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  1. #101  
    Quote Originally Posted by grndslm
    Hmm....can you get a data only plan with Verizon and the 700w?? And if you can, can you use Skype over EV-DO???
    You can use Skype over EVDO. A data only plan is $80 without phone service ($45 with phone service) so it's probably not worth it.
  2. #102  
    Quote Originally Posted by Kupe
    You can use Skype over EVDO. A data only plan $80 without phone service ($45 with phone service) so it's probably not worth it.
    Interesting. For anybody talking over 500 Min before 7pm every month...it seems like it'd easily be worth it.

    Do you know if regulatory fees, extra taxes, and other burdens are also included with EVDO only service. I could see A LOT of people saving money with Skype over EVDO as opposed to an expensive plan providing nothing but an unlimited number of minutes. Or you look at it like this: unlimited number of minutes for $50 and $30 for unlimited broadband access that you can legally use DUN with!!!!

    THIS IS AWESOME!!! I hope it's all true, however.
  3. #103  
  4. #104  
    Quote Originally Posted by grndslm
    Or you look at it like this: unlimited number of minutes for $50 and $30 for unlimited broadband access that you can legally use DUN with!!!!

    THIS IS AWESOME!!! I hope it's all true, however.
    Well, if you put it THAT way...

    I'm not familiar with Skype. Would it really replace a mobile phone (do I get a number someone can call me at?) Would Verizon try to prohibit its use?
  5. #105  
    Quote Originally Posted by darnell
    And most companies have no need for Oracle but still pay out the nose for it instead of using SQL Server which is cheaper or MySQL which is free...

    For smaller companies yea they use something other than Oracle. For the big companies using Oracle for years, they still use it and change slowly.
    MySQL is not a high end production database. There's alot more to a DB then select and insert queries. SQL server isn't either. I like SQL Server alot but it's not at Oracles level.
  6. #106  
    Quote Originally Posted by hariustrk
    MySQL is not a high end production database. There's alot more to a DB then select and insert queries. SQL server isn't either. I like SQL Server alot but it's not at Oracles level.
    The phrase "high end production" needs to be better defined when selecting a database solution. If it means handling a high number of transactions MySQL can do it just fine. Same with SQL Server. If it means also handling a 300TB database then Oracle or Teradata are a better option. But most companies are not close. Most (and I've seen plenty) can do just fine with MySQL and/or SQL Server in their "high end production" environments. If you need something like spacial mapping built into the database then Oracle has a add-on for that. But most of Oracle's add-ons are things most companies really do not need.

    Then of course there are things like the TPC-W numbers for web transactions. Which MS currently takes the lead in. If you take any stock in TPC numbers. MySQL is never here because their not a large company that can fund taking part in a TPC effort, but those who use it have no complaints. And the Oracle TPC results often involve machines that are far more costly than the SQL Server solutions that are on par.

    Mark my words, the transition will be slow for larger companies.
  7. #107  
    Quote Originally Posted by skfny
    Well, if you put it THAT way...

    I'm not familiar with Skype. Would it really replace a mobile phone (do I get a number someone can call me at?) Would Verizon try to prohibit its use?
    I'm sure it will eventually...but I'm not sure if EV-DO's latency issue will be a major problem or not. Others said they got the Samsung to work well with minor flaws in the quality, but I don't know if I can believe that. I think the biggest problem would be for SkypeIn.

    I'm guessing tho, it's still too early to really know what is and isn't possible with this new Treo and EV-DO network.
  8. #108  
    All the delusions in this thread are just making me laugh....

    For those of you waiting for the 700p, wait no longer. It's already out. It's named the Treo 650!! Wake up. It's over for POS.

    And this stuff about PalmSource moving forward? They've had Cobalt shelved for two years without selling a single copy and are now talking about writing a Linux OS! What kind of plan is that and what does it tell you about Cobalt?

