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  1. #161  
    Quote Originally Posted by insidr View Post
    If you believe in coincidences and the tooth fairy, you can go ahead and believe the delay in WM6 has no relationship to GMM5. So it will just be a big coincidence that the entire rest of the world has WM6, but ATT will release it shortly after the deployment of GMM5.

    Oh, and it will be delivered by Santa.
    And the relationships we have with other carriers are less important than the one we have with AT&T. The number of GMM users across the thre 3 major US carriers (AT&T, Sprint and VZW) are fairly evenly distributed, and Verizon has WM6 device, Sprint has announced (though they are typically a little late to the market anyway with devices) WM6 devices, yet it is GMM's fault that AT&T doesn't.

    Yeah, I can see what Santa and the tooth fairy have to do with that.
  2. driazen's Avatar
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    #162  
    I don't care if it's GMM, Sprite backup, aliens, george bush, the lock ness monster or the theory of atlantis. I just want the official version released already...
  3. #163  
    GG:

    Let's just see how the timing plays out. If WM6 comes out ahead of GMM5, I'll apologize to all in this forum. If it turns out the other way, I hope you'll do same.
  4. #164  
    Only difference is that GoodGuy has nothing to apologize for.
  5. #165  
    Quote Originally Posted by GoodGuy View Post
    Good is not in the ROM. It is a web shortcut. There is no code from Good on the Palm devices when shipped.
    But the shortcut is there, and the bottom line is that people bought the 750 because of GOOD compatibility, and the lack of this compatibility in a ROM upgrade is not allowed.


    Quote Originally Posted by GoodGuy View Post
    Sprint has announced (though they are typically a little late to the market anyway with devices) WM6 devices, yet it is GMM's fault that AT&T doesn't.
    Not sure where you were going here. Sprint has ANNOUNCED devices, or released them? AT&T has ANNOUNCED WM6 upgrades for the Blackjack, Treo, and 8525, and none have been officially released. Coincidence that all have been leaked? I doubt it.

    Not trying to nitpick here (although you have by stating GOOD is not in ROM, obviously knowing what I was implying) but GOOD compatibility delaying WM6 makes perfect sense, and what you're saying does not.
  6. #166  
    Quote Originally Posted by lifes2short View Post
    Only difference is that GoodGuy has nothing to apologize for.
    Nobody really has anything to apologize for. GG has said he's not in a "need to know" position, so everything he says is as speculative as anybody else's. I posted on 8/20 that WM6 was waiting for GMM5. GG insists there's no relationship. One of us is correct. I'm willing to admit if I'm wrong. FYI...go to the 680 forum and check my post on the 680 ROM update. I have pretty good sources inside.

    The ATT ROM is ready and GMM is not, there's no release. But it's been released for VF and H3. Coincidence? The only way I can be convinced otherwise is to see the release of ATT ROM WM6 before GMM5.

    And I'll state once again for the record... I think it's the right decision to wait, considering the critical nature of GM to its users. And also for the record...GMM is the best mobile corporate email platform.

    This started as, really just a heads-up to those waiting for the ATT release. No axe to grind for me. I'm using my 680 till everything is deployed for the 750. It's not perfect, but it works.
  7. #167  
    Quote Originally Posted by insidr View Post
    I posted on 8/20 that WM6 was waiting for GMM5. GG insists there's no relationship. One of us is correct.
    He has not. He has clarified what the relationship is, that being a limited vendor to AT&T.

    The ATT ROM is ready and GMM is not, there's no release. But it's been released for VF and H3. Coincidence? The only way I can be convinced otherwise is to see the release of ATT ROM WM6 before GMM5.
    I'm on pins and needles.

    And I'll state once again for the record... I think it's the right decision to wait, considering the critical nature of GM to its users. And also for the record...GMM is the best mobile corporate email platform.
    So you've said.

