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  1. #161  
    If you want to test the roaming thing just go to the settings.... phone icon.... click on serivces tab....then click on roaming and change that option to roaming network only/...... wont pull a sprint signal only a roaming one
  2. #162  
    Make a sticky and moderate this too many repeats! Thanks Mods and Ops !
  3. #163  
    Quote Originally Posted by crazie.eddie View Post
    I just ran some tests of my own using Garmin while coming home from a friends house.

    1. Garmin on - Phone Radio on - Signal and routed with no problems.

    2. Turned off the phone radio, then turned Garmin on - Garmin would keep displaying "searching for satelite". Also, the OS kept displaying repeatedly (like every 2-3 seconds), a message regarding cannot connect.

    3. While Garmin was on and navigativng, I turned the phone radio off - Suprisingly, Garmin still navigated, but only for a few miles. Strangely, Garmin lost signal when I was about 1000' feet from the nearest Sprint cell tower and going further away. I kept driving away and decided to drive back to the cell tower. Garmin never picked up any satelites. I also received OS messages on my device regarding cannot connect, but not as frequent. Maybe only every 5 minutes or so.

    The only test I am not able to do is having Garmin on and driving to an area with no Sprint coverage (roaming) and also driving to a dead zone area (No sprint coverage or roaming).

    So feel free to verify the test, come up with your own conclusions, or whatever. I also do not know much about GPS, but what my assumption about Network assisted GPS is that our GPS systems our phones, require assistance of the network to acquire your location. He did mention that CDMA phones with GPS are network assisted GPS. He did not mention anything about GSM phones with GPS or even the iPhone.
    That's good testing. The 800w appears to have crippled GPS. A hack is needed to unlock standalone GPS like the Mogul and Touch have. So nice being able to use GPS wherever you want in standalone mode.
  4. #164  
    I have some high-level corporate contacts at both Sprint and Palm, and would like to take this issue up with them. Hopefully they can get in touch with the right engineers or high-level tech support personnel and resolve the issue quickly. However, before I reach out to them, I want to make sure I have some "backup" for when I talk to them. Can someone point me to where it specifically says (either on Palm or Sprint's websites or in Palm or Sprint documentation) that the Treo 800w GPS is standalone and should work without a cell tower connection? Thanks.

    P.S. On this page (http://www.palm.com/us/products/smar...gps_wifi.html), it specifically says as a footnote that "GPS not available in all areas at all times. Requires an account and data services at additional cost." - not a good thing...

    Update: On this page (http://www.palm.com/us/products/smar...00w/specs.html) it says "Built-in GPS (standalone and assisted)" - it seems like Palm is talking out of both sides of their mouth at the same time...but I can definitely use this to take to them...any more links or documentation is greatly appreciated.
  5. #165  
    Quote Originally Posted by mbressman View Post
    I have some high-level corporate contacts at both Sprint and Palm, and would like to take this issue up with them. Hopefully they can get in touch with the right engineers or high-level tech support personnel and resolve the issue quickly. However, before I reach out to them, I want to make sure I have some "backup" for when I talk to them. Can someone point me to where it specifically says (either on Palm or Sprint's websites or in Palm or Sprint documentation) that the Treo 800w GPS is standalone and should work without a cell tower connection? Thanks.

    P.S. On this page (http://www.palm.com/us/products/smar...gps_wifi.html), it specifically says as a footnote that "GPS not available in all areas at all times. Requires an account and data services at additional cost." - not a good thing...

    Update: On this page (http://www.palm.com/us/products/smar...00w/specs.html) it says "Built-in GPS (standalone and assisted)" - it seems like Palm is talking out of both sides of their mouth at the same time...but I can definitely use this to take to them...any more links or documentation is greatly appreciated.

    I don't think you have a case with the "update" you posted. The site clearly states it is assisted... They will simply change the misunderstanding on the "update" link you posted and make it clear (by adding a "1" to it).

    If you know so many people, contact them and ask for a free update to to make gps truly standalone. From what I can tell, many are happy with what they have though. Swinging in with "backup" won't help, this issue is easy to understand without any "backup" from you.
    01000010 01100001 01101110 00100000 01010100 01101000 01110010 01100101 01100001 01100100 00100000 01000011 01110010 01100001 01110000 01110000 01100101 01110010 01110011 00100001
  6. #166  
    Quote Originally Posted by mbressman View Post
    I have some high-level corporate contacts at both Sprint and Palm, and would like to take this issue up with them. Hopefully they can get in touch with the right engineers or high-level tech support personnel and resolve the issue quickly. However, before I reach out to them, I want to make sure I have some "backup" for when I talk to them. Can someone point me to where it specifically says (either on Palm or Sprint's websites or in Palm or Sprint documentation) that the Treo 800w GPS is standalone and should work without a cell tower connection? Thanks.

