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  1. #41  
    Quote Originally Posted by jmill72x
    Deadly. I don't know of any company running Linux file servers. There's more to servers than Apache.
    I certainly can not say the same. I work in couputer security and my team does a lot of testing for the DoD. We run across far more Linux/Sun boxes than we do Windows. In fact the military, and government as a whole, will not be running anything older than XP in the near future. Almost all server type stuff in the DoD is non-Microsoft. You will find XP on just about every desktop, but not in the server rooms.

    And the "desktop Linux" threat is certainly nowhere to be found.
    No arguement there, it's basically non-existant, but it cant be ignored.

    It's another fad, just like Netscape. I'm sure Linux is great...right up to where you realize your legacy accessories won't work with it. Or when you realize "free" doesn't always mean "free".
    This is certainly not true, and saying Linux is "just like Netscape" couldnt be further from the truth. I'm not going to go into a huge post about how wrong these statements are, im not a Linux fanboy and it just isnt worth my time, but rest assured that Linux is anything but a "fad".
    iPhone in the Washington DC area.
  2. #42  
    I can run lots of Palm software today on my PocketPC using StyleTap. It's not perfect, but the advantage over Linux PalmOS with emulation is that it exists today.

    I'm no huge fan of MS (I've been a Mac user since forever) - but I just don't understand those who'd reject "any OS from MS" out of hand.
    Current: iPhone 3G
    Retired from active duty: Treo 800w, Sprint Touch, Mogul, Apache, Cingular Treo 650, HP iPaq 4350, T|T, M505 - Nokia 3650 - SE R520m, T610, T637, Moto P280, etc, etc...
  3. #43  
    Quote Originally Posted by phurth
    I'm no huge fan of MS (I've been a Mac user since forever) - but I just don't understand those who'd reject "any OS from MS" out of hand.
    Agreed, I havent used the most recent version of WinCE (or whatever theyre calling it now) but for people to claim they want an XP-like OS on their phone just seems silly to me.
    iPhone in the Washington DC area.
  4. #44  
    Quote Originally Posted by AnteL0pe
    I certainly can not say the same. I work in couputer security and my team does a lot of testing for the DoD. We run across far more Linux/Sun boxes than we do Windows. In fact the military, and government as a whole, will not be running anything older than XP in the near future. Almost all server type stuff in the DoD is non-Microsoft. You will find XP on just about every desktop, but not in the server rooms.
    I agree with you there, there's no reason to run anything older than Win XP. Win XP/Server 2003 is a proven OS. But as someone who has been an application developer at a few companies, and knows people in the IT areas of several Fortune 500 companies, I know of no one running Linux file servers. There's no benefit at all.


    Quote Originally Posted by AnteL0pe
    This is certainly not true, and saying Linux is "just like Netscape" couldnt be further from the truth. I'm not going to go into a huge post about how wrong these statements are, im not a Linux fanboy and it just isnt worth my time, but rest assured that Linux is anything but a "fad".
    You're right, it's not worth hijacking a thread over, but since you have no proof of this (tell me, how exactly is Linux not like Netscape?), I guess we'll just have to sit back and see where the industry is in 5 years. I used to be a Netscape fan, but there's a better chance of Mac OS catching on (especially with Apple's migration to Intel chips) than desktop Linux.

    Oracle is a bigger threat to Microsoft now than a fractured Linux industry.
    I'm back!
  5. #45  
    Quote Originally Posted by AnteL0pe
    Agreed, I havent used the most recent version of WinCE (or whatever theyre calling it now) but for people to claim they want an XP-like OS on their phone just seems silly to me.
    It's not that people want to run an "XP-like OS" on their phone, it's that people would like a more advanced OS on their phone, and right now, the former Palmsource has either been unable or unwilling to do so. They have butchered an OS, Garnet, within an inch of its life to get it where it is. They've introduced a new OS, Cobalt, that no one seems to want. If Microsoft comes along and woos Palm with an OS that can do everything that everyone on this board wants it to do, then I don't see a problem with it. And apparently neither does Palm.

    But those who are rejecting the OS that they're begging for because it says Windows instead of Palm should be stuck with a lifetime of Garnet hacks.
    I'm back!
  6. #46  
    Quote Originally Posted by jmill72x
    But those who are rejecting the OS that they're begging for because it says Windows instead of Palm should be stuck with a lifetime of Garnet hacks.
    Never argue with a masked bowling pin.
    MaxiMunK.com The Forum That Asks, "Are You Not Entertained?"

    Remember: "Anyone that thinks the Treo should just work right out of the box, shouldn't own a Treo..."
  7. #47  
    Quote Originally Posted by Insertion
    Never argue with a masked bowling pin.
    Are you not entertained???