    This started as, really just a heads-up to those waiting for the ATT release. No axe to grind for me.
    Anyone with reading comprehension capability knows better.
  8. #168  
    Quote Originally Posted by lifes2short View Post
    Anyone with reading comprehension capability knows better.
    I've been using the 750 happily with WM6 Aussie version happily for over a month. When I'm traveling, I just put my SIM into my 680 and use GMM. I really don't care when the ATT version comes out. And with my company's IT policies, it'll probably be several months before they certify GMM5 to be pushed out.

    So honestly, I don't care. Life IS 2 short. This is way too much energy over something of no real consequence to me.
  9.    #169  
    Basically, those who believe that GMM 5.0 is related to the delay have no way of winning. If 5.0 comes out first others will say it was just a coincidence. If WM6 comes out first we will get an "I told you so".

    My completely uninformed bet is the following: GMM will get released on 9/28, which GG has acknowledged is their target date and then WM6 to follow within 2 weeks.

    However, if for some reason GMM 5.0 is not ready by 9/28--or at least within a couple of days-- then AT&T will change their plans (or likely go with plan B)and just roll out WM6 and GMM will have to formally notify its users either directly or through a warning from AT&T that GMM users can not download the WM6 ROM until 5.0 is released. Neither AT&T nor GMM want this to happen but they might have to. Palm/AT&T promised an HSDPA upgrade in 2007 and because they opted not to include this in a subsequent patch but rather roll it into WM6 they need to move sooner than later.

    Clearly I am also not in a "need to know" position as I work for none of the above mentioned companies but I can speculate just the same.

    I am done with critical emails of anyone or their opinions on the matter, let's hope the rest of you are too. Opinions and speculation are great but I vote for no more attacks. Let's leave Santa, the tooth fairy, the Easter bunny and everyone else out of this.....unless they want to create an ID and post on their own
    PDA Lineage: Palm Pilot, Palm V, Palm Tungsten, Treo 650 (Cingular), Treo 750 (AT&T), Treo Pro GSM (unlocked), Pre Plus (AT&T), Pre 2 GSM (unlocked), Pre 3 16GB (AT&T Branded) and Touchpad 32 GB
  10. #170  
    But the shortcut is there, and the bottom line is that people bought the 750 because of GOOD compatibility, and the lack of this compatibility in a ROM upgrade is not allowed.
    Again, the number of 750's that are running GMM vs. the total sold is minor. To make a blanket statement that people bought the 750 for GMM is ridiculous.


    Not sure where you were going here. Sprint has ANNOUNCED devices, or released them? AT&T has ANNOUNCED WM6 upgrades for the Blackjack, Treo, and 8525, and none have been officially released. Coincidence that all have been leaked? I doubt it.
    Verizon HAS released a WM6 device by MOTOROLA, who incidentally, also makes GMM. The fact that AT&T has announced WM6 upgrades for all those devices and hasn't released them tells me it is AT&T's issue when other carriers have released the upgrades, i,e., the 750 on Vodaphone.

    Not trying to nitpick here (although you have by stating GOOD is not in ROM, obviously knowing what I was implying) but GOOD compatibility delaying WM6 makes perfect sense, and what you're saying does not.
    No, what you are saying makes no sense. Everyone is looking to blame someone for the late release of WM6 for the 750. Good is an easy target, though the logic behind it does not work. Again, when comparing the total # of devices of 750, Blackjack and 8525 that have been sold vs the # of those devices running GMM, it makes no sense from a customer service, financial or any other, standpoint.
  11.    #171  
    Quote Originally Posted by GoodGuy View Post


    Verizon HAS released a WM6 device by MOTOROLA, who incidentally, also makes GMM. The fact that AT&T has announced WM6 upgrades for all those devices and hasn't released them tells me it is AT&T's issue when other carriers have released the upgrades, i,e., the 750 on Vodaphone.


    GG--Does this release device include a "Get Good" icon?

