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  1. 1PTUser's Avatar
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    #21  
    Quote Originally Posted by gfunkmagic View Post
    Why is everyone complaining about the thickness of the device so much? Is it just me, but in my opinion I really don't understand the fascination that a device should be as paper thin as possible? I personally wouldn't like a super thin device because I just don't think it would be comfortable in the hand as a device that would be slightly thicker and easier to hold with the palm, thumb and fingers of a person's hand. If a device were to be too thin, it would become too uncomfortable to hold imo. I'm not saying the 800w couldn't be a bit thinner, but I sorta like the thickness of the device right now! Besides at this point I would like have a better battery life than a thinner device...
    Amen to all that! I have a wider but thinner BB8830 and we have a couple of thinner, narrower and taller blackjacks, and of course there's the boxy Moto Q. None of these feel as comfortable in the hand as the 800w imo. Nevertheless, it can sure use a little more juice.
  2. #22  
    Quote Originally Posted by gfunkmagic View Post
    Why is everyone complaining about the thickness of the device so much? Is it just me, but in my opinion I really don't understand the fascination that a device should be as paper thin as possible? I personally wouldn't like a super thin device because I just don't think it would be comfortable in the hand as a device that would be slightly thicker and easier to hold with the palm, thumb and fingers of a person's hand. If a device were to be too thin, it would become too uncomfortable to hold imo. I'm not saying the 800w couldn't be a bit thinner, but I sorta like the thickness of the device right now! Besides at this point I would like have a better battery life than a thinner device...
    I agree. Thick, but not too thick, just fits in your hand better.

    Plus, if you go too thin, then you end up getting too wide, like the Motorola Q series.
    a740 --> a900 --> Katana --> a900 --> a900m --> M1 --> a900m --> PPC6700 --> a900m--> 8400 --> a900m --> Treo 700wx --> Treo 800w
  3. #23  
    Is this the First EXCELLENT review of PalmTReo800w?
    http://www.buzzaboutwireless.com/cms...w-by-palm.html
    Way to go Palm - at last a WinCE Phone for Power U Monday, 14 July 2008 Collapse

    The first serious Palm phone - i.e a Treo - that has a full-function embedded GPS chip. No longer must you match up to an external GPS antenna via Bluetooth (and this phone has Bluetooth v2.0 + Wi-Fi) I am running with ....
    9.2
    Monday, 14 July 2008
    Written by: David J. Clement
    1 of 1 people found this review useful
    User Rating 9.2 Out of 10
    The first serious Palm phone - i.e a Treo - that has a full-function embedded GPS chip. No longer must you match up to an external GPS antenna via Bluetooth (and this phone has Bluetooth v2.0 + Wi-Fi) I am running with Sprint Navigation and it works great with the internal GPS antenna. My last Treo (a 700wx) ran WinCE 5. The Windows CE version 6.1 really does have enhancements to the way you sync up with your PC - and run Office Programs, see attachments, etc. Processor seems fast - they must have really optimized it throughout. This is a great phone and I'm glad I was an "early adopter" for this one.
    Overall Rating 9.2
    Value 8.0
    Battery Life 8.0
    Look & Feel 9.0
    Performance 10.0
    Phone Features 10.0
    Media (Software) 10.0
  4. #24  
    Is this the First GOOD review of PalmTReo800w?
    http://www.buzzaboutwireless.com/cms...w-by-palm.html
    Way to go Palm - at last a WinCE Phone for Power U Monday, 14 July 2008 Collapse

    The first serious Palm phone - i.e a Treo - that has a full-function embedded GPS chip. No longer must you match up to an external GPS antenna via Bluetooth (and this phone has Bluetooth v2.0 + Wi-Fi) I am running with ....