    I just saw a thread with an evilghost post and I see he's been banned. Very sad, I really enjoyed his posts. What happened to him?
    I'm back!
  8. #48  
    Quote Originally Posted by jmill72x
    It's not that people want to run an "XP-like OS" on their phone, it's that people would like a more advanced OS on their phone, and right now, the former Palmsource has either been unable or unwilling to do so. They have butchered an OS, Garnet, within an inch of its life to get it where it is. They've introduced a new OS, Cobalt, that no one seems to want. If Microsoft comes along and woos Palm with an OS that can do everything that everyone on this board wants it to do, then I don't see a problem with it. And apparently neither does Palm.

    But those who are rejecting the OS that they're begging for because it says Windows instead of Palm should be stuck with a lifetime of Garnet hacks.
    Oh i want a more advanced OS too, but I dont want it to get in my way as I find that MS OS's often do. Again, im not speaking from a current experience with MS's mobile OS, just an overall opinion from having used different OSs for over 20 years now. There are many features I want as I said before. I want multitasking, protected memory, a better file system, better handling of SD cards, etc. I dont really want to give up the simplicity of the Palm OS, but i'm open to change. As long as a more "advanced" OS doesnt make things more difficult i'm all for it.
    iPhone in the Washington DC area.
  9. #49  
    Quote Originally Posted by AnteL0pe
    Oh i want a more advanced OS too, but I dont want it to get in my way as I find that MS OS's often do. Again, im not speaking from a current experience with MS's mobile OS, just an overall opinion from having used different OSs for over 20 years now. There are many features I want as I said before. I want multitasking, protected memory, a better file system, better handling of SD cards, etc. I dont really want to give up the simplicity of the Palm OS, but i'm open to change. As long as a more "advanced" OS doesnt make things more difficult i'm all for it.
    I agree with everything you've said, but as far as "multitasking, protected memory, a better file system, better handling of SD cards, etc...", it looks like your best choice in the near future (unless Palm is willing to drop a Cobalt-enabled Treo 700 bomb) is WM 2005. Unless there is a Cobalt Treo in the works, I just don't see that happening with Garnet hacks or PalmLinux.

    That being said, I AM willing to give up on SOME of the simplicity for a stable, multitasking OS. I see it as a good tradeoff.
    I'm back!
  10. #50  
    Quote Originally Posted by AnteL0pe
    I dont really want to give up the simplicity of the Palm OS, but i'm open to change. As long as a more "advanced" OS doesnt make things more difficult i'm all for it.
    Seems the "simplicity" of the POS is the reason for talk of a WM Treo. It worked five years ago, but now we want more.
    MaxiMunK.com The Forum That Asks, "Are You Not Entertained?"

    Remember: "Anyone that thinks the Treo should just work right out of the box, shouldn't own a Treo..."
  11. #51  
    Quote Originally Posted by Insertion
    Seems the "simplicity" of the POS is the reason for talk of a WM Treo. It worked five years ago, but now we want more.
    I think I saw someone in another post refer to the POS as an "advanced organizer" or something along those lines. When I had my Handspring Visor Deluxe, that's what I was looking for. Now I want something that plays music and videos out of the box, has advanced HTML rendering in both it's browser and email client, allows for high speed communications protocols (EVDO, WiFi, etc), seamlessly integrates with my desktop applications, and is stable. Yes, I know some of this is valid out of the box, but these are by far not best-of-breed implementations (ie, Real Player, Versamail, and Blazer).

    Oh, and works as a phone every time it rings.

    I really don't think that's too much to ask.
    I'm back!
  12. #52  
    Quote Originally Posted by AnteL0pe
    No, it was a joke, but honestly I wouldnt want an OS like XP on my phone. As with many other M$ OS's there are too many unexplained, random issues. Sometimes the wireless network card wont make a connection for 5-10 mins, other times apps just wont launch, i need to reboot it almost daily just to keep it running. These are issues that shouldnt be present on a modern computer, there is no excuse for it. I certainly wouldnt want the "stability" of an XP box transfered to my phone, it would be far worse than the Palm OS i have now.
    I hear you, and I don't disagree.
    What I guess I'm getting at is quite simply this:
    I have Windows XP on my laptop, which has an EDGE PC card. That laptop does all I need, it works great for me, and I have a great experience including mobile internet anywhere I go. It's just too big to fit in my pocket.
    If I could get a laptop that fit in my pocket then I'd be set. There are inherent usability problems unless you modify it (boot up time alone would kill it) for a portable device, so I don't mean it litterally. Besides XP requires obscene processing power and RAM requirements so it couldn't happen in the near future. One company actually makes a very expensive WinXP handheld, but boy oh boy does it cost a lot and have a ton of issues.

