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  1.    #1  
    I see a lot of people posting wallpapers that I have to wonder if they are violating someone's copyright by doing it. How do we know if we are illegally downloading these wallapapers?
  2. #2  
    No one really cares? I mean lets be honest they make wallpapers for PC's and what not all the time. So take the Pre wallpapers like a desktop background
    SGIII SOON! (ATT)

    Palm Pre- > HTC EVO 3D > HTC One X > Samsung GSIII

    If any of my posts help you please thank me!!
  3. #3  
    You can't really know, but most copyright laws only attack those which share, not those who download.
  4. #4  
    If you're really concerned... don't download them.

    Bottom line, no one is selling these wallpapers, so it would be extremely doubtfull that any copyright owners would be upset that we want to use their images for our phone background.
  5.    #5  
    I visit a few photography forums where pros post, and they would be veryupset if someone was using their images without their protection. They earn their livings from selling images and if people are distrbuting them for free, then they cannot sell them.
  6. NxTech3's Avatar
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    #6  
    most "pros" would post at a website that requires payment to download. If its an open website then they know their images could possibly be shared without direct permission. If someone is worried about that, then they say "no sharing without said permission" Most of the wallpapers are from open image websites.
  7. #7  
    Quote Originally Posted by Eldo In The Weeds View Post
    I visit a few photography forums where pros post, and they would be veryupset if someone was using their images without their protection. They earn their livings from selling images and if people are distrbuting them for free, then they cannot sell them.
    If these pros don't want their pictures used for backgrounds/wallpapers/etc... then they wouldn't post them - without watermarks - in an open forum.

    I would never sell something that was made from an image I didn't own, but if I find an image on the Internet that I want as my phone/PC background I don't feel the slightest bit bad about using it as such.

    My wife is a photographer, and she posts quite a few pics to her Facebook and MySpace among other places. Every image she posts is cropped/sized/watermarked so if someone wants a good quality print they'll have to contact her for it.

    Using a picture as a phone background is not going to take money away from someone selling a print of the same image. You simply can't get a good quality print of a decent size from a 320X480 .jpg.

    Anyone posting anything to the Internet should be aware that once it's out there, there's no way to take it back. This big series of tubes and dump trucks is unforgiving. So make sure you always use protection!
  8. #8  
    There are usually a few questions that you have to answer to decide copyright infringement (as in you owe someone money because of your actions).

    1. Have you made money off of their work? (clearly, here, no)
    2. Have you prevented them from making money off of their work? (in a provable way, not theoretical, i.e. they sell the same wallpaper and you download it and offer it for free, thus preventing sale)
    3. Have you diminished the value of their work? (one example would be if the copyright owner could have otherwise packaged to sell palm pre wallpapers but your work has made that impossible because you stole the exact image that they were going to sell, the most possible, but not likely for 99% of the wallpapers that I would make)

    There is more, but mostly not applicable to wallpapers.

    As a wallpaper creator, 90% of the stuff I use is promotional, I am not worried about it. I will use the heck out of promotional materials, so long as you don't misrepresent the original owner of the work or post it as your own, you should be ok with those.

    The most likely scenario in any case, since this is not RIAA territory, is not someone going after you. It's a lawyer asking pre|central.net to cease and desist posting their copyrighted image to their board, and maybe pre|central.net kicking out the person that posted the image.
  9. jeffmcc's Avatar
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    #9  
    its not priating to get/give wallpaper for free...

    the same applys for music/movies...

    NOT "HP webOS"!!!
  10. jeffmcc's Avatar
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    #10  
    if I made pics/wallpaper and I didn't want people to have them I wouldn't share them with anyone....

    NOT "HP webOS"!!!
  11.    #11  
    Quote Originally Posted by urlmaker View Post
    There are usually a few questions that you have to answer to decide copyright infringement (as in you owe someone money because of your actions).

    1. Have you made money off of their work? (clearly, here, no)
    2. Have you prevented them from making money off of their work? (in a provable way, not theoretical, i.e. they sell the same wallpaper and you download it and offer it for free, thus preventing sale)
    3. Have you diminished the value of their work? (one example would be if the copyright owner could have otherwise packaged to sell palm pre wallpapers but your work has made that impossible because you stole the exact image that they were going to sell, the most possible, but not likely for 99% of the wallpapers that I would make)
    #1: You don't make money off something to infringe the copyright. By distributing it w/o consent you are violating the copyright. You were not given permission to use the image.