    Monday, 14 July 2008
    Written by: David J. Clement
    1 of 1 people found this review useful
    User Rating 9.2 Out of 10

    The first serious Palm phone - i.e a Treo - that has a full-function embedded GPS chip. No longer must you match up to an external GPS antenna via Bluetooth (and this phone has Bluetooth v2.0 + Wi-Fi) I am running with Sprint Navigation and it works great with the internal GPS antenna. My last Treo (a 700wx) ran WinCE 5. The Windows CE version 6.1 really does have enhancements to the way you sync up with your PC - and run Office Programs, see attachments, etc. Processor seems fast - they must have really optimized it throughout. This is a great phone and I'm glad I was an "early adopter" for this one.
    Overall Rating 9.2
    Value 8.0
    Battery Life 8.0
    Look & Feel 9.0
    Performance 10.0
    Phone Features 10.0
    Media (Software) 10.0
  5. #25  
    The review skipped the most important aspect of a phone. The Voice quality and signal reception! My biggest complaint with my 700WX is the poor call quality and signal reception. My wifes old 2003 Samsung I600 smart phone is always crystal clear and works whne my 700WX sends calls to VM and will not dial out.
    Still waiting for Hitachi to reintroduce the G1000 with a VGA screen and more memory. I still miss that crash prone beauty.
  6. #26  
    Quote Originally Posted by Palm_forlackofchoice View Post
    The review skipped the most important aspect of a phone. The Voice quality and signal reception! My biggest complaint with my 700WX is the poor call quality and signal reception. My wifes old 2003 Samsung I600 smart phone is always crystal clear and works whne my 700WX sends calls to VM and will not dial out.
    I've noticed that with most reviews.

    So the Treo can do this and that.
    Reviewers; Don't forget it's supposed to be an expensive phone.
    Just call me Berd.
  7. #27  
    Quote Originally Posted by gfunkmagic View Post
    Why is everyone complaining about the thickness of the device so much? Is it just me, but in my opinion I really don't understand the fascination that a device should be as paper thin as possible? I personally wouldn't like a super thin device because I just don't think it would be comfortable in the hand as a device that would be slightly thicker and easier to hold with the palm, thumb and fingers of a person's hand. If a device were to be too thin, it would become too uncomfortable to hold imo. I'm not saying the 800w couldn't be a bit thinner, but I sorta like the thickness of the device right now! Besides at this point I would like have a better battery life than a thinner device...
    In this case, I think because they didn't include a bigger battery, the thickness makes no sense to some people.

    I like solid devices too. It just looks like Palm skimped where they shouldn't have again
    HP has officially ruined it's own platform and kicked webOS loyalists and early TouchPad adopters to the curb. You think after you drop it like a hot potato and mention it made no money and is costing you money, anyone else wants it??? Way to go HP!!

    And some people are fools to keep believing their hype. HP has shown they will throw webOS under the bus and people are still having faith in them??? News flash: if it's own company won't stand behind it, it's finished!
  8. #28  
    Quote Originally Posted by The Phone Diva View Post
    In this case, I think because they didn't include a bigger battery, the thickness makes no sense to some people.

    I like solid devices too. It just looks like Palm skimped where they shouldn't have again
    No, they really didn't. You just have to keep in mind that the rules have changed a bit. As Mal pointed out a few podcasts back (talking about the Diamond's even-smaller-than-the-800w's 900 mAh battery), newer devices have several reasons why they're much more power frugal than previous generations.

    The first is that they use the new smaller, cooler-running die size on the processor, 65 nm instead of 90 nm. The new chips consume less juice and waste less heat because electrons don't have to travel as far.

    The second is the new power-saving features of Windows Mobile 6.1. Especially if you're using Exchange OTA sync (which I am), 6.1 absolutely sips power compared to 6.0's guzzle.

    Short version: I'm getting close to the same battery life out of the 1150 mAh battery in my WM 6.1 Treo 800w that I got out of the 1540 mAh battery in my WM 6.0 Mogul. It's not a one-to-one comparison.
    Jeff Kirvin
    Author of Between Heaven and Hell, a different kind of SF novel.
    Get it at eReader http://www.ereader.com/product/detail/5493
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  9. ejonny's Avatar
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    #29  
    Quote Originally Posted by Jeff Kirvin View Post
    No, they really didn't. You just have to keep in mind that the rules have changed a bit. As Mal pointed out a few podcasts back (talking about the Diamond's even-smaller-than-the-800w's 900 mAh battery), newer devices have several reasons why they're much more power frugal than previous generations.

    The second is the new power-saving features of Windows Mobile 6.1. Especially if you're using Exchange OTA sync (which I am), 6.1 absolutely sips power compared to 6.0's guzzle.