    I did quick search of the Verizon site and had a hard time finding which Motorola device is running WM6--although I am in no way saying it does not exist I could not find it. Is it the Moto Q music 9 I could not identify what the OS version was other than WM. I searched for Good Link, Good Mobile Messaging and GMM on their site and nothing was returned. I also searched their data plans and could not find a data plan targeted at users of GMM. I assume therefore that Verizon does not have the same type of relationship with GMM as AT&T does (be it partnership or vendor).

    So unless I missed something I still feel that some of my points still ring true:

    1. I have stated that I think AT&T (and GMM for that matter) doesn't want to release an OS upgrade on any of their devices that when originally shipped with WM5 included a link to GMM, and thus the potential--however small it might be-- that a customer is now a user of GMM and this relationship might be damaged. We can argue how important or unimportant that Get Good icon is but can't we assume that both GMM and AT&T felt it was worth something as they included it with those devices originally (Black jack, 8525 and 750)?

    2. A new device with a new OS does not include the obligation to support any type of third party relationship so they start with a clean slate. The necessity to work with GMM or the inclusion of a "Get Good" icon is unnecessary (one might argue I am simply restating point 1 again here).

    3. It does not appear that Verizon has a relationship with GMM that is comparable to the one that AT&T does, thus GMM's compatibility with their OS on this new phone is not really an issue.

    As far as Motorola owning Good, I agree Mot must see the logic in including GMM on all their devices when possible but they also still need to sell devices and I would guess that Good's contribution to Mot's bottom line is probably not all that material in the end either--similar to Good contribution to AT&T's. Therefore, Motorola likely stands to do better financially by getting a new device released and sold sooner than later versus holding it off the market and waiting to include GMM on it.

    I think your argument is simply if one carrier can release WM6 then surely AT&T can, but I don't correlate the situation the same way you do.

    Lastly, if the GMM release of 5.0 is holding up WM6 I can't say for sure that it is actually Good's fault. Perhaps AT&T needed to provide some spec or responses to Good that they never did or weren't timely with and thus they have themselves contributed to the delay as well. All I say (in virtually all of my posts) is that GMM 5.0 will be released ahead of AT&T's WM6. Pointing the finger at AT&T, Good, Palm or whoever might be interesting to some but is really not important to my argument.

    It's unfortunate that all of the 3 devices that await the upgrade all are compatible with GMM as they exist today because if one of them was not then we would know the answer, because if AT&T was still holding back the WM6 release for the device that never did work with GMM we certainly could not point the finger at the GMM 5.0 release could we?
    PDA Lineage: Palm Pilot, Palm V, Palm Tungsten, Treo 650 (Cingular), Treo 750 (AT&T), Treo Pro GSM (unlocked), Pre Plus (AT&T), Pre 2 GSM (unlocked), Pre 3 16GB (AT&T Branded) and Touchpad 32 GB
  12. #172  
    Quote Originally Posted by GoodGuy View Post
    My point is, and always has been that the reasons posted in this thread trying to point to Good as the reason for a delayed OS release are ludicrous:
    Life2Short:

    Perhaps you should read all the posts.
  13. #173  
    Quote Originally Posted by insidr View Post
    So honestly, I don't care. Life IS 2 short. This is way too much energy over something of no real consequence to me.
    Quote Originally Posted by insidr View Post
    Life2Short:

    Perhaps you should read all the posts.
    I have, as it's not a terribly long read. Yet you & cohorts continue to milk this tabloid non-issue. One has to wonder why that is.
  14. driazen's Avatar
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    #174  
    We have nothing better to do until WM6 comes out...
  15. #175  
    Quote Originally Posted by GoodGuy View Post
    No, what you are saying makes no sense. Everyone is looking to blame someone for the late release of WM6 for the 750. Good is an easy target, though the logic behind it does not work.
    No, I'm not looking to blame anyone at all. I've installed the leaked wm6, I am more than happy with the ROM and expect no differences when it is official. And WM6 or not, my 750 is sitting in my drawer and I'm using a different phone altogether. And I don't use GOOD either.

