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  1. #21  
    Quote Originally Posted by Malatesta View Post
    It could also be provisioning problems.

    The phone comes with the radio off. When you turn it on, it enters a "hands free setup mode" which is when it configures itself for Sprint. If you did not activate the phone though beforehand, it will cause wonkiness later when you do activate it. My data connection was dropping in and out but after a few soft resets/update profiles it seems to be better.
    Just as a speculation. And i give it no more crediblity than a random thought., since I agree that it is almost certain that Hesse comments on voice and data shoudl not be taken at face value, could it be that the phone may have to have two radios provisioned?

    Is this interesting possibility something we can eliminate for certain?

    for example is it all possible for it to have two cdma radios? I would think that would be so different to have leaked out during beta, but palm ran a tight ship on leak for pre.
  2.    #22  
    I have no idea on that one...outside of cracking it open (no way! lol) it'd be hard to tell. Seems like a lot of extra work and money on their end for one extra feature, which Sprint has done fine without for years. Hmmm.

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  3. #23  
    Quote Originally Posted by Malatesta View Post
    I have no idea on that one...outside of cracking it open (no way! lol) it'd be hard to tell. Seems like a lot of extra work and money on their end for one extra feature, which Sprint has done fine without for years. Hmmm.
    Dang it. What we need on this board is not just the curious, but the rich and curious, who can crack it open without care!

    I do agree it seems like extra cost. I don't know how to quantify it. $20 $30? $50? just a weird thought. the thing about hesse statement is, yes you can footnote his claim with voip or wifi (footnotes on all these plans and handests now look like the footnotes on AIG's financials!) , but it is weird for him to blurt it out at the pre gig regardless, given that if I flacked for apple, I would quote and mock the claim as a particularly unfulfilled iphone envy assertion when the phone hits
  4.    #24  
    Quote Originally Posted by aero View Post
    Dang it. What we need on this board is not just the curious, but the rich and curious, who can crack it open without care!

    I do agree it seems like extra cost. I don't know how to quantify it. $20 $30? $50? just a weird thought. the thing about hesse statement is, yes you can footnote his claim with voip or wifi (footnotes on all these plans and handests now look like the footnotes on AIG's financials!) , but it is weird for him to blurt it out at the pre gig regardless.
    lol, well Engadget just did a breakdown on the BB Storm and the Qualcomm dual gsm/cdma chipset was $35, so yeah...I'd imagine $20 per handset extra at least.

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  5. #25  
    Quote Originally Posted by Malatesta View Post
    lol, well Engadget just did a breakdown on the BB Storm and the Qualcomm dual gsm/cdma chipset was $35, so yeah...I'd imagine $20 per handset extra at least.
    Wouldn't a dual chipset require totally diffierent drivers/firmware, possibly OS tweaks to make it work properly, etc etc etc?

    So $20-35 might be a good number for the hardware....but then you have the manhours on top of that.
  6. #26  
    Quote Originally Posted by Ebag333 View Post
    Wouldn't a dual chipset require totally diffierent drivers/firmware, possibly OS tweaks to make it work properly, etc etc etc?

    So $20-35 might be a good number for the hardware....but then you have the manhours on top of that.
    absolutely. although those costs would be mostly one time per os and distributed across hundreds of thousands an then millions of units as opposed to the hardware costs per unit which would be more constant (although also dropping over time). I do think it wuold have leaked out of ten places if it was being worked on. That is why I give it a one in amillion odds.

    Do you suppose they might need to provison a second phone number to do this?

    funny thing is that data+voice simultanious is not killer for me, but I would love Sprint to get a top quality advanced device that could do cdma and gsm and have gps.
  7.    #27  
    Quote Originally Posted by Ebag333 View Post
    Wouldn't a dual chipset require totally diffierent drivers/firmware, possibly OS tweaks to make it work properly, etc etc etc?

    So $20-35 might be a good number for the hardware....but then you have the manhours on top of that.
    Probably? I mean we are headed deep, deep into unexplored and speculatory areas right now. I can even formulate an intelligent response to the idea, lol.

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  8. #28  
    I am sorry I did take the thread off topic and it was beyond even normal speculation.

    I do hope that ram allocation is being looked at and thank you Mal for all your testing so far.
  9. #29  
    Okay,
    how about this;

    We could do a Custom Rom, where we strip some of the bigger preinstalled apps. And then if we want them, we just install them to Storage.

    Ebag will have to make all the cabs for us though.
  10. #30  
    Quote Originally Posted by berdinkerdickle View Post
    Okay,
    how about this;

    We could do a Custom Rom, where we strip some of the bigger preinstalled apps. And then if we want them, we just install them to Storage.

    Ebag will have to make all the cabs for us though.
    That's exactly what everyone at XDA does with their custom ROMs. Very simple.
  11. #31  
    Yea, but Treo isn't much of an XDA interest.
    So if it is to happen, we're the Team.
    Go take a look at the Treo Pro section. I'm a Lone Ranger overthere.
    Hope things change when Sprint releases.
  12.    #32  
    Quote Originally Posted by berdinkerdickle View Post
    Yea, but Treo isn't much of an XDA interest.
    So if it is to happen, we're the Team.
    Go take a look at the Treo Pro section. I'm a Lone Ranger overthere.
    Hope things change when Sprint releases.
    Even if we could do that, which is a big if, it doesn't make up for nor excuse the situation (not that you're justifying it!, I'm just ranting here)

    Most people who buy this phone will not void their warranty to load a "custom" ROM and even so, it is a bad reflection on WM that people have to do so to get their phones working properly.

    While I love the custom ROM community, I think they're a necessary evil for the long term viability of WM. People want simplicity and the Treo Pro is built around that idea: no CDs, ready to use out of the box, simple to setup, etc. Telling people to now do a custom ROM negates all that effort.