    P.S. On this page (http://www.palm.com/us/products/smar...gps_wifi.html), it specifically says as a footnote that "GPS not available in all areas at all times. Requires an account and data services at additional cost." - not a good thing...

    Update: On this page (http://www.palm.com/us/products/smar...00w/specs.html) it says "Built-in GPS (standalone and assisted)" - it seems like Palm is talking out of both sides of their mouth at the same time...but I can definitely use this to take to them...any more links or documentation is greatly appreciated.

    I believe (personally) that the first link you posted has that reference because the Maps application requires data and aGPS.
  7. NRG
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    #167  
    Quote Originally Posted by mbressman View Post
    I have some high-level corporate contacts at both Sprint and Palm, and would like to take this issue up with them. Hopefully they can get in touch with the right engineers or high-level tech support personnel and resolve the issue quickly. However, before I reach out to them, I want to make sure I have some "backup" for when I talk to them. Can someone point me to where it specifically says (either on Palm or Sprint's websites or in Palm or Sprint documentation) that the Treo 800w GPS is standalone and should work without a cell tower connection? Thanks.

    P.S. On this page (http://www.palm .com/us/products /sm...gps_wifi.html), it specifically says as a footnote that "GPS not available in all areas at all times. Requires an account and data services at additional cost." - not a good thing...

    Update: On this page (http://www.palm .com/us/products /sm...0w /specs.html) it says "Built-in GPS (standalone and assisted)" - it seems like Palm is talking out of both sides of their mouth at the same time...but I can definitely use this to take to them...any more links or documentation is greatly appreciated.
    Ask them if it would be possible to download and store the GPS sat data longer than a reset. If they were to implement an add-on such as LTOmanager(stores sat data in a file) this would allow the aGPS to function without reliance on the cell towers on data connection everytime we want to use the GPS.
  8. #168  
    I have sent emails to all the contacts I have at both Sprint and Palm and am awaiting a reply. As soon as I have something new to report, I will post it here. Hopefully, the fact that there are a lot of us out there that are unhappy with the GPS as it is (as this thread is a testament too) will make Sprint and/or Palm make a change.

    On a side note, I must say that theog's post in response to mine came across as somewhat rude (i.e. 'Swinging in with "backup" won't help, this issue is easy to understand without any "backup" from you.') I'm not sure if I'm misunderstanding you, or what (if I am, then I apologize in advance), but I think it's obvious that people aren't happy with things the way they are (hence this thread).
    Last edited by mbressman; 07/22/2008 at 09:38 PM.
  9. #169  
    Any news on this. This is the only thing holding me back from getting the 800w
  10. insol's Avatar
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    #170  
    Quote Originally Posted by mbressman View Post
    I have sent emails to all the contacts I have at both Sprint and Palm and am awaiting a reply. As soon as I have something new to report, I will post it here. Hopefully, the fact that there are a lot of us out there that are unhappy with the GPS as it is (as this thread is a testament too) will make Sprint and/or Palm make a change.

    On a side note, I must say that theog's post in response to mine came across as somewhat rude (i.e. 'Swinging in with "backup" won't help, this issue is easy to understand without any "backup" from you.') I'm not sure if I'm misunderstanding you, or what (if I am, then I apologize in advance), but I think it's obvious that people aren't happy with things the way they are (hence this thread).

    Marc I'm glad you are trying something.... many (like me in this case) sit on the sidelines and just watch the game. Thanks for playing. Information (good or bad) can always be used. Hopefully you'll get some traction on this issue.
  11. #171  
    So, this has me wondering about a hack. I wonder if prefilling the cache would make any difference on the GPS start up. Sure, it might be a wacky thought, but maybe the boot strap needed.

    Figuring out the settings and then hacking up something to prefill the cache with something "close" -- maybe the GPS would take long to get a fix, but perhaps it would work "off network" from a cold start (or after a reset like everyone's tried and proven it don't quite start up)

    I could be talking out of my.... uh.... HAT, but maybe something like that could work. I have it in my plans to dig into my 800w (just got it today). Not looking to create "franken-treo" but, would be interesting to learn

    Just a thought.
  12. #172  
    Quote Originally Posted by unixvrules View Post
    So, this has me wondering about a hack. I wonder if prefilling the cache would make any difference on the GPS start up. Sure, it might be a wacky thought, but maybe the boot strap needed.

