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  1. #21  
    Quote Originally Posted by surur View Post
    Another iPhone owner....

    Surur
    You better believe it! And lovin' every minute of it. WM just didn't cut it, so yeah, another WM user that jumped ship.

    By the way, updated my Flickr feed with more Treo collection photos. It's too big, I'll need to get a better place to stage these, but it's cool looking nonetheless. My favorite: The Handspring Visor with the Springboard phone. THAT'S going back a ways! - http://www.flickr.com/photos/benjaminhigginbotham
  2. #22  
    You better believe it! And lovin' every minute of it. WM just didn't cut it, so yeah, another WM user that jumped ship
    And to be sure there will be more where that came from once the 3rd party apps start coming down the pike. Throw 3g into a second gen iPhone and we all might be using one (myself included)!
  3. #23  
    Quote Originally Posted by surur View Post
    Here Mat Miller from the ZDNet blog does a point by point rebuttal of Pogue's criticism. Pity so many less people will read it.

    http://blogs.zdnet.com/mobile-gadgeteer/?p=679

    Surur
    I'm not sure where this thread has ended up, but are saying that WM does NOT need an overhaul? Even Microsoft disagrees with you if that's the case.

    I am an iPhone owner (which you might already know) and a WM user also. If the iPhone had MMS, Slingbox, and 3G I would say I love it, but thats not the case so for now I "really like it a lot" LOL
  4. #24  
    Quote Originally Posted by Pattycerts View Post
    I'm not sure where this thread has ended up, but are saying that WM does NOT need an overhaul? Even Microsoft disagrees with you if that's the case.

    I am an iPhone owner (which you might already know) and a WM user also. If the iPhone had MMS, Slingbox, and 3G I would say I love it, but thats not the case so for now I "really like it a lot" LOL
    Sorry, I cant argue with people who value style over substance. Isn't that how most of America's politicians get elected?

    Surur
  5. #25  
    Quote Originally Posted by surur View Post
    Sorry, I cant argue with people who value style over substance. Isn't that how most of America's politicians get elected?

    Surur
    LOL It sure is!

    Saying "I like the iPhone UI better" is not saying "I like the iPhone better," although they usually do coincide w/each other. Matter of fact, this thread has nothing to do with the iPhone, really.

    "WM is too clunky" has been stated for YEARS, and originated when compared to Palm OS. Predominantly when the 700w came out, because it had a lot of Treo 650 migrants at the time.

    The only difference now is that Palm OS was always inferior to WM, but when Apple lays out its SDK then its almost an even playing field.
  6. #26  
    Sorry, I cant argue with people who value style over substance.
    Wow, now that's a well thought out and insightful statement. (Shakes head).
  7. #27  
    Quote Originally Posted by JGold View Post
    Wow, now that's a well thought out and insightful statement. (Shakes head).
    <plonk>

    Surur
  8. #28  
    Quote Originally Posted by surur View Post
    <plonk>

    Surur
    You choose to reply to THAT instead of my thoughtful, insightful, delightful, and downright factual post!!!

    So much for substance over style....
  9. #29  
    I chose to add him to my ignore list. Your thoughtful reply obviously stands all by itself.

    Surur
  10. #30  
    I moved to WM long ago because it provided the functionality and features I needed to meet the demands of my job. And I received a lot of slack from many in the TreoCentral community because I dumped Palm for.....oh my... ..the enemy......the ugly, tap intensive, mandatory stylus driven, bloated Windows Mobile.

    Now after several years with WM, with lots of exposure to other OS on a regular basis, I still do feel that it is the most powerful OS option currently available. It gives the most freedom of customizing and tweaking (and I will agree that many of these tweaks should not have to be made to begin with). It has a large selection of 3rd party software that probably now trumps any other OS....this claim is just shooting from the hip, I do not really know for sure. It is probably the most feature rich and powerful OS on the market now. But all of this does not mean it is the easiest or the most friendly to use. A factor that cannot be under estimated in the deciding process from an average consumer.

    I recoginize, the most useful programs I use and recommend to any WM user deals mostly with UI and making it easier and faster to do what you need to. I look forward to any Touch or iPhone style interface for the most common tasks that would cover nearly 100% of what an average user would do with a phone and about 85%-90% of what even a power user does most of the time. And if the interface is scalable and highly customizable then it could be configured to cover just about anything any level of user will need 99% of the time. And then still offer all the tools under the hood for those who want to look under it and do that much more.