    And all the extra $$$ you invested in POS software? Well I have too and it was all to fix/add functionality to POS that should have been there to begin with and is included in Windows Mobile.(DocstoGo,Webviewer,MP3 player,Ringtone mgr,Video player,etc) The masses want it all included & for the price it should be. There just aren't enough resources at Palm to do this.

    And finally,Apple's turnaround started with Gates saving them when he bailed them out buying a piece for $250M and then dictating terms for their niche market survival. Palm understands that.
    ROOTING for WebOS makes me more sympathetic to Cubs fans.
  9. KenwoodPI's Avatar
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    #109  
    Okay...newb question here. Can our Palm address book be converted to be used on the Windows OS?

    I've got over 600+ work realted contacts/addresses in my Treo650
  10. #110  
    Quote Originally Posted by Kenwood
    Okay...newb question here. Can our Palm address book be converted to be used on the Windows OS?

    I've got over 600+ work realted contacts/addresses in my Treo650
    All WM devices ship with Outlook.

    1. Install Outlook
    2. Install Hotsync Outlook conduits, which will be on the CD that came with your Treo.
    3. Hotsync Treo, and now your PIM data is in Outlook.
    4. ActiveSync your WM device to populate it's PIM.
    MaxiMunK.com The Forum That Asks, "Are You Not Entertained?"

    Remember: "Anyone that thinks the Treo should just work right out of the box, shouldn't own a Treo..."
  11. #111  
    Quote Originally Posted by bilbo__baggins
    Palms current situation is the one Apple was in in around 1996/97. An ageing OS and a general decline. Fortunately Apple did 2 things right - they produced the iMac (it halted the decline if nothing else) and they started the move to Mac OS X.

    I think Palms move to Windows mobile is equivalent to what would have happened if Apple had started using Windows in it's Macs (instead of getting Jobs back, buying Next and starting work on OS X).

    I don't think Apple would still be around if they had done that, and I'm not sure that Palm will survive very long selling Windows Mobile devices.

    I don't believe Palms hardware is good enough to win the day on it's own. It needs a decent OS to stand above the crowd.
    I agree with you; had Apple gone to the dark side and put Windoze on their machines, there would be no Apple Computer today; they would have gone the way of other box-makers. Anyone hearing from Gateway lately?

    Palm won't survive without an OS of its own; if it ends up being just another WM box it'll eventually get lost in the mix of handheld devices. In terms of cost of goods, they will never be able to keep up with giants like Motorola.
  12. glenada's Avatar
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    #112  
    I paid 600 smackaroonies for my unlocked 650. I haven't received my money's worth yet from this phone! Although I do like the look of the 700.
  13. KenwoodPI's Avatar
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    #113  
    Quote Originally Posted by Insertion
    All WM devices ship with Outlook.

    1. Install Outlook
    2. Install Hotsync Outlook conduits, which will be on the CD that came with your Treo.
    3. Hotsync Treo, and now your PIM data is in Outlook.
    4. ActiveSync your WM device to populate it's PIM.

    Thank You
  14. #114  
    Quote Originally Posted by longterm
    I agree with you; had Apple gone to the dark side and put Windoze on their machines, there would be no Apple Computer today; they would have gone the way of other box-makers. Anyone hearing from Gateway lately?

    Palm won't survive without an OS of its own; if it ends up being just another WM box it'll eventually get lost in the mix of handheld devices. In terms of cost of goods, they will never be able to keep up with giants like Motorola.
    What Apple should've done is the opposite. They should've put their OS on Intel platforms before Microsoft came out with Windows. If they had the vision Microsoft did of dominating the software market instead of focusing on hardware, then Apple would have the dominant OS today because it was a MUCH better system than Windows in the early days.

    IBM's decision to make the PC platform open and allow for clones just made the Intel PC architecture price too much cheaper for mainstream's user to pass up on for Apple's more expensive platform.