    Just looking at it objectively, and can see why GOOD could cause the delay. But this situation has no effect on me whatsoever, and I'm not sue why everyone has not just installed the leaked ROM if they want it so bad.
  16. #176  
    Quote Originally Posted by lifes2short View Post
    I have, as it's not a terribly long read. Yet you & cohorts continue to milk this tabloid non-issue. One has to wonder why that is.
    I agree. And that speaks to your user name, which I also very much agree with.

    At first, I thought, alright, let me participate since I also would like to see WM6 released, but if someone's problem is that they don't have it, it really isn't a problem in the grand scheme of things. I also would like a high resolution 320x320 Treo 750. But it's not really a problem. If this is your "problem", count yourself lucky, because if something was seriously wrong in your life, such as if you're in poor health, a loved ones dies, the current administration...lol, posting in this thread would be the last thing on your mind.

    So let me gracefully bow out of this thread that has become nothing but people getting angry at each other, arguing, getting so emotionally involved to the point where they're so upset over something so trivial, if you take a step back and look at the bigger picture. I have a Treo 750 running Windows Mobile 5.2.2 with the audio fix. I'm satisfied. Let there be peace.
    Treo Pro | Blackberry Bold OS 4.6.0.167 | Slingbox PRO-HD | Plantronics 665 Bluetooth

    Internet Sharing tethering app --> Awesome

  17. #177  
    Quote Originally Posted by Dsol View Post
    GG--Does this release device include a "Get Good" icon?

    I did quick search of the Verizon site and had a hard time finding which Motorola device is running WM6--although I am in no way saying it does not exist I could not find it. Is it the Moto Q music 9 I could not identify what the OS version was other than WM. I searched for Good Link, Good Mobile Messaging and GMM on their site and nothing was returned. I also searched their data plans and could not find a data plan targeted at users of GMM. I assume therefore that Verizon does not have the same type of relationship with GMM as AT&T does (be it partnership or vendor).
    The Q9m is WM6 and has the GetGood icon. Vzw and Good have the same agreement in place as AT&T as it relates to GMM data plans.

    1. I have stated that I think AT&T (and GMM for that matter) doesn't want to release an OS upgrade on any of their devices that when originally shipped with WM5 included a link to GMM, and thus the potential--however small it might be-- that a customer is now a user of GMM and this relationship might be damaged. We can argue how important or unimportant that Get Good icon is but can't we assume that both GMM and AT&T felt it was worth something as they included it with those devices originally (Black jack, 8525 and 750)?
    I am still trying to figure out why you, and apparently everyone else involved in this bizzare theory, seem to think that AT&T is the only carrier we have a relationship with. Devices have been shipping with the GetGood icon for years. There are over 1.5 million Moto Q's (not Q9, too new) that have been shipped. When it first shipped, it was not supported by GMM, yet had the GetGood icon on it. The Q9 now is shipping with WM6 and GetGood and it isn't supported.


    2. A new device with a new OS does not include the obligation to support any type of third party relationship so they start with a clean slate. The necessity to work with GMM or the inclusion of a "Get Good" icon is unnecessary (one might argue I am simply restating point 1 again here).
    What? It is not the device with compatibility issue. It is the OS. Why would one carrier knowingly ship a device with a LINK to a 3rd party application that is not supported on that phone (Q9m) while another would not? The Moto Q and the Moto Q9 are the exact same device specification wise, except for the OS. Exactly the same. The 750 with WM5 and 750 with WM6 is exactly the same device specification wise, except for the OS. Why would Verizon do exactly what you are saying AT&T won't do? Carrier issue and decision.

    3. It does not appear that Verizon has a relationship with GMM that is comparable to the one that AT&T does, thus GMM's compatibility with their OS on this new phone is not really an issue.
    They have the exact same releationship as AT&T outside of the fact that VZW customers buy CAL's directly. There is a Good Data Plan, that has a premium over the regular data plan, on all three US carriers.