    I love the fact that the iPhone is here and offers a nice level of competition in both sales and perception. I think it is great that MS now has just under a year to sweat out the potential of the Google phone. I think it is great that BB still has a strong hold on the professional level of customers. This all adds up to needed advancements in features, power, interface, easy of use, and sex appeal or die in the new dynamics of this continually changing market.

    WM certainly needs a major facelift for MS to even think they might have a shot at the non-professional customer who does not know how (or care about how to) use the power under the hood of WM. That iPhone level customer will be wooed every time by the slick polish of a good interface with no second thought of what features or power that maybe compromised.
    Last edited by HobbesIsReal; 11/09/2007 at 09:11 PM.
  11. #31  
    It is probably the most feature rich and powerful OS on the market now. But all of this does not mean it is the easiest or the most friendly to use. A factor that cannot be under estimated in the deciding process from an average consumer.
    Well said. However, feature-rich and power means nothing if things like alarms don't fire reliably and consistently. Alarms haven't worked reliably since the advent of WM2003. And speaking of reliable, WM still suffers from being unreliable at times you need it most. Last night was a perfect example. While driving a phone call came in and my Treo 750 just locked up and I needed to do a soft reset.

    I guarantee you there's not one Windows mobile owner that hasn't experienced this frustration with their device at some point or another. I know too many people who have shared thier "horror" stories with me.

    You guys should listen to the latest Mobility Today podcast. My friends Dave and Steve talk about this subject at length with even David Ciccone boycotting WM until changes are made. I am just sorry I could make the podcast at the time they recorded it.
  12. #32  
    Quote Originally Posted by JGold View Post
    Well said. However, feature-rich and power means nothing if things like alarms don't fire reliably and consistently. Alarms haven't worked reliably since the advent of WM2003. And speaking of reliable, WM still suffers from being unreliable at times you need it most. Last night was a perfect example. While driving a phone call came in and my Treo 750 just locked up and I needed to do a soft reset.
    I have a LONG laundry list of what we need to see in WM next major release. My list for Palm OS is just as long, if not longer. My list for BB is significant as well. Most can be fixed or added with 3rd party apps or tweaks in all cases. Alarms is a good case in point. I am sure this issue is on everyone's must fix for next release list. At the same time it is often times totally depending on the individual model of phone, but you usually find a thread for most phones that will resolve this issue most of the time.

    Quote Originally Posted by JGold View Post
    I guarantee you there's not one Windows mobile owner that hasn't experienced this frustration with their device at some point or another. I know too many people who have shared thier "horror" stories with me.
    The same could be said for Palm OS as well. My Treo with Palm OS would lock up more than my WM6 does.

    Lock ups are not unique to or solely a WM OS issue. In fact over the last two major OS upgrades it has done nothing but has been reduced. Look at the difference between WM02/03 & WM06. It is no way perfect. It is not fully resolved. But it has drastically improved. To be completely honest, with a clean install of WM it very rarely locks up (the same with Palm). A VAST majority of the time the culprit has to with 3rd party apps or a specific glitch or design flaw with a specific model of phone. This is a point that is becoming less of a concern with each new major upgrade in the OS. In fact I have a a large amount of 3rd party apps and major tweaks on my Sprint Mogul with WM6 and after something like 3 months, I have only had two lock ups.

    Heck I even experience lock ups with "regular" cell phones as well. Twice in the last month my Fusic just locked up and I had to pop out the battery to start it again. Again showing this is industry wide mobile issue and not a WM unique event.


    Quote Originally Posted by JGold View Post
    boycotting WM until changes are made
    This is the great thing about a free market. I wonder what their perfect Mobile OS is that is currently available right now that they are using instead? But of course perfection is realitive to one's wants, preferences, and personal & professional needs.

