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  1. #341  
    Quote Originally Posted by darnell View Post
    Please provide reasons why Sprint would carry the Treo Pro for reasons other than to gain and retain customers?
    To make you happy Darnell, so you can "win" arguments on message boards about phones

    Unless you have solid numbers/data to support your theory that people are leaving Sprint because of the 800w but will stay for the Treo Pro. you should really reconsider your next post that follows mine

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  2. #342  
    For anyone that would like to engage in conversation instead of personal attacks:

    Quote Originally Posted by darnell View Post
    Please provide reasons why Sprint would carry the Treo Pro for reasons other than to gain and retain customers?
  3. #343  
    Quote Originally Posted by darnell View Post
    Please provide reasons why Sprint would carry the Treo Pro for reasons other than to gain and retain customers?
    That's easy.

    Sprint and Palm can make more money off of the Treo Pro than the 800w because of the lower costs associated with production going with HTC rather than Inventec.

    Specifically, the profit margin is higher with the Treo Pro due to larger, more streamlined production systems at HTC.

    Furthermore, due to certain improprieties at Inventec with their CEOs, Palm no longer feels comfortable doing business with them and would prefer to use HTC instead--so they had to inform Sprint that they can no longer produce the 800w but instead have a Treo Pro as an alternative (HTC was not going to reproduce the 800w, an Inventec device after all). This also has the added benefit of officially keeping HTC out of the front-qwerty WM Pro business, by having Palm pay them to use their devices.

    This both explains why the Treo Pro seems so "different" from previous Palm devices and why HTC does not have a "Treo Killer" on the market, when we know they could.

    In conclusion, the reasons for switching to the Treo Pro has to do with
    1. Lower production costs
    2. Higher profit margins
    3. Dissatisfaction with Inventec
    4. Strategic alliance with HTC
    5. Sprint really likes Palm and will sell what they want to sell

    In other words, Sprint had no choice in the matter as Palm said they cannot offer Sprint the 800w any longer. Questions as to whether it would gain new customers or prevent churn were secondary if not tertiary.

    Next...

    See, the real dumb part of this whole "discussion" was the assertion by nsxprime:
    The bottom line is that Sprint wants happy customers to reduce churn and the 800w isn't keeping anyone around. That's why they pushed so hard to get the Treo Pro released quickly.
    No evidence for this. Pure speculation and fantasy with no facts to back it up. It's made up, out of thin air and yet here we are wasting time on it as if it mattered, or it was real. It's as authentic as my explanation above--that is, it's not.

    It's not that the Treo Pro won't gain customers for Sprint that is the problem Darnell, it was the baseless assertion that the 800w is losing customers right now for them. Maybe it's true, maybe not. We don't know.

    Either way, Treo Pro is not saving Palm nor Sprint from their problems.
    Last edited by Malatesta; 12/24/2008 at 02:04 AM.

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  4. #344  
    Quote Originally Posted by Malatesta View Post
    Sprint and Palm can make more money off of the Treo Pro than the 800w because of the lower costs associated with production going with HTC rather than Inventec.

    Specifically, the profit margin is higher with the Treo Pro due to larger, more streamlined production systems at HTC.

    Furthermore, due to certain improprieties at Inventec with their CEOs, Palm no longer feels comfortable doing business with them and would prefer to use HTC instead--so they had to inform Sprint that they can no longer produce the 800w but instead have a Treo Pro as an alternative (HTC was not going to reproduce the 800w, an Inventec device after all). This also has the added benefit of officially keeping HTC out of the front-qwerty WM Pro business, by having Palm pay them to use their devices.

    This both explains why the Treo Pro seems so "different" from previous Palm devices and why HTC does not have a "Treo Killer" on the market, when we know they could.

    In conclusion, the reasons for switching to the Treo Pro has to do with
    1. Lower production costs
    2. Higher profit margins
    3. Dissatisfaction with Inventec
    4. Strategic alliance with HTC
    5. Sprint really likes Palm and will sell what they want to sell

    In other words, Sprint had no choice in the matter as Palm said they cannot offer Sprint the 800w any longer. Questions as to whether it would gain new customers or prevent churn were secondary if not tertiary.
    Great information Mal! You should consider writing up an article on why Palm is switching to HTC and away from Inventec. (Lot of that was stuff I wasn't aware of before.) I'd be curious to see more details on that, and a more in depth article.

