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  1.    #101  
    Quote Originally Posted by elbastardocalvo
    Agreed, but that only pertains to WM5 devices, which are only some of the devices that use ActiveSync. it does not include (or exclude) Palm and/or other licensees. Again, this is at best ambiguous.
    Right. In other words, other devices use ActiveSync (just like before SP2), but the MSFP will only work with WM5 devices. At least that is my take. You hit it on the head. Ambiguous. Guess we will have to wait and see.
    Last edited by GoodGuy; 10/19/2005 at 06:42 PM.
  2. #102  
    Quote Originally Posted by GoodGuy
    ...Improvements in Exchange Server SP2 are available for devices that run the Microsoft Messaging and Security Feature Pack for Windows Mobile 5.0. The Feature Pack, together with SP2, is the latest set of improvements to the Microsoft mobile messaging solution. SP2 and the Messaging and Security Feature Pack provide a better Microsoft Office Outlook Mobile experience while making it easier than ever to manage and control devices. To find out about Windows Mobile 5.0 devices that include the Messaging and Security Feature Pack, visit the Windows Mobile 5.0 Messaging and Security Feature Pack page on the Microsoft Windows Mobile site."
    Actually, these are exactly the kinds of NEW edits that did not exist in any document released on/around June 6th. This document is NEW (from the end of September) and DIRECTLY CONTRADICTS the ORIGINAL wording of the original June 6th announcement...which said (exactly as rendered below with no editing or paraphasing or excerpting):

    "To see how the "heartbeat" of Direct Push Technology keeps your mobile device up to date, view screenshots of the GAL Lookup and of other features, and more, register on the Microsoft Events site to watch the Secure and Scalable Messaging with Windows Mobile 5.0 webcast.

    "Licensees of the Exchange ActiveSync protocol (such as palmOne, Motorola, Nokia, Symbian) can take advantage of these improvements through updates to their messaging applications or devices. The roadmap for those devices is owned and managed by the licensee."

    Further, as just one more example, note this comment posted from the author of the original description of the new "direct push" article:

    hi Vadim-

    Sorry to hear that you're having trouble with AUTDv1. AUTDv1 is the SMS-based solution, and troubleshooting info can be found here:

    http://support.microsoft.com/default...b;en-us;822176

    AUTDv2 (or, "Direct Push", as we now call it) has several distinct differences and improvements over AUTDv1 that I mentioned in my blog. Among those are that it is entirely based on data connections. So the behavior you describe, where scheduled sync works but AUTD does not, cannot occur with Direct Push -- that is, if scheduled sync works, Direct Push must, too, and vice versa.

    Further, it requires no additional setup on the device. Once you provision ActiveSync on the device for doing scheduled sync, that device has all it needs to establish a Direct Push session, too.

    Last, when SP2 is released, I hope you'll give it a shot
    and let us know how it goes. I suspect that the experience will be much more smooth than what you've seen with AUTDv1.

    Best,

    Sami

    Note the points I have bolded, and also note the lack of mention of MSFP!
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    #103  
    You need to have MSFP installed on your WM5 device for the new Exchange AUTD to work. Otherwise it will use the old (sms) AUTD.
  4.    #104  
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    #105  
    Quote Originally Posted by GoodGuy

    If you are refering to this article:

    Latest Windows Mobile devices out of sync

    That has NOTHING to do with Exchange Activesync or this discussion thread.

    The problems are limited to those connecting a device to a PC via a USB connection, Microsoft said. No problems have been reported when connecting wirelessly using a Bluetooth or infrared connection, or when connecting directly to a server.
  6.    #106  
    I know it has nothing to do with ActiveSync. It has to do with Windows bugs which is a direct correlation to new MSFT products.
  7. #107  
    Quote Originally Posted by GoodGuy
    I know it has nothing to do with ActiveSync. It has to do with Windows bugs which is a direct correlation to new MSFT products.

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    #108  
    Just to clarify for people that are not familir with WM devices.. there are two version of Activesync. One is for your desktop computer and that is what the article in question is refering too.

    The other is Exchange Activesync. Exchange Activesync is what will handle the AUTD (both the old way via SMS and the new way via "push").

    With Exchange Activesync configured for your device you will NEVER need to hook it up to desktop activesync...you will never need to even install it.

    Ok.. never say never some people might want to use it for application installation or syncing your music and files but I like to do most of that OTA (Over the Air i.e. wireless using the mobile data network, WiFi, bluetooth).

    In the 6 months I have used a Samsung SCH-i730 (WM2003SE) I have not had to hook it up to my computer at all...do everything over Verizons EVDO network. I have not even used had to use the built in WiFi since EVDO is fast enough for most things.

    The only time I hooked it up to my computer was to use it as a USB modem. but that has nothing to do with desktop Activesync.

    Desktop Activesync has been known to be problamatic (is that a word? ) for a long time...
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    #109  
    I guess you could say there are three versions as there is a version of Activesync on all WM devices...

    Does the lack of quality in desktop activesync correlate to a deficient Exchange Activesync? I would have to strongly say NO to that question.

