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  1. #61  
    Quote Originally Posted by darnell View Post
    And some other issues may not have been known till after 30 days.
    That's a nice "what if", but the reality is that Sprint gives you every opportunity to swap the phone if it doesn't work for you.

    What do you expect, them to give you 30 years to swap it?

    If you can't figure out that a phone works for you or not in 30 days, you got no one to blame but yourself.


    Quote Originally Posted by darnell View Post
    Nobody put a gun to anyone's head to keep the 800w, but leaving someone with a defective device and telling them their only option is to pay full price for another device is a pretty ugly means to make someone keep the 800w even if they find it to be defective.
    Nicely put, but that's not how the 30 days works.

    When you swap a phone, you get credited the amount that you paid for the original. And you get whatever deal you got before (generally). So you're not paying full price.
  2. #62  
    Quote Originally Posted by Ebag333 View Post
    Additionally no one forced you to keep the 800w.
    Sprint offers a 30 day exchange program for a reason. People who kept their 800w post 30 days did so knowing all the issues, it wasn't like they used it for 30 days, and on day 31 went "Whoa! This phone is bigger than other phones!"
    What a strange claim, and simply false. Let's not play the blame the customer for advertised features game!

    The maker warranty is 12 months. False advertising is unlimited and in this case, if mitigated by the faq, gives zero mitigation and remains unlimited to anyone who bought in the first 60 days before the faq.

    Sprint's 30 days is for non advertised non warranty issues and is irrelevant.
    What a strange claim, and simply false. Typical blame the custeorm -- and lay out 100% false facts as well.

    The maker warranty is 12 months. False advertising is unlimited and in this case, if mitigated by the faq, gives zero mitigation and remains unlimited to anyone who bought in the first 60 days before the faq.

    Sprint's 30 days is for non advertised non warranty issues and is irrelevant.

    Analogy:
    You buy handset advertised with WIFI by Palm
    The retailer offers a 30 day no questions asked exchange
    Palm itself offers a 12 month warranty
    Some users notice problewms with wifi in 30 days. Plam says they are looking into the problem
    Most other users try the wifi later and discover ti doesnt work as specified in the advertisements

    Ebag's position : the 30 day return policy voids completely the warranty, and also means they can make any claim whatsoever on features, and it is the b buyer's responsibility to check the 100 features and specs advertised int eh 30 days or they are whiners and the customer is at fault.

    Everyone else's position, and the law:
    30 day no questioned asked policy by Sprint (required by law in many states), does not void warranties, is not about warranty, which in this case are one year, and doesn't void false adverting claims which run for several years. (If they did then offering a seven day no questioned asked policy would also void any warranty responsibility by makers).
    Last edited by aero; 01/17/2009 at 08:11 AM.
  3. #63  
    Quote Originally Posted by Ebag333 View Post
    If you can't figure out that a phone works for you or not in 30 days, you got no one to blame but yourself.
    Since you are literally the only person on the planet with that view,.

    You are literally claiming there is not 12 month warranty and literally claiming advertised features need not be present after 30 days!

    30 days is if you don't like the sound quality, color, heft and form factor or Sprints service and want out of your contract. It has zero to do with warranting the advertised features.

    warranty is 12 months, and this is by law covered, and false adverting is for the products life time, for anyone who bought during the period of the false advertising.
  4. #64  
    Quote Originally Posted by Malatesta View Post
    I see a lot of assumptions being made here.

    All we know is this:
    • Early September: Palm submits to the FCC
    • Early October: FCC Testing Complete--> heads to Sprint for testing
    • Late October: Treo Pro shows up testing on Sprint (DSL report)
    Yeas and then we had two pushback lrequests from Palm on release dates.
    You indicated a pushback would be needed by Sprint if they had too much stock, you left out on your list the fact that there were pushbacks (two)
  5. #65  
    Quote Originally Posted by darnell View Post
    Palm needed over 30 days to figure out a lame response for their own GPS issue. For some time they could not even understand the problem.
    Exxaclty and this no one forced you to beyu it means the person you ae debating rejects any issue of false advertsing on any product.

    They now also claim that a 30 day no questioned asked return policy means that the accompanying 12 month warranty is void after 30 days.

    By this (i)logic, if I sold Sony TV's. and offered a seven day no questions asked return policy, and the maker gave a 12 month warranty, and the TV tuned out not to have a prominently advertised by sony qam tuner, which you may not have known until trying it off of your cable box in 60 days, advertised, Sony could tell a buyer, "you had a seven day return policy, so the 12 month warranty or our adverting to consumers is void." lol they would have to think you fell off a turnip truck!



    Sprint offers a 30 days return policy because they are required so by law in many states and in others other carriers offer such a policy. It has nothing to do with false adverting or warranty issues.
  6. chong67's Avatar
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    #66  
    I paid $8 insurance since the first day I bought it.

    I walk in to Sprint store yesterday and they get me a replacement the next day.

