and have their own OS.
    That's like saying computers are getting lost at sea using Windows.
  7. #7  
    More choice is good. I tired of all this android forced down our throats.
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  8. #8  
    Quote Originally Posted by allen832008 View Post
    I agree, but its a chicken/egg scenario. Without hardware, or at least the promise of it, no dev is gonna spend much time on anything other than maybe a patch here and there.
    we have chickens in the form of the devices currently used by the ports team, its not like a market leeching system needs specific hardware, its mainly a software issue, as long as we can leech apps from somewhere it doesnt matter how bad they run as long as they run, speed issues etc can be fleshed out later.

    its a worse situation if you got your new hardware, i mean what exactly are you going to do with it? youd only have stock apps "if" your lucky, if your saying your happy with no apps for some considerable time while loads are made up how is that any different to the touchpads terrible start. (that didnt really start or end well)
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  9. #9  
    Quote Originally Posted by geekpeter View Post
    we have chickens in the form of the devices currently used by the ports team, its not like a market leeching system needs specific hardware, its mainly a software issue, as long as we can leech apps from somewhere it doesnt matter how bad they run as long as they run, speed issues etc can be fleshed out later.

    its a worse situation if you got your new hardware, i mean what exactly are you going to do with it? youd only have stock apps "if" your lucky, if your saying your happy with no apps for some considerable time while loads are made up how is that any different to the touchpads terrible start. (that didnt really start or end well)
    The TouchPad failed on pricing. If it would have been $350 out the door HP would still own a successful product. LG wants the OS for entertainment purposes so I would think they already have the majority of the big name apps that were missing in that area in the works. Porting apps is not the answer. It hasn't worked at all in favor for the playbook. If that's the end game then they should just keep making Android phones. Without a native experience you can't survive in the long run.
  10. #10  
    Quote Originally Posted by allen832008 View Post
    The TouchPad failed on pricing. If it would have been $350 out the door HP would still own a successful product. LG wants the OS for entertainment purposes so I would think they already have the majority of the big name apps that were missing in that area in the works. Porting apps is not the answer. It hasn't worked at all in favor for the playbook. If that's the end game then they should just keep making Android phones. Without a native experience you can't survive in the long run.
    it couldnt have failed with less than a month on sale with the CEO already in the mindset of dropping everything, this is a bad habbit many seem to carry thinking that the touchpad somehow spelled doom for all of webOS when in fact the CEO had already planned to drop everything, PC business and mobile/webOS.

    you cant realistically say that webOS/touchpad and the aborted pre3 on its very launch day were failures if the CEO has no intention of letting them "have a go", they didnt fail at all because they were bad, they failed because the CEO intended them to fail then be disposed of as inconveniences to his plan for HP's future.

    if this mindset of "it didnt do well" was really how corporations thought then sony's vita and many more mobile devices would have been aborted in minutes, or not even released.

    webOS/touchpad failed because of leo apothekar, not because "it sucked", even if somehow it was a major success and sold bungloads, leo still aborted their entire PC division and the mobile market in favour of his enterprise plans, so talk of the touchpads success or lack of is unrelated to reality.

    native apps is not something we can rely on either, we have next to no devs left, the harsh reality is we need them from somewhere, just because the playbook dropped the ball doesnt mean everyone will or that we shouldnt try.
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  11. #11  
    Quote Originally Posted by geekpeter View Post
    it couldnt have failed with less than a month on sale with the CEO already in the mindset of dropping everything, this is a bad habbit many seem to carry thinking that the touchpad somehow spelled doom for all of webOS when in fact the CEO had already planned to drop everything, PC business and mobile/webOS.

    you cant realistically say that webOS/touchpad and the aborted pre3 on its very launch day were failures if the CEO has no intention of letting them "have a go", they didnt fail at all because they were bad, they failed because the CEO intended them to fail then be disposed of as inconveniences to his plan for HP's future.

    if this mindset of "it didnt do well" was really how corporations thought then sony's vita and many more mobile devices would have been aborted in minutes, or not even released.

    webOS/touchpad failed because of leo apothekar, not because "it sucked", even if somehow it was a major success and sold bungloads, leo still aborted their entire PC division and the mobile market in favour of his enterprise plans, so talk of the touchpads success or lack of is unrelated to reality.

    native apps is not something we can rely on either, we have next to no devs left, the harsh reality is we need them from somewhere, just because the playbook dropped the ball doesnt mean everyone will or that we shouldnt try.
    This is hogwash.

    The Touchpad failed because people didn't care. Sales were decreasing week by week, Best Buy was returning a ton of unsold stock and it was over. They pulled the plug.

    A recent film Beautiful Creatures, had a TON of TV advertising and awareness but after taking a beating at the box office, advertising was pulled and theaters put more successful films on the screens that opened up.

    There are some here that have no clue how business works.
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  12. #12  
    Quote Originally Posted by rnld View Post
    This is hogwash.

    The Touchpad failed because people didn't care. Sales were decreasing week by week, Best Buy was returning a ton of unsold stock and it was over. They pulled the plug.

    A recent film Beautiful Creatures, had a TON of TV advertising and awareness but after taking a beating at the box office, advertising was pulled and theaters put more successful films on the screens that opened up.