    Two entirely different development teams and design goals. The Exchange team puts its releases through a much stronger QA process....

    In practice I am very pleased with Exchange Activesync and completely impressed with its speed and stability compared to desktop activesync... when I show people how fast Exchange Activesync works (compared to desktop activesync) they are VERY impressed and jaws hang down.

    I mentioned stability in the last paragraph... let me just say that with desktop activesync errors are common... with Exchange activesync I have NEVER gotten an error.
  10. #110  
    Quote Originally Posted by GoodGuy
    I know it has nothing to do with ActiveSync. It has to do with Windows bugs which is a direct correlation to new MSFT products.
    Ahem, perhaps you should review your own software documentation. My understanding is that y'all are still resolving "issues"...of course, with such a small installed base for your current versions, I guess it's no surprise that "issues" are still turning up, huh!

    I thought you were going to focus on your own software and cool it with the attacks on other people's work, GoodFudda?
  11.    #111  
    Quote Originally Posted by gex
    Just to clarify for people that are not familir with WM devices.. there are two version of Activesync. One is for your desktop computer and that is what the article in question is refering too.

    The other is Exchange Activesync. Exchange Activesync is what will handle the AUTD (both the old way via SMS and the new way via "push").

    With Exchange Activesync configured for your device you will NEVER need to hook it up to desktop activesync...you will never need to even install it.

    Ok.. never say never some people might want to use it for application installation or syncing your music and files but I like to do most of that OTA (Over the Air i.e. wireless using the mobile data network, WiFi, bluetooth).

    In the 6 months I have used a Samsung SCH-i730 (WM2003SE) I have not had to hook it up to my computer at all...do everything over Verizons EVDO network. I have not even used had to use the built in WiFi since EVDO is fast enough for most things.

    The only time I hooked it up to my computer was to use it as a USB modem. but that has nothing to do with desktop Activesync.

    Desktop Activesync has been known to be problamatic (is that a word? ) for a long time...
    So, dex, please educate me on the i730/WM. If I want to install an application to the device, how do I do it without ActiveSync? Using POS terminology, I want to install the PRC file. Are you saying download it via the web browser on the device for installation? Now, I understand with EVDO, that is great, but what about on CDMA or GSM? Would it be better (read: faster, more efficient) to do it via ActiveSync on the desktop? Music I would simply put on an SD card and pop it in. Not trying to flame, but since I don't have the luxury of EVDO, I am curious.
  12.    #112  
    Quote Originally Posted by gex
    I guess you could say there are three versions as there is a version of Activesync on all WM devices...

    Does the lack of quality in desktop activesync correlate to a deficient Exchange Activesync? I would have to strongly say NO to that question.

    Two entirely different development teams and design goals. The Exchange team puts its releases through a much stronger QA process....

    In practice I am very pleased with Exchange Activesync and completely impressed with its speed and stability compared to desktop activesync... when I show people how fast Exchange Activesync works (compared to desktop activesync) they are VERY impressed and jaws hang down.

    I mentioned stability in the last paragraph... let me just say that with desktop activesync errors are common... with Exchange activesync I have NEVER gotten an error.
    Agreed, there can be some confusion regarding the two 'ActiveSyncs' and I agree that the desktop version (for hot syncing) has been problematic (though for as long as it has been out, I would think that they would have been addressed by now), but to say the Exchange team puts its releases through a much stronger QA process is a bit of an overstatement, don't you think? How many patches have come out for Exchange 2003 since its release? While Exchange ActiveSync, as a function of Exchange, may not have had as many issues as Exchange as a whole, it has not been without it's faults. And before Delta starts smelling blood, we too have had updates.
  13.    #113  
    Quote Originally Posted by delta_baggage
    Ahem, perhaps you should review your own software documentation. My understanding is that y'all are still resolving "issues"...of course, with such a small installed base for your current versions, I guess it's no surprise that "issues" are still turning up, huh!

    I thought you were going to focus on your own software and cool it with the attacks on other people's work, GoodFudda?
    Delta, please tell me our install base since you seem to have your pulse on the finger of Good.

    Thought so.

    I have read our documentation. Please point out to me what you are referring to.