    I think Palm will do just fine with MS's software. I think Bill is really committed to Palm. In fact, how do you think Samsung, Dell and HP felt when Bill said that lots of Windows Mobile users are going to want to migrate to the Treo Windows Mobile platform? I'm thinking they felt screwed!
    ROOTING for WebOS makes me more sympathetic to Cubs fans.
  15. #115  
    Here is a post from pdaforums abut the Sprint 6700 that uses WM 5"

    ******
    Originally posted by Scott R
    I got mine today, so I can now add to the list with my very brief real-world experiences.

    Good
    - Looks like D-Pad/keyboard on-screen navigation is implemented better than I expected. I can do most things I need to do without touching the screen. But see below.

    Bad
    - On-screen navigation isn't implemented as well as with the Treo 600/650. By that I mean that it isn't as obvious how to move from here to there. For example...If I'm using PIE and I've got the focus on the URL field I can't use the joystick to move the focus somewhere else. I've got to use the Tab key on the keyboard first. Then I've got the focus on a link on the web page and can now use the joystick to "tab" around and change focus.

    - GUI for phone app is not optimized well for a screen this small. The number buttons are too small. This is the same GUI they use for the 6600 which has a significantly larger screen. A screen this small needs a phone app (and, I'd argue, any portrait-oriented app) with fewer, larger thumb-friendly on-screen buttons.

    - It needs more dedicated application buttons. In particular, I think it would benefit from a dedicated "Menu" button. Instead, most apps end up wasting one of their precious "soft" buttons for pulling up the application menu.

    - Another trait missing that is found on the Palm OS is what mode the "Shift" is in. Microsoft thinks they know better than us and likes to auto-capitalize the first letter of fields. Fine. But at least let me know that you've auto-shifted so that I know to manually un-shift if I need to start a word with a lowercase letter.

    * In short, usability is classic "Pocket PC" (i.e., poor) as compared to the Palm OS.
    *****

    Obviously, a number of these issues are potentially solved on the 700w if the software has been tweeked to use the 5-way and other buttons in an efficent manner. But some of them may continue to be an issue especially how well it works with the small screen.
  16. #116  
    I've read all the posts...interesting takes, alot to take in. Here's my 2 cents:

    + COMMUNITY: What really made the Palm OS unique was all the third-party apps. For example, how I could live without TealAuto, KeyCaps 600/650, Crash, SoundOff, Uninstall, Butler, Agendus, Splash Wallet, Power Up, TakePhone, KB Lights Off and Chattter e-mail? I fear the Windows Mobile won't have that same community as Palm does/once had.

    + TREO AS A LAPTOP REPLACEMENT: Since my laptop died on me this March, I upgraded to the Treo 650. More and more, this Treo was becoming my defacto computer. From what I read of the Treo700w, it looks like it's taking one step back (screen res?), but two steps forward (voice and voice mail s/w upgrades, among other things). The multitasking capabilities of the 700w "looks interesting on paper" but won't be fully realized once the darn thing is released. I really want my next Treo to replace a typical laptop with an OS that has advanced multi-tasking features. That said, I see the Treo 700w as a beta device. The more you think about it, it might take a few iterations before the 700w gets it right, much like the transition from VisorPhone --> Treo 650. I'm not willing to pony up to get the first 700w cause it will be far from perfect...not as perfect as the T650.

    + UPGRADE CONSIDERATIONS & EASE OF USE: All the money spent on Palm software apps, accessories and the OS is a major consideration whether I stick with Palm OS or defect to Windows Mobile. Here's an example: For the average consumer, how will Palm be able to sucessfully transition a customer from a Palm T650 to a Windows Treo? I hope Palm has alot of beta testers out there for this. Getting back to ease of use, I never had to think about how I use my Treo. Not once did I have to crack open the Palm Treo manual, 'cause everything was so darn intutive. Windows Mobile? Never tried it, but that doesn't mean you can't teach an old dog new tricks! Another thought: How would a Windows Treo be able to 'talk' with a Palm OS Treo?