    Unfortunately remaining efficient while meeting the demands of my job I have to use the WM because it does the best job at meeting those demands. But as I have said over and over in the past, I have no loyality to WM in any way. If Palm came out with a new updated OS (okay everyone stop laughing) that met my needs better than WM, then I would be waiting outside the Sprint store before they opened to buy it the first day it was released.
    Last edited by HobbesIsReal; 11/10/2007 at 11:12 AM.
  13. #33  
    This thread is supposedly about whether WM needs a UI update to make it friendlier to new users. I would say being new user friendly is a good goal, but it would be a shame to do this at the expense of the power of the devices. Obviously the easiest UI for a phone would be to only have one button and no screen, but the side effect would be that it could only call one person and not do anything else.

    http://ww1.prweb.com/prfiles/2004/12...469/04513a.jpg

    Surur
    Last edited by surur; 11/10/2007 at 10:15 AM.
  14. #34  
    Quote Originally Posted by surur View Post
    I would say being new user friendly is a good goal, but it would be a shame to do this at the expense of the power of the devices.
    That is exactly my point that I fully agree with. Have a good layout that accesses 95% of what must users do on a daily basis while providing accessibility to all the power the OS has to offer for those that need it.
  15. #35  
    Quote Originally Posted by HobbesIsReal View Post
    That is exactly my point that I fully agree with. Have a good layout that accesses 95% of what must users do on a daily basis while providing accessibility to all the power the OS has to offer for those that need it.
    The current supposed champion of user-friendliness has nearly no power at all. I'm not sure you can have your cake and eat it too.

    Surur
  16. #36  
    I fully agree, that is why I am looking forward for a WM device with the user-friendliness that I feel that is quickly becoming an expectation or standard rather than a feature, without loosing the power that attracts so many power users.
  17. #37  
    I absolutely agree with Pogue. The windows interface was designed for a large screen and a mouse. Cell phones have neither. EVERYTHING on a winmob device takes more work to get to. Multi-tasking is great, but the interface sucks. Unfortunately, MS's idea of an interface upgrade is adding even more confusion. More capabilities is great, but not if they make common, everyday activities harder to use.

    On my palm OS device, I can go weeks (months if I don't play any games) without pulling the stylus out of the device. Not possible on Winmob.

    Winmob needs a total interface redo, so that common tasks are as easy to accessk, one handed and stylus free, as on a Palm OS device, while the less common tasks are hidden from view behind a menu or tab. Ideally, each user should be able to customize what those common tasks are.

    Quote Originally Posted by WMExperts Articles View Post
    So David Pogue put up a review of the T-Mobile Shadow (Video First Look of the Shadow here) - I'm jealous because the Shadow is the device I'm itching to try out for real once the Smartphone Round Robin is over. He gives the hardware and the specs very high praise, but spends the bulk of his review railing against Windows Mobile.


    Read: Looks Good, Feels Good, but Wait... - New York Times

    I have a few thoughts on this (including a Zuney **zany** idea!)- read on after the break.

    Read more at http://www.wmexperts.com/articles/ed...obile_doe.html
    Bob Meyer
    I'm out of my mind. But feel free to leave a message.
  18. #38  
    Quote Originally Posted by surur View Post
    Except the Shadow is a WM Standard phone, and no more complex than a Razr.

    Here's he's nonsense about the UI. He does not mention the new interface ONCE. Its all a litany of nitpicking.
    What you call nitpicking I call dead-on. One or two of these things might not be a big deal, but the sum-total of WinMob is that everything is more complicated than it needs to be. Can you adapt and get used to all the clicking and tapping? Sure you can. But why should you need to, when it's all so unnecessary?

    Microsoft has no CLUE as to how to design a good, small-device interface. (Frankly, I'm not sure they have much of a clue when it comes to large device interfaces either, but that's a different story.)
    Bob Meyer
    I'm out of my mind. But feel free to leave a message.
  19. #39  
    Quote Originally Posted by surur View Post
    ... and those things are also the same as in a Razr. For the target market (Razr users) its not even worth discussing.

    Surur
    I don't recall anyone claiming a Razor was the epitome of user interfaces. When the only praise you can give one bad interface is to say it's no worse than another bad interface, that's faint praise indeed.
    Bob Meyer
    I'm out of my mind. But feel free to leave a message.
  20. #40  
    Quote Originally Posted by surur View Post
    Another iPhone owner....

    Surur
    Another stupid comment. When one can't refute the argument, just attack the person making it, right?
    Bob Meyer
    I'm out of my mind. But feel free to leave a message.
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