    Short version: I'm getting close to the same battery life out of the 1150 mAh battery in my WM 6.1 Treo 800w that I got out of the 1540 mAh battery in my WM 6.0 Mogul. It's not a one-to-one comparison.
    I've had the same experience.
  10. #30  
    Quote Originally Posted by Jeff Kirvin View Post
    No, they really didn't. You just have to keep in mind that the rules have changed a bit. As Mal pointed out a few podcasts back (talking about the Diamond's even-smaller-than-the-800w's 900 mAh battery), newer devices have several reasons why they're much more power frugal than previous generations.

    The first is that they use the new smaller, cooler-running die size on the processor, 65 nm instead of 90 nm. The new chips consume less juice and waste less heat because electrons don't have to travel as far.

    The second is the new power-saving features of Windows Mobile 6.1. Especially if you're using Exchange OTA sync (which I am), 6.1 absolutely sips power compared to 6.0's guzzle.

    Short version: I'm getting close to the same battery life out of the 1150 mAh battery in my WM 6.1 Treo 800w that I got out of the 1540 mAh battery in my WM 6.0 Mogul. It's not a one-to-one comparison.

    From the review: "Battery Life

    Now here's the onion.

    I'm not at all happy with the Treo's battery life. It's just barely adequate for use as a phone -- add Direct Push, or a little Wi-Fi use, and you're sucking down battery power like it's icewater in the Gobi Desert.

    Heavy users had best plan to either leave chargers lying around wherever they go, or buy a larger extended battery. (And deal with the increased bulk and thickness that brings with it.)

    I can't fathom Palm's thinking in using such a tiny battery for such a feature rich and hungry device. It certainly doesn't recommend the 800w as a Blackberry replacement when I doubt you'd get 24 hours of standby out of the device with Direct Push enabled."

    Disclaimer: I have not used the 800w or know what he considers good battery life. But if he's complaining about even the phone use, that makes me wonder. Unless he got a beta model.
    HP has officially ruined it's own platform and kicked webOS loyalists and early TouchPad adopters to the curb. You think after you drop it like a hot potato and mention it made no money and is costing you money, anyone else wants it??? Way to go HP!!

    And some people are fools to keep believing their hype. HP has shown they will throw webOS under the bus and people are still having faith in them??? News flash: if it's own company won't stand behind it, it's finished!
  11. #31  
    Quote Originally Posted by Jeff Kirvin View Post
    No, they really didn't. You just have to keep in mind that the rules have changed a bit. As Mal pointed out a few podcasts back (talking about the Diamond's even-smaller-than-the-800w's 900 mAh battery), newer devices have several reasons why they're much more power frugal than previous generations.
    Jeff,

    I disagree strongly with you. If you look at reports from months ago, the beta testers were saying they were stunned at the short battery life.

    I think this is a serious drawback on this phone. OK I didn't design it, but to me the 10% more gross weight and volume of the handset that would have given 50 to 75% more battery life would have been well worth it.

    To say they can make the features more frugal isn't the point, since there are so many added features that one still ends up with a net battery life that is very very short.

    I could grab my 700p without worrying it if I hadn't charged it the night before. I don't think I will ever do this with the 800w without worrying.

    People are mentioning their moguls. OK fine, so it has crap battery life too. Hey it doesn't have a form factor that has been through so many iterations while staying the same.

    The fact is the battery life on the 800w is a big disappointment and a big lose of utility. As others have noted that is exactly why the review mentioned the thickness. The ones obsessed with the thickness are NOT the users, it seems to have been palm engineers desperate for "updating" and "modernizing" the same old form factor. Let's face it, what is new about the Treo form factor, in a fresh form factor obsessed market, is that the size was reduced along with the battery life. that's it. It is like reducing the gas tank on a SUV as its main reduction in size!

    Here is a post on the 800W beta from April:
    Quote Originally Posted by nyc_rock View Post
    Sat down next to this guy on a flight I took today. I was using my touch, he asked how I like it. I looked at his, what I thought was a centro, and asked how he like his, and he told me it was an 800w he was beta testing.

    Overall, I was not crazy about it. Form factor was nice, but the plastic outershell was a let down. Also was using an 1100 mah battery which he said was terrible. It was the much confirmed 256/128, wifi and wm 6.1. Its nice, dont get me wrong, but its so late to market that it really didnt have the "wow" factor I was hoping for.
    There were discussions about adding a second battery to the package (like Instinct).