    #2 & #3: Let's say a photographer makes a cool picture of a Ferrari and posts it on a photography forum to get people's opinions. You like it and make it into a wallpaper then post it here for others to use. He/she probably will not be able to sell that image since it has been already distributed. That both dimishes the value of their work and prevents them from selling their work.
  12.    #12  
    Quote Originally Posted by jeffmcc View Post
    its not priating to get/give wallpaper for free...

    The same applys for music/movies...
    Wrong

    If I take your car without your permission and give it to my girlfriend, then that is not stealing, right? I never got any money for it.
    Last edited by Eldo In The Weeds; 11/23/2009 at 07:00 PM. Reason: typo
  13. #13  
    With regards to copyright on the internet with photos.......big time gray area. Any good professional photographer is not going to post their photos anywhere without watermarking it. If you are clone stamping out the watermark...then you suck and you are stealing. However, I seriously doubt any of that is happening. Almost every wallpaper I've gotten has come from open sources (flickr, etc) or from the photographer themselves (interfacelift.com, etc). I don't think it's anything but a speculative stew to try and decide if copyright is being violated on this website. Besides, this thread will quickly turn into name calling and legalistic debating on pirating other things (movie, music, etc) instead of Pre wallpapers.

    Just my 2 cents.
  14. #14  
    He would not be stealing your car he would make his own copy and let you keep yours!!!
  15. #15  
    I think this is just a trolling post...Lets just move on with our day
    SGIII SOON! (ATT)

    Palm Pre- > HTC EVO 3D > HTC One X > Samsung GSIII

    If any of my posts help you please thank me!!
  16. #16  
    Quote Originally Posted by cgardner View Post
    I think this is just a trolling post...Lets just move on with our day
    And the crowd says "AMEN".
  17. #17  
    Quote Originally Posted by Eldo In The Weeds View Post
    Wrong

    If I take your car without your permission and give it to my girlfriend, then that is not stealing, right? I never got any money for it.
    Did you leave your car doors wide open with the keys in the ignition? That's what you do when you post pics on the internet without a watermark...stupid. Speaking of...yeah, this thread is pretty pointless. You sound genuinely concerned Eldo, so just do what Spader suggested: don't download images whose owner(s) you're not certain of.
  18. jdale's Avatar
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    #18  
    A lot of photographers post non-watermarked small images of their work, without granting permission to use those images. Taking them, modifying them, and posting them here is a copyright violation. If PreCentral knew that they were copyright violation, they would have to remove them, or they could be subjected to fines. They probably aren't in any danger as long as they don't know. People downloading the images just for their own personal use certainly aren't in any danger. (In my personal opinion as a non-lawyer.)

    Personally I wouldn't post such images, where there would be a permanent record that I knowingly and willfully violated copyright. Probably it won't be worth anyone's time to do anything about it, but you never know.
  19.    #19  
    Quote Originally Posted by Flak1969 View Post
    He would not be stealing your car he would make his own copy and let you keep yours!!!
    I would love to see him copy my car in the driveway. That would be awesome! We could be YouTube Famous!!!
  20. #20  
    Quote Originally Posted by urlmaker View Post
    There are usually a few questions that you have to answer to decide copyright infringement (as in you owe someone money because of your actions).

    1. Have you made money off of their work? (clearly, here, no)
    2. Have you prevented them from making money off of their work? (in a provable way, not theoretical, i.e. they sell the same wallpaper and you download it and offer it for free, thus preventing sale)
    3. Have you diminished the value of their work? (one example would be if the copyright owner could have otherwise packaged to sell palm pre wallpapers but your work has made that impossible because you stole the exact image that they were going to sell, the most possible, but not likely for 99% of the wallpapers that I would make)

    There is more, but mostly not applicable to wallpapers.

    As a wallpaper creator, 90% of the stuff I use is promotional, I am not worried about it. I will use the heck out of promotional materials, so long as you don't misrepresent the original owner of the work or post it as your own, you should be ok with those.

    The most likely scenario in any case, since this is not RIAA territory, is not someone going after you. It's a lawyer asking pre|central.net to cease and desist posting their copyrighted image to their board, and maybe pre|central.net kicking out the person that posted the image.
    The above is helpful but not entirely accurate, as it deals with "fair use," which is a *defense,* not a determination of whether something is infringing. In other words, you only get to the question of fair use *after* you have already infringed.

    Are the wallpapers infringing someone's copyright? Almost certainly. Will the copyright owner object? Probably not, but they have the right to do so. If they do, it's clearly more likely that they'd go after the people creating and distributing the wallpaper than the individual who downloads/installs a personal copy (which is an infringment but probably below any reasonable threshold of action). {Jonathan}
    Prof. Jonathan I. Ezor
    Writer, PreCentral
    Past Palm Real Reviewer
    @webOSquire on Twitter
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