    Obviously it's mostly speculation, but that's some good speculation.
  5. #345  
    Quote Originally Posted by Ebag333 View Post
    Sprint doesn't make money off phones, they lose money. Off pretty much all their phones.

    They make money off people having contracts. If the 800w attracts even a very small % of people, then Sprint is making money.
    Well perhaps the Treo Pro will attract even more people.
  6. #346  
    Quote Originally Posted by Malatesta View Post

    See, the real dumb part of this whole "discussion" was the assertion by nsxprime:
    And nsxprime got what he wanted. He likes to stir the pot.
    Sprint 600 - 650 - 755 - Mogul - 700Wx - Centro - 800W & iPhone
  7.    #347  
    Quote Originally Posted by JohnH59 View Post
    And nsxprime got what he wanted. He likes to stir the pot.
    He is just being honest. A few people on here can't hack a few negative remarks about their beloved 800. Its a phone, has a few flaws, big deal. I love those who claim there is nothing wrong with it.
    ATT History- From 1997-2001-> Nokia 6362->Motorola StarTac->Nokia 8260.

    Nextel History From 2001-2004-> Motorola i1000-> Motorola i90c-> Motorola i95cl-> Motorola i730->Motorola i850.

    Sprint History From 2005 - Currently->Sanyo 5500-> Sanyo 5600-> Sanyo-> 7400->Sanyo 8300->Sanyo->7500-> Sanyo 9000->Sanyo 8400->Sanyo M1->PPC-6700->Treo 700wx->PPC-6800(Mogul)-> Motorola Q9C-> Treo 800w-> Curve->Treo 800w->Touch Pro->Treo Pro> Curve "M"->HTC Hero.
  8. #348  
    Quote Originally Posted by darnell View Post
    Well perhaps the Treo Pro will attract even more people.
    Correct. There's really no other reason as to why Sprint would be trashing the 800w so quickly after its release unless they also view it as fatally flawed. Otherwise, they'd continue to offer both devices and would support both devices.
  9. #349  
    Quote Originally Posted by nsxprime View Post
    Otherwise, they'd continue to offer both devices and would support both devices.
    I think so long as Sprint would be willing to sell both, Palm would be willing to offer both to Sprint.
  10. #350  
    Quote Originally Posted by VibrantRedGT View Post
    He is just being honest. A few people on here can't hack a few negative remarks about their beloved 800. Its a phone, has a few flaws, big deal. I love those who claim there is nothing wrong with it.
    He was honest three months ago. Now, he just antagonizes. Same type comments throughout the forum. But, if one feels so compelled, so be it.
    Sprint 600 - 650 - 755 - Mogul - 700Wx - Centro - 800W & iPhone
  11. #351  
    Quote Originally Posted by darnell View Post
    I think so long as Sprint would be willing to sell both, Palm would be willing to offer both to Sprint.
    Of course Palm would be willing to do that. They would make a lot more money that way. It's clear that Sprint is the one who's choosing to kill off the 800w for some reason.
  12. #352  
    Quote Originally Posted by nsxprime View Post
    Of course Palm would be willing to do that. They would make a lot more money that way. It's clear that Sprint is the one who's choosing to kill off the 800w for some reason.
    Evidence/sources for any of the above or just guessing? Usually we don't take it upon ourselves to speak for companies or their motivations unless they've said it publicly or we work for them.

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  13.    #353  
    Quote Originally Posted by Malatesta View Post
    Evidence/sources for any of the above or just guessing? Usually we don't take it upon ourselves to speak for companies or their motivations unless they've said it publicly or we work for them.
    Most of us were under the impression that you and Ebag worked for Palm. Care to share their next move?
    ATT History- From 1997-2001-> Nokia 6362->Motorola StarTac->Nokia 8260.

    Nextel History From 2001-2004-> Motorola i1000-> Motorola i90c-> Motorola i95cl-> Motorola i730->Motorola i850.