    + FUTURE & CONSTINCENCY OF 3RD PARTY APPS: What will the major 3rd-party Palm software makers like Normsoft, Iambic, DataViz and Chatteremail (small but big!) do in the interim? I feel that all the Palm upgrades that I might currently get will be obsolete unless we hear about the future of Palm OS in the next few weeks. E-mail is a huge consideration for just about everybody, for example. Would these major companies really spend R&D to develop Windows Mobile versions of curent Palm software? If so, would these companies offer Palm OS users discounts on the Windows Mobile versions?

    + THE STATE OF THE WIRELESS INDUSTRY: Thank goodness I'm not under a (Sprint) cell phone contract right now, as I'm month to month. Since upgrading the Treo 650 in April, I would have to wait 'Till November 2006 to get under Sprint's discounted phone hardware program. Between now and then, lots of things could hapen with the Wireless industry. Little guys like Skype could either get bigger (as with the eBay deal) or get swallowed up by the bigger Telcos. Cities across the nation are trying to develop their own Wi-Fi zones, so this will definitly make things interesting. The fact that Verizon scored a major coup with the Windows Treo, will Sprint and Cingular be forced to play second fiddle? What will be the prices of Sprint Vision and new multimedia apps like MobiTV be like once EVDO becomes more prevalent? Out off all the subjects I've mentioned, I think this one is the most important.

    ###
  17. #117  
    Quote Originally Posted by Bob-C
    All the delusions in this thread are just making me laugh....

    For those of you waiting for the 700p, wait no longer. It's already out. It's named the Treo 650!! Wake up. It's over for POS.

    And this stuff about PalmSource moving forward? They've had Cobalt shelved for two years without selling a single copy and are now talking about writing a Linux OS! What kind of plan is that and what does it tell you about Cobalt?

    And all the extra $$$ you invested in POS software? Well I have too and it was all to fix/add functionality to POS that should have been there to begin with and is included in Windows Mobile.(DocstoGo,Webviewer,MP3 player,Ringtone mgr,Video player,etc) The masses want it all included & for the price it should be. There just aren't enough resources at Palm to do this.

    And finally,Apple's turnaround started with Gates saving them when he bailed them out buying a piece for $250M and then dictating terms for their niche market survival. Palm understands that.
    None of the software and reference material you mention as being included in WM5 is in the $400 I mentioned. . .

    450,000 word dictionary
    Spanish English dictionary
    Pocket Quicken
    TSMobile
    eReader and reference material
    Chess
    Checkers
    MegaClock
    Movie Guide
    BackUp Buddy
    mSafe
    Road Atlas
    Voice Dial

    Cheers, Perry.
    Last edited by gtwo; 09/27/2005 at 10:24 PM.
  18. #118  
    Quote Originally Posted by darnell
    The phrase "high end production" needs to be better defined when selecting a database solution. If it means handling a high number of transactions MySQL can do it just fine. Same with SQL Server. If it means also handling a 300TB database then Oracle or Teradata are a better option. But most companies are not close. Most (and I've seen plenty) can do just fine with MySQL and/or SQL Server in their "high end production" environments. If you need something like spacial mapping built into the database then Oracle has a add-on for that. But most of Oracle's add-ons are things most companies really do not need.
    It's not just size and transaction capabilities, it's features. MySQL just added triggers,views, and stored procedures recently for goodness sakes. It's a nice simple database for simple purposes. As far as SQL Server, PL/SQL is just alot more powerful then T-SQL. Better trigger options, better indexing options, and support for java.