    /rant

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  13. #33  
    I agree!
    And yes, my post wasn't to justify, thanks

    Infact, to not derail this thread into Customs, but rather to talk about the little mem and why?

    There isn't really a need for a Custom with the GTP (Gsm Treo Pro)
    It is a Clean Rom.

    Yet carriers want their apps cooked in. (so the evil of a custom)
    I don't see this as a blame for MS, they didn't decide how much mem the mfg would give us, or how much bloatware.

    It's how much did Palm/Htc decide to give us and where, and also important is why?

    All hopefully premature questioning.

    If it gets "Officially Released" as is mem wise, then yes, the outta box experience will be less that it could of been.
    Just call me Berd.
  14. #34  
    Quote Originally Posted by aero View Post
    I am sorry I did take the thread off topic and it was beyond even normal speculation.
    Actually not off topic at all. A second radio would explain the missing 20mb of RAM.
    Pilot 1000 -> Pilot 5000 ->Palm Pilot Professional -> HP 620LX -> TRG Pro -> Palm V -> Palm Vx -> Palm M505 -> Palm i705 -> Palm Tungsten|T -> Samsung i500 -> Treo 600->Treo 650 -> Treo 600-> Treo 700p ->Centro ->Treo 800w + Redfly C8n -> Palm Pre -> HP Touchpad
    R.I.P Palm 1996-2011
  15.    #35  
    Quote Originally Posted by rc46 View Post
    Actually not off topic at all. A second radio would explain the missing 20mb of RAM.
    You think rc46? I have no idea about this stuff, but can you walk us through the rationale? I'd be curious.

    Also, related to memory: I was just testing IE6 for WME, going to various flash sites, switching between "mobile" and "desktop" and I watched the RAM. After 25mins of goofing around? It sucked down 23mb of RAM. (was down to 13mb of free RAM). Honestly, flash only works well on mobile sites for flash, which all I can really find now is m.youtube.com

    That was recovered once I exited IE of course, but still. Now, if you're just viewing mobile sites, it probably wont get that high, but some more intensive ones and it could.

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  16. #36  
    Quote Originally Posted by Malatesta View Post
    You think rc46? I have no idea about this stuff, but can you walk us through the rationale?
    I have no idea about this stuff either but I thought I heard you say on the pod cast that part of 128mb of RAM is allocated to the radio thats why it does not show up in the "Total" memory number. So if thats the case an extra radio would need another slice of the RAM pie.

    We still don't know where the missing 20mb of memory is going. If IE6 is sucking up system RAM then its pretty safe to assume that the 20mb is not set aside for IE6.

    Here is my convoluted logic

    GSM Treo Pro (1 radio)
    128mb Physical RAM
    100mb Available to the OS

    CDMA Treo Pro (2 radios?)
    128mb Physical RAM
    80mb Available to the OS

    It might explain the 20mb variance?

    Or maybe that 20mb is set aside for special drivers that allow the same time use of voice and data? That could explain it as well.

    I was really hoping that the 20mb was set aside for IE6 but that does not seem to be the case. If it turns out to be one of the reasons speculated above then its probably not fixable which would really suck.
    Last edited by rc46; 01/29/2009 at 03:39 PM.
    Pilot 1000 -> Pilot 5000 ->Palm Pilot Professional -> HP 620LX -> TRG Pro -> Palm V -> Palm Vx -> Palm M505 -> Palm i705 -> Palm Tungsten|T -> Samsung i500 -> Treo 600->Treo 650 -> Treo 600-> Treo 700p ->Centro ->Treo 800w + Redfly C8n -> Palm Pre -> HP Touchpad
    R.I.P Palm 1996-2011
  17. #37  
    Don't you think they would advertise simultaneous talk/data in the literature if they created a unique CDMA phone with multiple radios?
  18. #38  
    Quote Originally Posted by MobileBiz View Post
    Don't you think they would advertise simultaneous talk/data in the literature if they created a unique CDMA phone with multiple radios?
    Absolutely.
  19. #39  
    Quote Originally Posted by MobileBiz View Post
    Don't you think they would advertise simultaneous talk/data in the literature if they created a unique CDMA phone with multiple radios?
    I would think so too, and I would think it would have leaked out of qualcomm, htc, microsoft, if involved ,or Sprint.

    As I said it was just a speculation, and one the very margins of the possible.

    Back to speculation that of the more possible. I am curious are we discounting the possibility it is ie6 hogging user avaialbe? not the program size but perhaps some cache or set aside memory working area (either properly or improperly implemented) for ie6 generally or its flash, java or video needs?

    I don't know if mal replicated the reported crash with one of the included programs (I think someone mentioned bejeweled?)
  20.    #40  
    Quote Originally Posted by aero View Post
    Back to speculation that of the more possible. I am curious are we discounting the possibility it is ie6 hogging user avaialbe? not the program size but perhaps some cache or set aside memory working area (either properly or improperly implemented) for ie6 generally or its flash, java or video needs?
    It's probably IE6. Titan isn't pre-loaded and there is no 2nd radio, so it's the only thing that's really left.
    Quote Originally Posted by aero View Post
    I don't know if mal replicated the reported crash with one of the included programs (I think someone mentioned bejeweled?)
    Here's the (odd?) thing about Bejeweled 2: Now I've never played this game and have no idea how it handles on other WM devices, but in short it don't multitask with the Treo Pro.

    What I mean is if you launch it but hit the Red key (home screen) it automatically shuts down/unloads the app. I have 28mb pre-load and it takes about 4mb of RAM, so it's not too low on memory. I dunno if that's the way Astraware designed it, but it's odd on a WM device to have that happen.

    Nothing really crashes on the Treo Pro, it just unloads apps, lol. IE6 is usually the first to go.

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