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  1. #41  
    Very cool Ebag.

    My roaming preferences are still there so I'll play around with this today as I travel.

    I just threw it on Roaming only and started the GPS and it totally locked. This was even after a soft reset. Of course I haven't tried it off location, that will be interesting.

    I'm using GPSToggle (free today plugin) that just turns your GPS on/off and shows how many sats are locked. It uses no data and sure enough, neither did the GPS in my tests, which backs up the using the idea that it is using stored sat data and not accessing assistance servers for this. I still easily locked on 8-9 sats by my window.

    Questions to be worked out:
    1. Does it work after a hard reset in Roaming Only?
    2. Do it work in a different location in Roaming Only/after Soft Reset?

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  2. #42  
    Interesting. I installed the application, ended up moving it to the top of the plug-in list. It showed a lock on 10, 9, then 8. I then opened up Google Maps and the GPS was not shown as enabled. Enabled it and it quickly changed locations. I then disabled GPS via GPSToggle, went back to Google Maps and it shows GPS as being active, confirmed as I walked around.

    I just lost the Bluetooth connection with Active Stynk....
  3.    #43  
    Quote Originally Posted by Malatesta View Post
    Questions to be worked out:
    1. Does it work after a hard reset in Roaming Only?
    2. Do it work in a different location in Roaming Only/after Soft Reset?
    Thanks Mal. Good to have confirmation that it's working for everyone and it's not my "magic" GPS at work.

    This also seems to confirm Palm's statements that it is only the network time needed to prime the GPS.

    It really makes me question if we'll ever be able to do standalone GPS, because if that's true then it's likely the driver or firmware itself, and not simply configuration like many of us had hoped.

    So unless someone can code a new driver/firmware, we're probably waiting on Palm/Qualcomm.

    All that being said, since we can now start GPS when roaming (and not just on Sprint's network) then that HUGELY reduces the need for true standalone GPS. It's only people like me who are crazy enough to go travel a couple hundred miles from the nearest town, or people who travel out of the country who will still be hurting for GPS. (And in both cases, a standalone GPS puck should be carried even IF the GPS was true standalone on the phone. I know I carry my GPS puck regardless, even if I'm roaming and could start GPS on my phone.)

    I'll hard reset my phone, and play with this some more. Maybe I can test out the no service thing later this week.
  4. #44  
    I have a Garmin Colorado 400T - the one with the swivel button on the top; the Oregon has the touch screen; other than that, not a big difference between the 2 series. The 400T handles the regular size SD, the other series I believe handle the micro. Anyway, satellite acquisition here in Hawaii (Oahu) is about 30 seconds. Entering data, such as geocaching stuff, is done via the desktop. The built-in maps are not as detailed as those that are dedicated to traveling. I went with the Colorado series because of the "water" resistent design and hiking goal; otherwise, the portable ones (car type that you can carry around) do just as well, though they do not have the "recreational" information of those designed specifically for recreation/hiking.

    ------------------------------------------------------------------------


    True standalone GPS - any comments on portable/hand held units?
    Last edited by bclinger; 12/27/2008 at 11:14 AM.
  5.    #45  
    Quote Originally Posted by bclinger View Post
    True standalone GPS - any comments on portable/hand held units?
    I just got a cheap $79.99 unit. No LCD, no methods of connecting it other than bluetooth, no nuthin'. Works great. I had a heck of a time finding it though....and I can't remember the brand of it offhand.
  6.    #46  
    So here's proof that standalone GPS works off Sprint's network.

    I had just hard reset my phone, so took the opportunity to test it.

    To test:

    1) Set my phone on roaming networks only.
    2) Enable NetGuard (uncheck the box to allow data connections).
    3) Installed the GPS today plugin (Mal linked to this above).
    4) Deleted all GPS data (it was hard reset, but went into ##GPS# and deleted anyway).
    5) Soft Reset
    6) Start GPS through the Today plugin.


    So what's interesting is that aGPS tries to kick in, you can see it because you'll get prompted to connect to the net. It'll try several times to pull data from Sprint's aGPS server.

    If you deny net access, it will find Sats. It's very slow (no doubt not helped any by me being inside a building), but after about 5 minutes it found the first Sat, all on it's own. I've never been prouder!



    Now, this is not true complete standalone GPS. For that to work, we need to have *NO* network signal at all and still have GPS work.

    What this does tell us is a few things:

    1) The stored GPS data will work while roaming or on Sprint's network.
    2) aGPS will work while roaming, as long as you have a good data connection.
    3) Should stored data and aGPS not be available, the standalone GPS will kick in and satellite data will be pulled down, while roaming or on Sprint's network.


    Folks, that is just short of having full, true, standalone GPS.
  7. #47  
    btw, to add to this:

    Still won't work in "flight mode" with Wifi on--which is shame (and odd). Although I didnt wait 5 mins...more like 2 but still no reason to suppose it'd be different.

    Interesting how it now works as Palm says it should (just needs network time), though obviously still not standalone.
  8. gum7's Avatar
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    #48  
    Great Job guys!......Hooked it up no problem following ebag's directions....works like a charm...thanks!
  9. #49  
    Simply amazing.. Palm should employ you guys to save their bacon.
    Clie>Treo 600p> Treo 650p>Treo 755p>Treo 800w>Palm Pre
  10.    #50  
    I wouldn't turn down a job from Palm....if the price was right.