    I agree there are some solutions that mysql and sql server is fine for, but when you need to do more then insert and select, you better take a good look at your db product, else you will be doing alot of middleware development thats out of scope of your project usually.
  19. #119  
    Quote Originally Posted by hariustrk
    It's not just size and transaction capabilities, it's features. MySQL just added triggers,views, and stored procedures recently for goodness sakes. It's a nice simple database for simple purposes. As far as SQL Server, PL/SQL is just alot more powerful then T-SQL. Better trigger options, better indexing options, and support for java.

    I agree there are some solutions that mysql and sql server is fine for, but when you need to do more then insert and select, you better take a good look at your db product, else you will be doing alot of middleware development thats out of scope of your project usually.
    As someone who has used DB2, Teradata, and SQL Server, I prefer SQL Server. I agree that MySQL would be hard pressed to be used as an enterprise solution, but I disagree that SQL Server wouldn't perform as well, or even outperform, Oracle in enterprise applications. Check out Microsoft's SQL Server case studies page to see how some large companies are using very effectively. When it's properly set up, administrated, tuned, and clustered, SQL Server can handle an enoumous load.

    And at a fraction of the cost of of Oracle, as someone pointed out.

    And with SQL Server 2005, you can now write your stored procedures in any .Net language, you are no longer confined to T-SQL, giving you far more flexibility and as much power as PL/SQL.
    I'm back!
  20. #120  
    Quote Originally Posted by KevMeister
    I've read all the posts...interesting takes, alot to take in. Here's my 2 cents:

    + COMMUNITY: What really made the Palm OS unique was all the third-party apps. For example, how I could live without TealAuto, KeyCaps 600/650, Crash, SoundOff, Uninstall, Butler, Agendus, Splash Wallet, Power Up, TakePhone, KB Lights Off and Chattter e-mail? I fear the Windows Mobile won't have that same community as Palm does/once had.


    + UPGRADE CONSIDERATIONS & EASE OF USE: All the money spent on Palm software apps, accessories and the OS is a major consideration whether I stick with Palm OS or defect to Windows Mobile. Here's an example: For the average consumer, how will Palm be able to sucessfully transition a customer from a Palm T650 to a Windows Treo? I hope Palm has alot of beta testers out there for this. Getting back to ease of use, I never had to think about how I use my Treo. Not once did I have to crack open the Palm Treo manual, 'cause everything was so darn intutive. Windows Mobile? Never tried it, but that doesn't mean you can't teach an old dog new tricks! Another thought: How would a Windows Treo be able to 'talk' with a Palm OS Treo?

    + FUTURE & CONSTINCENCY OF 3RD PARTY APPS: What will the major 3rd-party Palm software makers like Normsoft, Iambic, DataViz and Chatteremail (small but big!) do in the interim? I feel that all the Palm upgrades that I might currently get will be obsolete unless we hear about the future of Palm OS in the next few weeks. E-mail is a huge consideration for just about everybody, for example. Would these major companies really spend R&D to develop Windows Mobile versions of curent Palm software? If so, would these companies offer Palm OS users discounts on the Windows Mobile versions?

    + THE STATE OF THE WIRELESS INDUSTRY: Thank goodness I'm not under a (Sprint) cell phone contract right now, as I'm month to month. Since upgrading the Treo 650 in April, I would have to wait 'Till November 2006 to get under Sprint's discounted phone hardware program. Between now and then, lots of things could hapen with the Wireless industry. Little guys like Skype could either get bigger (as with the eBay deal) or get swallowed up by the bigger Telcos. Cities across the nation are trying to develop their own Wi-Fi zones, so this will definitly make things interesting. The fact that Verizon scored a major coup with the Windows Treo, will Sprint and Cingular be forced to play second fiddle? What will be the prices of Sprint Vision and new multimedia apps like MobiTV be like once EVDO becomes more prevalent? Out off all the subjects I've mentioned, I think this one is the most important.

    ###
    You can run all your Palm apps on Windows Mobile 5.0 by using StyleTap - check this out: http://styletap.com
    Shneor
    Pre 3 on T-Mobile, 32gb Touchpad
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