    Lastly, as I have mentioned before the type of battery in the Treo ages by chronological age and by net draw cycle. This means that as the battery ages it has a permanant loss of capacity. It will lose 25% of its capacity in 14 months no matter if it is used or not. The amount of recharge the battery will go through also effects its capacity. A battery with 25% more mA would not just start with more capacity but will lose less capacity over time due to net draw cycling (ie with lilon 3 charges of 40% charge = 2 of 60%). This is why if you leave your lilon laptop plugged in the battery capacity at the end of a year will be much longer than someone who unplugs it for use and plugs it in at night. But with a cell phone you usually just charge it and take it off the charger fairly quickly.

    In short, the capacity of the current 800W batteries, from age and cycling, in one year is likely to be only 60% to 65% of what it is today. I feel fairly sure that we are all going to be buying second batteries or expensively (for the customer) third party engineered battery/humpback combinations anyway.
    Last edited by aero; 07/15/2008 at 11:42 PM.
  12. #32  
    Quote Originally Posted by The Phone Diva View Post
    In this case, I think because they didn't include a bigger battery, the thickness makes no sense to some people.

    I like solid devices too. It just looks like Palm skimped where they shouldn't have again
    Gotta love the material on the battery cover as well. I bought one of mine in to have the tech remove it, he told me he had one come in already with the cover broken and that he himself broke another!
  13. #33  
    Aero, I'm not at all surprised the battery life sucked in beta. It's beta. Nothing's optimized in beta. I'm telling you I have a Treo 800w and the battery life is about the same in real world usage as my Mogul, which itself had the best battery life of any WM device I'd owned to that time. You can argue the numbers all day long, but none of that changes what I'm actually seeing in daily usage.
  14. #34  
    Aero, I had the 700P for 6 months before switching to my 700WX both with Sprint. The 700P did not have any longer run time than I get with the 700WX.
    Zilch, zero nada...
    Still waiting for Hitachi to reintroduce the G1000 with a VGA screen and more memory. I still miss that crash prone beauty.
  15. #35  
    Quote Originally Posted by Palm_forlackofchoice View Post
    Aero, I had the 700P for 6 months before switching to my 700WX both with Sprint. The 700P did not have any longer run time than I get with the 700WX.
    Zilch, zero nada...
    I am not comparing the 700wx, I am saying we have two years experience with several 700p units and they run over twice as long as the 800w -- with bluetooth enabled.

    Jeff ,I understand your point. My poin tis that it is not just about engineering and the technology -- which I understand.

    It is a question of the trade offs on two other factors size/weight vs selected battery mA (usable time).

    These were really style vs utility questions; or frankly marketing considerations that are as or more important in consumer electronics as any other consideration. I think it is a fact, that most Treo users are heavily business utility oriented compared to iphone, instinct and even mogul buyers.

    Here is the question: what do you think treo 800w buyers would prefer? The 10% reduction in size and weight in return for 33% less battery life than they would have had at typical treo form factorsor not? For myself, I would go with more battery life. I think many other treo type users would agree. We are not in this for the sex appeal!

    Again, the battery life will decrease over the life of the phone. Noticeably in less than a year. This issue will get worse over time.
    Last edited by aero; 07/16/2008 at 11:29 AM.
  16. #36  
    Quote Originally Posted by aero View Post
    Jeff,

    I disagree strongly with you. If you look at reports from months ago, the beta testers were saying they were stunned at the short battery life.
    See...ya gotta know the other half of that story though to make sense.

    Yes, battery life was terrible, especially using the first ROM on the device.

    I say "first" because they had 4-5 ROM updates during testing and they all improved on battery life. So that statement is only partially true.

    Battery life is what it is: it's a WM device so it's just mediocre. They probably could have fit a larger battery in it, but that's what we have.

    But heck, it wall-charges very quickly at least.

    WMExperts: News, Reviews & Podcasts + Twitter
  17. #37  
    Actually, it charges pretty quick off USB to the PC, too. I might fork over the $30 for a spare battery, it's pocketable enough, but I really think I'll be okay. Maybe I've just spent too much time at PIC, but it seems like it's a knee-jerk reaction to look for potential flaws in any Palm product, and if you can't find many, make 'em up.
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