    So I got to test this today in a real life situation. Out playing in the snow, far from civilization. Was able to startup GPS with no problems 3 times (had to soft reset twice, due to my very old version of Google Maps sometimes not updating when the phone powers off in sleep mode). All 3 times in roaming with very spotty signal.

    Shoot, with this tweak standalone GPS becomes less and less of a big deal to me.
  11. #51  
    Quote Originally Posted by Malatesta View Post
    btw, to add to this:

    Still won't work in "flight mode" with Wifi on--which is shame (and odd). Although I didnt wait 5 mins...more like 2 but still no reason to suppose it'd be different.

    Interesting how it now works as Palm says it should (just needs network time), though obviously still not standalone.
    Yup. Still no standalone GPS on flights or overseas. Seems like it would be an easy fix for Palm to make but they still choose not to. Odd.
  12.    #52  
    Quote Originally Posted by nsxprime View Post
    Yup. Still no standalone GPS on flights or overseas. Seems like it would be an easy fix for Palm to make but they still choose not to. Odd.
    Actually, not true.

    It'll work just fine as long as you don't soft reset.
  13. #53  
    Quote Originally Posted by Ebag333 View Post
    Actually, not true.

    It'll work just fine as long as you don't soft reset.
    Nope. Going into flight mode is enough to kill it. Please re-read Mal's post and let him know if you think he's wrong.
  14.    #54  
    Quote Originally Posted by Malatesta View Post
    Maybe quit peeing in our pool?




    And as a side note, lets try and keep the discussion on topic and to the point. This isn't a thread to rehash old arguments about standalone GPS, and Palm's possible (or not) fixes. I'd hate to have to ask Dieter to come in and moderate the thread.
  15. #55  
    Good poin--back OT.

    Anyways, seriously Ebag: the GPS is pretty awesome now on this phone. I can't believe how instant it is now. I'm curious if Palm is just going by what Qualcomm is telling them--I mean we know Palm's WM team is pretty decimated at this point and it seems that the way we have it now is the way the pretty much intended (according to the FAQ), though the true-standalone is lacking.

    I get the feeling there is lots of confusion between various teams (Qualcom, Palm and Sprint) on this issue.

    Another question
    : what would happen with this current setup in say Europe, with the radio still on, GPS data stored? It would seem that it should work for a few days? OTOH, I imagine the battery would die quickly too looking for a signal!

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  16.    #56  
    So I was testing out GPS without the radio on.

    Initialized GPS (turned it on then off), then turned off my radio. I was able to successfully start GPS back up with no problems (with the radio off), and it tracked my location perfectly (including dropping and picking up new sats as conditions changed).

    So if you are going to need to use GPS completely off network, all you have to do is initialize it on network and you should be fine.

    Considering that standalone GPS works perfectly fine on roaming, there is no reason to believe that it will not work completely off network (though this is a rather hard premise to tests as it would require you initializing GPS, moving several hundred miles away to invalidate cached data, then starting GPS back up).


    So for those of you who want to track your location while flying, you should be able do so.


    Quote Originally Posted by Malatesta View Post

    Another question
    : what would happen with this current setup in say Europe, with the radio still on, GPS data stored?
    Assuming you didn't soft reset (which would drop the network time), and you initialized GPS while on Sprint network, it should do the following:

    1. Attempt to use cached GPS data (which would be incorrect due to the location change).
    2. Attempt to connect to Sprint's aGPS server (which would fail assuming you had no network coverage).
    3. Fall back on standalone GPS (see my tests on forcing it to use standalone GPS above).


    Since one rarely needs to soft reset, it's certainly feasible to use the 800w as a GPS device completely off network (though a worldwide phone or a standalone GPS device makes far more sense). I haven't tested this completely and to my satisfaction yet, but I hope to next time I get off network (which is getting progressively harder even out here).
    Last edited by Ebag333; 12/28/2008 at 03:44 PM.
  17. #57  
    Quote Originally Posted by Ebag333 View Post




    And as a side note, lets try and keep the discussion on topic and to the point. This isn't a thread to rehash old arguments about standalone GPS, and Palm's possible (or not) fixes. I'd hate to have to ask Dieter to come in and moderate the thread.
    Good call. This hack at least gets the aGPS performance in line with other Sprint phones like the Mogul and Touch Pro. At least it's a start. Too bad Palm can't get rid of the initialization bug.
  18. gjlowe's Avatar
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    #58  
    Thanks everyone for this great stuff! Mal - what is the trick you put up in "five minutes" back on 12/23? For those of us just joining the thread, it isn't quite clear.

    Thanks!
  19. #59  
    Quote Originally Posted by gjlowe View Post
    Mal - what is the trick you put up in "five minutes" back on 12/23? For those of us just joining the thread, it isn't quite clear.

    Thanks!
    http://discussion.treocentral.com/sh...d.php?t=174963

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  20. gjlowe's Avatar
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    #60  
    Thanks!
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