    Sprint History From 2005 - Currently->Sanyo 5500-> Sanyo 5600-> Sanyo-> 7400->Sanyo 8300->Sanyo->7500-> Sanyo 9000->Sanyo 8400->Sanyo M1->PPC-6700->Treo 700wx->PPC-6800(Mogul)-> Motorola Q9C-> Treo 800w-> Curve->Treo 800w->Touch Pro->Treo Pro> Curve "M"->HTC Hero.
  14. #354  
    Maybe it's a wild guess, but I think everyone here agreed Palm will continue selling the 800w even after Sprint does not sell it any longer. And the source document of replacement is from Sprint, not Palm. So Palm is going to keep selling the 800w and Sprint will stop selling it far as we know. I could be totally wrong, but I highly doubt Palm would keep selling it while telling Sprint to stop selling it. I think the "replace" is a Sprint move. Palm is still selling plenty of models that Sprint no longer promotes.
  15. #355  
    Quote Originally Posted by VibrantRedGT View Post
    Most of us were under the impression that you and Ebag worked for Palm. Care to share their next move?
    Our NDA prevents us from telling you about the upcoming 800w ROM update that unlocks the rest of the processor (it's actually the same speed as the Pro), increases program memory (the ROM partitions were not setup correctly), fixes GPS, and increases the SVI to 78.3.
  16. #356  
    Quote Originally Posted by VibrantRedGT View Post
    Most of us were under the impression that you and Ebag worked for Palm. Care to share their next move?
    Hmmm...I wasn't aware of a public consensus on my day job. Unless you are speaking for yourself but are covering it with "most of us" for the illusion of inviolability?

    Would you mind sharing your evidence that I work for Palm? I'm sure the community would like to know (as would I) since that's a pretty heavy claim!

    Either way, this is an interesting distraction from my request from nsxprime above for evidence of her claim and I'm not sure it necessarily absolves her from the situation. After all, I haven't made any suppositions as to Sprint's or Palm's motivations here, precisely because I don't know.
    Last edited by Malatesta; 12/24/2008 at 02:53 PM.

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  17.    #357  
    Quote Originally Posted by Ebag333 View Post
    Our NDA prevents us from telling you about the upcoming 800w ROM update that unlocks the rest of the processor (it's actually the same speed as the Pro), increases program memory (the ROM partitions were not setup correctly), fixes GPS, and increases the SVI to 78.3.
    From your current position, "President of Palm Fantasy Land and Two Plus Year Release Division" I think you should be promoted to "President of False Advertisement, No Support and Ditch It Department." You are a moving on up.
    ATT History- From 1997-2001-> Nokia 6362->Motorola StarTac->Nokia 8260.

    Nextel History From 2001-2004-> Motorola i1000-> Motorola i90c-> Motorola i95cl-> Motorola i730->Motorola i850.

    Sprint History From 2005 - Currently->Sanyo 5500-> Sanyo 5600-> Sanyo-> 7400->Sanyo 8300->Sanyo->7500-> Sanyo 9000->Sanyo 8400->Sanyo M1->PPC-6700->Treo 700wx->PPC-6800(Mogul)-> Motorola Q9C-> Treo 800w-> Curve->Treo 800w->Touch Pro->Treo Pro> Curve "M"->HTC Hero.
  18. #358  
    Ibtl
  19. #359  
    I really wish we could discuss these details and things not get out of hand.

    We do know Palm keeps selling and Sprint will stop. And we know the source of the Sprint document feels it was a Sprint move in saying:
    ...but Sprint probably wanted to give its fairly fresh 800w a little breathing room before getting sunsetted in favor of the significantly more attractive Pro.
    We know sellers buy from manufacturers and so long as a manufacturer markets a device I have NEVER seen a case where the manufacturer continues marketing a device, but tells all retailers to cease selling it. So I believe Palm would keep providing 800ws to Sprint so long as Sprint (a seller) requests.

    Sprint is not so phased by selling a Treo Pro for $200 (which probably does not turn much or any profit for Sprint) as much as the prospects of making $2,399.76 off a customer on a 2 year Sprint Everything contract. Sprint is going to push whatever looks most attractive and back burner anything else. The 700wx is still sold by Palm, while it can't be found at Sprint.
  20. #360  
    Quote Originally Posted by VibrantRedGT View Post
    From your current position, "President of Palm Fantasy Land and Two Plus Year Release Division" I think you should be promoted to "President of False Advertisement, No Support and Ditch It Department." You are a moving on up.
    Lets compare the amount of support you've provided for the 800w to the amount I've provided.

    Quote Originally Posted by darnell View Post
    The 700wx is still sold by Palm, while it can't be found at Sprint.
    That's not *QUITE* true.

    At least as of a few months after the 800w was released, Sprint still would sell 700wx's to business customers who had existing phones and needed to replace them (large business customers here, not individuals). The purpose was to provide support for larger business customers who had a fleet of phones and didn't want to have to deal with upgrading to a new phone for their employees.

    The impression I got was that Sprint had quite a lot of them in their warehouse at the time. They may not now. *shrug*

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