    I'm just saying WM5 is an attempt to get the features of windows to a portable device with minimal change in experience. I see nothing wrong with that. So in the context of the question ("why would anyone want it") then there you go. Doesn't make it 'better' just answers the question.
    Treo 750 (AT&T)
    Treo600->Treo650->Cing8525->Blackberry 8700c->Treo750->AT&T Tilt->Treo750->iPhone 3G
  13. #53  
    Quote Originally Posted by gyrfalcon
    The Treo has a much larger game library than the WM
    Really? It's not scientific, but a quick search of Handango reveals:

    Windows Mobile games category: 3154 titles
    PalmOS Games category: 2598 titles

    The Dell Axim X50v even has a special ATI graphics processor for games and multimedia apps.
    WM users like to talk about multi-tasking, like they talk & playgames while burning a DVD on their cellphone...
    Naw, but it'd be awful nice to add an appointment from info in an e-mail without having to basically close my calendar, switch to the e-mail app, copy a bit of text (not too much! mind the clipboard size!), switch back to the calendar and re-open then entry I was working on... oh hell, you use a Treo, you know what I'm going on about. Doing *anything* on a Palm that can't be done with just one app is a complete PITA.

    Having said that, I still love my Treo!
    Current: iPhone 3G
    Retired from active duty: Treo 800w, Sprint Touch, Mogul, Apache, Cingular Treo 650, HP iPaq 4350, T|T, M505 - Nokia 3650 - SE R520m, T610, T637, Moto P280, etc, etc...
  14. fly888's Avatar
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       #54  
    sorry to keep hammering away at this but it seems to me that this thread has turned into a PalmOS vs MW thread. I don't doubt that WM has features that should be present in a Treo. I see this as a bunch of mac users getting together to try to put XP on an iMac. I mean of course each OS has it's benefits but why put the OS you like on inferior hardware, when there are so many nice choices out there already?
  15. #55  
    By "inferior hardware" you mean the Treo?? That's not something I would have expected to read here.

    I consider the Treo the best form factor of all the smart phones available. The HP hw6500 comes close, but it's got a lower resolution screen.
  16. #56  
    You're making the assumption that it would be WM5 on a Treo 650. We don't know what the hardware will be. I wouldn't get it if it was simply a WM on a 650 (as you said, there are now 'better' choices.) But if they add a faster processor (don't know if it's necessary,) memory (definate must for Win,) and wifi and/or GPS, maybe a better camera, with the 650's exhisting screen and form factor, then I think it would be the best WM5 device out there.
    The screen and form factor on the Treo is still the best on the market IMO.
    So I agree with fly888 only if the hardware isn't improved.
    Treo 750 (AT&T)
    Treo600->Treo650->Cing8525->Blackberry 8700c->Treo750->AT&T Tilt->Treo750->iPhone 3G
  17. #57  
    It would also need broadband wireless access like EVDO I would think.
  18. #58  
    For people that are new to the PDA/Phone concept, having a "windows" interface is familar and easy.
  19. #59  
    I read a review of the new HP IPaq 6515 (I think that's the model #)
    As far as I can tell from the review everying on it was pretty good, except they ripped it apart for it's 240x240 screen. The reviewer says that this screen make the device incompatible with most Win Mobile applications. 'Porting applications to the 240x240 screen is easy for developers, but we'll be lucky if we see many actually taking the time to do so.' In other words there's no point in buying it since you can't use all of the wonderful window software out there.
    What wasn't clear, however, was if it's the fact that it's a 240x240 screen, or if it's the fact that it's not a full page rectangular screen like most Windows CE/Mobile devices out there. If you ran WM5 on the Treo's 320x320 screen will it have the same incompatibility issues with so many windows apps out there?
    In any case, after reading that it's enough to make the HP a definate do-not-buy.

    This is something I hadn't thought of before, and it's the first thing I'll be looking in to when the WM5 Treo comes out which is how compatible are all of the software apps out there for it?
    Treo 750 (AT&T)
    Treo600->Treo650->Cing8525->Blackberry 8700c->Treo750->AT&T Tilt->Treo750->iPhone 3G
  20. #60  
    One thing about all these fancy phones "form factors" / Hardware

    Sometimes Simplicicty is the best way to structure a product. the "Less more" appropach. Sliders, hidden keyboards, less keys, more keys, horizontial / vertical scrrens, etc. make a more complicate product, which may be more difficult to use.

    These are phones, used many times a day, in various enviorments - I belive a simple to the point, basic from, which puts eveything at your finger tips is the way to go.

    Currently the Treo has that, with few Challenges.
    da Gimp

    Please note: My spelling sucks and I'm to lazy to check it.
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