    As far as Motorola owning Good, I agree Mot must see the logic in including GMM on all their devices when possible but they also still need to sell devices and I would guess that Good's contribution to Mot's bottom line is probably not all that material in the end either--similar to Good contribution to AT&T's. Therefore, Motorola likely stands to do better financially by getting a new device released and sold sooner than later versus holding it off the market and waiting to include GMM on it.



    I think your argument is simply if one carrier can release WM6 then surely AT&T can, but I don't correlate the situation the same way you do.
    Your argument there goes to my point: It is a carrier issue, not an application vendor issue.

    Lastly, if the GMM release of 5.0 is holding up WM6 I can't say for sure that it is actually Good's fault. Perhaps AT&T needed to provide some spec or responses to Good that they never did or weren't timely with and thus they have themselves contributed to the delay as well. All I say (in virtually all of my posts) is that GMM 5.0 will be released ahead of AT&T's WM6. Pointing the finger at AT&T, Good, Palm or whoever might be interesting to some but is really not important to my argument.

    It's unfortunate that all of the 3 devices that await the upgrade all are compatible with GMM as they exist today because if one of them was not then we would know the answer, because if AT&T was still holding back the WM6 release for the device that never did work with GMM we certainly could not point the finger at the GMM 5.0 release could we?
    Again, carrier issue. Do you honestly think that if a ROM update that would affect millions of users was ready, that AT&T would hold that update back because of an issue that would affect a fraction of those users? That, IMO, makes zero business sense from AT&T's perspective.

    This discussion, while entertaining, is going in circles. The only 'fact' in this argument is that AT&T has not shipped a promised update. AT&T has a history of being late on updates, however, for some here, that doesn't matter. Unless you are on the engineering team at AT&T, then EVERYTHING is pure speculation as to the delay. Here are the two facts that I use to back my point it is a carrier issue, not a Good (or any other 3rd party app) issue: The WM6 update has shipped for the 750 on Vodaphone, but not for AT&T. The Q9m has WM6 and the GetGood icon, but it isn't supported by Good. Those are not conjecture or speculation, they are facts. That AT&T has not released the update for their devices is an AT&T issue.
  18.    #178  
    GG, you have cetainly made a case for a carriers willingness to release their device with an inoperable icon. I can't argue that. But I am still going to hang my hat on my main argument regarding an upgrade for an existing device. I know you think this is the craziest rationale you have ever heard but what can I say--for some reason I am in the camp with those that think an upgrade to an existing device that could create some problems for a group of customers (no matter how inconsequential some of you believe) is not something AT&T wants to do.

    Yes, I use GMM everyday and will benefit with 5.0's release but I subscribe to a theory that was suggested by an individual that uses neither the 750 or GMM, but I assume heard something from somebody somewhere and it adds up to me. His source might be credible or might not be but nonetheless seems logical to me.

    GMM 5.0 gets released first then AT&T WM6
    PDA Lineage: Palm Pilot, Palm V, Palm Tungsten, Treo 650 (Cingular), Treo 750 (AT&T), Treo Pro GSM (unlocked), Pre Plus (AT&T), Pre 2 GSM (unlocked), Pre 3 16GB (AT&T Branded) and Touchpad 32 GB
  19. #179  
    Quote Originally Posted by driazen View Post
    We have nothing better to do until WM6 comes out...
    Clearly.
  20. #180  
    I have never read so much BS in my life. Dsol and Insidr wanting to blame the incompetence of ATT and Palm on GoodMail. Goodguy, who admits he doesn't know anything, drinks the corporate kool-aid and represents a position that he can't back up and that has no logic. Lifes2short should just get a life or a hobby, cuz he/she is totally clueless.
    The update will come out when it does. If you want to use WM6 now, there's a bunch of choices. If GMM doesn't perform well, then go back to WM5 and use it there. If you don't use GMM, then you'll be happy with WM6, any flavor. But geez... same some energy for things you can do somthing about.

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