    Figuring out the settings and then hacking up something to prefill the cache with something "close" -- maybe the GPS would take long to get a fix, but perhaps it would work "off network" from a cold start (or after a reset like everyone's tried and proven it don't quite start up)

    I could be talking out of my.... uh.... HAT, but maybe something like that could work. I have it in my plans to dig into my 800w (just got it today). Not looking to create "franken-treo" but, would be interesting to learn

    Just a thought.
    What you're suggesting sounds like QuickGPS.
  13. #173  
    I have yet to receive any reply from my Palm contacts...before I call up their corporate HQ and start yelling, I figured I'd go the correct path to see what I could accomplish...I called Level 3 Support regarding this GPS issue and logged it with them; they are going to get in touch with their advanced engineering staff and get back to me early next week. I will see what happens then...
  14. #174  
    Quote Originally Posted by mbressman View Post
    I have yet to receive any reply from my Palm contacts...before I call up their corporate HQ and start yelling, I figured I'd go the correct path to see what I could accomplish...I called Level 3 Support regarding this GPS issue and logged it with them; they are going to get in touch with their advanced engineering staff and get back to me early next week. I will see what happens then...
    Thanks for letting us know.
  15. #175  
    I was out in PA this past weekend, and was in an area that had a clear line of sight to the sky, and cell signal (I could make voice calls), but no data signal (I was roaming some of the time, and other times I had 1X signal but it wouldn't let me connect to the data network when I tried). I tried to get a standalone GPS fix several times (I used GPSGate and TomTom Navigator) and it wouldn't let me - it kept trying the data network over and over again and failing to connect.
  16. #176  
    Quote Originally Posted by gunjin123 View Post
    If you want to test the roaming thing just go to the settings.... phone icon.... click on serivces tab....then click on roaming and change that option to roaming network only/...... wont pull a sprint signal only a roaming one
    Tried this and it worked. I am currently not in the u.s. and only gsm networks are here so sprint is far away. I was able to get 5 satellites in ##gps# and then using gpsgate in tomtom was able to see all five signal strength in the gps screen but tomtom in this one case said lost gps signal in the main screen. However its hard to get it working every time. I was only able to get it once.
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    #177  
    well that is simply retarded. The whole point of gps is to help you when your LOST. You cant assume someone is ONLY going to get lost in metro areas or where they have service- that totally defeats the point of even having GPS in the first place. this is a dumb oversight by Palm but i dont see them ever addressing
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    #178  
    Quote Originally Posted by nsxprime View Post
    The 800w appears to have vGPS (vaporware-GPS)... the Mogul and Touch have GPS wherever you want in standalone mode.
    WHAT??!!


    Quote Originally Posted by Rabbi-emu View Post
    Any news on this. This is the only thing holding me back from getting the 800w
    How often do you venture out into booney land? If you already have a data plan then here's a couple of options:
    1. Just do it. - Nike
    2. Buy it Now. - eBay
    800w = one slick pda phone.


    Quote Originally Posted by mbressman View Post
    I have yet to receive any reply from my Palm contacts...before I call up their corporate HQ and start yelling, I figured I'd go the correct path to see what I could accomplish...I called Level 3 Support regarding this GPS issue and logged it with them; they are going to get in touch with their advanced engineering staff and get back to me early next week. I will see what happens then...
    Thanks for going the extra mile for us, much appreciated.

    Also, no need to yell, just use the "V" word... Vaporware!

    And, offer them a simple solution. They can easily "leak" the hacks or drivers necessary for us to activate the imaginary standalone gps chip/function... a chip that cost them $10 to order from whoever they ordered it from.

    Hope this helps you, help us. Thanks.
  19. klmsu19's Avatar
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    #179  
    you would think its an "easy fix" but how many months did it take to get gps on the touch/mogul? 8 months or so? it was leaked 3-4 months beforehand through adding drivers.

    if they do release it it will probably require a new ROM besides the fact is has to go through weeks and weeks of testing

    And its more than a "booney" problem. It sounds like it wont work while data roaming either. My guess is its looking to connect to the Sprint a-gps server and isnt recognizing phones off-network data roaming. This eliminates a ton of geographic area where youre not solely in Sprint native coverage. It may be a bigger problem then most will admit. Sure if you never leave your area its not a problem for the individual. But people use gps when they travel and are truly lost. Whats the point of gps if you cant 100% always use it to find your way no matter where you are? Is that not the true underlying meaning of GLOBAL positioning system?
  20. #180  
    Quote Originally Posted by klmsu19 View Post
    It sounds like it wont work while data roaming either. My guess is its looking to connect to the Sprint a-gps server and isnt recognizing phones off-network data roaming. This eliminates a ton of geographic area where youre not solely in Sprint native coverage.
    No, it does work while roaming. But that isn't the point. It doesn't work without getting cdma sprint or a sprint roaming partner.

    Palm advertised "Standalone GPS." This means they advertised it will work without a cdma signal at all
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