    If I have to mail it to Palm, I wonder how long thats going to take.
  7. #67  
    Long time palm users like myself assumed that Palm would fix the 800W over a reasonable period of time with the usual ROMs, patches, and accessories, etc. None of the Palm devices in the last 5 years were 100% out of the gate, but they eventually made them pretty decent. So, we hung in there beyond the 30 days assuming Palm would make it right in time. The 800W was different, because instead of making it right, they turned around and dropped us like a bad habit and were were left holding the bag after the 30 days expired.

    You can say we were stupid for keeping it, but you have to look at it in the context of Palm history.
  8. #68  
    Quote Originally Posted by Ebag333 View Post
    If you can't figure out that a phone works for you or not in 30 days, you got no one to blame but yourself.
    Quote Originally Posted by aero View Post
    Since you are literally the only person on the planet with that view,.
    Aero, this IS Sprint's policy as well as Verizon's, AT&Ts and T-Mobile: You have 30 days to try the phone and see if you like it.

    After that, you have to take any problems up with the manufacturer. You can try back with the carrier, but they are not obligated to go beyond those 30 days.

    There is no debate here on that and it's very clear. If you want to go down the route of false advertising, then do so. But have any of you actually field a lawsuit yet? Why not if you are so passionate about it?
    Quote Originally Posted by aero View Post
    Yeas and then we had two pushback lrequests from Palm on release dates.
    You indicated a pushback would be needed by Sprint if they had too much stock, you left out on your list the fact that there were pushbacks (two)
    I see one deferral request and an update to that same request. It is obvious the FCC requested a reason and clarification for the original request, so Palm responded with "marketing requirements". Where do you see two? Incidentally, this has nothing to do with Sprint launching the device, it has to do with keeping those FCC docs out of public view.
    Quote Originally Posted by socomon View Post
    None of the Palm devices in the last 5 years were 100% out of the gate, but they eventually made them pretty decent.
    700w?

    No one was ever compensated for that fiasco and that was back when you only had 15 days. Personal opinion here, but I think it is very risky to buy a device that does not meet your requirements/satisfaction expecting a "fix". That is a gamble.
    Last edited by Malatesta; 01/17/2009 at 01:40 PM.

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  9. #69  
    Quote Originally Posted by chong67 View Post
    When I go to Sprint website to do a upgrade on other phones, it allow me. I think I am 1.5 yr into my contract.

    I wonder if I can get it for $250 on Jan 25. Will they extend by SERO?
    I believe you're eligible for an upgrade after 1 yr, but you'd have to pay more for the new phone than you would after 2 yrs.
  10. #70  
    Quote Originally Posted by chong67 View Post
    When I go to Sprint website to do a upgrade on other phones, it allow me. I think I am 1.5 yr into my contract.

    I wonder if I can get it for $250 on Jan 25. Will they extend by SERO?
    You are entitled to $75 credit.

    But, as mentioned above, talk to them. I was able to get my 2 year credit early. Explain that you have the 800w but had you known about the Treo Pro, you would get that (or whatever else you may want) and try do a deal with them.
    Last edited by Malatesta; 01/17/2009 at 01:46 PM.

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  11. #71  
    Quote Originally Posted by darnell View Post
    The Treo Pro is old tech in CES terms, no way Palm was going to mention it there. CES is for the most cutting edge new tech, not a CDMA mod of something already on the market.



    I would not go as far as to claim "salvation" but certainly an improvement over the 800w. Palm and Sprint marketed the 800w with what was in my opinion false statements about the device. Then months after release, made what I feel were bogus cover stories. It took more than 30 days for even Palm to be able to come up with their cover story. And after doing it all, many who seek to get a refund are turned down unless they force Palm's hand or hammer Sprint. Plenty of responsible customers purchased the 800w feeling Palm would stand by their warranty with far less hassle. Only because of Palm and Sprint's misrepresentation of the device was anyone left holding the bag. Anyone can get out of it, but Palm and Sprint sure made it harder than need be.
    So true. I seem to remember a couple of people on this very forum defending Palm to the death and promising fixes for all of the bugs and a major ROM update in the near future. That was a couple of months ago. Maybe I should check Palm's site and download that ROM update.

    Of course, if Sprint or Palm would have come clean from the start, customers would have had accurate information during their 30-day window. Now people are forced to sling their 800w's for next to nothing just to cover a small portion of the purchase price for a phone that works as advertised like the Treo Pro.
  12. chong67's Avatar
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    #72  
    1.5 yrs ago I got the Mogul for free plus another $35 more.

    I sold the Mogul for $190 and got me a new 800w for $258 from ebay.

    Now I wonder how much I am going to get for selling the 800w so I can get me a new Treo Pro.
  13. #73  
    Aero, you know there is a 1 year warranty and Palm is bound by it. I'm not going to continue a circular debate. It does not matter if a defect is discovered on day 300 of ownership, never mind 30 days, Palm is bound to fix or refund.

    Quote Originally Posted by chong67 View Post
    I paid $8 insurance since the first day I bought it.

    I walk in to Sprint store yesterday and they get me a replacement the next day.