    There are some here that have no clue how business works.
    then read more on leo's legacy, he binned everything including their pc business because he didnt want any of it, same as the mobile/webos division.

    no sane company scraps 2 entire divisions because of 1 months worth of poor sales. weos being scrapped was decided before the touchpad even went on sale, the pre3 was scrapped the same day it launched so that didnt even get the chance to fail or succeed but still got scrapped.
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  13. #13  
    Quote Originally Posted by geekpeter View Post
    then read more on leo's legacy, he binned everything including their pc business because he didnt want any of it, same as the mobile/webos division.

    no sane company scraps 2 entire divisions because of 1 months worth of poor sales. weos being scrapped was decided before the touchpad even went on sale, the pre3 was scrapped the same day it launched so that didnt even get the chance to fail or succeed but still got scrapped.
    Lots of sane companies cut their loses after a bad purchase and a product line that failed. No sane company throws good money after bad.

    HP and the Touchpad and phones can't be viewed in a bubble. It has to be looked at with the perspective of the marketplace at the time.

    It's no win for HP that the bulk of Touchpad owners bought because of a fire sale of pennies on the dollar.
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  14. #14  
    Quote Originally Posted by rnld View Post
    Lots of sane companies cut their loses after a bad purchase and a product line that failed. No sane company throws good money after bad.
    True enough, but Apotheker wanted to focus on more deals like the Autonomy buyout which cost HP $8,800,000,000.00 USD more than the company was worth and eject one of HP's core strengths and most visible product lines, PC manufacture, from the portfolio by spinning it off...

    If that's sanity, you can keep it.

    You are still arguing "failed product" while ignoring the fact that the short duration of the TouchPad's supported release is no real model to judge by.

    No sane person says 4 week's worth of data is conclusive evidence on a macroeconomic scale.
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  15. #15  
    Quote Originally Posted by RumoredNow View Post
    True enough, but Apotheker wanted to focus on more deals like the Autonomy buyout which cost HP $8,800,000,000.00 USD more than the company was worth and eject one of HP's core strengths and most visible product lines, PC manufacture, from the portfolio by spinning it off...

    If that's sanity, you can keep it.

    You are still arguing "failed product" while ignoring the fact that the short duration of the TouchPad's supported release is no real model to judge by.

    No sane person says 4 week's worth of data is conclusive evidence on a macroeconomic scale.
    Sure you can. It's not like HP was the launch of WebOS. When HP was going to get 250,000 unsold Touchpads back from HP, it was done.

    Pretty simple. The cost of the returns and then getting rid of them or blow them out at $99 bucks and walk away.

    Any other failed deal they made is not relevant to the Touchpad no matter how much misguided hate you have for a former CEO.
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  16. #16  
    Quote Originally Posted by rnld View Post
    Sure you can. It's not like HP was the launch of WebOS. When HP was going to get 250,000 unsold Touchpads back from HP, it was done.

    Pretty simple. The cost of the returns and then getting rid of them or blow them out at $99 bucks and walk away.

    Any other failed deal they made is not relevant to the Touchpad no matter how much misguided hate you have for a former CEO.
    he already decided and acted to dump webOS and the pc division before the returns, its not like he waited a month then suddenly that very day announced the scrapping of their pc and mobile line, it was done before that, again it was reported as fact that it had been decided beforehand and that everyone asociated with palm were kept out of the loop and none of them knew about it even on the very day he announced his bombshell.

    also your logic somehow assumes that their pc division also was somehow "bad" and thats why he scrapped that as well seeing as it was ****canned along with webOS/palm.

    theres a very good reason he got fired tbh.
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  17. #17  
    "Leo" getting fired did not change my life in the least. HP made some bad deals - Palm being one of them.

    The phones were not selling, the Touchpad was a generation behind the iPad and weekly sales dwindled after a tepid launch week. If "Leo" would have kept WebOS going or not, it was a huge money loser. In the end, maybe less so buy cutting spending on the project and making a bit back from the fire sale.

    The carriers did not want the phone line and retailers didn't want the Touchpad after it stiffed. It doesn't get more simple.
    Last edited by rnld; 03/03/2013 at 03:52 PM. Reason: typo
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  18. #18  
    Quote Originally Posted by rnld View Post
    "Leo" getting fired did not change my life in the least. HP made some bad deals - Palm being one of them.

    The phones were not selling, the Touchpad was a generation behind the iPad and weekly sales dwindled after a tepid launch week. If "Leo" would have kept WebOS going or not, it was a huge money loser. In the end, maybe less so buy cutting spending on the project and making a bit back from the fire sale.

    The carriers did not want the phone line and retailers didn't want the Touchpad after it stiffed. It doesn't get more simple.
    what about the pre3?
    what about their pc's?
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  19. #19  
    Quote Originally Posted by geekpeter View Post
    what about the pre3?
    what about their pc's?
    What about the Pre 3?

    HP is in the PC business - They sold 15 million PCs in the 4th quarter.
  20. #20  
    Great Topic, but it strayed from the goal of the Petition Thread.
    <<Moved>>
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