    And you insist on bringing Good into this with every statement I make. I posted a link regarding a known bug with WM5 and the fact that even though it is a known issue, MSFT has a 'workaround' posted until they release a fix next month. The fact of the matter is that MSFT is known for bugs and issues in early releases, especially of new products and that WM5 is no exception. No FUD about it.
  14. #114  
    Quote Originally Posted by GoodGuy
    ...patches...for Exchange 2003.... While...we too have had updates.
    See, you refer to their "bugs" and "patches", but address your "issues" with "updates."
  15.    #115  
    Quote Originally Posted by delta_baggage
    See, you refer to their "bugs" and "patches", but address your "issues" with "updates."
    No, MSFT refers to them as patches.
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    #116  
    Quote Originally Posted by GoodGuy
    If I want to install an application to the device, how do I do it without ActiveSync?...Are you saying download it via the web browser on the device for installation? Now, I understand with EVDO, that is great, but what about on CDMA or GSM? Would it be better (read: faster, more efficient) to do it via ActiveSync on the desktop? Music I would simply put on an SD card and pop it in.
    There are a number of ways to install apps in WM. You can do it from a web site, email it to yourself (this is what i mostly do), or put it on an SD card. Installation is very easy. You just tap the CAB file and it installs. Most apps come in both CAB (direct device installable file) or an exe that is done through desktop activesync. I try to avoid installing any files through desktop activesync since a lot of exe's leave reminances(sp?) of themselves in the start menu and the add delete programs control panel (on your desktop computer). It is also a waste of time since all the exe's are doing is copying the cab file to the device then launching it. The installation continues on the device as if you had just tapped on a cab file to start with.

    CAB file are usually very small and can easily be DL'd over EVDO, 1xRTT, GPRS, etc. if you don't have a data connection you can put it on a storage card if you like. If you like you can connect your device to your desktop computer and copy it over that way as well (you access the storage space of your device like it is a hard drive).

    One word of caution.. after a successful installation the CAB file deletes itself so I keep backup copies on an SD card and my desktop computer.
    Last edited by gex; 10/20/2005 at 10:37 PM.
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    #117  
    Quote Originally Posted by GoodGuy
    ...to say the Exchange team puts its releases through a much stronger QA process is a bit of an overstatement, don't you think?
    I really dont think so... from my experience, and what I have been able to gather from others, Exchange Activesync has been rock solid. If you are using AUTD with SMS I have heard of delays due to carrier issues or roaming environments but that is due to the nature of SMS.

    I hear about bad experiences with desktop activesync all the time...but i don't think it is as bad as intelisync (is that what palm OS uses?)

    Kidding on that last part.. don't know anything about PalmOS and how they sync.
  18.    #118  
    Quote Originally Posted by gex
    There are a number of ways to install apps in WM. You can do it from a web site, email it to yourself (this is what i mostly do), or put it on an SD card. Installation is very easy. You just tap the CAB file and it installs. Most apps come in both CAB (direct device installable file) or an exe that is done through desktop activesync. I try to avoid installing any files through desktop activesync since a lot of exe's leave reminances(sp?) of themselves in the start menu and the add delete programs control panel (on your desktop computer). It is also a waste of time since all the exe's are doing is copying the cab file to the device then launching it. The installation continues on the device as if you had just tapped on a cab file to start with.

    CAB file are usually very small and can easily be DL'd over EVDO, 1xRTT, GPRS, etc. if you don't have a data connection you can put it on a storage card if you like. If you like you can connect your device to your desktop computer and copy it over that way as well (you access the storage space of your device like it is a hard drive).

    One word of caution.. after a successful installation the CAB file deletes itself so I keep backup copies on an SD card and my desktop computer.
    Thanks! The reason I asked was because I had an Axim and hot synced all the CAB files over via ActiveSync. Never though about emailing them over to yourself. The SD card route makes sense as well.
  19.    #119  
    Quote Originally Posted by gex
    I really dont think so... from my experience, and what I have been able to gather from others, Exchange Activesync has been rock solid. If you are using AUTD with SMS I have heard of delays due to carrier issues or roaming environments but that is due to the nature of SMS.

    I hear about bad experiences with desktop activesync all the time...but i don't think it is as bad as intelisync (is that what palm OS uses?)

    Kidding on that last part.. don't know anything about PalmOS and how they sync.
    I was referring more to Exchange as a whole rather than ActiveSync. I have heard a mixed bag from people regarding getting devices to sync up once EAS was running, but overall what I have read is that EAS is a nice little product. Limited features, but decent enough

    Kidding....
  20. #120  
    Quote Originally Posted by GoodGuy
    No, MSFT refers to them as patches.

    Hey, GoodFudda!

    Here is the text of the original article you were apparently referencing with your "let the bugs begin..." comment above. Let's play word search--you are looking for (1) bug, and or (2) patch...okay, start your timer:

    Microsoft confirmed Thursday that devices running its newest mobile software are unable to connect to a PC in some cases.

    The software maker said some users of ActiveSync 4, the latest version of Microsoft's synchronization software, are unable to link up to their PC, particularly on systems running firewall or parental control software. The problem occurs in devices based on Microsoft's Windows Mobile 5 operating system, including recently released handhelds from Dell and HP, as well as cell phones from Sprint and iMate.

    The problems are limited to those connecting a device to a PC via a USB connection, Microsoft said. No problems have been reported when connecting wirelessly using a Bluetooth or infrared connection, or when connecting directly to a server.

    "Microsoft is committed to solving this issue for its customers and its partners," the company said in a statement.

    An updated version of ActiveSync is planned for late next month, but a workaround has been posted on Microsoft's mobile device Web site, the company said.


    Time is UP! Put down that crayon!

    Oh, I am sorry. It seems the appropriate words were: "problem", "issue", and, of course, "updated."
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