    If I have to mail it to Palm, I wonder how long thats going to take.
    Sprint is the warranty service agent for the Palm Treo 800w. So Palm's warranty to repair or replacement is to be performed by Sprint regardless of whether you had the insurance or not, so long as you are the original owner and purchased from a store that resells directly from Palm. You have the insurance, but the replacement you're getting is via Sprint, not Asurion the insurance backer. So your having insurance did not resolve your problem, Sprint did and they are the warranty service agent for the Palm Treo 800w.
  14. #74  
    Quote Originally Posted by darnell View Post
    ...Sprint is the warranty service agent for the Palm Treo 800w. So Palm's warranty to repair or replacement is to be performed by Sprint regardless of whether you had the insurance or not, so long as you are the original owner and purchased from a store that resells directly from Palm. You have the insurance, but the replacement you're getting is via Sprint, not Asurion the insurance backer. So your having insurance did not resolve your problem, Sprint did and they are the warranty service agent for the Palm Treo 800w.
    Warranty terms usually offer repair or replace (at the manufacter's discresion) and not refund. Refunds are occasionally given as a good will gesture or as an undocumented remedy for problems that the manufacturer can not resolve. Refunds can usually only be enforced by a court or granted by the manufacturer.

    My understanding is Palm is responsible for the warranty and not Sprint. If Sprint carries the resposibility, why do they charge $55 for warranty replacements in store if you did not purchase the Sprint insurance. If you send it back to Palm, there is no fee. It is illegal to charge a fee for in warranty service that is not disclosed in the warranty document. It apparently isn't illegal for Sprint to charge a fee to process your warranty claim for you.
  15. #75  
    Quote Originally Posted by pgh1969pa View Post
    Warranty terms usually offer repair or replace (at the manufacter's discresion) and not refund. Refunds are occasionally given as a good will gesture or as an undocumented remedy for problems that the manufacturer can not resolve. Refunds can usually only be enforced by a court or granted by the manufacturer.
    Correct.


    Quote Originally Posted by pgh1969pa View Post
    My understanding is Palm is responsible for the warranty and not Sprint. If Sprint carries the resposibility, why do they charge $55 for warranty replacements in store if you did not purchase the Sprint insurance. If you send it back to Palm, there is no fee. It is illegal to charge a fee for in warranty service that is not disclosed in the warranty document. It apparently isn't illegal for Sprint to charge a fee to process your warranty claim for you.
    That's because it's not a warranty swap. They even call it an "in-store exchange", and do not use the word warranty.

    When I got my 700wx swapped, they charged me $15, so the price is negotiable (depends on the manager, your standing with Sprint, etc etc etc).
  16. #76  
    Quote Originally Posted by pgh1969pa View Post
    Warranty terms usually offer repair or replace (at the manufacter's discresion) and not refund.
    Have you read your Palm Treo 800w warranty? The remedies at Palm's discretion are noted to be repair, replace or refund.

    I know Palm is the party to provide the refund, my point is that Palm makes it difficult to reach them. So most disappointed with the 800w that have found defects go to Sprint because Palm says go to Sprint and once Sprint can't remedy their problems they feel rather stuck. The most forwarding information I could get from Sprint to reach Palm was a service number which would charge anyone who was past 90 days of ownership. They wanted a CC number before they would even speak to anyone past 90 days. Not exactly what I find to be good warranty service. And it's rather intimidating.

    I don't know if you've actually been through the process of seeking remedy for 800w issues, but I'm not surprised anyone would feel Sprint left them stuck. I was able to finally get relief through Palm, but it's not a very straight forward process. I am willing to help anyone that feels need to enter that process though.
  17. insol's Avatar
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    #77  
    I for one cannot wait. I am just itching to be in the TP. Jim2000's comment in another thread about the 800w truck versus Pro Bmw pretty much sums it up for me...

    It would be nice to get some credit, I switched to sprint to get the 800w when it came out, but either way I am in the TP come the 25th.
    Last edited by insol; 01/18/2009 at 06:36 PM.
  18. #78  
    Quote Originally Posted by chong67 View Post
    1.5 yrs ago I got the Mogul for free plus another $35 more.

    I sold the Mogul for $190 and got me a new 800w for $258 from ebay.

    Now I wonder how much I am going to get for selling the 800w so I can get me a new Treo Pro.
    Unfortunately, a used Mogul is probably STILL worth more than a used 800w. New 800w's sell for around $225 shipped with no contract.
  19.    #80  
    What happened to my thread? It turned into some kind of legal debate. At least it's activity!

    I'm really trying to think of some good reasons to get this thing next week:

    (1) I'm not going to get anything more than a $75 discount.
    (2) My Centro does everything I actually need to do.
    (3) I can probably do things quicker on my Centro.
    (4) I will waste at least a week playing with the Pro.
    (5) I'll have to buy some apps.
    (6) Immediately after I scratch it good, the Pre will be available.

    That's it I'm getting one! Can't wait until next Sunday!
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